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Suzuki Grand Vitara vs Subaru Forester vs Hyundai Santa Fe vs Jeep Liberty vs Ford Escape vs Saturn

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    sasquatch_2000sasquatch_2000 Member Posts: 800
    Why?
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    wales1wales1 Member Posts: 90
    Ohh my..Hung..you lost it !! I remember you talking about you were going to put video monitors in the head rests of the SFe. I was wanting to view it to see what it looked like. A local audio/video sotre here sells them but I wanted to see the "real thing" in a Santa Fe. They arent cheap and kids do love to touch screen with Juicy Juice soaked fingers. Hell..I got a 42 in Sony my kid use to eye ball for an attack, so up went the safety shield on the screen.
    As to "there I go again" HUNG..listen carefully...and I do mean LISTEN...I was saying if YOU (HUNG) are happy with the looks and feel and ride, etc..of YOUR Santa Fe..then so be it. Forget what others say. BUT..you have asked for feedback from others so I have given my 2 cents worth. To ME..what you have done to your Santa Fe is something I personally would not do. Again..its all a matter of likes and tastes. If you cant take the comments, then well..all I can say is ..learn to deal with it.
    As far as you providing the HELPFUL TIPS, I use my manual and good common sense. I have a 3 yr. old, I know all too well about car seats, and my dealer showed me all the safety features th SFe offers. AGAIN..your site is very indepth, CONGRATULATIONS..you win the Hyundai OWNER SITE AWARD. so..I guess we can shft gears to the Rav 4 forums soon and see what is cooking over there soon?
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    hung0820hung0820 Member Posts: 426
    Does anyone out there have the 2001 Tribute/Escape and 2001 Forester that lived in San Francisco? Can you please contact me so that I can shoot pictures for the detail all about your vehicle? I want to develop a website for the Tribute/Escape and Forester as well to help this topic work better.
    travis@y2kcatalogs.com

    Wales1:
    Nice Compliment there Wales1. I really like the way you talk now!

    Suvshopper4:
    Just what is it you are going to do that is "dedicated to the RAV4 owners too"?
    Development the website on the RAV4 and link to RAV4 discussion board. Showing detail of the RAV4 so that consumers/buyers/researchers would be able to learn more about the car. Not just really for the RAV4 but for the Triscape and the Forester as well if someone can help me out.
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    sasquatch_2000sasquatch_2000 Member Posts: 800
    "Does anyone out there have the 2001 Tribute/Escape and 2001 Forester that lived in San Francisco?"

    Which one was that? Was there only one? Why did it die? Or did it move?
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    hung0820hung0820 Member Posts: 426
    Sasquatch_2000:
    The only reason why I ask that because I need permission first before I can come and do the shooting on the car...
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    armac13armac13 Member Posts: 1,129
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
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    billtungbilltung Member Posts: 255
    Another Mazada fan try to attack my creditability?

    Why others can but I can not? To re-post or link to a particular message is not the 1st time in Edmunds.com forums. Anything posted in forum is subject to share & go public, the message I re-posted above is in www.santafeforum.com, I believe have been read by lot of SF owners.
    It is not a secret message! Do you know "traveler"? Will/Can you hurt him? I always think 1st before doing something. It is a very difficult task to please everybody, just like USA has so many good friendship countries but also have gained so many enemy countries! If you are so logic then u might assume that I'm "traveler" because "traveler" actually stand on my side & think what you guys doing is hasty & annoying the real contributors of this forum!

    Actually I can link the readers to that message, but I don't want u blame on me by jumping you "to here to there"...

    For those who send emails to me, I will never publish their e-mails w/o their approval.

    I felt you complain to me is unreasonable. You need deep thinking!

    BTW! LOL! I think most of you guys now enjoy argueing than comparing the SUV's.

    Let's stop complaining about who's & who's!

    Get back on track!.......Eg. Forester is an excellent powerful all-wheel-drive.... Mazda/Ford is a very powerful + fast accelerate SUV.....
    OK...
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    jpvwaudijpvwaudi Member Posts: 139
    Until I saw the pictures of that Santa Fe, the last time I laughed that hard was when I saw wire wheel hub caps on a Yugo. Lemme ask you this: In that accessories catalog for the Hyundai, did they have any adds for an outhouse elevator?
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    john284john284 Member Posts: 71
    as to the demographics of these SUV owners, including their educational levels, ethnic backgrounds, and psychological profiles. Well, what else can I say besides shaking my head. Host Drew, it is time to end this.
    Subaru, Mazda and Hyundai SUV drivers, hit the road and drive your SUVs out of this forum, to the woods, campsites or point B that ends on a photogenic hill in SF....
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    rsharp83rsharp83 Member Posts: 82
    I need to add a trailer hitch to my sante Fe so I can tow my SeaDoo. So I thought "hey, why not post 30 or so pictures of my new trailer hitch! Every angle, every possible detail..., yeah, I have a few hundred extra hours to waste!"

    So hey everybody get ready for my in depth trailer hitch posts! coming soon...
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
    Lunatic Fringe
    In the twilight's last gleaming
    This is open season
    But you won't get too far
    We know you've got to blame someone
    For your own confusion

    But we're on guard this time
    Against your final solution
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    hung0820hung0820 Member Posts: 426
    Man! I can't wait to see the pictures of the Santa Fe that is towing. I love to play water jetski! I hope you enjoy the sport of water(SeaDoo) and land (Santa Fe). Wish you the best and have a great fun day!

    **I just drove my Santa Fe to Twin Peak a moment ago and I got to tell you that I left everyone behind when driving with so many curbs all the way up the hill/mountain. So many people going up there tonight and I guess is probably because of Friday! I used 2nd gear running 35+mph but that was to fast so I move it into 3rd gear running at 30+mph! Either gears I use; the car still performed smooth like silk. Climbing the hill/mountain is a piece of cake! I don't have any feeling climbing the hill at all. However, I really like the most is the cornering on the curbs!**
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    vin_weaselvin_weasel Member Posts: 237
    Here you go, my personal and opinionated comparison of the Forester, Triscape, Sante Fe and even the new Rav:

    Out of these 4 I only test drove 2, the Forester Special Edition (Canadian, close to the S, auto) and the Rav 4 package B(Canadian, 5 spd).

    I liked the Forester best because of the safety, seating position, the power combined with fuel economy, the looks of the front half of the vehicle as well as the ride. I wanted one with a 5 spd, but the cost was just too far out of my range and there is only one dealership within 8 hours of Winnipeg (the salesman was a real knob, $1500 markup above MRSP on each vehicle).

    I liked the Tribute second (I probably wouldn't buy the Ford) because of looks, power and a good experience with an MX-6. The reason I wouldn't buy one is I've been scared off by the initial problems. If I was waiting until next model year, I would seriously consider it.

    The Rav 4 would be next. The positives are the styling from the outside and the gas mileage. That's really it. From the inside it just didn't feel right. I took it for a good test drive and it really lagged on the highway. One nice thing was how quiet the engine was, to the point that I was revving to 5000 rpms with thinking I was at about 3000. I also felt that it would break and that you would have to treat it well. It made me uneasy but in my opinion it is the best looking one out there.

    The Sante Fe I took a look at but didn't drive. I liked the interior but the exterior just isn't for me. The curves just seem a little too exaggerated. The 10 year warranty looked attractive, but if Bill is correct (please correct me if I'm wrong), it isn't offered here in Canada and I'm afraid I wouldn't buy a Hyundai without it. The majority of the safety information has now come out after I'd made my decision and I will give the vehicle points for that.

    Finally, a little bit more on why I bought the Cherokee Sport. Like I said before it was the first one to really put a smile on my face. When the I6 pins you back in your seat and you get a feel for the ride, I kind of forget out the small back seat, poor safety, etc. Damn testosterone. This is the last vehicle I'm going to buy before I start having little ones and I wanted to enjoy myself. I like the fact I can tow 5000lbs and put 200lbs on the roof. However, the biggest reason it won me over is that while I was still on a high from the test drive, the price of the vehicle didn't drag me back down. With full-time AWD, auto, power group, towing, etc, etc (no ABS) it was almost $6500 cheaper than a Forester S and $5000 cheaper than the Rav 4 with the B package, after tax (14%, god bless Canada). Plus both of those would be 5 spds while the Jeep is auto. So for a similarly equiped vehicle with such a price difference, I had my choice.

    Sorry this was so long.
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Bill: that link is old news. Both topics it covers have already been discussed here.

    However, to save my brand new DOT-approved Bell Helmet from any further damage, allow me to change the subject...

    My Forester was hit yesterday.

    Driving along in the rain, some goofball decided it was OK to stop in the middle lane of a major avenue to make a left turn. That created a chain reaction of accidents behind him (or her).

    My Forester's twin-piston calipers clamped down hard, and the 4-sensor 4-channel ABS kicked in as I applied full pressure to the brake pedal. With no wheels skidding, or much drama, for that matter, I managed to stop with room to spare, braking the chain of collisions.

    But not the woman in the Saturn behind me. SCREEEETCH - BAM! Her non-ABS equipped sedan skidded and turned sidways, ramming into my rear bumper pretty hard.

    Her car suffered pretty major damage. Her bumper is a goner - cracked in more than one place, hanging there. Her hood was creased, accordianed, and had chipped paint. Her passenger side quarter panel actually cracked and broke apart (remember, they are plastic on Saturns, not metal). She also lost the headlight and turn signal. Her air bag did not go off, probably because the impact occured at an angle.

    My Forester had a tear in the bumper cover, and my driver side rear taillight cracked. Minor cosmetic damage, really, compared to what her car suffered. Her insurance will be paying for it.

    I didn't get photos at the scene, but I'll take some of my Forester a little later and share them. I can say that I was shocked at how little damage the Forester suffered given the force of the collision. The hatch, glass, and interior are completely intact.

    I was fine. The other driver stumbled out a little dazed, but OK. Coincidentally it happened in front of a Fire House, so a couple of volunteers came out to make sure we were OK.

    We were, except for her Saturn.

    -juice
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    speterson1speterson1 Member Posts: 228
    Man, that's scary! Good thing you didn't have any kids in the car! Hats off to Sandy for keeping you safe! That's one of the reasons we buy Foresters...

    Good luck dealing with all the insurance paperwork and I hope repairs go smoothly.

    Steve
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    billtungbilltung Member Posts: 255
    I'm not very sure that the Bill in "Bill: that link is old news. Both topics it covers have already been discussed here" is me or not! I don't think I did post any old news in here....

    Anyway, glad to know you're OK in the car accident & your baby(Forester) only suffered minor damages!

    This Victoria day's long weekend in BC, Canada so far already has lot of car accidents, speeding is one of the main factor....

    I saw a latest model Acura sport sedan(not sure what model) remains on saturaday after crashed in the highway I usually drive everyday, flying up after hitted curb & rolling over many times, the two young man insided died instantly, Hey man! It is the price to race using an excellent performance cars!

    http://www.tvforbc.com/bc/news/stories/news-78209520010520-150503.html

    On friday! My SF also had a heart-break accident(had taken pictures).....but because some people here don't really happy with my photos contributions, I'm very hesitate whether I should continue sharing my SF's pictures in Edmunds or not?

    billtung "Hyundai Santa Fe (SUVs Board)" May 20, 2001 9:23am

    Looking to see your Forester's pictures if possible........

    Take cares & Good luck in your Forester's repairs!
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Yeah, no kids, but they would have been secured in a safety seat anyway. I did have my dog with me, and he's fine. He was a bit startled by the noise, but unharmed.

    Bill: the link you offered talked about the IIHS and AutoPacific, weren't those topics already covered? Oh well, never mind.

    -juice
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    billtungbilltung Member Posts: 255
    Axeiteira! I see what u mean, but the news is published on 5/17/2001 despite whatever its said. I find out this link in other forum, just paste it here to share w/ u guys....
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    sasquatch_2000sasquatch_2000 Member Posts: 800
    I really liked the Cherokee too. The only trouble is my knees hit the steering wheel! Otherwise, I'd have one now. My wife and I both like the styling, and I like the power, utility, etc.

    I like the shifter in the Santa Fe, and am surprised that more manufacturers do not offer similar. Doesn't Chrysler have one of those? That would be neat in a Durango!

    Subaru seems great all around except it looks like Princess Di's hearse and it lacks a little in ground clearance versus some of the others. Otherwise THAT would be a contender (for me).
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    bajabillbajabill Member Posts: 60
    Ok, Ive driven both the escape and santafe.

    SF - does anyone think the positioning of the break and accelerators feel awkward. Almost like the brake is too close to the accelarator.

    Escape - has anyone noticed the feel of the brake pedal, good for heel/toe swithcing and the brake motion is more downward than forward, IMO nobody approaches BMW on this front but the escape was a very nice attempt.

    Cherokee - both pedals are off to the left more than I am accustomed to.

    BTW, ford has some getupandgo in this thing and I really like the watchamacallit shifter in the SF, I wish more makers would utilize this toy so I can play and my wife can drive.
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    billtungbilltung Member Posts: 255
    Believe it or not, the SHIFTRONIC shifter in SF contributed to a very major factor in my decision to buy this "cheap Hyundai's brand" toy... If u used to it, u will find really fun, & leave a lot of car behind you, since u can shift faster than normal manual stick about .5 second each time according to Hyundai's brochure.

    As I mentioned before, I've beaten Celica before when start off in traffic light, but seem nobody believe me! Of course it also depend on who is the driver (if Subaru's changed the world's rally team members. Will they still win so easy?).

    :-)
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Just curious, but why would you heel/toe an automatic?

    Subaru has won rallies with several different drivers, FWIW.

    -juice
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    bajabillbajabill Member Posts: 60
    You are refering to holding down two pedals with one foot. I am probably using the wrong term to describe the ease at which the transition from one pedal to the other occurs. There is no need to lift the heel from the floor, merely pivot about the heal and the toe is allowed to move sideways. The BMW arrangement provides very fluent movement and quick transitions to braking from the accelerator. It was the first thing I noticed when driving one and still the most memorable, more than the handling.
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    billtungbilltung Member Posts: 255
    Just because worry about the re-sale & my wife also drive it to meet costomers. And in Canada I think there is no manual stick option available.

    I just just ...... hate/bore to drive w/ the steering-wheel-side shift stick in my Durange & GMC...
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    billtungbilltung Member Posts: 255
    Since I've received at least 5 requests (in edmunds & santafeforum) to continue postings (w/o oppose) pics before my SF's website start function, I will release all those pictures tonight, pls come back tonight & you will be surprised! Guarantee.....or u money back!
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    bajabill: makes sense now. Thanks for clearing that up.

    The wife is taking my Forester to the shop at 3pm, so I should have a damage estimate later today. I'm guessing about $1200.

    -juice
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    hung0820hung0820 Member Posts: 426
    Sorry to hear that you have involved in the accident and I hope that you will be able to handle and resolve the problem with no hassle. Hope you that best. Talk to you later.
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Wow, I should get a job in estimating. The damage was $1,180.46, with all OE parts and dealership prices (which tend to be on the high side).

    I'm going to fax it to their insurance to get paid (first things first), then get it fixed. I'll try to share photos tomorrow.

    -juice
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
    Glad you're alright AJ.

    "Wow, I should get a job in estimating."

    Ok, can you give me an estimate on my monitor from all the forehead damage?
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    vin_weaselvin_weasel Member Posts: 237
    Yeah. When I first took the Cherokee for a test drive I hopped in and tried to move the seat back one notch. I pull the big lever and try to move it back. The saleswoman says that it's already all the way back. I'm only a little over 5'8" and I just fit. I wouldn't want to be 6' or over and try to be comfortable.

    Sorry about the accident, juice. I've been on the giving end of two rear-enders and my vehicle has taken the brunt of the damage in both cases. Both collisions were under 20 km/h for a grand total of almost $4000 on two different VWs and the other parties didn't even put in an insurance claim. The husband of one woman I hit did try to tell me that I bent the frame of a '94 Thunderbird with an '87 VW Fox going 15 km/h. After laughing at him on the phone I never heard from him again.
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    $1156 for a 17" Dell flat panel. Ouch.

    You guys need insurance more than I do!

    -juice
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
    ...you're almost psychic. I actually want to get the 18" flat panel as my next monitor. I got a 19" trinitron for now.

    Boy, you are pretty good. Guess my weight?
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    2 tons.

    OOPS! Sorry, that the Santa Fe. ;-)

    -juice
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
    You nailed it again (for the Santa Fe)... can you guess how fast I can go from zero to sixty?
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    guyfguyf Member Posts: 456
    2 tons is closer to the weight of the RX-300 than the Santa Fe.

    Oups, I should not be here.

    Guy
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
    Yup, and it'll still smoke the Santa Claus in zero to sixty. Thanks for the reminder.
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    scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    I am a Ford fan but Subaru has been doing AWD far longer than Hyundia and Ford combined. Their 4channel AWD is Awesome. The Sub also comes with a limited slip rear diff. If I had to take any of these offroad my vote would go to the Subaru coming out ontop.
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    jeffmust2jeffmust2 Member Posts: 811
    Tony -- you'll never make it to 60 without a vehicle of some kind. 0-6, maybe.

    I will go back to lurking if I can ask just one question that has been bothering me:

    If Hung's SF has a "secret transmission cooler" (as he states in a previous post)...how does he know about it?

    Going shopping this weekend for a new monitor anyway.
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    hung0820hung0820 Member Posts: 426
    RX300:
    front headroom = 39.5
    rear headroom = 39.2
    front/rear hip = 55.2
    front leg room = 40.7
    rear leg room = 36.4
    0-60mph = 9.0
    TMV price = Top Model START @ $32753

    Tribute:
    front headroom = 40.3
    rear headroom = 38.9
    front hip = 53.3
    rear hip = 48.8
    front leg room = 41.7
    rear leg room = 36.9
    0-60mph = 9.0
    TMV price = Top Model START @ $23852

    Forester:
    front headroom = 39.6
    rear headroom = 37.2
    front hip = 51.4
    rear hip = 50.9
    front leg room = 43
    rear leg room = 33.4
    TMV price = Top Model START @ about $24700

    Santa Fe:
    front headroom = 39.6
    rear headroom = 39.2
    front hip = 54.4
    rear hip = 54
    front leg room = 41.6
    rear leg room = 36.8
    0-60mph = 9.5
    TMV price = Top Model START @ $22294

    Speed**Not much different; tribute/lexus winner

    Price**Big different; thrash out the RX300 here and the Santa Fe is the best while still have more options than any of it competitors.

    Room Space***Marginal beat each other but Santa Fe is the widest here

    ****Choose do you want speed since there are not much different or do you want price since there might be a big different?*****
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    billtungbilltung Member Posts: 255
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    guyf1guyf1 Member Posts: 50
    The S-F is slower than the RX-300 in the 0-60 because of all the money the S-F drivers have left in their pockets after choosing the SF over the RX. All this money adds weight.....

    Have a nice day everyone....

    Guy
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    curreycurrey Member Posts: 144
    What are the "more options" the Santa Fe has that the others do not? I know of a couple of true options that the Tribute has that are not available on the Santa Fe. Granted, there are a few things available on the Forester that are not available on either the Santa Fe or the Tribute. Each of these vehicles can come with something the other does not. However, there is not a clear winner, but, I would give the edge to the Forester. (My assessment of standard/options available is based of the specs provided here at Edmunds).
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Sorry, Jeff, you're wrong. Tony's head can reach his monitor going 60mph in about 3 seconds. Impressive! ;-)

    vince: you'd love the photos on the Yahoo Forester Club. You need a Yahoo ID, but then check it out - sweet!

    Why did we start comparing the RX? C'mon, that's a luxury SUV, totally in a different class. Yes of course in price, but also in every other way.

    The flaw in Hung's post is that he is using retail price, which noone on their right mind will pay. Use real-world prices instead, and it's a differen story.

    Fitzgerald has a Forester S 5 speed for $21,204. Even with automatic, it's $22,378. The S Premium adds features that Hyundai does not even offer, like a factory moonroof. So if we compare apples to apples, we should use the Forester S auto.

    Then look at what Hyundai does not include for that $22,494 retail price (I guess it went up $200 since Hung checked, per Edmunds) - ABS, which I learned first-hand is a major and essential option after being hit by a car without it. Add that package and you also get traction control and heated seats, with a total retail price of $23,384.

    But the Forester S already comes standard with a rear LSD (to manage one axle, like Hyundai's traction control), heated seats, and ABS.

    So is the Hyundai cheaper? Depends on how close to retail you pay. You'd have to negotiate more than $1000 off the retail price just to match the Subaru. My bet is many SF buyers did not.

    -juice
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    tonychrystonychrys Member Posts: 1,310
    I'm sorry, but 9.5 seconds for the Santa Claus is Hyundai's claimed spec. In several car reviews, like MT's SUV of the Year, the time was closer to 11 seconds, or to paraphrase the article "the slowest of the bunch".

    You folks make me laugh. Let me get my monitor crash helmet on so that I can decipher the unintelligible messages that are sure to follow...
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Car & Driver also had it at over 10 sec. I think Consumer Reports, too, but they're slow with every car they test.

    -juice
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    armac13armac13 Member Posts: 1,129
    I wish you would stop injecting rational and realistic discourse into this board. Accuracy and reason run against the tone of this thread, so be careful. Hey, my head doesn't hurt!!

    Ross
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Ross: I apologize?

    ;-)

    -juice
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