"You can save 70% off the price of a Tahoe if you buy a year or 2 old model. These are great vehicles, but a 2007 Tahoe LT 4WD is worth only about $12,000 max. "
umm, you might want to recheck your figures. More like $25k average.
GM only leads in the markets that are going south the fastest (big trucks and full-size SUVs) or not large enough to support the company (expensive sports cars).
It is competitive in large crossovers, and fields ONE competitive entry in the family sedan segment (Malibu) and entry-level luxury market (CTS). But a competitive entry isn't enough to get satisfied customers out of vehicles with better reputations or more presence in the market.
In every other segment, it is basically an also ran, especially in the important minicar and compact segments.
Big 3 die so does this country !!!! Some estimates put the ripple effect at as high as 20+ million jobs !!!! A UAW paycheck switches hands like 12 times
Who is giving those 20 million estimates?
Wonder if there have been studies made about how well former UAW persons that get laid off or downsized can acclimate to new non-union jobs. Can these folks change their attitudes and be more agreeable and team players? Or conversely, will some of them go into non-union places and then start to try and organize after a short time on the job.
We will be very vulnerable for an attack by one of our global enemies and we would not have the manufacturing capacity to fight a WWIII, but nobody outside of a few can see that fact !!!
I mentioned on a related board that the U.S. Army had purchased Toyota trucks for some of its needs from Korean war to early 60's. Since we are very strong allies with Japan, seems that they would step up and their companies such as Toyota and Nissan would help.
But, Ford and Chevrolet truck manufacturing will not go away anytime soon. F-Series and Silverado are the workhorses of American farms, ranches and construction businesses and have consistently led in total amount of all vehicle sales in the U.S.
It was an economist that was being interviewed I believe on CNN or MSNBC......
Wonder if there have been studies made about how well former UAW persons that get laid off or downsized can acclimate to new non-union jobs. Can these folks change their attitudes and be more agreeable and team players? Or conversely, will some of them go into non-union places and then start to try and organize after a short time on the job.
I guarantee you that UAW members are better team players than your non-union shops because they don't have to worry about a brown noser back stabbing them or having a time study done to see how fast they work every other day !!! This is the type of crap that really goes on. My mom had a time study done on her the other day and it's a way for them to look at people to fire !!! I'm sure each of you have time studies done on you right ??? How fast you can swallow that second cup of coffee or rasberry bismark on company time...Right !!!
Toyota will stop production at all its plants in the U.S. and Canada for two extra days in addition to the regular Christmas holidays next month, and cut about half of 500 temporary workers at a plant in Georgetown, Kentucky by March, company spokeswoman Kayo Doi said.
The production cuts are the latest effort by the company to deal with shrinking demand in the U.S., which is expected to slip into recession this year.
Earlier this month, Toyota said net profit for the July-September quarter plunged 69 percent and downgraded its full-year profit forecast to about a third of last year's result. Officials said the company is also assessing its manufacturing operations.
Somewhere posted here on Edmunds about how Toyota wasn't laying off people and was supporting their folks?
500 parttime at Georgetown!!!
"Beginning January, Japan's top automaker plans to reduce production of the Sienna minivan at its Indiana plant, and slow a line for the Camry and Avalon sedans at the Kentucky plant, Doi said."
"At New United Motor Manufacturing Inc. in Fremont, California — its joint venture with General Motors Corp. — Toyota will eliminate a shift producing the Tacoma pickup truck. "
So much for the PR piece on how they pay their people even when cutting back?
Or are they doing what the UAW negotiated for??? and have work locations for people who aren't working?
I agree in part. But did Toyota lose any customers with the engine sludge issue? Google it and the five year law suit which gave the issue closure. Then they still have yet to admit any fault. Then Honda had its transmissions issues. They should be given credit owning/fessing up and correcting the problem.
Those Toyota's covered many year models and the onus was put on the owners to made whole. Many were not and this just proves that there is a vast number of consumers whom have yet to be burned. All manufacturers will have issues regardless of they being union or non - union. These engineering issues have little to do with the workers on the lines and more of a design issue.
With America being the police of the world. Engineering talent is being diverted into the defense and space fields. This talent would make a difference if its energy was also put into automobiles. No one could argue that we are light years ahead in defense and space.
Toyotas with the sludge problem pop up even in the small sample on the boards here. They typically are used car buyers who get taken. Just saw one within the last two days. link title
Sorry Charlie, but they ALL get their pension monies from YOU AND ME, courtesy of the PBGC. If the Big 3 go belly up, guess who pays the retirees?? Yep, YOU AND ME!!!! And there is no renegging on that, because PBGC is an INSURANCE POLICY, and it will HAVE to be PAID OUT
True that the current retirees get their full benefit. However, those yet not retired get a reduced benefit under the PBGC. Pension funds are separate from the company. In another entity as to not have a conflict of interest. They are funded by the company by a formula to make sure there is enough money to cover present/future liabilities. They invest the money and assume a rate of return. All of this is factored in and hence, when the market is under preforming, many pensions need more funding. So its true that underfunding is a burden on the taxpayer.
I agree in part. But did Toyota lose any customers with the engine sludge issue? Google it and the five year law suit which gave the issue closure. Then they still have yet to admit any fault.
I'm a little undecided on sludge, myself. I have a 2007 Dodge Intrepid with the 2.7 V-6, another engine that's supposed to be infamous for sludging. However, I have about 143,000 miles on mine, and have never had any problems. And I hate to fess up to this, but I haven't been exactly religious about changing my oil. When I first bought the car, I wanted to shoot for every 3,000 miles, but adding it up, it's averaged more like every 5,000, and a few times I've gone longer than that.
Every mechanic I've ever talked to about sludge, in ANY car, has said that you have to really abuse them to get them to do that. Let the oil run too low, overheat them and keep driving them, let the oil go way too long between changes, etc.
Anyway, I've heard that Toyota actually will step up and take care of their sludge customers...at least moreso than Chrysler would.
I've also heard that with those 5-speed automatics that Honda had problems with, Honda would extend the warranties on them, and make other concessions to those people afflicted with them.
My Mom & stepdad had the transmission in their 1999 Altima fail at 35,000 miles. My first thought was oh here we go, another Nissan piece of crap. Before that they had a '91 Stanza that was pretty bad by around 90K miles, although they limped it on to around 110-115K. But Nissan replaced their transmission, with no fuss, accusations, etc, and now that same car has over 250,000 miles on it.
I would like to think that Chrysler would have done the same for me if my Intrepid ate its transmission. But I'm not holding my breath on that one. However, I was impressed that they helped out one of my friends years ago, who bought a Dodge Dynasty. I think it was a 1990. It had the 3.3 Mopar V-6 and that new "Ultradrive" 4-speed automatic that was infamous for early failure. I think the first time it failed, it was just out of warranty, but close enough that they covered it in good faith. The second time it failed, around 86,000 miles, they paid for half of it. However, we're also talking back in the early/mid 1990's. I dunno if they'd be so generous today!
Every manufacturer has issues from time to time, but it seems like the Japanese step up and remedy the problem much more quickly.
Did she slow down or be more deliberate in actions, kind of like slow-motion?
She kept her same pace because if she would of slowed down she might not of been as fast as some other person thus when they look toward firing someone she would be one of the first to go !!!! That is the reality of the non-union work enviroment !!!! They also were looking at mirrors the quality auditors passed that were bad and if you have so many bad ones per million even though you are working like a hebrew slave and better not take too long to look well you could be fired also for that !!! What's sad is sometimes they don't have enough work due to the glass cutting area being down yet they better work at a very fast pace !!!
Honda continues to have AC compressor issues with CR-Vs too. Honda, to their credit, is covering a lot of them after warranty, but whether you get coverage is a bit of a crap shoot.
GM only leads in the markets that are going south the fastest (big trucks and full-size SUVs) or not large enough to support the company (expensive sports cars).
Is that what Consumer Reports, is telling you ??? I can't think of to many area's GM, isn't competitive in ???? Sure they have a few area's to address or could make improvements but overall their line-up is a lot better than Fords and defintely Chrysler !!!
It is competitive in large crossovers, and fields ONE competitive entry in the family sedan segment (Malibu) and entry-level luxury market (CTS). But a competitive entry isn't enough to get satisfied customers out of vehicles with better reputations or more presence in the market.
You are crazy !!! The Cobalt, is still selling pretty well despite it's aging design and the Astra, has been winning awards like the Aura and Malibu. The Saturn VUE, received a good review from edmunds and we both know the Trucks and SUV's are top notch. Sure the STS, needs to be redone as does the LaCrosse....Hummer's H3 is selling pretty well but the Colorado/Canyon, should be replaced or refreshened with a quality interior..... I feel that GM, is very competitive but given our sagging economy the only automobiles that are selling are those that appeal to the wealthy trophy wifes which are mainly the luxury brands of the Japanese and/or Germans.
Speaking of CR-V's, I've actually seen two fires now that are a result of that "double gasket" problem that the oil filters have. A few years back, I saw one burning on the DC Beltway median. A few months ago, I saw another one on the median, with a fire burning on the ground in front of it. So I'm guessing they pulled over, and it caught the ground on fire under it, and then they backed it up?
I don't know if I'd blame this issue on the vehicle or the oil filter, though. In early 2007 I changed the oil filter on my 2000 Intrepid, which just uses the generic spin-on oil filters that have been around since 1958 or so. I've NEVER experienced this before, but this time, the filter came off and left its gasket attached to the car. I didn't notice, and put the new filter on. Started the car up, and it began to make the most perverted noises, sort of like what the GreaseMan might do (if you know who he is). And the car immediately dumped about 3 quarts of oil on my grandmother's driveway!
As quickly as that oil drained out of my car, I'm surprised that anybody with a CR-V and that problem ever made it more than a mile or two before running dry and seizing the engine.
Well, we'll see. Presidents tend to favor free trade - even those Presidents who made protectionist noises when they were governors or senators. After all, the consumers who benefit from greater choice & lower prices live in all 50 states, while the workers whose jobs are potentially at risk are concentrated in a relatively small number of states.
As quickly as that oil drained out of my car, I'm surprised that anybody with a CR-V and that problem ever made it more than a mile or two before running dry and seizing the engine.
You'd be surprised how long an engine can run and survive w/o much oil. A friend of mine drove a early 90's Accord over 5 miles with zero oil. The oil change place forgot to put oil in it. He got home by the time he noticed the low oil pressure light on. The engine still made it to 200k when he finally traded it off.
My boat has a chevy 305 v8. This summer I was running full throttle when an oil line from the remote oil filter failed and I probably I ran it for several minutes at 5000rpm before I noticed the warning horn and 0 oil pressure on the gauge. I replaced the line (cleaned up one heck of a mess), and added 5 qts. of oil, and so far haven't noticed any issues.
My wife drove her '92 Saturn SL2 on a 100 trip with less than a qt of oil in it. When she told me it sounded like something wrong, I started it and it was chattering worse than a diesel. I had to put nearly 4qts of oil in it (4qts is all it held). Started it up and after about 5 minutes the valve train quieted down and the engine was fine until we finally traded it in a few years later.
As for issues with Toy/honda's etc. The people I know that had issues with them alway seemed happy with how they were taken care of and the problems resolved. The few foreign cars I've owned were great. The few problems I had were always met with exceptional service and support. That has not been the case with my GMs and Fords where I've often felt left out in the cold. I couldn't get GM to help me with my Suburban when the trans died at 46k and the A/C compressor at 65k. I got nothing but a big bill. Seems Toy/honda are more willing to help when out of warranty. When things go wrong it's an opportunity to either keep a customer happy or really piss them off. Seems the big 3 have done more of the latter.
rockylee: Is that what Consumer Reports, is telling you ???
Consumer Reports, Car and Driver, Edmunds.com, Thetruthaboutcars.com...pretty soon, the pile of evidence reaches Rocky Mountain proportions, and can't be denied.
Unless we are going to say that Toyota, Honda, BMW, etc. have conspired to secretly buy up every publication and website that tests new vehicles, and is now forcing them to rate imports higher.
rockylee: I can't think of to many area's GM, isn't competitive in ???? Sure they have a few area's to address or could make improvements but overall their line-up is a lot better than Fords and defintely Chrysler !!!
The competition isn't just Ford and Chrysler anymore...
rockylee: You are crazy !!! The Cobalt, is still selling pretty well despite it's aging design and the Astra, has been winning awards like the Aura and Malibu.
Astra sales have been terrible, and the car is missing some features it needs to be competitive in this segment. In October it sold a whopping 543 units. That can't be blamed entirely on the collapse in new car sales.
For the calendar year, its sales are a pathetic 9,707 units.
The Cobalt relies heavily on fleet sales to rental car companies. Its sales have been mediocre, at best, and only the SS versions are really competitive with the comparable Civic version (Si).
rockylee: The Saturn VUE, received a good review from edmunds and we both know the Trucks and SUV's are top notch.
I said that the full-size trucks and SUVs from GM are top notch.
The Vue has placed fifth or sixth in every comparison test I've ever read. If someone likes it, fine, but it's not really good enough to get anyone out of their RAV4 or CR-V. For that matter, I doubt that it will get many people out of their Escape.
The sludge problem occurs when oxidized oil builds up in an engine. Its forms a mucky goo that can cause the engine to seize up. Because the problem can be caused by failure to change the oil. Toyota has been refusing to cover repairs under its five-year/60,000-mile power train warranty.
But last week, Toyota sent letters to 3.3 million owners of vehicles equipped with the two engines affected by the problem -- the 1MZ V-6 and the 5SFE inline 4 -- saying it will pay for repair costs in cases where owners can prove they made "reasonable efforts" to maintain the vehicle.
Under the "special policy adjustment," which will be effective for only one year, Toyota says it will cover the cost of repairs if owners can show they made at least one oil change per year. The company, however, is refusing to back down from its contention that negligent owners are the cause of the problem, not a design defect or quality problem.
Hanson says the problems have been concentrated where winters are extremely cold and summers are especially humid and among owners who make a lot of short trips. Hanson says the company is making an immediate change to its V-6 engine that will give a wider margin of error if people wait too long to change their oil. A redesign of the four-cylinder already incorporated a similar change.
Used cars? Look at this case by case documentation. 3.3 million motors = 3.3 million customers. Toyota the darling of the business schools has gone on to blame the owners, many of which have the service records. Pathetic customer service and not an isolated case. The link below tells it all.
If the market is really free I ask you gagrice, to go buy a Harley Davidson
Let's turn that around. I can buy a Jaguar built in the UK here in the states for less than a Brit can buy the same car. It may be that no one in Japan wants a HD, Buick or Caddy. Why can Toyota build cars in Indiana at a profit and GM cannot? Major reason is excess baggage. Most of it added by the UAW. Wringing your hands will not make the competitive companies disappear.
It may be that no one in Japan wants a HD, Buick or Caddy.
Do they sell those Chinese Buicks in Japan, by any chance? I know they have a strong following in China, so maybe they would work in Japan, as well? I hear the Chinese Buicks are more like a Lexus in hierarchy though...too sophisticated, I guess, for us out here in the colonies. :sick:
I'm aware of the Chrysler 300 six having sludge issues and know of one that has its oil changed every 1000 miles. I wish someone would figure out what is the issue. We thought it was yankee oil, high in paraffin/wax, such as Quaker State/Penzoil. Then we moved on to crank case ventilation. Poor maintanence............ But no evidence to conclude anything.
Every manufacturer has issues from time to time, but it seems like the Japanese step up and remedy the problem much more quickly.
Five years in the courts seems excessive to me. Then only to pay the plaintiffs legal fees and some undisclosed sum to the plaintiff. Then the other customers have to jump through hoops to be made whole. A close friend of mine replaced the V6 is his 4 runner two years prior at about $5000 and Toyota hasn't contacted him. He had it replaced at a Toyota dealer. I will give credit to Honda in owning up to their responsibilities in a timely manner. However, Toyota is pathetic and has a history of this. 92, 93. 94, and 95 Camry owners got nothing in this cheap to keep Japanese and this is well documented and nothing to brag about.
I don't think you can lump Honda and Toyota together on the admit a mistake and fix it front. Honda is much more likely to step up to the plate. Toyota might be slighly ahead of Ford which is not saying much.
On Chinese Buicks - I wouldn't expect them to sell in Japan as there is still a lot of bitterness in Japan on things Chinese dating at least back to WWII. However, I have no actual knowledge on this so who knows?
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
I favor FREE TRADE. Barriers to entry, such as a company having to partner with a domestic company in China is anything but free. Once again, America is the number one consumer of cars/trucks and we should demand that barriers, hurdles, and tariffs be removed. China is the number two consumer of cars/trucks as of last year. China's consumers are given less choice in that protectionism of its industry for the sake of keeping jobs is just plain stealing from other the workers of other nations who produce cars/trucks.
Globalization is what were being sold, what do you call what China and others are practicing? Again they need to keep employment up in order to avoid an uprising which may threaten the ruling classes control (high level communist and their families) and wealth. Since they have one fifth of the future consumers of this planet, they can make unreasonable and absurd demands on corporations whom desire access to those consumers. They don't ask, they tell them to move companies and or establish companies in China. Some companies there make product during the day and knock offs at night. Patents, copyrights, intellectual property, and the likes are western concepts which are rarely enforced. The environmental crimes, exploitation of child/prison labor, and other western ideals are not even regulated.
Dog fur in coats sold by Burlington coat factory, lead paint on children's toys, pet food, and the list goes on. I'll bet that not even 1% of what is really going on there.
"Why can Toyota build cars in Indiana at a profit and GM cannot? Major reason is excess baggage."
I see 2 problems with that statement.
First, Toyota builds several of their models on the same Camry platform, much in the same way that Chrysler did in the early and mid '80's. I assume that much savings can be made in that arena.
Secondly, 50% of Toyota's products sold here are imported. Because they have been a global player moreso than GM, they can just switch products to this country easier than we can send products to Japan that have been designed for NA.
People in Japan may have no need for a Buick Enclave, but the better question would be why wouldn't a Vauxhall Astra be competitive in Japan, or a small Holden, as those cars are geared more toward a Japanese auto market (w/ RHD, diesel eng., etc).
For the first time in 16 years, Harley-Davidson Inc. regained the top slot for sales of heavy motorbikes in Japan last year, tapping its image for classic Americana to overtake rival Japanese makers. Harley, the largest motorcycle maker in the United States, said registrations of its bikes in Japan rose 7.6 percent, to 9,467 units, in 2000, while the overall market for motorcycles with engines larger than 750cc fell 0.9 percent, to 44,161 units. Harley-Davidson's success in Japan, its biggest foreign market, was aided by an expanded sales network and long financing programs.
2008
SUSIE GHARIB: And finally tonight, Harley Davidson is gearing up for its 105th anniversary this weekend. The company's four-day celebration kicked off today. Motorcycle riders from all over the country are making their way to Milwaukee, where a million Harley fans are expected to gather. While sales in the U.S. have slowed in the sluggish economy, overseas, it's a completely different story. Lucy Craft shows us how Harley hogs are all the rage in Japan.
One of the country's most successful manufacturing companies is having a hard time breaking into some of the world's most lucrative overseas markets. Harley-Davidson, an icon of American brands, is battling tariff and non-tariff barriers throughout the world, but particularly now in China, says company chairman and CEO Jeffery Bleustein.
"We cannot sell a motorcycle in China today unless we are willing to manufacture it there and, frankly, I don't think Harley-Davidson with its Americana image and the kinds of quality and features we put into the motorcycle would have the same cachi even in China if it were built in China," Bleustein told the recent winter meeting of the National Governors Association in Washington, D.C.
Bleustein said Harley-Davidson knock-offs are being sold in China's black market. But most people riding the fakes "want the authentic U.S. experience," he said. "They don't want one that was made in their country. They want the ones that were made where Harley-Davidsons are made."
Bleustein told the governors that this type of un-level playing field exists throughout the world in every product category. His examples "come from motorcycling but they can come from everyplace," he said. "I don't mind competing to sell motorcycles, but let's have a level playing field. We are far from a level playing field."
Dog fur in coats sold by Burlington coat factory, lead paint on children's toys, pet food, and the list goes on. I'll bet that not even 1% of what is really going on there.
Interesting but irrelevant. This is a discussion about the UAW, which means that we're talking about the automobile industry. I don't understand why you want to drag coats, dogs, toys or China into this conversation.
My wife had her Tahoe starter motor go out, just out of warranty, they charged $100, which included towing. Then too the rear A/C went out and they fixed it for free. Prior it had been serviced for hail damage by the insurance companies vendor of choice and more than likely they failed to put the head liner and duct system back on properly. So we were seeing the opposite with this GM dealer. However, I can speak for Honda other than they seem to have happy owners. They do get miles into the six digits, but by that time the car looks hideous/an eyesore.
Prior she had a 92 Camry which was a piece of fecal matter. You would not believe the price of parts on Toyota's these days. Those years of Camry are rated as poor for reliability. Her 79 Celica was an awesome car which was one of the 300,000 mile "cheap to keep" model as was her 82 Supra which was light years ahead of the VETT would have gone 300,000 miles too.
Unfortunately they are living on a past reputation and one can see this here on Edmund's if you look into the Toyota Matrix and more class actions in Canada. Add to that the sludge issues and enough said.
After the Camry, she will never ever buy Toyota again.
The UAW represents many industries and not just autos. China should respect the rights of workers to organize. Most of the auto industries woes are blamed on the UAW. Being it the scapegoat of gross mismanagement, as in the banking industry, we need to acknowledge that big labor goes hand in hand with big business. One could argue that unions have been besmirched as a term. Lobbing groups tend to call themselves guilds or associations and all the while service their membership. The AMA is nothing but a representative group for doctors as is the ABA a group who champions the lawyers agenda. They create barriers to entry and thereby limit competition as has been the case with realtors, At one time one in seven Americans had a real estate license. The number of students accepted into medical schools has been limited as to keep medical cost up. Was it the Wagner Act which upheld the right to organize? Call them what you will, organization are there to represent their members best interests.
Mentioned in the hearings today was that we cannot build cars in China with partnering with one of their companies.
We need to require a partner company for Toyota, Honda, et al, to continue building the fraction of cars here that they're not importing. That and eliminating the heavy burden of lush retirements and healthcare coverages for retirees and current high seniority workers, would revitalize the companies pronto -- and a complete management change at the top with drops to Japanese style pay rates for management.
My 2007 Mazdaspeed 3 needed a new LF strut and turbo prior to 26000 miles. And only one HPDE. I should have known what was coming after I checked the oil for the first time and saw "FOMOCO" stamped on the dipstick... :sick: From now on it's Munich or nothing...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Toyota might be slighly ahead of Ford which is not saying much.
Our good friend Ford. They did a cost benefit calculation and decided, by their own company memos, that folks cooked in a Pinto cost less than fixing all those Pinto's to begin with. Unfortunately, a fellow whom was one of their victims walked into court. All you could see were his eyes and mouth. He looked more alien than human. So punitive damages were awarded by the jury, a group of sane and rational people, much like you and I. My feelings are that if someone or a group decide to, wantonly overlook safety, it should be looked upon they had bad intentions and acted with malice. Therefore, as a society we must deter this behavior. Either capital punishment or prison time of these folks in management Will make others think before putting others at risk. Their decisions put many at risk. Otherwise, you have the same effect as ENRON happening when the punishment doesn't fit the crime. Many lost an enormous amount of money and a country club prison isn't likely and hasn't deterred others. If it was your money, I'm sure you would want a pound of flesh. Teaching ethics and moral turpitude in the business schools isn't going to change ones character.
I enjoy going to the factories. Black Lake Michigan is a favorite too. Here both management and labor share a special relation. Being multi faceted is my forte and I enjoy being able to weave my disciplines into new ideas. I majored in math and physics. Soon I was interested in economics, added an MBA and serve as a patent attorney. True I go off on tangents, but thats part of my genius/creativity. I've kept the same wife now for over 20 years. Sure she might be due for a trade in soon. Her skills and abilities, along with seniority, have to be taken into account. Her looks don't hurt her chances none either.
I feel very fortunate, as I have sired extraordinary offspring. Blessed to have a great family and have been able to provide well for them. By nature I'm frugal and don't require a fortune, however, my family is rather materialistic. In the spell of Madison Ave. They may out grow it.
I read those stories about the Toyota sludge problem. That's scary. How extensive is this problem, and why is Toyota the number 1 selling auto if this has any truth to it. My father had a 1987 Camry station wagon, a beautiful vehicle, and sure enough in the mid-90's that car needed a replacement engine, same reason. He put the engine in. WHY? I guess I better stick with BMW, since I was thinking of going with a Lexus. I'd like to know what about this problem.
Dallasdude, you better wake up out of your reverie. The UAW has killed the auto industry. They are the reason why the BIg 3 are failing. Period. Yes, you can blame management, but only for going along with union blackmail for all these years, instead of telling the workers to take a walk. They need to go into Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection, reorganize, and workers should be paid not one dime more than a Toyota or Honda worker, then the indstry will revive. Yes, you are going to take less. But if you don't you are going to have nothing. The American people are having none of it, trust me.
My point is GM, won the most top spots from "edmunds most wanted" last year. 2007 and 2008 GM, got rave reviews.....I am sick and tired of the media hammering about the Big 3's CEO's flying in corporate jets and left the unanswered question of does the CEO's of Toyota and Honda, fly on private jets ???? The cost is pocket change and these executives deserve to fly while on company time. ARM, fly's his family which should be a big No, No, IMHO !!!! ........If the american people want to get mad then they should look at the compensation packages of these executives at the Big 3 !!!! The media is too dumb to look at the other issues involved as to why the Big 3 have collapsed !!! It boils down as lemko and I were talkin' and it's all about having good paying jobs, which creates disposable income for people as well as healthcare reform, currency manipulation, and doing away with unfree trade !!!!
This country should be the beacon of manufacturing !!! Americans, can make some of the finest stuff in the world. Why should the american people tolerate shoddy stuff like tools made in China, that lemko, can break in half with his bare hands like it was a pencil ???? :confuse: We have accepted as a society slightly cheaper goods from China, when we use to make refridgerators made by GM, that are still running strong !!!! I would love to buy a modern day UAW-made, energy efficient refridgerator or ride on bullet trains made by GM. These type of technologies might cost a little more but damn it they will last a lifetime if you take care of it !!! Do you folks really want to continue to fund China, and let them steal our technology and know how ??? Where do you think they are investigating those dollars they make off of you ???? There Military Complex !!! I know I'm just some dumb son, grandson, nephew, cousin, stepson, step-grandchild of UAW, members but I feel like I'm cognizant enough to recognize the big picture !!!!
Let's turn that around. I can buy a Jaguar built in the UK here in the states for less than a Brit can buy the same car. It may be that no one in Japan wants a HD, Buick or Caddy.
No that's because it cost 3 times more in Japan. You are missing my point obviously !!!
Why can Toyota build cars in Indiana at a profit and GM cannot?
Well because they can sell them closer to sticker because americans have been dumb down to believe Japanese=Good, American=Bad !!! Just look at our media outlets and how biased they are !!!! :sick: Remember toyota imports 51% of it's cars making the currency manipulation a big factor in profitability as well !!! Yeah, of course they are non-union and don't contribute to the long term well being of their workforce, thus their workers rely on a Vegas 401K, Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. There JAW, workers back in Japan, have nationalized benefits.
Most of it added by the UAW. Wringing your hands will not make the competitive companies disappear.
If the american people had good jobs like in manufacturing like we once had then this whole going into a depression would be a non-issue because the economy would be rolling and people would be out spending money and buying new cars with their disposable income instead of buying pills which they are cutting in half and cutting coupons for a cheap meal !!!! The american people have lost their disposable income due to corporate greed and off-shoring !!! Why is this so hard for you to understand ??? These are the facts !!! Ask any economist !!! The lost of unions and good paying manufacturing jobs has lowered the standard of living of every sector but the healthcare, executive, levels of our economy. Oh let's not forget the energy sector !!!
Comments
-Rocky
umm, you might want to recheck your figures. More like $25k average.
http://www.motortrend.com/used_cars/09/2007/chevrolet/tahoe/index.html
It is competitive in large crossovers, and fields ONE competitive entry in the family sedan segment (Malibu) and entry-level luxury market (CTS). But a competitive entry isn't enough to get satisfied customers out of vehicles with better reputations or more presence in the market.
In every other segment, it is basically an also ran, especially in the important minicar and compact segments.
Who is giving those 20 million estimates?
Wonder if there have been studies made about how well former UAW persons that get laid off or downsized can acclimate to new non-union jobs. Can these folks change their attitudes and be more agreeable and team players? Or conversely, will some of them go into non-union places and then start to try and organize after a short time on the job.
We will be very vulnerable for an attack by one of our global enemies and we would not have the manufacturing capacity to fight a WWIII, but nobody outside of a few can see that fact !!!
I mentioned on a related board that the U.S. Army had purchased Toyota trucks for some of its needs from Korean war to early 60's. Since we are very strong allies with Japan, seems that they would step up and their companies such as Toyota and Nissan would help.
But, Ford and Chevrolet truck manufacturing will not go away anytime soon. F-Series and Silverado are the workhorses of American farms, ranches and construction businesses and have consistently led in total amount of all vehicle sales in the U.S.
It was an economist that was being interviewed I believe on CNN or MSNBC......
Wonder if there have been studies made about how well former UAW persons that get laid off or downsized can acclimate to new non-union jobs. Can these folks change their attitudes and be more agreeable and team players? Or conversely, will some of them go into non-union places and then start to try and organize after a short time on the job.
I guarantee you that UAW members are better team players than your non-union shops because they don't have to worry about a brown noser back stabbing them or having a time study done to see how fast they work every other day !!! This is the type of crap that really goes on. My mom had a time study done on her the other day and it's a way for them to look at people to fire !!! I'm sure each of you have time studies done on you right ??? How fast you can swallow that second cup of coffee or rasberry bismark on company time...Right !!!
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
Go to University Dodge down in Florida and buy a new Dodge Ram and get another one free.
The production cuts are the latest effort by the company to deal with shrinking demand in the U.S., which is expected to slip into recession this year.
Earlier this month, Toyota said net profit for the July-September quarter plunged 69 percent and downgraded its full-year profit forecast to about a third of last year's result. Officials said the company is also assessing its manufacturing operations.
http://www.mlive.com/newsflash/autonews/index.ssf?/base/business-89/122709452540- 530.xml&storylist=autonews2
Did she slow down or be more deliberate in actions, kind of like slow-motion?
Best time studies done when people not aware being done.
I have coffee whenever, breaks are so plebeian.
500 parttime at Georgetown!!!
"Beginning January, Japan's top automaker plans to reduce production of the Sienna minivan at its Indiana plant, and slow a line for the Camry and Avalon sedans at the Kentucky plant, Doi said."
"At New United Motor Manufacturing Inc. in Fremont, California — its joint venture with General Motors Corp. — Toyota will eliminate a shift producing the Tacoma pickup truck. "
So much for the PR piece on how they pay their people even when cutting back?
Or are they doing what the UAW negotiated for??? and have work locations for people who aren't working?
I'm going to have to find that post or article.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I agree in part. But did Toyota lose any customers with the engine sludge issue? Google it and the five year law suit which gave the issue closure. Then they still have yet to admit any fault. Then Honda had its transmissions issues. They should be given credit owning/fessing up and correcting the problem.
Those Toyota's covered many year models and the onus was put on the owners to made whole. Many were not and this just proves that there is a vast number of consumers whom have yet to be burned. All manufacturers will have issues regardless of they being union or non - union. These engineering issues have little to do with the workers on the lines and more of a design issue.
With America being the police of the world. Engineering talent is being diverted into the defense and space fields. This talent would make a difference if its energy was also put into automobiles. No one could argue that we are light years ahead in defense and space.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
True that the current retirees get their full benefit. However, those yet not retired get a reduced benefit under the PBGC. Pension funds are separate from the company. In another entity as to not have a conflict of interest. They are funded by the company by a formula to make sure there is enough money to cover present/future liabilities. They invest the money and assume a rate of return. All of this is factored in and hence, when the market is under preforming, many pensions need more funding. So its true that underfunding is a burden on the taxpayer.
I'm a little undecided on sludge, myself. I have a 2007 Dodge Intrepid with the 2.7 V-6, another engine that's supposed to be infamous for sludging. However, I have about 143,000 miles on mine, and have never had any problems. And I hate to fess up to this, but I haven't been exactly religious about changing my oil.
Every mechanic I've ever talked to about sludge, in ANY car, has said that you have to really abuse them to get them to do that. Let the oil run too low, overheat them and keep driving them, let the oil go way too long between changes, etc.
Anyway, I've heard that Toyota actually will step up and take care of their sludge customers...at least moreso than Chrysler would.
I've also heard that with those 5-speed automatics that Honda had problems with, Honda would extend the warranties on them, and make other concessions to those people afflicted with them.
My Mom & stepdad had the transmission in their 1999 Altima fail at 35,000 miles. My first thought was oh here we go, another Nissan piece of crap. Before that they had a '91 Stanza that was pretty bad by around 90K miles, although they limped it on to around 110-115K. But Nissan replaced their transmission, with no fuss, accusations, etc, and now that same car has over 250,000 miles on it.
I would like to think that Chrysler would have done the same for me if my Intrepid ate its transmission. But I'm not holding my breath on that one. However, I was impressed that they helped out one of my friends years ago, who bought a Dodge Dynasty. I think it was a 1990. It had the 3.3 Mopar V-6 and that new "Ultradrive" 4-speed automatic that was infamous for early failure. I think the first time it failed, it was just out of warranty, but close enough that they covered it in good faith. The second time it failed, around 86,000 miles, they paid for half of it. However, we're also talking back in the early/mid 1990's. I dunno if they'd be so generous today!
Every manufacturer has issues from time to time, but it seems like the Japanese step up and remedy the problem much more quickly.
She kept her same pace because if she would of slowed down she might not of been as fast as some other person thus when they look toward firing someone she would be one of the first to go !!!! That is the reality of the non-union work enviroment !!!! They also were looking at mirrors the quality auditors passed that were bad and if you have so many bad ones per million even though you are working like a hebrew slave and better not take too long to look well you could be fired also for that !!! What's sad is sometimes they don't have enough work due to the glass cutting area being down yet they better work at a very fast pace !!!
CRAZY !!!
-Rocky
rmb26, "Toyota Highlander Maintenance and Repair" #4435, 19 Nov 2008 7:02 am
Honda continues to have AC compressor issues with CR-Vs too. Honda, to their credit, is covering a lot of them after warranty, but whether you get coverage is a bit of a crap shoot.
Is that what Consumer Reports, is telling you ??? I can't think of to many area's GM, isn't competitive in ???? Sure they have a few area's to address or could make improvements but overall their line-up is a lot better than Fords and defintely Chrysler !!!
It is competitive in large crossovers, and fields ONE competitive entry in the family sedan segment (Malibu) and entry-level luxury market (CTS). But a competitive entry isn't enough to get satisfied customers out of vehicles with better reputations or more presence in the market.
You are crazy !!! The Cobalt, is still selling pretty well despite it's aging design and the Astra, has been winning awards like the Aura and Malibu. The Saturn VUE, received a good review from edmunds and we both know the Trucks and SUV's are top notch. Sure the STS, needs to be redone as does the LaCrosse....Hummer's H3 is selling pretty well but the Colorado/Canyon, should be replaced or refreshened with a quality interior..... I feel that GM, is very competitive but given our sagging economy the only automobiles that are selling are those that appeal to the wealthy trophy wifes which are mainly the luxury brands of the Japanese and/or Germans.
-Rocky
Seriously GM, is the #1 advertiser on this site and it makes me wonder ????
-Rocky
I don't know if I'd blame this issue on the vehicle or the oil filter, though. In early 2007 I changed the oil filter on my 2000 Intrepid, which just uses the generic spin-on oil filters that have been around since 1958 or so. I've NEVER experienced this before, but this time, the filter came off and left its gasket attached to the car. I didn't notice, and put the new filter on. Started the car up, and it began to make the most perverted noises, sort of like what the GreaseMan might do (if you know who he is). And the car immediately dumped about 3 quarts of oil on my grandmother's driveway!
As quickly as that oil drained out of my car, I'm surprised that anybody with a CR-V and that problem ever made it more than a mile or two before running dry and seizing the engine.
You'd be surprised how long an engine can run and survive w/o much oil. A friend of mine drove a early 90's Accord over 5 miles with zero oil. The oil change place forgot to put oil in it. He got home by the time he noticed the low oil pressure light on. The engine still made it to 200k when he finally traded it off.
My boat has a chevy 305 v8. This summer I was running full throttle when an oil line from the remote oil filter failed and I probably I ran it for several minutes at 5000rpm before I noticed the warning horn and 0 oil pressure on the gauge. I replaced the line (cleaned up one heck of a mess), and added 5 qts. of oil, and so far haven't noticed any issues.
My wife drove her '92 Saturn SL2 on a 100 trip with less than a qt of oil in it. When she told me it sounded like something wrong, I started it and it was chattering worse than a diesel. I had to put nearly 4qts of oil in it (4qts is all it held). Started it up and after about 5 minutes the valve train quieted down and the engine was fine until we finally traded it in a few years later.
As for issues with Toy/honda's etc. The people I know that had issues with them alway seemed happy with how they were taken care of and the problems resolved. The few foreign cars I've owned were great. The few problems I had were always met with exceptional service and support. That has not been the case with my GMs and Fords where I've often felt left out in the cold. I couldn't get GM to help me with my Suburban when the trans died at 46k and the A/C compressor at 65k. I got nothing but a big bill. Seems Toy/honda are more willing to help when out of warranty. When things go wrong it's an opportunity to either keep a customer happy or really piss them off. Seems the big 3 have done more of the latter.
Consumer Reports, Car and Driver, Edmunds.com, Thetruthaboutcars.com...pretty soon, the pile of evidence reaches Rocky Mountain proportions, and can't be denied.
Unless we are going to say that Toyota, Honda, BMW, etc. have conspired to secretly buy up every publication and website that tests new vehicles, and is now forcing them to rate imports higher.
rockylee: I can't think of to many area's GM, isn't competitive in ???? Sure they have a few area's to address or could make improvements but overall their line-up is a lot better than Fords and defintely Chrysler !!!
The competition isn't just Ford and Chrysler anymore...
rockylee: You are crazy !!! The Cobalt, is still selling pretty well despite it's aging design and the Astra, has been winning awards like the Aura and Malibu.
Astra sales have been terrible, and the car is missing some features it needs to be competitive in this segment. In October it sold a whopping 543 units. That can't be blamed entirely on the collapse in new car sales.
For the calendar year, its sales are a pathetic 9,707 units.
The Cobalt relies heavily on fleet sales to rental car companies. Its sales have been mediocre, at best, and only the SS versions are really competitive with the comparable Civic version (Si).
rockylee: The Saturn VUE, received a good review from edmunds and we both know the Trucks and SUV's are top notch.
I said that the full-size trucks and SUVs from GM are top notch.
The Vue has placed fifth or sixth in every comparison test I've ever read. If someone likes it, fine, but it's not really good enough to get anyone out of their RAV4 or CR-V. For that matter, I doubt that it will get many people out of their Escape.
True, but as far as I'm concerned, they're my only other alternatives - in favor of Chrysler.
But last week, Toyota sent letters to 3.3 million owners of vehicles equipped with the two engines affected by the problem -- the 1MZ V-6 and the 5SFE inline 4 -- saying it will pay for repair costs in cases where owners can prove they made "reasonable efforts" to maintain the vehicle.
Under the "special policy adjustment," which will be effective for only one year, Toyota says it will cover the cost of repairs if owners can show they made at least one oil change per year. The company, however, is refusing to back down from its contention that negligent owners are the cause of the problem, not a design defect or quality problem.
Hanson says the problems have been concentrated where winters are extremely cold and summers are especially humid and among owners who make a lot of short trips. Hanson says the company is making an immediate change to its V-6 engine that will give a wider margin of error if people wait too long to change their oil. A redesign of the four-cylinder already incorporated a similar change.
Used cars? Look at this case by case documentation. 3.3 million motors = 3.3 million customers. Toyota the darling of the business schools has gone on to blame the owners, many of which have the service records. Pathetic customer service and not an isolated case. The link below tells it all.
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/toyota_engine.html
Let's turn that around. I can buy a Jaguar built in the UK here in the states for less than a Brit can buy the same car. It may be that no one in Japan wants a HD, Buick or Caddy. Why can Toyota build cars in Indiana at a profit and GM cannot? Major reason is excess baggage. Most of it added by the UAW. Wringing your hands will not make the competitive companies disappear.
Do they sell those Chinese Buicks in Japan, by any chance? I know they have a strong following in China, so maybe they would work in Japan, as well? I hear the Chinese Buicks are more like a Lexus in hierarchy though...too sophisticated, I guess, for us out here in the colonies. :sick:
Every manufacturer has issues from time to time, but it seems like the Japanese step up and remedy the problem much more quickly.
Five years in the courts seems excessive to me. Then only to pay the plaintiffs legal fees and some undisclosed sum to the plaintiff. Then the other customers have to jump through hoops to be made whole. A close friend of mine replaced the V6 is his 4 runner two years prior at about $5000 and Toyota hasn't contacted him. He had it replaced at a Toyota dealer. I will give credit to Honda in owning up to their responsibilities in a timely manner. However, Toyota is pathetic and has a history of this. 92, 93. 94, and 95 Camry owners got nothing in this cheap to keep Japanese and this is well documented and nothing to brag about.
On Chinese Buicks - I wouldn't expect them to sell in Japan as there is still a lot of bitterness in Japan on things Chinese dating at least back to WWII. However, I have no actual knowledge on this so who knows?
I favor FREE TRADE. Barriers to entry, such as a company having to partner with a domestic company in China is anything but free. Once again, America is the number one consumer of cars/trucks and we should demand that barriers, hurdles, and tariffs be removed. China is the number two consumer of cars/trucks as of last year. China's consumers are given less choice in that protectionism of its industry for the sake of keeping jobs is just plain stealing from other the workers of other nations who produce cars/trucks.
Globalization is what were being sold, what do you call what China and others are practicing? Again they need to keep employment up in order to avoid an uprising which may threaten the ruling classes control (high level communist and their families) and wealth. Since they have one fifth of the future consumers of this planet, they can make unreasonable and absurd demands on corporations whom desire access to those consumers. They don't ask, they tell them to move companies and or establish companies in China. Some companies there make product during the day and knock offs at night. Patents, copyrights, intellectual property, and the likes are western concepts which are rarely enforced. The environmental crimes, exploitation of child/prison labor, and other western ideals are not even regulated.
Dog fur in coats sold by Burlington coat factory, lead paint on children's toys, pet food, and the list goes on. I'll bet that not even 1% of what is really going on there.
I see 2 problems with that statement.
First, Toyota builds several of their models on the same Camry platform, much in the same way that Chrysler did in the early and mid '80's. I assume that much savings can be made in that arena.
Secondly, 50% of Toyota's products sold here are imported. Because they have been a global player moreso than GM, they can just switch products to this country easier than we can send products to Japan that have been designed for NA.
People in Japan may have no need for a Buick Enclave, but the better question would be why wouldn't a Vauxhall Astra be competitive in Japan, or a small Holden, as those cars are geared more toward a Japanese auto market (w/ RHD, diesel eng., etc).
2001
For the first time in 16 years, Harley-Davidson Inc. regained the top slot for sales of heavy motorbikes in Japan last year, tapping its image for classic Americana to overtake rival Japanese makers. Harley, the largest motorcycle maker in the United States, said registrations of its bikes in Japan rose 7.6 percent, to 9,467 units, in 2000, while the overall market for motorcycles with engines larger than 750cc fell 0.9 percent, to 44,161 units. Harley-Davidson's success in Japan, its biggest foreign market, was aided by an expanded sales network and long financing programs.
2008
SUSIE GHARIB: And finally tonight, Harley Davidson is gearing up for its 105th anniversary this weekend. The company's four-day celebration kicked off today. Motorcycle riders from all over the country are making their way to Milwaukee, where a million Harley fans are expected to gather. While sales in the U.S. have slowed in the sluggish economy, overseas, it's a completely different story. Lucy Craft shows us how Harley hogs are all the rage in Japan.
http://www.pbs.org/nbr/site/onair/transcripts/080827e/
now in China
One of the country's most successful manufacturing companies is having a hard time breaking into some of the world's most lucrative overseas markets. Harley-Davidson, an icon of American brands, is battling tariff and non-tariff barriers throughout the world, but particularly now in China, says company chairman and CEO Jeffery Bleustein.
"We cannot sell a motorcycle in China today unless we are willing to manufacture it there and, frankly, I don't think Harley-Davidson with its Americana image and the kinds of quality and features we put into the motorcycle would have the same cachi even in China if it were built in China," Bleustein told the recent winter meeting of the National Governors Association in Washington, D.C.
Bleustein said Harley-Davidson knock-offs are being sold in China's black market. But most people riding the fakes "want the authentic U.S. experience," he said. "They don't want one that was made in their country. They want the ones that were made where Harley-Davidsons are made."
Bleustein told the governors that this type of un-level playing field exists throughout the world in every product category. His examples "come from motorcycling but they can come from everyplace," he said. "I don't mind competing to sell motorcycles, but let's have a level playing field. We are far from a level playing field."
Interesting but irrelevant. This is a discussion about the UAW, which means that we're talking about the automobile industry. I don't understand why you want to drag coats, dogs, toys or China into this conversation.
Prior she had a 92 Camry which was a piece of fecal matter. You would not believe the price of parts on Toyota's these days. Those years of Camry are rated as poor for reliability. Her 79 Celica was an awesome car which was one of the 300,000 mile "cheap to keep" model as was her 82 Supra which was light years ahead of the VETT would have gone 300,000 miles too.
Unfortunately they are living on a past reputation and one can see this here on Edmund's if you look into the Toyota Matrix and more class actions in Canada. Add to that the sludge issues and enough said.
After the Camry, she will never ever buy Toyota again.
We need to require a partner company for Toyota, Honda, et al, to continue building the fraction of cars here that they're not importing. That and eliminating the heavy burden of lush retirements and healthcare coverages for retirees and current high seniority workers, would revitalize the companies pronto -- and a complete management change at the top with drops to Japanese style pay rates for management.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
From now on it's Munich or nothing...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Our good friend Ford. They did a cost benefit calculation and decided, by their own company memos, that folks cooked in a Pinto cost less than fixing all those Pinto's to begin with. Unfortunately, a fellow whom was one of their victims walked into court. All you could see were his eyes and mouth. He looked more alien than human. So punitive damages were awarded by the jury, a group of sane and rational people, much like you and I. My feelings are that if someone or a group decide to, wantonly overlook safety, it should be looked upon they had bad intentions and acted with malice. Therefore, as a society we must deter this behavior. Either capital punishment or prison time of these folks in management Will make others think before putting others at risk. Their decisions put many at risk. Otherwise, you have the same effect as ENRON happening when the punishment doesn't fit the crime. Many lost an enormous amount of money and a country club prison isn't likely and hasn't deterred others. If it was your money, I'm sure you would want a pound of flesh. Teaching ethics and moral turpitude in the business schools isn't going to change ones character.
UAW employees build Corollas in California, the Geo Prism was a Chevy off the same line.
The small Toyota truck is another joint venture. Tacoma/Pre Runner
However, they weren't force to and did it of their own free will. Both found that they would benefit from the venture/relation.
We need to require a partnership where the foreign company puts money into the US company and is locked in with it from then on.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I feel very fortunate, as I have sired extraordinary offspring. Blessed to have a great family and have been able to provide well for them. By nature I'm frugal and don't require a fortune, however, my family is rather materialistic. In the spell of Madison Ave. They may out grow it.
Enough about myself and elaborate on yourself.
This country should be the beacon of manufacturing !!! Americans, can make some of the finest stuff in the world. Why should the american people tolerate shoddy stuff like tools made in China, that lemko, can break in half with his bare hands like it was a pencil ???? :confuse: We have accepted as a society slightly cheaper goods from China, when we use to make refridgerators made by GM, that are still running strong !!!! I would love to buy a modern day UAW-made, energy efficient refridgerator or ride on bullet trains made by GM. These type of technologies might cost a little more but damn it they will last a lifetime if you take care of it !!! Do you folks really want to continue to fund China, and let them steal our technology and know how ??? Where do you think they are investigating those dollars they make off of you ???? There Military Complex !!! I know I'm just some dumb son, grandson, nephew, cousin, stepson, step-grandchild of UAW, members but I feel like I'm cognizant enough to recognize the big picture !!!!
-Rocky
No that's because it cost 3 times more in Japan. You are missing my point obviously !!!
Why can Toyota build cars in Indiana at a profit and GM cannot?
Well because they can sell them closer to sticker because americans have been dumb down to believe Japanese=Good, American=Bad !!! Just look at our media outlets and how biased they are !!!! :sick: Remember toyota imports 51% of it's cars making the currency manipulation a big factor in profitability as well !!! Yeah, of course they are non-union and don't contribute to the long term well being of their workforce, thus their workers rely on a Vegas 401K, Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. There JAW, workers back in Japan, have nationalized benefits.
Most of it added by the UAW. Wringing your hands will not make the competitive companies disappear.
If the american people had good jobs like in manufacturing like we once had then this whole going into a depression would be a non-issue because the economy would be rolling and people would be out spending money and buying new cars with their disposable income instead of buying pills which they are cutting in half and cutting coupons for a cheap meal !!!! The american people have lost their disposable income due to corporate greed and off-shoring !!! Why is this so hard for you to understand ??? These are the facts !!! Ask any economist !!! The lost of unions and good paying manufacturing jobs has lowered the standard of living of every sector but the healthcare, executive, levels of our economy. Oh let's not forget the energy sector !!!
-Rocky
Also lets not forget medicine and food pal !!! I'm like paranoid when shopping for food now to see where it's grown or made !!! :surprise:
-Rocky
-Rocky
http://www.michaelmoore.com