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However the production is still going and workers are still working. Hopefully the negotiations will continue instead of an AK Steel setup by management occuring in Springfield.
link title
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The company didn't say they "would move production to another plant instead of negotiating".
What the article says is: "company officials announced that truck assembly is going to be moved out of the Springfield plant to plants in Texas and Mexico until negotiations conclude."There's a difference.
There's more to the story too.
Truck sales are in the tank right now. Few big rigs are being purchased these days. This manufacturer is hanging on by a thread. So are all the other big rig manufacturers.
A couple of years ago, the International assembly plant in Chatham Ontario was a candidate for closure due to low sales. The Canadian version of UAW--the CAW--decided to hold demonstrations at the site. These became violent very quickly because an unruly mob showed up--including the Union President who was charged with throwing a cement block through a vehicle window, resulting in serious injuries to the driver. He was charged and stood trial for a number of criminal offences.
One of his cronies stood up in court and took the blame by lying and saying it a was him who threw the thing, not the President!
The good news is that site is still operating, albeit on a much reduced scale.
So this company is perhaps justifiably gunshy about any mgt/labor situation getting out of hand.
Let's face it, there's often much more to these situations than first meets the eye.
I also think that seeing an older guy get the shaft after many years of service builds no loyalty to the company in that younger worker.
Furthermore, all the streets, sidewalks, and buildings everywhere are covered with a brown iron oxide stain. Nice!!
Re your older guy editorial "an older guy get the shaft after many years of service builds no loyalty to the company in that younger worker":
Better have a chat with your UAW hierarchy.
One of their big red buttons of late is for workers with 30 or more years seniority to take voluntary retirement so younger workers can be guaranteed a job!!
Is your comment therefore sort of a dichotomy?
It was like that before the Daimler / Chrysler "merger of equals". The lots nearest the building are for Chrysler vehicles, and the farther lots are for "competitive vehicles".
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/opinion/20070930_Editorial___Three_Gorges_Dam.htm- l
Respect between and for unions of union people is something that most non-unionized workers can't appreciate. I was in a union at one time many years ago and worked at a company location of approx 2,000+ employees.
The union called a strike at one particular time and I honored it and walked the picket lines at the plant entrance every day over a couple of weeks. I had seen time after time trucks pulling up to entrance and drivers asking us what was going on. When we explained, and of course they saw our signs, not a one of them crossed the line. They turned around. I believe these were Teamster members driving the trucks. Company management had to make arrangements to go get goods and drive them into the plant by themselves. How many white collars (or non-unionized) of any company would sympathize/empathize with their peers at another company.
I see 80's Japanese cars as well as 80's GM, Ford and Chrysler on the road. Unless there are particular collectibles, such as Corvettes, late 60's Mustangs, etc., or you are very poor, don't know why anywone would want to drive 20-25 year old cars today. And, these American collectibles can last 50, 60, 70+ years given that their owners generally only drive them on weekends and keep them out of the elements. But, some people out of choice, do like to drive old non-collectibles.
In my own case, cross-shopped American brands vs Honda/Toyota in 84 and 86 and IMO, the Japanese brands were superior to American. Unlike many GM plant workers, I owned and drove an 84 and 86 Hondas and an 86 Suburban, each for approx 14 years. I could clearly see the differences. While the Suburban was a great utility vehicle that served me well, no way was it a match for quality, reliability, fit/finish, interior, paint, etc to the Hondas. Kept Hondas to 195K and 247K miles and easily sold via newspaper want-ads.
-Rocky
whether you agree or don't agree now with organized labor you honoring the strike back then was the right morale thing to do IMHO.
-Rocky
I don't know what all this quality talk is about because after 5 years in the rust belt those cars looked like they were shot up with all the holes in the sheet metal. But yeah, they were superior. :surprise:
-Rocky
930,000 mile '95 Honda Civic
Wages $28.44
OT 3.90
Vacation 6.62
Upfront Bonus 0.60
Other Misc. 2.09
Total Wages 41.65
Pension 4.94
Group Life 1.40
Healthcare 13.38
FICA&UC 3.26
Other Misc 0.35
Total Ben 23.34
Total 64.99
This does not include the cost of current retirees, but does include the future cost of retirement for active workers.
Source: pgs 30-31 http://www.cargroup.org/pdfs/LaborPaperFinal.PDF
With the newly draw up contract between the UAW and GM, the automaker will transfer almost $30 billion into a what is basically a health care fund, with another $5 billion to $7 billion added down the road. As Salmon says, that's more than enough to just buy the General outright, essentially turning it into an employee-owned company.
Source: Could the UAW buy GM?
Why is the figure cited as hourly labor costs by the companies so much higher than the wage rates?
In addition to regular hourly pay, the labor cost figures cited by the companies include other expenses associated with having a person on payroll. This includes overtime, shift premiums and the costs of negotiated benefits such as holidays, vacations, health care, pensions and education and training. It also includes statutory costs, which employers are required to pay by law, such as federal contributions for Social Security and Medicare, and state payments to workers’ compensation and unemployment insurance funds. The highest figures sometimes cited also include the benefit costs of retirees who are no longer on the payroll.
Notice that they don't dispute the number that the companies cite, they are just explaining it.
-Rocky
P.S. That is the CREDIBLE evidence from a 3rd party I was looking for. Thanks for the find.
They would have blown their cash buying GM and STILL have to pay the benefits that they would owe themselves.
-Rocky
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
How much value do UAW members contribute to their employers?
American autoworkers are among the most productive workers in the world. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, the typical autoworker produces value added worth $206 per worker per hour.1 This is far more than he or she earns in wages, even when benefits, statutory contributions and other costs are included.
How much are labor costs in relation to the total price of a new vehicle?
The total labor cost of a new vehicle produced in the United States is about $2,400,2 which includes direct, indirect and salaried labor for engines, stamping and assembly at the automakers’ plants.
-Rocky
You bring up a good point imidazol97 !!!!
Was it not Ford's executive "FIELDS" that was using the corporate jet to fly to Florida, every weekend costing FoMoCo. like $2.4 million. :surprise: Yeah, stuff like that is left out of the executive compensation calculations. :surprise:
-Rocky
does that include the management cost? What is the cost of managers per car--all those not physically working as are the UAW.
>the typical autoworker produces value added worth $206 per worker per hour
The extra about the $65 cited goes to cover management cost since the company has nominally not been making any money.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The only American cars I see that old are sitting up on milk crates, no wheels, solid rust, next to the barn, and that is only because someone mowed the grass right up to the vehicle, which was hidden from view until the mowing
Altho, just tonite, I saw a restored 1970 Olds Cutlass, 2 door, convertible, silver in showrrom condition...I guessed 1971, as the taillights were distinctive, but he said it was a 70...those were the days of REAL Rocket 350 engines, and boy, do I miss those...
L
P.S. Not implying that these quality issues were caused by UAW, as most all the issues seemed to stem from design, cheap parts, engineering goofs, and such. Perhaps it was the bean counters. So in a way, we are straying into something aside of the topic anyway here.
As for rust, it's not like the domestics don't. The front bumper on my Suburban is starting to rust and my FIL has a 95 tahoe that he washed religiously and all four door are about to rust completely thru. I don't think we want to start up an 80's to early 90's car comparison thread. That is a big part of the reason GM finds themselves in the situation they are in.
PS
My son's 4Runner was rusted through at 10 years. :sick:
I don't know Loren ??? I would assume it's Japanese or Chinese since they are the biggest steel producers. The problem with the Japanese cars back then 70's/80's was their steel didn't have the what do you call it ???? Missing elements in their steel ????? I guess some might call it Impurity or Temper Embrittlement, causing premature rusting and corrosion.
Didn't they change the metal in Japan made products some time around mid-nineties ? Look, if you want to dig up real problems, start with the 1970's, '80's and 90's domestic problem cars right off the production line. Best not to go there. Things have improved for domestic cars. If you dig up the past, Pandora's Box will open, and countless accounts of crappy cars will be posted. Let's not go there. All cars are pretty close now for reliability. Durability, is a possible. I'll leave it at that. L
P.S. Not implying that these quality issues were caused by UAW, as most all the issues seemed to stem from design, cheap parts, engineering goofs, and such. Perhaps it was the bean counters. So in a way, we are straying into something aside of the topic anyway here.
I know you and others will throw daggers at the 80's domestic vehicles. However your opposition could do the same torwards your Japanese/Euro makes and models of the same era. I could pop the lid off that old can of worms where Toyota, hid their recalls if ya like ?
-Rocky
Well if it's not VW, then who gagrice ???? I guess Audi is the same as VW on warranty ????
-Rocky
Now that you mention it, I'd say in general it seems German cars don't seem to rust to bad. I can't say that I can recall seeing a rusted out BMW, Porche, or MB. I've seen a few old VW Bugs and Rabbits that were rusted, but in all they seem to resist rust pretty well.
American autoworkers are among the most productive workers in the world. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, the typical autoworker produces value added worth $206 per worker per hour.1 This is far more than he or she earns in wages, even when benefits, statutory contributions and other costs are included.
1 U.S. Census Bureau, Annual Survey of Manufactures 2005 data
I don't know exactly how it's calculated Loren. If nobody else looks up the article first I willtry to get around to it.
I have a job interview east of Lansing, at 2 P.M. thus I better get some sleep as I have a long drive and day a head of me.
-good night from the Great Lake State
-Rocky
P.S. Here's a link worth reading I found earlier.....
http://www.uaw.org/barg/072/barg072_complete.pdf
So where's your source on the productivity of Union shops? You claimed you remember reading it in a Union newsletter and quote it as gospel, yet when GM claims a figure you call it "propaganda".
Which one is it?
As I have said before, on a dealership level I have NEVER seen a dealer service department go Union and not drop in productivity and profitability. Not once ever.
The $28 per hour fits about what you can buy a home in Michigan for, and that is $200k. That is based on 6.5% interest. If Interest was to go up to 8% that wage would not be enough to safely buy the average home.
When I say safely, I mean without all the smoke & mirrors that has resulted in the highest rate of home loan default on record. The CA real estate market is buried in foreclosures. I know personally 3 families that are losing their homes because they were sucked into sub prime loans. It is going to get real bad in the next few years.
I say go team to the UAW for keeping a few people at a living wage.
PS
Good luck on the job interview....
That is not your typical appreciation around the country. The mid For Ex. my FIL still lives in the same house he bought in NW Indiana (he's a retired iron worker from the steel mills). He paid about $20k for it in 1973. He'd be lucky to get $100k for it today.
Accourding to the National Association or Realtors "The median existing single-family home price in the Midwest was $163,500" during the second quarter of this year. Still very affordable for many.
The NAR reported the highest metro area is San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara area of California where the median price was $865,000. Wow, need some serious coin to afford a house out there.
Comparing a sales/service environment to manufacturing is completely apples and oranges.
My cousin worked for a Union Contractor in Minneapolis. If the builder could slide a piece of paper between the miter joints on the trim it was ripped out and redone. You did not get many bad joints before he sent you packing. Workers are only as good as the supervision above them.
GM should demand quality work from their line workers to the CEO. Then we will get top quality cars and trucks. I don't see the UAW trying to resist if it is administered fairly.
True, if you look at any list that reports most admired companies, best managed, best companies to work for etc, you won't see a member of the Big 3 mentioned.