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Comments
I think the best thing would be for Chrysler to go under. Mercedes got bamboozled into buying an "equal" and Chrysler's world market share is dismal. When Mercedes bastardized them they were left with no R&D and technology. Mercedes can buy Jeep and Nissan can make the Ram.
As for GM, in one for or another they need to stick around. A government aided bankruptcy may be the best choice, but they will keep digging themselves into a hole the way things are now. If they can be the 5th largest automaker and sustain a profit, that is a success,
Let's face it. GM and Chrysler's years of bad products has caught up two fold:
-No one wants to buy their cars
-People hate the companies so much they would rather see them fail
If only the Cimarron had never been made. :lemon:
I agree. Rocky, it's not your fault that GM has the Volt they've been advertising for 3 years that isn't in the showrooms yet. It's not like GM has a Prius or Civic or even a Genesis to sell. That's not your fault. With your passion I'm sure we would all buy from you if we were in MI and you were selling the cars we wanted!
Best of luck in this tough market.
So as this is probably my last post for the evening I will get on here tomorrow and let you guys know how it went down. I have a feeling I won't get positive feedback from the management team but my coworkers probably will appreciate the new guy having enough hair on his you know what to say something.
-Rocky
These are just some examples of how everything can't be blamed on the United Automobile Workers. They can only do the best job they can with the parts they are given. The UAW workers can't make miracles happen!!!
-Rocky
Good night from G-RAP!!!
-Rocky
All of the carbon credit junk and other burdens put on the first world in the name of the environment are simply a scheme to bankrupt the first world to make it easier to submit to the dumbed down globalized new world order.
The plight of the automakers will just be used a distraction from nationalization elsewhere.
And that's the way it's always going to be. He's family, and you're not, so when push comes to shove, he's gonna win every time. I've seen that in other small, family owned/run businesses. Friend of mine works for small, family owned coffee wholesaler. They are still back in the 70's in so far as their bookkeeping is concerned, and she wanted to bring them into the [non-permissible content removed] era. No dice - the owner doesn't understand that new-fangled computer stuff, and paper records and inventory control work just fine, thank you very much.
The total pollution and environmental damage to build a hybrid is greater than a Civic or Corolla or Cobalt is less over their lifetime. We're going to see if Geithner knows how to run an auto company. He hasn't done well at anything else since TARP 1; he hasn't done well at handling the UAW inequity costs problem with the higher paid, older faction thereof.
>I think you can chalk me up for a non-Obama, vote next election.
ROFL
>Hillary, would be light years better than what we got now.
No. No. No. She in last couple of days made statement that we have to protect or take care of the interests of the Chinese. Remember all the money Bill (and SHE) took from the Chinese? She wouldn't be using that to extend the interests of the Old UAW even though she would have used them even more than the NEA in pimping for her election votes.
I think it's going to be funny to see how they spin what this may do to the Old UAW folks. The media will help but it will be something like adding 5 trillion to the total debt over 5 years and saying that we want to cut the debt in half, both at the same time.
>I am removing Barry, from my Myspace friends tonight because of what he is doing to Wagoner.
ROFL!!!
May I say, I told ya?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The criticism of GM is two fold. Aloof management unable to run a company efficiently, in turn loosing billions.
GM's product quality since the 60's. That Pontiac Sunfire is a great example. The Civic and Corrola have developed a loyal fanbase. Would they ever retire that nameplate?
In the past four years, GM has piled up $82 billion in losses.
Tax payers good will is the only reason GM is around.
Chrysler looks gone. Fiat is not , and in this world recession it will be hard for Fiat to justify buying a failing company. Fiat may be in bailout territory as well.
http://money.cnn.com/2009/03/29/news/companies/motor_world.fortune/index.htm :lemon:
The White House pushed out GM's chairman and directed Chrysler to move quickly to forge a partnership with Fiat if it expects to receive additional government assistance.
President Barack Obama and his top advisers have determined that neither company is viable and that taxpayers will not spend untold billions more to keep the pair of automakers open forever.
In a last-ditch effort, the administration gave each company a brief deadline to try one last time to convince Washington it is worth saving, said senior administration officials who spoke on the condition of anonymity to more bluntly discuss the decision.
Obama was set to make the announcement at 11 a.m. Monday in the White House's foyer.
In an interview with CBS'"Face the Nation" broadcast Sunday, Obama said the companies must do more to receive additional financial aid from the government.
"We think we can have a successful U.S. auto industry. But it's got to be one that's realistically designed to weather this storm and to emerge - at the other end - much more lean, mean and competitive than it currently is," Obama said.
Under the terms of a loan agreement reached during the last administration, GM and Chrysler are pushing the United Auto Workers to accept shares of stock in exchange for half of the payments into a union-run trust fund for retiree health care. They also want labor costs from the union to be competitive with Japanese automakers with U.S. operations.
Little progress has been made between the companies and the union.
But Wagoner never followed up his success with Lutz by recruiting other outsiders, leaving it to Ford and Chrysler to recruit Toyota stars Jim Farley and Jim Press.
And despite the clear failure of several staff functions to perform adequately, Wagoner never let anybody go. He despised ritual hangings to keep survivors on their toes and couldn't find it in himself to move anyone aside for poor performance.
The collapse of General Motors is a tragedy in several regards, but nowhere more so than in the case of Wagoner. Having become chief financial officer at the age of 39 during GM's last crisis in 1992, he performed loyally and uncomplainingly throughout his entire career. In other circumstances, he could have been a superstar.
GM earns a large share of its profits from high-margin trucks and SUVs, which are vulnerable to a continuing shift in consumer preference to smaller vehicles. Additionally, while the Chevy Volt holds promise, it will likely be too expensive to be commercially successful in the short-term [ ]GM is at least one generation behind Toyota on advanced, “green” powertrain development. In an attempt to leapfrog Toyota, GM has devoted significant resources to the Chevy Volt. While the Volt holds promise, it is currently projected to be much more expensive than its gasoline-fueled peers and will likely need substantial reductions in manufacturing cost in order to become commercially viable.
Chrysler:
On a standalone basis, Chrysler will struggle to comply with increasing fuel efficiency standards, and it may even have to restrict the sale of certain models to make sure it is in accordance with proposed standards.
http://blogs.wsj.com/environmentalcapital/2009/03/30/auto-pilots-gm-chrysler-flu- nk-small-cars-test-says-team-obama/?mod=yahoo_hs
The ironic part about this is that in those other circumstances, you don't need a superstar. When times are good, cars/trucks are selling at 12-15 million units a year, and you're one of the few players in the game, ANYONE can look good. It's when the going gets tough (like now) that the truly great CEOs, those that are really worth their multi-million dollar compensation packages, prove their worth.
He has lost $82 billion in four years. Even when SUV's were selling he could not make a dime.
If Wagoner was running your family business and had lost copious amounts of money over the last eight years would you keep him? :lemon: GM needs an outside thinker. Someone that has not been at GM for so long that they haven't driven a Toyota or Hyundai.
After weeks of reviewing company's operations, the panel concluded GM's current restructuring plan "is not viable" and is not scheduled to reach many of its goals until 2014, according to a memo summarizing its findings that was released late Sunday night.
"A great deal of progress needs to be made," the task force wrote, "and GM's plan contemplates initiatives that will take many years to complete."
Using the threat of withholding additional loans, the task force forced GM Chief Executive Rick Wagoner to step down on Sunday. He will be replaced by Frederick "Fritz" Henderson, currently GM's chief operating officer.
In its memo on the company, the task force also said that the majority of GM's directors would be replaced and that Kent Kresa, a long-time director, would serve as interim chairman.
Despite the pessimistic view on GM's restructuring plan, members of the task force said they are "confident that with a more fundamental restructuring, GM will emerge from this process as a stronger more competitive business."
To help GM, the Obama Administration will provide it with working capital for 60 days to develop a more aggressive restructuring plan.
A five-page summary reviewing GM's financial health is largely an evisceration of the plan GM presented to the task force earlier this year. It challenges the auto maker's rosy projections on almost every front, from how quickly the company expects to lose more U.S. market share to its ability to price competitively to its ability to introduce and sell new, fuel efficient cars.
In one section, the task force examined GM's optimistic view of its sliding market share by recounting its 30-year decline. In 1980s, GM's market share was 45%; last year, it was 22%. But the company only forecasted a rate of decline through 2014 at half the rate it has lost a year for the last three decades - 0.3% a year versus 0.7% annually.
Most important to the task force, the company simply is burning through more cash than it can bring in, "failing a fundamental test of viability," the government panel concluded. Task force members said while they considered many factors, GM's ability to generate future profits is the truest test of the company's viability.
Critics of the company long complained that GM had been saddled by too many brands, too many dealers and too many retirees to whom they had promised generous lifetime health care benefits. Like other U.S. auto makers, GM had also become overly dependent on sales of trucks and SUVs for profits while shunning less profitable cars.
The government body also took aim squarely at the Chevy Volt – GM's heavily hyped electric car of the future – saying it will likely be too expensive to be commercially successful in the short-term.
Looming over all of GM's financial woes is the massive obligation GM has to its retirees. The task force found that GM's own plan to deal with retiree health care and pensions "grow to unsustainable levels, reaching approximately $6 billion per year in 2013 and 2014."
To pay those bills, GM would need to sell 900,000 additional cars per year, according to the panel. GM sold 8.35 million vehicles globally last year.
The company does not clearly address "the lingering consumer perception that GM makes lower-quality cars," the task force found. The implications of that perception mean most consumers will pay less for GM cars against its competitors, forcing the auto maker to entice customers with hefty price reductions through incentives.
"While the Company has made meaningful progress in its turnaround plan over the last few years, the progress has been far too slow, allowing the Company to continue to lag the best-in-class competitors," the government panel concluded.
I hope I'm not the only one finding humor in the administration's team criticizing GM for being over optimistic while the administration reduced the deficit projection to 5 years because the usual 10 years projection used by the office that does that shows the huge ballooning effect of all the deficit spending.
Even the forecast for how quickly we'd get out of this recession was tainted by very high optimism on things that would happen to show a rosy future.
What's missing from the summary is what Bo's administration is going to do about the older high cost UAW folks that are one end of the cost problem.
The other thing missing is the inequity in how the competition cars through the decades were allowed in to undercut the costs of the US automakers.
Same administration is proposing to change rules for companies getting tax breaks now for producing off our shores and for moving production. But the past administrations allowed competition in unlike how other countries allow us to produce or import into their countries.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
rocky: I hope you have the ability to speak the truth to your employer about the obvious situation with inventory...you cannot sell what you do not have, and, in this market, no one wants to wait for you to find one 20 minutes away...
maybe Beth can support YOU and you can be Mr. Mom and take care of the kids of you and Beth (am I rushing this relationship too fast???)
you should always re-evaluate your abilities, but maybe you could have better luck selling a product other than GM...when folks walk into an import dealer, they are already prejudiced toward their quality, whether real or perceived...you might have a better time selling cars that get great write-ups from companies that are farther from bankruptcy than Big 3...
UAW tactics like striking to cripple their own companies finances (do they not know who they work for?) and resisting automation don't help.
Perceptions are really screwed up. We know so much about the company that we can pass judgment on the ins and outs of so many parts of their business, but our knowledge of the quality of their products is left to follow common held perceptions. Even the Bowtie is considered offensive in some circles.
-Rocky
Well our meeting this morning included threats from the manager and why we are to blame for not selling cars even though we don't keep the products people want in our inventory. I made small talk with my sales manager and gave my $0.02 on why we aren't selling cars here. I have a interview Wednesday at the Hyundai, dealership. I will be able to sell Hyundai, Nissan, Dodge, Jeep, Pontiac, GMC, thus I'm not totally away from GM.
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
Canada should buy Chrysler. Thanks Canadian tax payers.
Don't let poor management discourage you. And don't go out eating pizza and drinking with your bosses kid. Did you know these guys at Wayland Chevrolet?
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f1bb20a/300
You will have to widen your circle to include the "treasonous Communists" that actually buy imports and non-UAW products...when you meet them, listen to WHY they buy the imports...don't shut your ears to what they say...they may give you VERY important insights as to why the Big 3 and the UAW are going down...don't hand them the "skilled labor" stuff you hand to us...they will look you in the eye and tell you why they deserted Big 3 brands...and, if you are half as intelligent as gagrice thinks you are (...
If they tell you about dealers who screwed them, or cars that fell apart, or were not well assembled, listen to them, because you will be talking DIRECTLY to the people who could have bought a Big 3 car but didn't...regardless of YOUR opinions, they mean nothing to the person who will never buy a Big 3 car again, so listen to why GM no longer gets their money and you might learn something...
See, that is something you have insulated yourself from for years...you sell UAW, you have UAW family, and you only know UAW products...you need to place yourself in the belly of the beast and talk to the REAL people who have deserted GM forever, and find out why...regardless of what YOU think, it is THEIR money and you would be wise to find out why they buy imports...working at a Chevy Dealer, frankly, will teach you NOTHING about the downfall of the Big 3 because everyone thinks like you do, and everyone worships the ground that the UAW walks on...that gives you ZERO insight into why people spend their hard-earned money on imports...
Learn from Hyundai, it may open your eyes more than we ever could, because we discuss theory, and they will represent the "Real World" and real opinions on the cars you have attempted to sell...
So, back to the cleavage... :P
Fast forward a year. Perhaps your former manager might ask you to be a reference when he applies for an entry sales job at the Hyundai/Nissan/etc dealership in 2010.
-Rocky
The market is flooded with cars, credit is hard to come by, and no one wants to buy big ticket items. Maybe at this new dealership he can be successful and reap the rewards when the market ticks back up. By then there will be less cars and dealers to compete with.
-Rocky
-Rocky
Don't worry about Chevy. The name will last forever. My next door neighbor has at least 7 Chevys all 100% UAW made. Of course none are newer than 1957. He has 3 of my favorite all time cars. 1955, 56 & 57 Chevy Nomads. He had this drop dead gorgeous 55 Convertible out for a drive last Saturday and I took a few shots. You will see these collected. No one will ever collect a 1995 Camry.
In three years when we are out of this recession and people who have been waiting to trade in their junkers have enough confidence to do it, you will start making money again.
GM won't be the largest for a long time, but what is wrong with being a solid 3, 4, or 5. I don't see Honda salesman complaining.
Some posters have said that the Big 3 going out of business won't affect all the parts suppliers. They'll do just fine, so really there won't be all those high numbers of people out of work. At least that is what a few posters would like to think.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Also don't feel to bad for Wagoner. He is getting top notch health insurance and a $20+ million severance package. I hope he doesn't start his own dealership; god knows he will run it into the ground.
-Rocky
-Rocky
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxUQcNa_fL8
This is who we need in office. A defender of the american worker.
-Rocky