Synthetic motor oil

bigorange30

Well the reliability of the Pathfinder/QX4 vehicle allow it to last longer and therefore more than pay for the extra initial cost. You're fooling yourself if you only look at the intial cost. My money (as in the fact that I bought it) is on the fact that my QX4 will last at least 100 K miles more than your Mountaineer before the same repairs have to be made. As far as the difference in price between the Pathfinder and the QX4, it is about $2 K and the amenities you get are well worth it to me. If we compared the receipts over 10 years of ownership and drive the same # of miles/year, I am betting mine will cost less than yours.

On the Mustang, I don't know what you're talking about with the insurance. I pay less than $50/month for insurance on it. My Astro minivan was more than that when I owned it. What do you pay for insurance on that Mountaineer Premier?

bluedevils

I would have thought QX4 premium over Pathfinder would be much more than $2k. Personally I'd be reluctant to pay more for the Infiniti-badged version of that vehicle. Good truck, but I'd take the Nissan version and save my money. Too small for my tastes and needs, though.

bigorange30- yes, there's more to it than initial cost. But it takes a lot of repairs to make up for a $6k difference in initial cost. You seem to be assuming the Mountaineer is sure to have serious and numerous mechanical problems much earlier than the QX4. That may prove true, but it's a pretty extreme assumption.

fleetwoodsimca

NO way I could have said it better for myself! Actually, I like Nissan products and for the most part think they are a better buy than Honda, Toyota, and the "lesser" Asian brands. I bought my 1998 Pathfinder in the fall of 1998. Nissan was really floundering in the market at that time. I got lucky when a salesman I knew alerted me to the fact that there was a factory clearance and price reduction of 5K dollars on his remaining '98 Pathfinders. I negotiated further, and walked away with one for under $24K.
I think that of all the Nissan brand vehicles, the Pathfinders are priced too high, and the over pricing just gets worse when you change the nameplate to Infiniti. At the price I paid, though, it was a very good buy.
Rest assured I got a dynamite deal on my Mercury Mountaineer as well. I'll have moved on to a new batch of wheels by the time any of them even gets broken in, based on any high miler braggarts' standards, and won't be faced with any concomitant problems.

bigorange30

that the additional $2 K is not worth it unless you have had the Infiniti experience. They actually treat you like a real person instead of a number. They LIVE off of the ratings you give them in the survey they give you after EVERY service visit. If they don't get an EXCELLENT rating, they must get severly chastised. A loaner car everytime you go for oil change, scheduled service or whatever is very nice. I don't ever have to go without a car. I even got to drive a brand new (<2000 miles) G35 sedan the last 2 visits. It is called the BMW beater in all the car magazines lately.

I am assuming that the Mountaineer will have have more trouble earlier than my QX4. I thought I stated that pretty clearly. I am paying for piece of mind as well as less repair bills. Piece of mind is worth some cash to me too.

bluedevils

For $2k difference, I might spring for the Infiniti. I agree that there's something to be said for GOOD service and treatment from a car dealer. At a $4-5k premium- that's a tougher sell for me.

I've heard great things about the G35. Sounds like a great car and a great value.

adc100

I have rarely rarely been treated poorly at dealerships. The very few times I have-I was able to resolve the problem to my satisfaction.

fleetwoodsimca

I am very attracted to both the sedan and coupe in the G35 designation. The coupe, as you know, is the chassis of the Z350. I have heard, but do not know for sure, that the sedan chassis is shared with the Altima. These are ALL superior cars. The G35s are the car of the year at Motor Trend, and some say that is quite an honor and accomplishment. While the Pathfinder has been a top rated SUV (and may now be showing slippage from the throne?) I am not aware that the QX4 has ever been highly rated in the industry. But for that kind of money, I'll surely take the outstanding V8 performance and overall quality of the Mountaineer Premier.
Shall we petition Edmunds to change the name of this thread?

bretfraz

I bought a Maxima in 1996, kept it a year, and bought a new QX4 in 1997. The dealer experience was like night and day. Hard to explain unless you experience it personally. For example, the early 3.3L V6 motors in the QX4 and Pathy experienced cracked exhaust manifolds on some units. I had taken my QX4 in for normal service (and got an I30 as a *free* loaner) and when I picked up the Q (having been handwashed after service) they told me, "we noticed a 0.5" split in one of your manifolds so we replaced it under warranty. We're very sorry for the inconvenience". What are the chances of that event taking place at your local Nissan store?

Infiniti's have better warranties (5/60), the best loaner car plan out there, a "customer first" attitude, employees who are enabled to solve problems proactively thus avoiding confrontations with mgmt, and an overall better customer experience.

Styling is whatever you think it is. The reason I bought Infiniti was that the QX4 looked different than most SUV's and I knew I wouldn't see myself coming and going. At that time a loaded V8 Grand Cherokee was mid 30's as was an Explorer Limited. I distinctly recall the Grand Cherokee with the 5.9L V8 HO motor was $38,500. The gaps between the rear hatch and the body were so big I could slip a finger in between.......

Nowadays Nissan has taken most all the technology advantages of the QX4 like the AWD system and given it to the Pathy. But the styling on the Q is still better IMO. I was looking at M45's the other day and noticed the sticker on the QX4 was high 30s, about the same as in 1997. The new Nissan Murano will be over $35K if you get one fully loaded and it's not nearly as capable off road, but it is a lot roomier inside.

I too love Nissan products and may come back someday but if I do it will be with Infiniti. Who needs the abuse from BMW and Mercedes dealers anyway?

fleetwoodsimca

Excellent points right down the line--
I would add that my local Infiniti dealership advised me one day that if I wanted to bring in my Pathfinder for service there, they would be more than happy to have me for a service customer. I will keep my eye out for sometime in the future buying an Infiniti.

18466

I am really amazed by how long this sludge issue with the 3.0 Toyota v6 has gone on. We have a 2000 Sienna with over 65000 miles on it with only Mobil1 5w-30 in it since 5000 miles (changed every 7500). This engine has been the best running engine we have ever had. I do think some people have had some problems with their engines sludging up but I believe that bad maint has been the cause. Maybe not on the owners part but on the part of the garage doing the oil changes. I have seen a lot of very cheap no name oils used by garages that I would not put in my lawnmower. One garage in my area uses an oil that is not even API certified with an S or a C rating. They offer very low cost oil changes but sometimes you get what you pay for. There is alway more than one side to a story. I am amazed at how many people are bashing Toyota and they don't even own one. I don't work for Toyota and I am not very brand loyal to any automaker. I am a mechanical engineer and some of the stories on the sludge issue don't make any logical sense. I would never run conventional oil more than 5000 miles in this engine and I would never be brave enough to go more than 7500 even on synthetic. If this engine was so bad why does Consumer Reports give it very high reliability ratings? Even higher than the Honda Odyssey. Only problem with our van was a window switch at 35000. How many other vans are this problem free?

bretfraz

I received the same "offer" from my local Nissan store. "You know, you can bring your truck to us for servicing". Not for me, thanks.

I would use Nissan dealers to get some parts that Infiniti didn't have or wanted too much $$ for. Like the rear wiper. As you well know, it's a stubby one and not easily found at retail. Infiniti dealer didn't have it in stock and wanted some crazy price for it. Nissan dealer had several and cost a lot less, $11 IIRC. Stuff like filters were cheaper at Nissan too.

Nice to be able to go from one to the other depending on what you need. Give that Infiniti dealer a spin and let us know what you think.

malachy72

a post on one of these oil threads by a guy whose son has a recent model 4cyl Camry. He did not change the oil for 9k. It cooked. He says the Toyota dealer suggests that he not go beyond 3750 miles before changing oil. You are probably right about the maintenance on some of these sludged engines, however, I do believe that they may have to be more closely monitored early in their life than some similar engines. My sister has a 2001 4cyl camry and I have to constantly remind her to get the oil changed. I have done it once for her but she insists on going to the dealer in order to maintain her warranty. Now if I could just get her to go--she is due!

fleetwoodsimca

I found the Infiniti service area very friendly, but I do all my own maintenance, with rare exception, so I don't plan on taking them up on the offer to service my Pathfinder.

vadp

The sludge issue is affecting the Toyota brand only.
The cheapo oil argument as the source of the problem doesn't fly since all the makes are being serviced by those garages.
Like it or not, we all can agree that certain Toyota engines require more maintanance and shorter than usual service intervals in order to stay sludge free.
Also the driving styles probably play not a small role in sludge formation.
According to your post, you put more than 25,000 miles a year on your Sienna. Under those conditions your engine experiences the least amount of stress(freeway miles are the easiest on an engine and oil).
BTW, aren't your engine camshafts driven by gears?
And doesn't Toyota employ a timing belt in the NEW V6 Camry engine instead?
If that is true then here we have some updating changes.

vadp

I just found a very comprehensive article.

1. Toyota says it has received about 3,400 sludge-related complaints since 1999.

2. The majority of sludge complaints involve the V-6 in the 1998-2001 Sienna minivan.

3. Parry, who says he has repaired about 30 sludge-filled Toyota engines since 1998, contends the V-6's cylinder head temperature is too high because Toyota reduced the size of coolant passages in the head gaskets.

4. He says that makes for a hotter, cleaner burn, but also causes sludge to build up because the oil gets too hot. Also, Parry says, sludge develops as the oil passes back into the block, which is running 60 to 70 degrees cooler.

5. According to General Motors, the industry standard for temperature differences between the cylinder head and engine block is between 10 and 15 degrees.

http://www.autonews.com/article.cms?articleId=38921

adc100

It was finally killed on the other board. Hoping that Shifty kills it here.

fleetwoodsimca

I suspect that a polyol ester based oil, such as Redline, would not allow the sludging based on the high head temperature theory. Also, I agree that this is not a Toyota sludge complaint forum.

18466

We can all disagree with each other, that is part of what makes Town Hall great. I still believe that Toyota makes a great v6. I know of 5 other owners with this engine and two of them are Lexus'. All of them love their vehicles and have very little complaints. Lets drop this issue and Everyone Have a Happy Holiday!

On another topic just purchased a 2003 Honda CR-V to replace our Jeep. The CR-V requires 5w-20 oil. Contacted Mobil 1 and was emailed that they will be making a 0w-20 synthetic oil that meets the requirements of both Honda and Ford. It will be available in mid March at retailers such as Wal-Mart.

mdecamps

I come to this board almost daily to read about oil. I don't come here to hear people's opinions on Toyota cars. It's not fair to have to read through a bunch of discussions that have nothing to do with oil. Please take them elsewhere.

gambiaman

I was catching up on my reading this weekend and read the Oct 02 issue of Consumer Reports. They had a list of ways to save money on maintenance on your vehicle. One suggestion was "Don't spend extra money on synthetic oil unless your car calls for it." I just starting reading this board recently so I apologize if this same comment was beat to death back in September when the Oct CR issue first came out.
Comments anyone?

ruking1

#4826

Many of the higher end OEM cars specify synthetic oils. The interesting thing is that nameplates like MB, Porsche, Corvette, BMW, etc. etc. not only specify synthetic oils, but in the case of MB and BMW, again etc., offer free oil change intervals between 10-15k miles usually for the life of the warranty.

It is more than coincidental in my opinion, that when the customer is paying for the oil and filter change, 3k is recommended; but when the dealer/manufacturer is paying for it, the mileage is now 3-5 times greater between changes.

I have done the math on 3k conventional oil and 15k sythetic (Mobil One) and the synthetic oil is cheaper per mile lubricated, not to mention that you use 5x less product. Being as how the OEM manufacturer has WAY more to LOSE than JUST the cost of effecting a repair on a engine warranty, due to "malfunctioning" synthetic oil, it is NOT LOGICAL to "GREATLY INCREASE THE RISK" on longer intervals between oil changes, unless of course it were statistically acceptable to do so.

IF SYNTHETIC OIL WERE not a better lubricant it would be penny wise and pound foolish in the extreme degree to employ this procedure, especially if it has been "shown" not to work.

Lastly, it would cost OEM app $10. to put a useful oil life remaining computerized calculator in a vehicle. Seems like 10 bucks to remove most doubt is what the owners of cars that advocate conventional oil changes are not "willing to pay" to remove most doubt, yet the very same ones will cite as one of the reasons they change at 3k as "CHEAP INSURANCE. " Kind of makes one wonder who is being penny wise and pound foolish!!??

fleetwoodsimca

No truer words were ever spoken than those you quoted from CR. (:oÞ

harry31

All those synthetic-from-the-factory cars have a sump TWICE the size (or more) of my Asian tinkertoy. Even if I used Mobil 1, I wouldn't dare leave it in more than 5-6K. Then I'd also need to have regular oil analyses. Using eighty-six cent WallyWorld oil every 3K and not needing any oil analyses is, compared to using synthetic, like getting free oil changes! Marley and I have done the math.

ruking1

#4828

If you are using different math because you are using half the oil..., hey, just as long as your math works for you! My only two Christmas wishes are: 1. synthetic cost .86 cents 2.could be changed between 10k-15k !!

Just remember Chevron Supreme is a very good product! If 3k is good!! 1.5k is better!!

ruking1

#4830

Over 100,000 miles, if you do 3k conventional and 15k synthetic oil and filter change intervals, you are doing 34 and 7 oil and filter changes respectively.

If the Wally Mart conventional oil is .86 cents and the synthetic Mobil One is 3.64 and your sump takes 4 qts, then:

(Conventional: 34 x 4qt x .86 per qt= $116.96.)

conventional=136 qts VS synthetic=28 qts

(Synthetic is 7 x 4qt x 3.67 per qt= $102.76)

Do you care about a more or a less waste stream? Or don't even care!?

[now if you count the 34 filters at $2.= $68. and 7 filters x$2.= 14.]

So on the oill alone basis it is $116.96 VS $102.76

Add in the filters and it is $184.96 VS $116.76

Of course, if you do this at a qwiky lube it would be $1020 VS $228.

ruking1

#4831

Correction: last figure of $228. should be $242.

(I didn't sneak under the edit time imposed by the thread administrator.)

fleetwoodsimca

For (some/many/most?) cautious vehicle owners, 15,000 miles on an oil and filter change is out of the question. And for some of us, even 10,000 miles is beyond the comfort zone. The gamesmanship of extended change intervals is obviously entertaining for some owners, and anathema for others.
Now let's all meet in the motor oil isle at Walmart, join hands, and sing John Lennon refrains. The money will work out. It's going to be okay. I'm really sure... Please! Santa is watching. (:o]

ruking1

#4833
If the math is histrionics, then we are all better off nurturing our myths!!!

You bring the guitar and I will join you in a round of kum bye ah's!!

Now shall we meet at WALLY MART in the "synthetic oil special rack" or the conventional oil row!!??

ata3001

I would suspect because if there were an engine problem due to improper maintanance or caused by an internal failure, the engine may not sustain as much damage due to the fact that synthetic oil is being used. The cost of repairing or replacing one of these engines is far more costly than replacing, lets say, a Ford Taurus engine, or for that matter, almost any domestic engine. These "high end" engines are often times no more sofisticated than those of lesser $ cars. The lesser $ cars engines NEED AS MUCH oil protection as the "high end" cars. Its just that the "high end" manufactures are less prone to playing Russian Roulette with their engines. Your Cavalier engine is just as important to you as the BMW engine is to a BMW owner. Just because my car is not a Mercedes does not mean it doesn't need every bit as much oil protection. They both use pistons, cam shafts, valves, etc.... I live in Niagara Falls, NY and we see very cold winter weather. One morning last week it was 2 degrees below zero at 7 AM. I have Mobil 1 in my non-sludged Toyota. This motor is just as important to me as is the motor in my friends 3 day old 2003 BMW 745, is to him. I guess that what I am saying is that "high end " motors don't need any better an oil than "low end" motors. They both perform the same basic function and operate basically the same way. Take the example of Mercedes, BMW, Chevy Corvette and a few others, and use the best oil you can in your Ford Focus or any other car. It will help you just as much as it does a BMW owner.

fleetwoodsimca

Darn! Mother nature is currently providing my Colorado neighborhood with what will now be a white Christmas, and I have conventional oil in all my vehicles. I'd be afraid to try to start them, due to no manufactured molecules being in them. Maybe next spring I can break the ice off one or two of them and meet you at Waldomart for the songfest. Until then, let's negotiate within this forum about which isle we designate for the slippery sit-in!

armtdm

Having used synthetics for 10 years now I have yet to have an engine where the stuff can go longer then 12,000 miles anbd this is rare. More appropriately it is 7500 between changes so your math is not realistic. Further, you forgot the analysis cost of $28/pop if you want to go 15,000 between changes.

It really is not cost effective!

fleetwoodsimca

Frankly, I see no reason to feel obligated to use extended oil change periods to make synthetic use cost less than using conventional oils. From the late 70's through the early 90's, I used synthetics in all my vehicles. Never in that 15 year period did I "get concerned" over the comparative cost. I used synthetics because I was convinced that the superior engine protection was the value to gain. Those were the years of ester base oil domination in the synthetic products, and those oils attracted me-- especially Amsoil and even better Redline. When the pretenders arrived, with their nonester based oils, well, I saw no reason to waste money buying copies of mineral oil fractions. Meanwhile, the prices for ester oils has gone so high that it destroys my ability to feel good about buying synthetic motor oils.
SO! I am hoping Santa brings me some Havoline SL...

pulgo

Cost effective? Who cares.

Compared to my 2001 Toyota Echo a BMW 745 is not cost effective!

It is a matter of CHOICE for me. I don't care for the few more $$$ spent on synthetic oil.

It matters to me that IF extreme temperatures were to occur my little car's engine will be a bit safer.

By the way, I change the oil every 7.5k miles or less often, depending on oil analysis. Again, I don't care whether it is cost effective. I do it out of curiosity because I like to know how high or low the wear numbers are in my engine.

Merry Christmas to everyone. Seasons greatings if you insist in being PC.

bretfraz

But the motivation behind certainly can be.

All the calculators in the world aren't going to provide you with engine protection. And none of them will help you at all if you spin a main bearing, throw a rod, and wind up at the side of the road with a wasted motor.

The only help math provides is a method to add up the cost of an engine replacement. I've been there - - ain't goin' there again.

ruking1

#4836

Last month, I was just in Pagosa Springs,CO. (Start of Elk Season) The temperature change was indeed wide. I went from 86 degrees in the Mohave Desert, to about 27 degrees in Pagosa Springs, CO. At Pagosa Springs, I had to pry the door open to get into the vehicle to start it. It started in one try, with absolutely no lugging at all! (5W-30)Mobil One. It has been so long since I tried to start a vehicle cold temperature that I can hardly remember the feeling.

The route to Pagosa Springs, CO is just breath takingly beautiful. It felt almost like being in the Swiss Alps!

ruking1

#4840

While I have never been there on a synthetic oil watch, I don't blame you in the slightest!! I ran one TLC, 250k miles. The things that went unscheduled maintainence were: a starter, alternator, master/ slave cylinder, and radiator. As you probably know, none is lubricated by synthetic oil.

Personally, I have not really cared that much about the "cost effectiveness" of synthetic vs conventional oil, as many have noted and feel that up front the synthetic product costs more (no question). BUT being as how it is there, I have taken advantage of it!

There is no doubt in my mind that one can run conventional oil with 3k-7.5k miles and post great results.

By the way with what oil did you have the problem with your engine?

fleetwoodsimca

The harbinger of my leaving synthetic engine oils behind was the arrival of the first Mobil 1 product. It was the first synthesized replica of mineral oil on the national market, to the best of my remembrance. That was the beginning of the waters getting muddy, and conventional oils improving immensely. I continue to recognize the value of certain other synthetics, such as Hypoid gear oil. And I remind all that I can change my oil and filter three times for the cost of one quality oil analysis, and not have my vehicle at risk AT ALL, concerning over used product!

bluedevils

You don't change your oil filter more often than 15k miles? That seems like a really long time to me. Also, I don't recall whether you are getting oil analysis performed on your used oil.

adc100

I agree that you can easily run 3 to 4 K oil changes without analysis. And oil analysis is to some of us (who have nothing better to do)an entertainment factor. But beyond that there are a number im important reasons to do it. The major one is Water in the oil which likely signifies a coolant leak. The second is fuel dilution which signals injector problems or other engine issues. Silicon along with iron can indicate manifold leaks and/or bad filtration. My last analysis on my auto-trans fluid indicated that My Mobil 1 ATF had sheared down quite a bit - thats hugely important in an ATF. So here you can tell if the oil you are using is flat out protecting the engine/trans. If you can do without TBN's than you can find oil analysis for about 10 bucks.

I also agree with Spector who has done probably the most oil analysis on this board. My limited exposure on 4 different vehicles indicates that Mobil 1 is good for 8-12K miles. But 12 K would be pushing it in 3 of my vehicles. So for me 8K is nice with a good K&N high flow filter. I think its a good compromise. Is it cost effective??-maybe-maybe not. Is it practical?-to me yes-I can change my own oil without living under the car. Is it conservative and the best possible for the car?? I think so-based on the oil analysis that I have done.

ata3001: You made some valid points !!

As far as going 15K without doing an analysis. I personally wouldn't consider it. But again that's based on my own experience. I'm too old to experiment with those high numbers.

Merry Christmas. And if you are not Christian-safe and Happy Holidays

ruking1

#4644

I change the oil filters at the same time I change the oil. I would recommend the oil analysis if one wants/needs the oil figures, or for those who have any doubt. If anything, oil analysis needs to be done on conventional oil. If conventional oil is not as good a lubricant as synthetic do you really know what the useful oil life is at 1.5k 3k, 5k, 7.5k? But as some have noted it is not considered cost effective. So in effect, I did as most conventional oil folks do, only mine was at a longer interval.

Again I have run Mobil One 5w-30 for app 250k miles on an inline 6 cylinder 1987 TLC with stickshift. I had it for app 14 years. It was bought for 16k and sold it with app 250k miles for 9k. (one of the first things the prospective owner did was to run it thru the mechanic of his choice, even though I had run it through the dealers mechanic as reference) I also probably did what some folks might label as abhorrent! I used Fram PH8A filters! The interesting thing is that for most of the operating life of the engine, it used Mobil One that only met the oil ratings at the time, the last being the SJ standard. The new SL version is FAR better than the SJ and below. Also the Mobil One SL version has more moly in its formula! (moly being a friction reducer)

fleetwoodsimca

My compliments on #4845 & #4846-- Very good posts.
NO matter the oil, I have always opted for the safety and cleanliness of shorter oil and filter change intervals-- as I've said too many times. Comparing how we all "keep 'em running between the ditches" makes this an educational forum.

rubicon52

I have gradually gone to synthetic lubricants in my vehicles and can report the following:

1. Have two Toyotas with V-6 engines. Started using synthetic oil in the first engine at 60K miles. Over the next two years, noticed less and less noise from the engine. The V-6 engine with 74k miles is now as quiet at the V-6 engine with 14k miles.

2. Noticeably smoother shifting in the Toyota automatic transmissions (which are smooth to begin with)

3. Much better shifting in the manual transmission with synthetic gear lubricant. Transmission no long jumps out of gear when starting from a standstill on very cold mornings.

chas_in_okc

Oh well. don't feel like retyping it now.

Merry Christmas everyone.

adc100

I know the feeling. I had the same problem (again). I wrote to Shiftright and complained. He gave me an email address to write to(don't have it anymore). The slowness and unreliability of this board has been a problem for a while-IMHO

bluedevils

"So in effect, I did as most conventional oil folks do, only mine was at a longer interval."

I interpret your statement to mean that you change the synthetic oil in your vehicles at an interval which is safe even without having oil analysis. Assuming that's what you meant, I must say that I feel doing 3k dino oil changes without oil analysis is much safer than doing 15k Mobil 1 synthetic oil changes without analysis. I know you have had good results with Mobil 1 at 15k intervals, but I believe you are rolling the dice more than you think.

ruking1

#4851

First of all, failure due to oil is VERY VERY RARE, regardless of whether you use conventional or synthetic.

I can appreciate that you feel that way, but I have over 613k miles in "rolling the dice"(synthetic, you know the DARK SIDE) so to speak. If anything I think you would agree that the conventional oil has proven itself to need considerably much more watching, or i.e., why do you change it so much? AND SO often? Since I have "more miles" (630k miles) on the conventional oil side (you know the FORCE) I have to say in all fairness, that I have only experienced one catastrophic oil related failure which by coincidence happened while using Castro GTX oil. (in my estimation the failure was not caused by oil)

The thing I most notice is the lack of sludge over the long term on the synthetic oil side.

I am particularly impressed by how many oil changes I DID NOT do.

(613,000 miles/3000=205

VS

613,000 miles/15,000=41

205-41= plus or minus 164 (depending on whether you think the glass is half full or half empty)

according2me

done an oil analysis on the Mobil 1 at any mileage on any of your vehicles.

I'm just curious because I too use M1 SS, but wouldn't dare go that length before changing. And I'm also not into oil analysis either, but I sure would do it if I went beyond 10k.

bluedevils

Hopefully, ruking1 will answer your question clearly. I asked same the other day and his response was "I would recommend the oil analysis if one wants/needs the oil figures, or for those who have any doubt." To me, this means he has not done oil analysis and he feels it is not necessary given his situation (the particular vehicles he drives, the type of driving and environment, the change interval, etc.).

Personally, I think the SL-rated Mobil 1 with SuperSyn is a great oil and a pretty decent value around $4/qt. However, I feel that using this oil for 15k mile change intervals without doing analysis is a bit risky. As ruking has explained in his recent posts, he does not feel it is risky at all based on his past success with this change interval. If he were to start doing 15k change intervals in a different new vehicle without oil analysis, I think he would be taking on some significant risk that the oil would be worn out and not doing a good job sometime during the latter half of the 15k change interval. From what I have heard various oil enthusiasts say here and elsewhere, I think most folks would agree with my feelings. If I was running Mobil 1 without oil analysis, I wouldn't go past 7500 miles or so. When I used Mobil 1 SJ Tri-Synthetic for a couple years, I wasn't willing to use it past 6000 miles. Just a personal hang-up about having oil in a vehicle so long - I've been corrupted by the 3000 mile Jiffy Lube change intervals!

Oil analysis reports from consumers using Mobil 1 and many other oils are available for discussion at other web sites that dig into this stuff much more than the Town Hall does. The Town Hall format does not readily support different threads for specific oil analysis results from single owners of certain vehicles. If you haven't already, check out bobistheoilguy.com. It's an excellent site that picks up the oil discussions where Edmunds Town Hall leaves off.

bretfraz

"Past results are not indicative of future returns"? Something like that. While I'm sure RUKING's maintenance plan has worked for him I think its wise to advise others to be a bit more cautious. I agree that if one's goal is to extend drain intervals as long as possible then an occassional analysis might be illuminating, if for no other reason that to support your suppositions with some hard facts and professional analysis.

bluedevils

very good post - reasonable and logical - just the way I like 'em. I agree 100%.