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Jeep Liberty Diesel

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Comments

  • mdamickmdamick Member Posts: 277
    EGR=Exhaust Gas Recirculation
    It allows a measured amount of the exhaust into the intake manifold to cut down combustion temperatures and help emissions.
    If it doesn't work right and allows too much gas in it causes the engine to miss or not run at all.

    The NSG370 is a 6 speed manual transmission that should have been put in the CRD but wasn't. They only offer it in the gas models.

    I am not sure on the heat issue if it is a gauge or actual temp issue. The earlier post suggests that it does run a bit warm at times.
    I have a gauge attached to the cooler line on the transmission and have got to 205 on a warm day pulling a long hill. I am watching it.
    The only transmission problem I have is it drops out of overdrive @ 53-55. Annoying but nothing more.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    You may enjoy browsing Essential Enthusiast Lingo and Auto101: How To and How it Works!.

    Steve, Host
  • naroversnarovers Member Posts: 7
    Greetings Frostyy from a fellow Canuck.I have a 2005 Liberty CRD with about 6,000kms on her so far.I ordered mine through Davidson Motors in West Hill (just outside of Toronto) The reason being,that they sell/service a high volume of Sprinters equpped with Diesel engines.Therefore I figured that their service personnel would would be semi qualified to service the CRD.I don't know if this reasoning is correct as I have not required service since I picked it up new.As for cold weather starting,I have had 4 VW Diesel Golfs and never had a non start situation because of cold weather.I did however,always add Hawes Anti Gel Diesel Treat to the fuel in the winter.Anyway good luck on your purchase :)
  • hermithermit Member Posts: 15
    Thanks for the info I really appreciate it! Will take a look at Steve's info too.
    There are only a few of these out here in CO and I have a dealer trying to pin one down with our specifications.

    Curious what some of you paid for your Liberty CRD? I have been whittling down the salesman and we are at 25,887 for the Limited Edition w/ skid and tow pckg (if he can find what I want). Most dealerships out here are asking high 26K even with all the rebates out there.
  • caribou1caribou1 Member Posts: 1,354
    We are all subject to this shifting between 4th and 5th gear. Just check the tachometer and you will understand why it changes:
    - When you drive light footed from standstill, just like when at 55 mph on a flat road, without moving the pedal you will notice the gear change happening all the time at the same rpm value.
    This engine is different than the gasser in the sense that the throttle pedal could be compared to a 0-100% load demand. On diesels when you think you have a lot of power in reserve in fact sometimes the engine gives all it has, and you don't know about this. Going up a steep incline at 50 mph needs very little pressure on the pedal but if you want to accelerate you often feel nothing comes and later the engine decides to downshift instead of staying in the same gear. It's not the tranny that's wrong, it's due to this very specific type of engine. I don't know if you get a clear picture from this explanation, just try for yourself driving very smoothly.
  • stucoltsstucolts Member Posts: 15
    :Hi;
    The dealer was asking $25670 I paid an even $23000 no trade in. That is $1670 off the sticker plus the $1000 rebate to get it to an even 23000. I bought it three months ago. The same dealer in now advertising the same equipped jeep for $22570 after rebates and no trade price. I also took the 36 month financing at 0% So far 3700 mi and no problems. :shades: :)
  • anomiousanomious Member Posts: 170
    Sorry but I don't agree....this is my 5th diesel passenger vehicle and the only one with this heat generating beast of a transmission. My last car was a 300SDL turbo diesel Mercedes and it would go from zero to 4800 rpm, shift (chirp the tires) and head back up to 4800 and the next shift... God do I miss it...
    I'm still hoping that DC finds a way to fix this dog. LK
  • mdamickmdamick Member Posts: 277
    Paid $21800 for a CRD Sport in SD. Tow package, Sirius Radio.
  • tired_old_davetired_old_dave Member Posts: 710
    Thanks for the temperature numbers.

    Our trailer was bought and brought home empty in the first week in June.
    Based on the trailer/heat/fans/radiator flow ad nauseum posts, our trailer has never been used. Our two recent heat episodes were not on the hottest days here and of course not towing.

    Provent and now homemade tranny coolers. What next guys. I've spent too much time with this vehicle and these posts.

    DC step up to the plate.

    Done
  • anomiousanomious Member Posts: 170
    Lots of luck....they got our money. :mad:
  • towwmetowwme Member Posts: 52
    Tire_old_dave, use your trailer, I do. Mine weights 4400# (Aero Cub C210D) loaded I pull at 1800RPM going 60MPH. I have a full Reese Hitch as my trailer has a 400# tougne weight when empty. Just watch the gauges esp the tach and feel for the transmission shifting. The torque converter will lock and and unlock which will show about 100 rpm change, this causes the tempature rise in the fluid. I have not experienced the overheating pulling here in Ohio (kind-of-flat). When pulling down the interstate (I75) I do not notice the transmission shift or the TC locking/unlocking even at an overpass.

    Now driving at 55 MPH that is a different story, even without the trailer the CRD doesn't like 55mph, the TC is locking/unlocking at will, I just drive faster - near 60MPH the TC will stay locked.

    I did notice that the TC shifts less when the cruise control is ON. I think the throttle-by-wire is very sensitive under foot control.

    On the overheating issue - Is the radiator actually boiling over or is it just the gauge rising? :confuse:
  • jkievit240jkievit240 Member Posts: 6
    I've owned my CRD for a couple of weeks and love it, BUT I got under it
    recently to check out a very minor oil leak and was a little shocked at the
    oil filter location. My oil leak was slightly loose oil filter which I tightened back
    up, but now I'm a little nervous about that filter. An errant thrown stone offroad
    or a piece of junk run over on the pavement could take that baby right out.

    I see a few people make skid plates for the rear engine/transfer case area,
    but do these need to be engine specific, e.g., would a plate that works on a
    3.7 gas work also on the CRD? Any recommendations from anybody?
  • caribou1caribou1 Member Posts: 1,354
    The engine you had was a traditional turbo diesel, not a common rail.
    http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=61116
    I've also driven with this type of engine and I prefer it to the common rail for it's simplicity. It was much smoother to drive and less sophisticated. Time will tell if the common rail is as robust. I have my doubts about the electronics in the Jeep and I would be very enthusiastic to retrofit a mechanical injection. Cables, cams and levers are easier to repair and understand for most diesel mechanics. The same applies to the tranny. Is it already too late to change :confuse:
    This is my second common rail engine and I would not have bought it with the manual gearbox. It's just too 'weak' in the low rpm range to provide a comfortable ride (typically sunday driving). This type of engine with a manual shift gives nothing, then a thunderstom like acceleration, then nothing again. In the small cars we have here, everytime you change gear the passengers move in and out of their seats. We used to say we were sea-sick on a boat, now I say we are common-rail sick in the cars. It's really unpleasant. :sick:
    The overheating of the tranny is in fact masking the issue of the punctual acceleration. The converter has to slip to keep the engine within the narrow band of acceleration efficiency. You can feel this when the LO gears are engaged. The shifting is then brutal on flat ground.
  • tired_old_davetired_old_dave Member Posts: 710
    1797 was to be my last post -

    but the bell tolls for all of us whether some don't believe it or won't admit it
  • tired_old_davetired_old_dave Member Posts: 710
    Our loaded trailer would be half your gross weight - a Wells Cargo Service Wagon ordered with electric brakes.

    Our heat issue happened at 100F in stop and go rolling traffic on the level.
    ~10 - 10.5K miles on the odometer, with a whole bottle of redline in a full tank, since mostly used diesel kleen in every tank. Was it a cleaning effect of the redline. Oil changes early as well as air filter replacement.

    Heat destroys. Cast iron/aluminum motor.
    A HD transmission with synthetic fluid.
  • tired_old_davetired_old_dave Member Posts: 710
    One of my earlier posts ~3500 miles and first oil change. Filter loose, dripping, and ready to vibrate off and drain plug needing King Kong to loosen.

    I don't know about oil filter seal integrity with a retightening-maybe you're okay.
    Buy a filter and drain gasket(metal washer) and seven quarts of Mobile 1 0w40. The fill amount is about 6 qts and 13 ounces.
    I use an 8mm long allen wrench. You may need a cheater tube over the wrench to get the drain plug out. I now tighten it just as hard when I reinstall. Torqueing it like a normal drain plug on ours causes weepage (no drops in the garage just a wet drain plug - enough to wet a finger tip)

    Someone posted the the gasser plate trans plate no. and I reiterated the number.
    It was just installed by an off road shop because two dealers couldn't find the nutzert numbers let alone the nurzert tool. Buy the $25 plate and find a good off road shop with the tool to install the two nutzerts after they drill two holes in the cross member. The hole in the plate exposes the drain plug. The oil filter is partially protected except for a lateral hit.
    There are off road places to lurk and see what serious off roaders use.
  • tired_old_davetired_old_dave Member Posts: 710
    You are right. ...thunderstorm like acceleration...

    That's what I was asking to do without in my first post - (The TSB really calmed our pedal response of the engine. Fast high rev'ing - tach gone wild. ) If taking off the turbo would give me that, I would gladly take a no throw yourself back in the seat reaction just a gradual rise in power, slower 0-60 times, better fuel mileage, and have no need to look at the dash instead of the highway, and get 500k miles and better mpg while doing it. Why does Cummins not need an egr.
  • jeepgalpegjeepgalpeg Member Posts: 8
    I, too, am a bit concerned about the location of the oil filter. I've read on other forums that Jeep will be coming out with a specific skid plate for the CRD in November.

    I don't believe that the skid plate for the 3.7L will work on the CRD, but the following part numbers have also been displayed on a few other forums.

    TRANSMISSION SKID PLATE part # 52128925AC
    NUT part # 6506644AA
    BOLT part # 6505027AA

    I'm not sure which vehicles these were originally designed for, so have the dealership search for these parts to see.

    I'm still shocked that Jeep even gave the CRD its "TRAIL RATED" badge. In my opinion, I think they should do a recall on all CRD's once a skid plate is designed and install them free of charge.
  • tired_old_davetired_old_dave Member Posts: 710
    I have that part on my CRD now. I too saw this latest post with the nut and bolt part numbers. You need a nutzert(nutsert?) tool. I got the part number from a post maybe anomious here or n3qik here or where you have been also. Buy it and have a good off road road shop professional drill the cross member (the front fits in the bolt holes between the front skid and the frame) and install the nutzerts so that they don't just spin and spin. Plate steel (vs heavy sheet metal crimped) fabricator skid plate info for the CRD can be found at lost--

    I posted about a plate part number the Grubbs parts manager found in the fall parts book he just got in. He stated it could've just passed testing and been given a temporary number because no price or ordering was available. Expected availabilty november but could easily be here in october. The extra effort to get it done now was another texas road full of junk with people swerving - us included. The off road shop said it fits great and there's no need to worry about any new part that may or may not be coming.
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Sounds like you got a lemon. Most of the complaints in this forum are from people with early builds of the CRD.

    On my return trip from Florida, I stopped using the RedLine additive. I wanted to see if things would be different. Fuel economy went up a little, engine noise remained the same, and performance did not suffer. Blew the EGR's nose several times and amount of smoke was the same, clearing by the third time. I attribute the smoke to the rotten quality of U.S. diesel fuel.

    While in Florida, it was very hot and very humid. Ran the A/C most of the time. The temperature gauge stayed right where it always is, just below the half-way point, no matter what the traffic conditions were at the time. I do not tow.

    As for tires, I cannot blame you for being upset. I replaced mine at 111 miles. Big, big improvement. Rarely use four wheel drive.

    Skid plate issue does bother me some. Hit a five gallon plastic bucket at 75 mph and it got stuck under the Jeep. Had to pull over and pry it out. No damage but will consider designing a small skid plate just to protect the oil filter.

    Brake grinding noise: had it intermittently for the first 1500 miles and then it stopped.

    Provent issue: unless DC says I need one, I am not going near it. The intercooler looks like it is pretty easy to remove and could probably cleaned.

    As for assembly issues, all cars have them.

    Good Luck! ;)
  • moparbadmoparbad Member Posts: 3,870
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Diesels are noisy when started in cold weather. The colder it gets, the more noise they make. Plugging your diesel in to keep it warm will be a big help.

    I had an Isuzu diesel car back in the early 80's. Never plugged it in but it always started.
  • bsidesbsides Member Posts: 4
    Just an FYI on those nutzerts. A friend and I had to install steel skid plates on our 2 VW TDI. Got tired of replacing the lower plastic covers to the tune of $400 every time you hit a chunk of ice or road kill on the road. We didn’t think about getting the tool until we were under the cars ready to install them, screwed up again :+ ( So I took the nutzerts and ground a flat spot on 2 sides of them with my bench grinder. I ground them until I could get a large sized end wrench on them real good and hold them while tightening them. Then I left the skid plate off and put the nutzerts in the wholes and ran the bolts up into them with a washer on the bolts just big enough to cover the whole and make them expand, while holding the nutzert on the outside with an end wrench. Once the nutzerts expanded good you are all set. Then remove the bolts put the skid plate up there and bolt it in. Just make sure you tighten the bolts good enough to spread the nutzerts good before you install the skit plate. That way they won’t turn on you when the plate is up in place. But it only took a couple minutes on each one to grind the flat spots on them. Might save you a couple busks for a tool that you will only use once.
  • sailormonsailormon Member Posts: 48
    Got to wondering about the EGR valve. Say it goes out, can it be bypassed, removed or just vent to the atmosphere? Is it really needed to make the engine run well? For that matter where is it located? Is this something that could be carried with you to replace on the road like we do when cruising on a boat? BR
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    If the EGR valve fails, you will need a lift to get to it. It can be bypassed but the engine will either run badly or not at all.

    It is located on the driver's side of the engine, low on the block and just in front of the flywheel. It is also water cooled, so removing it means opening the cooling system.

    Frankly, I would not touch it.
  • mdamickmdamick Member Posts: 277
    I have looked at this. I think the best way would to build a plate that goes between the EGR & the feed to the intake manifold. Still under warranty and working OK so I have not bothered.
    The truck will run fine without it, it is just another piece of emission stuff that is put on vehicles. May even run better without it, can't tell at this point.
    If you are in a state that does emissions tests, it may not pass. Not sure if diesels are put through the same tests as gassers.
    You would not want to try to replace it on the road-it is rather buried.
  • sailormonsailormon Member Posts: 48
    Got two answers which are good even though they differ in outcome. If you ever do try the bypass post the results. If it runs better without, it would seem valves can be altered and not worry about failures. Where I go they do not test vehicles for pollution. BR
  • jsymskijsymski Member Posts: 18
    www.obddiagnostics.com

    Yes, I agree, that is why I don't think this TSB did anything for the problem. The A/C was on too.
  • jsymskijsymski Member Posts: 18
    www.obddiagnostics.com
    cheap and it does exactly what I want it to do.
  • anomiousanomious Member Posts: 170
    My Mercedes 6 cyl. turbo diesel had a vacuum controled EGR valve. There was a pipe that went from the output of the turbo to the intake, it had 1/4 " of yuk built up on its inner walls. After cleaning it out I pulled the small vacuum hose off of the EGR and put a "BB" in the hose before replacing it! No more yuk and it ran like a fine watch (tick and all!)
    I'll have to study this one a bit and see how I can disable it. My state does not sniff the the diesels for emissions.
    LK
  • patentguypatentguy Member Posts: 45
    Winter2:

    What dealership in the DC metro area are you going to and are you satisified with their work on your CRD? I will need to bring mine in for the 6,250 mile service soon and my dealer only has one certified CRD mechanic.
  • kyjeeperkyjeeper Member Posts: 31
    After redline additive, still jerking 50 to 55, I'd like to have a new transmission and convertor, see if that help. I am sure the dealer would not want to do this . I was wondering about the tire upgrade. If you put differ size on wouldn't you have to buy a new spare too the different in size would mess up gears wouldn't it.that is you have a flat.
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    The dealer is: Courtesy Jeep - Chrysler. They are in Rockville, MD. Tel: 301.424.1700
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    I wonder if you have air in the fuel injection system? I get a miss or two first thing in the AM for the first few hundred feet and then it stops . Does not always happen. Wonder if there is a marginal sensor somewhere?

    I stopped the additive for now. Want to drive 1500 miles to see if not using it makes any difference.

    I think the jerking is the transmission trying to make up it's mind if it should be in fifth or in fourth. I assume the jerking stops at speeds beyond fifty-five?
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    One other thing. If the modification is found by an inspector, it could lead to a fine. I believe tampering with emissions controls is a punishable federal offense. :confuse:
  • n3qikn3qik Member Posts: 6
    Disclaimer: Bypassing This is illeagle and will void your warranty.

    Ok, with that said. I had to bypass my EGR while I waited for a new one. I did this two ways.
    First way:
    Disconnect both electrical connectors for the EGR and EGR mixing valve. This way will set off codes P0403, P0299, P0401, and P1140.

    Second way:
    Plug the EGR pipe that goes from exhaust manifold to EGR valve. I did this with a 1.25" square piece of stainless steel. This way will set off code P0401.

    Both ways will set off the CEL, but made a undriveable Jeep driveable. I prefer the second way as the first way the EGR mixing valve will not hold if the EGR valve has failed in the open postion.

    With ULS diesel and/or tuners turning off the EGR system this may be a problem of the past.
  • alb09439alb09439 Member Posts: 1
    Gosh, this is a pretty strange review. First he says that the engine is mounted transversely leading to more exhaust noise and then later he says that the Liberty is built on a ladder frame.

    AB.
  • anomiousanomious Member Posts: 170
    Hi! Winter is right about the transmission, it's a programing thing...
    About the tires! If you go to a 245-70-16, things will be ok.

    225-75-16 245-70-16
    Diameter 29.3" 29.5"
    Circumfrence 92" 92.7"
    Revs/mile 689 684
    Speedometer 60 Actual speed 60.4
    sorry, the spacing messed up! LK
  • sailormonsailormon Member Posts: 48
    This is doable with a small plate and would keep the jeep running. Does it run normallly and what do you mean "ULS diesel and/or tuners turning off the EGR" making it a problem of the past. I am learning the language and attempting to catch up to you tech type guys. BR
  • hermithermit Member Posts: 15
    Yikes- getting nervous about purchasing one of these after all of these posts!
    It was mentioned in one of the posts that the early manufactured CRD's were having most of the issues. What months are considered "early" and at what point during manufactucturing were some of these issues ironed out?
    What additives are you adding and why are you adding them?
    Thanks for bearing with me.
  • rnaborsrnabors Member Posts: 25
    I wouldn't get too nervous. Any new car or truck model will have some start up bugs that need to be worked out. Remember that 5000 CRD's were sold and most of them are fine--my dealer says that only one of the CRD'd that they sold has come back with any of these issues. Mine is an early build (Feb.) and the only problem I have had was the rear brakes growling first thing in the morning. I have driven it all over the mountains of North Carolina in the heat of August, with the air on, and never did experience overheating or transmission problems. This is my 5th modern jeep and I have always found Jeep to be responsive to correcting problems. I also own a Ram 3500 with a Cummins and find the same with them. If you buy now you will be buying a 2006 and I would be reasonably sure that the early problems are corrected.
  • bullheadbullhead Member Posts: 125
    Hermit...

    We have an '05 CRD with the 'C' Package built in March. 5.5k miles. Put Shell brand diesel in it exclusively, with no extra additives, and have yet to understand all this talk about additives. However, I believe these vehicles may be extra sensitive to diesel quality, so the additives could be well be justified. All I can say is if you have easy access to Shell fuels, worry not.

    We've done nothing to our Liberty and love it. Not to say I won't install additional transmission cooling- since I tow a lot. But this is nothing out of the ordinary. Yikes is right ! Your reaction is understandable.
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    ULS diesel is ultra low sulfur diesel. Sometime in 2006, the refiners will need to remove almost all of the sulfur from diesel fuel. Sulfur poisons certain catalysts, rendering them ineffective. Also, when sulfur is burned in air, you get sulfur dioxide which when combined with water contributes to acid rain. The sulfur in present day diesel fuel is probably contributing to EGR failure/problems, but I feel that it is the quality (lack there of) of the fuel which is the big culprit in this case.

    Turning off the EGR or plugging it will contribute to higher NOx pollution.
  • drudgerydrudgery Member Posts: 13
    Can someone tell me the specific turbo charger on the CRD - I thought it was a Honeywell (Garrett) but can't find anything specific. Sorry for what may seem like a silly question.
  • smilie1smilie1 Member Posts: 21
    I remember way back in the day[early 70's] when bypassing these new emission gadgets was the way back to some lost power.Now it seems Big Brother is breathing down our backs and there is some price to pay anyway you go.If the codes pop up,can you clear them?Or can you afford to risk having another code come up and not know it?I was just about to blank off the pipe myself,but decided to wait and see if a tuner chip company will come up with an "offroad"tuned programmer.It cant be good to feed a lot of burned gas back into the engine, all just to lower combustion temps.Witout that recycle flow, the efficiency goes way up along with the fuel economy.Well,good luck with your experiment.
  • winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    It is a Garrett. Max boost is 26.5 inches.
  • smilie1smilie1 Member Posts: 21
    Here are a couple of thoughts on some discussions lately.On the oil drain plug...an 8mm Allen wrench will do the job just fine,but a socket makes a better fit.If you use some good pipe joint compound such as Oatey "Great White with Teflon" on the threads and washer it will eliminate any chance of leaks and will hold the plug in place almost like Locktite.Another problem we all have talked about is the crankcase breather.I remember making catch cans out of brake fluid cans and putting stainless steel wool in them to catch the vapor on cars that had aftermarket intakes and carbs.Putting a can or other device in line on the original hose would most likely catch the oil vapor before it got to the turbo.A vessel similar to a moisture trap on air lines would work,and could be drained when needed.
  • love2golflove2golf Member Posts: 5
    have the same problem with mine. early am rear brakes growling at first stop. what was the resolution? by the way i love mine -- no other problems with the vehicle -- 29 hwy, 23 around town.
  • vtdogvtdog Member Posts: 163
    I have about 9500 mi on mine and use Hess diesel. I got the truck in Mar and it was winter blended at the time. I have had no issues with the Hess and the few times I have used other brands the only thing I noticied was a small drop in mpg.
  • hermithermit Member Posts: 15
    mabors and bullhead thanks for the info!
    I made the mistake of buying an 05 Laredo without test driving it up here in the mountains. Did great in city, but put it on a mtn road and you are going 70 mph downhill before you blink an eye. I find myself braking, not driving for 30 miles a day, or driving in 3rd. The 15 miles per gallon is silly stupid right now.
    Made sure to test Liberty on a dirt motorcross area for a good 30 minutes as well as up and down mtn passes for 40 miles. Much better response than Laredo all the way around. Learned the hard way I guess... Picking Liberty up tomorrow. Whoo hooo, it's an early Christmas.
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