Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

stickguy · March 2012

if you are that worried about it, let it go. And I wouldn't spend that on a warranty, especially since at the first whiff of trouble you will cut it loose!

isellhondas · March 2012

The price of that warranty should be a tipoff to you.

Seriously, anyone concerned over the frequency and price of repairs should NOT be looking at any European cars.

They are not for the faint of heart.

anonymousposts · March 2012

What has me worried are reports of transmission problems in the 06-07 ML320's. Anything else I could pretty much deal with but a $7,000 repair is excessive and turns my $21,000 ML into a $28,000 ML. It's out of manufacturer warranty so that only leaves third party service contracts. Credit union wanted $5000 for their "platinum" plan while carchex wanted $4100. I'm thinking at this point I will drive it a few days to get some return on the money I paid for inspections and then pass on it. I love driving it but the unease about the transmission would ruin my new car high.

fezo · March 2012

qbrozen · March 2012

I've learned NOT to get into something that you have repair concerns about. It makes the ownership experience unpleasant just worrying about it constantly and you wind up dumping it early for fear of that big expense.

isellhondas · March 2012

You worried about your Hondas too.

My buddy had a serpentine belt snap on his E-320. When it came off it did a lot of damage to the tune of almost 5000.00.

His Xenon headlight bulbs were 310.00 each to replace and then the entire xenon system failed. The dealer told him " These are nothing but trouble" and reccommended converting the headlight system to non xenon. This was nearly 3000.00 to do this!

Having said this...there will always be dire "reports" of impending doom on ANY car. to read some of these forms, one would think that every Honda Odyssey will need a transmission and every CRV will need an A/C compressor.

The truth is, as a percentage very few of these units fail.

I'm curious...how can you be driving this car long term?

roadburner · March 2012

Exactly. A Kentucky pervert is someone who likes sex better than basketball.
If you think I'm joking, just check out this story.

kyfdx · March 2012

Sort of a "dog bites man" news story, there... I'm surprised it even ran in Kentucky..

As a Kentucky fan, I don't even care what U of L fans think... they obviously are poor, misguided souls...

My wife is an IU grad.. wonders why I can't root for her team, since she roots for UK (when they don't play Indiana). I tell her it's the same reason I don't root for the Devil.. :surprise:

roadburner · March 2012

My buddy had a serpentine belt snap on his E-320. When it came off it did a lot of damage to the tune of almost 5000.00.

The cost could be due to the car or the repair shop. Recall that a few years ago I had put off changing a noisy idler pulley on my wife's 128K 1997 528i, and in late fall of 2004 my procrastination was rewarded by the pulley bearing disintegrating and taking out both belts as well as the fan shroud. I decided to let my independent BMW tech handle the repairs. While he had the car we decided to replace the radiator, the water pump, and the remaining idler pulley as a precaution. My tech also found and replaced a bad tie rod and had the car aligned. The total cost of repair was $1161.

His Xenon headlight bulbs were 310.00

Hosed again; I bought two Philips OEM Xenon bulbs off Amazon for $83.70

then the entire xenon system failed

Likely a bad ballast- no big deal.

"The dealer told him " These are nothing but trouble" and recommended
converting the headlight system to non xenon. This was nearly 3000.00 to do this!

There's the key; I suspect that the dealer saw an easy mark who'd believe anything he was told. I hope the shop kissed your buddy and sent him flowers the next morning.

fezo · March 2012

Ha! Thanks. Exactly what I needed just now.

isellhondas · March 2012

This work was done at a Mercedes Dealer in Orange County CA. I was with him when he had one of the 310.00 Xenon bulbs replaced and I wasn't impressed by the place. It's a typical high line "botique" dealer where the customers are pampered and everything is expensive.

As of two years ago, they were charging 160.00'hr labor and parts are full bore retail.

The bad Xenon system wasn't just a bad ballast. That is what they thought it was but after digging deeper they realized the whole system had failed.

Now, my buddy still loves his car despite the fact, he can't seem to drive it a month without some kind of warning light coming on or "something" happening.

Me, I'll take my boring Hondas. If I want trouble, I'll dig the BMW out of the garage..." OK. what are you going to do to me today?"

stickguy · March 2012

Also depends on the model you get. The Volvo I have is a NA S40. Actually relatively low tech. No turbo, no Xenons, nothing exotic. Not even auto CC, And the 5 cyl drivetrain is very robust.

Now, if you get into a gizmo loaded S80 turbo AWD, way more to go wrong.

And don't go betting on Hondas. Our Odyssey (a 2005) has actually been quite troublesome. Jut turned 70K, and the PS pump (and I think the rack at least once) had to be replaced twice. And the master cylinder failed somehow and got replaced (thankfully not on my dime, since they were defects that were under some kind of recall). Defective front brakes replaced at 20K. Rear shocks giving up the ghost early.

Tranny has not gone out yet at least! But overall, not the pitcure of no maintenance Hondaphiles like to portray.

and we don't beat on it, and all service has been done by the same dealer.

One of the reasons I am looking to replace it this year (other than my wife is tired of piloting the land yacht) is I have no confidence in taking this thing out another 5-6 years and over 120K.

stickguy · March 2012

as a general rule, no, trading for MPG is not financially prudent.

Now, if you are driving a 10MPG beast and have a 200mile daily commute, the equation could change. But it normally takes a long time just to recoup the sales tax, doc fees, etc.

Now, if you are trading anyway, then certainly make it a criteria~

anyway, do a simple spreadsheet to figure out the difference in gas costs (old to new). Then look at the costs to get the new wheels. That should answer your question.

Not sure what you have and what you are looking for, but often the change is not that big (meaning people are just looking for a justification).

Going from a Tahoe to a Yaris? Pretty big change.

Going from a 4 runner to an Infiniti G35? not so much!

isellhondas · March 2012

A lot of people trade cars for the wrong reasons. Getting rid of a car and buying a different one in order to get 5 MPG better makes no sense.

You will pay taxes, fees etc and yul'll lose money on the car you trade. All of that wuill buy a lot of gas!

fintail · March 2012

Another thing - no need to take something that old to a dealer.

I got a 4 year warranty on my E55 when I bought it for something like $2500, but the AMG models actually tend to age better than the normals.

isellhondas · March 2012

I'll be the first to tell you that Hondas certainly break too although I've NEVER heard ofa PS pump or rack going bad on an Odyssey.

Add everything up and the chances are if you own a European car you will spend a TON more money thatn if you own a Japanese car or even a domestic.

I have a family friend who will no longer talk to me. Several years ago, when she was about 24, she fell in love with a nice (?) S80 Volvo that we had taken in.

I did EVERYTHING in my power to talk her out of it and into something more practical but nothing doing! I went so far as to tell her that that S-80 would KILL her with repair bills.

She brought her know it all smartazz boyfriend along who not only pushed the Volvo but talked her out of buying an extended warranty.

Granted, extended warranties are VERY expensive for cars like that and for very good reason! The warranty companies know the risks and it would be like selling a two pack a day 75 year old smoker life insurance!

Needless to say, as I found out later, the Volvo was one expensive problem after another mostly electrical in typical Volvo fashion. Against my strong advice, she signed up for 72 months of payments and was seriously underwater when she gave up and bailed after two troublesome years.

tjc78 · March 2012

she signed up for 72 months of payments

On a used car? I would be hesitant on a brand new one (unless it was 0%)

isellhondas · March 2012

Yeah, I know but he won't listen to me. for some unexplainable reason, he loves and trusts this dealer.

Even so, if a quality Independent had done the same work what would he have saved? 10%? 25%?

They might have taken a chance and maybe not replaced everything the dealer did whan that belt broke. Smart thing to do? Perhaps...

European cars are so picky. Our BMW rejects non BMW light bulbs! You would THINK that an ftermarket bulb would work? Well, they do work but the warning light on the dash will stay on unless the bulb is a factory BMW bulb!

Last yer, it failed it's emission test because of a bad gas cap. Went to NAPA and bought a new one...passed the test. Two days later the Check Engine light comes on. Cause? " Bad Gas Cap"

Dealers response..." Don't you know, you HAVE to use a factory BMW gas cap!

Bought one, light went out. Go figure!

isellhondas · March 2012

Yep, on a used car. The times I tried to talk people out of such things I was usually not successful.

Nope, it HAS to be a fancy S-80! It HAS to have a sunroof, leather etc.

" A lowly Civic? Forget it!"

lemmer · March 2012

How does BMW do that?

Use a non-BMW taillight and the light is out warning stays on. I thought maybe my car was odd until I read about it multiple times on various sites.

stickguy · March 2012

well, the PS issue was significant enough to generate a TSB (aand recall I believe). So not like I won the anti-lottery.

and once you get up close to 100K you are playing tranny roulette also.

fintail · March 2012

On larger jobs the independent I use is an easy 25% savings, it adds up if you are doing a major service or brakes etc. Dealers are for warranty work or if you want the concierge to kiss up to you or maybe get a loaner car if you are lucky.

My MBs have never had those picky problems, other problems maybe :shades:

stickguy · March 2012

If you have a good indy much more likely they will have a cheaper solution to a particular problem, or not be so quick to recommend major replacements. Dealers are often notorious fo "suggesting" the most expensive solution to something that may not even be worth dealing with.

midwesternlife · March 2012

Since I started driving 11 years ago, I've had six cars. My most recent purchase was two years ago this May and I am considering purchasing another car. My justification? The SUV I bought doesn't get the greatest gas mileage and I am concerned that my 45 mile commute to and from work each day is going to impact my budget. So I've been looking for a used toyota in St. Louis and have been browsing website all day. As someone who, admittedly, has a problem with purchasing every two years or so, do you think gas mileage issues are reason enough to go ahead and make another purchase?

lemmer · March 2012

Honda had the transmission problem fixed with the 2004 models.

Isell has presumably seen many, many Hondas come down the service line. You have just the one. Anecdotal evidence, you know.

akangl · March 2012

You need a diesel to make that trip. The shame of it is, from reading your posts stuff is really high priced up there so selling it once you are down in lower 48 is going to be killer.

Monday is the day. We have an appt to go back to the Ford dealer and look at some used trucks they have in mind. Hubby is lobbying for a trade......I'm the hold out. Here's his justifications.....with an older truck he can take it hunting without me freaking out, if the new puppy does something to it then it won't be such a huge deal, and he can use it as he wants without me worrying he's going to scratch my Princess.......anyone else see a pattern here?

In other words, once we get to the lower 48 the truck is HIS and I get something else IF I can drive or I get stuck with the Civic.

Since we have plenty of time we will be holding out for a diesel or a Dodge with hemi. *Grumble* I'd rather keep my F-150.

roadburner · March 2012

European cars are so picky. Our BMW rejects non BMW light bulbs! You would THINK that an ftermarket bulb would work? Well, they do work but the warning light on the dash will stay on unless the bulb is a factory BMW bulb!

I believe that I've already told you that the issue is not the brand but the TYPE of bulb you need to use. Go to Autozone and buy Sylvania/Osram silver base "Euro" bulbs. That's what I do, and I've never had a problem with phantom "Bulb Failed" issues.

Last year, it failed it's emission test because of a bad gas cap. Went to NAPA and bought a new one...passed the test. Two days later the Check Engine light comes on. Cause? " Bad Gas Cap"

Dealers response..." Don't you know, you HAVE to use a factory BMW gas cap!

Bought one, light went out. Go figure!

You'll get no sympathy from me; such problems are likely anytime you throw parts that are of non-OEM quality on a car. I seeNAPA charges $5-$16 for an E36 gas cap but you can get the BMW cap for $11-$12. Why risk headaches for a couple of dollars?

isellhondas · March 2012

I don'r need or want sympthy and you are missing my point. It's not like a NAPA gas cap is a cheap replacement like you would buy from Pep Boys of O'Reliiey's. It looked and felt exactly like the original and it was almost the same price. I wasn't trying to save money. I was trying to save a 20 mile drive back and forth.

A quality replacement light bulb should work without turning on the dash warning light. I shouldn't have to buy a "silver base" "Euro" bulb.

The BMW is a nice car but it is like a prissy little old lady.

I should probably replace it with a REAL car like an F-150!

roadburner · March 2012

I guess I just have a different philosophy when it comes to maintenance; I use OEM or OEM equivalent parts on all my cars; BMW, Jeep, Mazda, it doesn't matter. The Bimmers get BMW coolant and BMW approved oil, ditto for the Mazda and Jeep. It might be overkill and a bit more work, but it has paid off for me in terms of long term reliability.

fintail · March 2012

Oh yeah, that's true. I remember when I sold my old W126, at 16 years old and nearly 200K, the prospective (and eventual) buyer wanted to have it inspected by a dealer - his nephew, who works for the dealer, was the one who told him about my car. I had no problems as I knew the car was amazing for its age, but it still came back with $5K worth of "needs" - many of them being restoration style items rather than items for driving. It did mention the tires and brakes were heading for replacement, and I accounted for that in negotiation, but nothing else. He was still happy to get the nice old car.

fintail · March 2012

Thinking of that makes me wonder when I see a recently plated new highline car at a cheapo gas station.

stickguy · March 2012

They still had issues in 2004, and some other problems (TC related largely) still going on.

stickguy · March 2012

If you were just leasing it, would you care?

let me rephrase that. Do you think the average person leasing a car they probably can't afford is going to spend extra for tier 1 gas?

kyfdx · March 2012

Had a place look over our '87 325is, about a month after we bought it...

$6000 in recommended work.... lol..

stickguy · March 2012

You should have asked for the "basic reliability plan for a 25 YO car" instead of the "stage 0 restoration to make it like new" report.

kyfdx · March 2012

To their credit, they did respond with realistic recommendations, when asked to....

nyccarguy · March 2012

Just filled up my BMW today for the 1st time. I used BP 93 Octane. I'm leasing. I'll admit I'm not your average 3 series lessor.

andres3 · March 2012

the vast majority of auto repair shops are either incompetent or crooked.

rayainsw · March 2012

'I'll admit I'm not your average 3 series lessor. '
I use Tier 1 gasoline.
Apparently we are raising the average?
- Ray
First time I have leased.....

kyfdx · March 2012

We use premium in all of our leased cars, if that is the recommended octane...

Who wants less power?

qbrozen · March 2012

Odd. I mostly use aftermarket parts on my cars and have never had a problem.

Personally, I believe OEM to be substandard in many cases when it comes to maintenance items. Only exception I've run into over the years were spark plugs for my S70. It just wouldn't run completely smooth with the high-end aftermarket brands.

RB - when I replace the coolant in my 540, I'll be going with that zero pressure stuff ... can't remember the name offhand.

stever · March 2012

Me too, most recently a presumed Chinese blower resistor I got from Rock Auto. Don't mind filling up at Sheetz or Circle K either. :shades:

lemmer · March 2012

With BMW, I am not sure I'd choose any of the OEM cooling system products over the re-engineered aftermarket ones that fix the factory flaws.

au1994 · March 2012

What's all this talk of "repair"? We're CCBA'ers, don't we just buy another rather than repair or change oil? :P

qbrozen · March 2012

Oh, but I never sell a car with needs I can fix. I like to get the most I can for my vehicles. That's how I help support my habit.

lancerfixer · March 2012

Yep. OEM plugs in the S70 only...found that out the hard way myself.

tjc78 · March 2012

With BMW, I am not sure I'd choose any of the OEM cooling system products over the re-engineered aftermarket ones that fix the factory flaws.

I always find it hard to believe that with today's technology that BMW of all makes has cooling system problems.

I wonder if some of it is just neglect on the owner's part.

anonymousposts · March 2012

My recent experiences with Honda indicate that their quality has slipped. While our transmission did not fail in either Odyssey, the 2011 was starting to exhibit the symptoms related to the failed torque convertor/transmissions. Added to that is the fact that Honda cars are not as driver-oriented as they have been in the past. Even our 2008 Odyssey had a lighter and sportier feel than the 2011. Our 2004 Accord was also sportier than our 2009. And the older Accord had none of the quirks I started to associate with my 2009 Accord.

I am pretty confident in my decision to pass. For the money, I will start searching for a nice 2007-2008 3-series sedan or wagon with Navigation.

lemmer · March 2012

Are you kidding me? BMW is famous for weak cooling systems. Maybe the newest ones have that licked. Not sure.

isellhondas · March 2012

" the vast majority of auto repair shops are either incompetent of crooked"

The rules of these forums will cause me to temper my response to this.

Your post above is a good example of why I no longer respond to your postings. This isn't your first time at this.

Having spent my entire life in and around auto repair shops and having managed a huge auto repair facility I can state that you have no idea of what you are talking about. " Vast majority"??

Only the strong (and honest) shops can survive in today's climate. It takes a lot of money, skill and management skills to operate a profitable shop these days. I doubt if you have ANY IDEA of the costs of rent, equipment, training and overhead it takes.

Being incompetent or crooked does not work.

Some places, mostly "chains" tend to hire secondary help and may be overselling questionalble services but for the most part the Independent shops and dealers are above board in their dealings.

A comment like yours is a slap int he face and an insult to the 95% of technicians and shops that work very hard for not a lot of money!

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