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Comments
Thanks in advance.
Mine is "Pennzoil Platinum" 10W30, which is one of the newer full synthetics.
Quaker State full synthetic is essentially the same oil: both are owned by SOLUS (Shell Oil & Lubricants / U S) which is the trade name for Royal Dutch Shell in the U S. :surprise:
Everything was good except Infinity speaker system.
Subwoofer makes abnormal sounds when CD or radio plays bass-full music. Subwoofer speaker makes vibration and crackling sounds. It does not well fit on back board of car. Whole back board shows vibration and abnormal sounds. It is very annoying. So, I asked Hyundai service center to fix this problem. At first visiting, they did not notice the noise. Second visiting, I showed the noses and they agreed with me but they did not fix the problem. They mentioned like this: “No problem found played cust CD-then switched to other CD did not hear the noise.” Oh my god! Third visiting, the manager also agreed with me. He said that it is manufacturing problem and they can not fix this problem. In addtion, I found that speed sensing volum control is not equipped. This option should be equipped in premium and ultimate package of Azera. Hyundai lied in the web and catalog. I can not play any music in Azera because of the terrible bass noise. :mad: :mad:
However, another thing they should be trying to do is replace the sub for you. I have my audio settings set with the bass at maximum and I don't get any funny noises from the sub at all (and I turn my stereo up to 30 a regular basis when cruising with the windows down).
Does the problem happen with all the CD's you play or only on burned CD's? Could be your recording volume is too high which would cause distortion in playback. Do orginal CD's play okay?
got the same thing going on but it only happens with certain songs, either fm or original disc, but i fixed it, it was fairly simple
discovered some years ago that a speaker frame can be distorted during installation and the net is a strange sounding speaker in certain conditions
ok, i crawled in and backed off the screws about 1/2 turn each
i then grabbed and tried to wiggle the frame of the speaker to see if it was lose, if it was i tightened each screw 1/4 turn
the boss was in the front seat in volume control, net result the 'strange sound was gone
dealers, service managers, techs typically do not have a clue so i don't even ask them
you could go to a reputable sound shop
i'm sure they would listen, identify and give you corrective options, go for it, see what the pro audiophiles tell you about this vibration???
The Azera is a great car. I enjoy it much. But HMFC reminds me of some of the Hyundai dealerships I visited. Here's what I'm dealing with thus far.
March 8 – Leased an Azera
April 3 - Called HMFC because I haven't received anything in the mail about my lease. I asked them if I should pay over the phone or online. They told me that the ONLY way to pay is by mail on leases and that I would receive an account number and my remittance information in the mail and just to wait until I get the information in the mail.
April 15 - I receive a Hyundai letter with a remittance slip for my lease payment. No due date is indicated on the remittance forms.
April 18 - Mailed my lease payment to HMFC.
April 26 - Got a phone call from HMFC stating that my lease payment was due on the April 8 and I'm late and when they can expect payment. I told them that I DIDN'T EVEN GET THE FORMS until the 15th and there was no "due date" listed on the form and I mailed payment on April 18. They told me that they have been having "computer problems" and that is why I got the forms late. I told them that the late payment shouldn't be held against me since it was an error on their part. I told them I called and tried to pay the first week in April and was told to wait until I get the forms. Since I had no account number or information (since it was my first payment) I couldn't just write a check. I needed the account number. They told me it was their error and certainly the late payment wouldn't be held against me.
May 1 - I get a letter from HMFC Collections Department stating that my lease has not been paid and to submit it immediately. I called them and they said that they DID receive payment on April 25 (which was a day BEFORE they called me about "no payment)and to just ignore the letter. Okay.
You might say, "Well. . . you can expect problems when a lease is first started." No, I don't. I expect with a well run company to have a smooth initiation. Maybe Hyundai's chief, Chung Mong Koo, being arrested for embezzlement and fraud from the company has something to do with it. Problems with the lease and no online option makes the company appear "cheap" and poorly run. Sorry if that offends anyone. I expect a little better.
Another problem is that the "sales tax" listed on remittance form is MORE than on my contract. When I inquired about that, they told me that my local city it taking tax that they must collect. Local city? They said it was in "addition" to the state sales tax. I should have been informed about this tax that I knew nothing about. I know that tax rates can change, but this is a separate tax I knew nothing about. So, I am paying a completely different amount than is listed on my lease contract. Is that commonplace?
Again, super car, but some problems with the company.
Pennzoil Platinum uses a newly developed gas-to-liquid base stock identified as "EOP" - an API designated Group V fluid. Quaker State's full synthetic motor oils use severely hydroprocessed paraffinic base stocks that are designated by the API as Group III fluids. The parent company for both Pennzoil and Quaker State is Shell Oil Petroleum, U.S. - SOPUS.
Azera Avalon Lexus Accord
Ltd XLS ES330 V6
Edmunds TMV Price 28,677 33,181 29,959 28,185
5yr cost per mile (15k) .66 .64 .68 .59
3 yr trade value 12,540 18,577 20,890 15,781
5 yr trade value 7,957 13,520 15,081 11,582
Loss in value in 5 yrs 72% 59% 49% 59%
The value factor misses the mark using this analysis. The Azera sheds nearly $8,000 in value during the first year. A potential buyer might consider buying used next year after this sizable initial hit. You would need to cut a deal significantly under dealer cost for the value proposition to make any sense. However, this is not out of question once the “gotta have it” factor dies down and Hyundai starts to roll out the huge rebates.
After scanning the posts on this board I come to the following conclusions: generally poor dealer support, lease quotes that support the huge drop in value, service at the level you would expect from a second or third tier manufacturer (where rapid growth surpasses the supporting servicing network) and buyers that are extremely happy with their acquisitions (similar to a sports draft when a players value drops and they fall from a high first round pick to a low first rounder).
In 2000, I purchased an Acura TL using this same analysis. Six years later I can get between $10,500 and $12,000 for the vehicle that has trouble free for the most part. The Acura dealership experience is absolutely top notch providing free oil changes for the first 3 years and covering many items under the original warranty without any cost not to mention free loaner cars and car washes whenever we do have routine maintenance.
I compare it to a good restaurant, with Acura I’ll always be willing to pay a little more for quality because everytime I visit I have had a good experience. Hyundai is like a new restaurant trying to make it, although the parts may come from similar vendors and be equal in quality the service delivery is more like fast food than fine dining. It takes time to develop but for the time being the value equation comes up way short unless you have money to burn.
A contract is a contract, your pricing/payment is based on the contract you signed at day one.
Any subsequent changes are 'illegal'
The contract cannot be changed or modified after you agree and sign the original contract.
Make copies of the changed contract and the original, highlight any modifications/changes after the fact.
Send registered mail to Hyundai, accounts payable, with a cover letter. Keep copies and only pay original contract agreed upon monthly lease price.
If Hyundai continues to badger go to the lemon law section of the owners manual and proceed/call for guidance.
FYI
Loan company for home wrote a contract, we agreed and signed, they later modified and changed the contract without telling us. Net result, many months of waiting/paperwork and crap but loan company ended up paying/refunding ALL costs/expenses/monthly payments/legal costs over duration, every penny, they ever collected and we went to another loan company/bank.
And that's the way it is.
Right - got the acronym wrong. I read online that Quaker State and Pennzoil were now exactly the same (although - yes, it started out - as almost every available synth as Class III. The newer EOP-based oils are the only true synthetics)
I have also found on this board where folks are running into problems that are service oriented. Thankfully, I've come across two Hyundai dealers that really take care of a customer. Both dealers have honored the loaner car program covered under the warranty. The dealer I go to now offers complimentary car washes when you bring your vehicle in for service. They also make an effort to get to know you by name as well.
I am one that's not worried about the resale value of this car as I plan on holding on to it for quite a while. Based on my experience with my Sonata, I'm pretty sure I'll be able to do just that.
I would agree that Hyundai hasn't quite reached the threshold of being in the midst of the the Big 3, but the Big 3 are looking over their shoulders because they know it won't be long until it will be the Big 4! People seem to forget that all car companies went through their growing pains. The Big 3 had a huge head start on Hyundai. At one point, it was thought HMC would pack it in and never be seen again, but they've stuck it out and their persistence is paying off.
HMC went through the same thing when they redesigned the Sonata in 02. At one point, you were hard pressed to see one on the road. After about 7-8 months, they were all over the place like the Camry and Accords. Give it time, you'll start seeing the Azera all over the place too.
The contract cannot be changed or modified after you agree and sign the original contract.
I agree a contract is a contract, however, I read that the "taxes" on a lease CAN certainly change. For example, if you move to new location, the taxes on your lease will change to reflect the new location's rates.
I bought my Azera in one county but live in another. What they are saying is that the taxes I was charged initially didn't include "local taxes" within the county where I reside; therefore, an "adjustment" had to be made which caused my total lease payment to rise. Now my lease has the Utah state sales tax PLUS the county and city taxes where I reside.
At least that was how it was explained to me. Do you still think that sounds fishy?
I've always paid state, county and city taxes at purchase, it's usually calculated into the 'cash' down part you pay to drive away. Dealers know these numbers in your area, it's their business and their liability to know. If they add the tax into the 'lease' then your total tax amount over the lease is a scary number, to say the least.
Again, I'd enforce the original contract or contact the state DMV or State Dept of Taxation for clarity on the issue.
It may be far cheaper to go to DMV and make a one time payment vs. paying over the length of the lease???
We bought our car in one county and live in another. We paid state tax (6%), tax in the county purchased, flat fee of $50 and $10 to the county we live in. No applicable city taxes.
It just seems questionable that HMFC raised the monthly fee for 'local' taxes. One would think the dealer would have contacted you???
BUT, IT IS part of the ORIGINAL CONTRACT closing (tax, tag, title) and SHOULD NOT be prorated over the life of the lease because IT IS NOT part of the lease contract pro-rate, the vehicle price, MSRP or bargained price is the pro-rate plus interest, depreciation and whatever, but NOT TAX
Sitting behind the wheel I noticed the 'alignment, fit' of the drivers door panel was not like the passenger side. :confuse:
The passenger side, on the top front where the wood trim curves/blends into the dash wood trim is 'smooth' while the drivers side is visibly mis-aligned??? Both the door panel and dash board appear to be properly installed. The wood trim is on the same level line but the curve where they meet is more like a corner???
Page 2,
Then quite by accident I discovered the left front hood corner extended over the grill and head lamp while the right side was a smooth blend. All of the hood alignment gaps and fender alignment gaps are equal and straight. The hood and fender front corners align correctly.
It appears that the 'grill and head lamp may be 'back' by 1/4" on the top??? Wonder if the head lamp is properly aligned???
When I replace the grill I'll investigate this further and report back on the findings.
Has anyone else found similar type 'alignment, fit' concerns???
My shorts are not in a tither over this, it may be 'within factory tolerance' and 'hey' I'm probably the only one who would notice. I'm not going to mention to the dealer. I'm sure they would have no clue on how to adjust. Providing of course adjustment is possible???
Page 3,
After 42 days, 1,850 miles this beauty is sparkling and running like a top 'SMOOTH, SMOOTH, SMOOTH'
Motorcraft does market a full synthetic line of motor oils, but not at WalMart. (In fact it's not too easy to find - even at Ford dealerships unless specially ordered.) What you more likely found is a synthetic blend (heavy on the synthetic part - around 50% when most other brands of synthetic blends are closer to 10-15%. (There's no legal mandate for the degree of synthetic content in a "synthetic blend" motor oil.) The remaining base oil content is a very high quality, highly processed, conventional base oil*. Motorcraft brand oils are blended and bottled for Ford by ConocoPhillips in the U.S. It's an excellent motor oil despite its "blend" status. You could definitely do worse - and pay more for the privilege.
*The two base oil types used to formulate Motorcraft Premium Synthetic Blend motor oils undergo similar final purifying treatment under very high heat and pressure in the presence of hydrogen gas in what can best be described as a very large pressure cooker. The process breaks apart unstable and undesirable wax and solvent molecules left over from processing crude petroleum in the distillation tower and reforms ("isomerizes") them into very stable and desirable paraffinic lube molecules. The difference is even higher heat and pressure, and more time in the case of the synthetic base oil ConocoPhillips and most other blenders use in formulating their respective full synthetic and synthetic blend motor oils.
I was under the impression that the synthetics are long chain aliphatic esters. Is this so? Is the hydrogen process you describe used to to saturate the more reactive olefinic components?
I was under the impression that the synthetics are long chain aliphatic esters. Is this so? Is the hydrogen process you describe used to to saturate the more reactive olefinic components?"
In general, full synthetics are heavier on the additive pack to accomodate the longer drain intervals most users expect from them. Mercedes-Benz and BMW are recommending oil changes to 10,000 miles and beyond, but that recommendation is predicated on using full synthetic fluids that often retail for ~$9.00+/liter. (the "hundred-dollar oil change") The traditional built-up molecule popularized by Mobil 1 fluids is a PAO (polyalphaolefin) polymerized in stages from 1-decene, a very thin liquid. The resulting base oils are classed by the API as "Group IV". These base oils have exemplary lubricating qualities, but, due to their extraordinary purity, have an adverse effect on elastomeric "rubber" sealing materials allowing shrinkage. Engines run on the first commercial products using PAOs inevitably began leaking oil from their main seals due to seal shrinkage. Mobil discovered that certain esters added to PAOs negated the seal shrinkage issue. Additionally, esters have two further sterling qualities: 1) they can be darned good lubes in themsleves, and, 2) they exhibit a "polar" quality in their electrical charge distribution. The molecules orient themselves and bind with the 1-2 molecule thick layer of oxide that forms on all metals. The oxide-bound ester layer remains behind when the rest of the motor oil has drained backinto the sump after engine shutdown to provide initial cold start wear protection. The Group III base oils I described previously, while not directly related to Group IV fluids in any way, do share the seal shrinkage problem with Group IV fluids.* Full synthetics formulated with Group III fluids also benefit, for the same reasons listed above, with the addition of select esters. Your point about hydrogen saturation is directly related to breaking unstable ringed structures ("polycyclic aromatics") and isomerizing them into straight chain saturated lube molecules according to the general paraffinic designation of C(n)-H(2n+2) where "C" represents carbon, "H" represents hydrogen, and "n" represents the number of carbon atoms in the chain. These hydrocracked paraffins are NOT molecularly the same as PAOs, but do share most of the latter's lubrication traits - including high viscosity indeces (the very desiarable ability to maitain initial viscosity over a wide variation in temperature). All this is accomplished in the hydrocracker before the resulting base oil is blended with the ester and additive components during the production of commercially finished motor oil. The synthetic blend motor oils currently available use some combination of Group II/Group III or Group II/Group IV mixtures. While Group II base oils are not totally devoid of parasitic solvent-like compounds, their percentage distribution is in the order of single digits - sufficient to avoid seal shrinkage without unduly compromising lube properties out to 5,000 - 7,500 mile oil change intervals. While not as oxidation resisitant as full-synthetic formulations, they're a cost-effective compromise for users who're more comfortable with shorter oil change intervals. Using the syn-blends out to 10,000 miles is probably pushing beyond their service life, though. As you propose, I practice 3,000 mile oil and filter changes. For me, cars are minimally a decade investment, barring the unforeseen. I have an '89 Toyota truck that, at 279,000+ miles, is on its second clutch and third water pump, but the engine's never been touched other than routine scheduled maitenance - and that was initially using motor oil formulations from a time during which the best conventional motor oils weren't anywhere near the quality of current bottom-feeder motor oils that many wouldn't put in their lawnmower engines.
*Prior to the early sixties, the majority of finished motor oils relied on Group I base oil stocks. The solvent-like properties of unstable double-bond ringed structure polycyclic aromatics common to these base oils resulted in compromised lubrication and oxidation characteristics, but did maintain seal softening and swelling very nicely.
Particulates come in all sizes. Down to about 20 microns, automotive oil filters will trap them very effectively. Below 20 microns the picture becomes murkier (as does the oil), and below 5 microns you're usually on your own. An oil's detergent/dispersant package will suspend and neutralize many of these partially oxidized fuel and oil fragments, but the chemistry breaks down with extended use, cold weather and hot weather operation, and aggressive driving style or high-load conditions such as hauling or use in steep terrain. In the end it's the car owner's choice - with some staring blankly at the service adviser and stammering, "Well, why would I want to pay to have the oil changed when this car has a 100,000 mile engine warranty?" People with that mindset cannot be reasoned with.
I haven't had the opportunity to peruse current Hyundai owner's manuals, but the one that I have for my '03 Sonata recommends 3,000 mile oil changes in the "severe service" section - and that covers a lot more driving circumstances than many owners realize.
I know people that do 7,500 with no problems.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Here in FL it's hot and I tow a boat with the Santa Fe....I use either a 5W-30 or 5W-20..
Running great!!!
The grill without the 'H' arrived today and was installed.
It took eight days from order and the company is the one that supplies parts to Hyundai in Korea.
The installation is not a DIY less you be having some above average disassembly and assembly abilities.
There are seven small philips screws behind the grill in that tiny space in front of the radiator, you cannot get there from the bottom. You could I guess remove the radiator and it would be real easy or you could remove six hold down plastic retainers, four small hold down retainers on the top of the grill, lifting and removing two black pieces of plastic from the top of the grill, removing two 10 millimeter bolts, one each side, holds the upper bumper, next to the headlight, and popping the bumper off of the pin next to the 10 millimeter bolts you removed, you'll see it. The two top screws that secure the grill on each side are a challenge and impossible if you do not have the right tools. The rest is pretty straight forward if you can work without instructions and have patience.
Do not pull the bumper top piece out to far, you may damage the paint. You can hold a light in one hand and a stubby philips in the other to remove the easy five. you will need an offset or philips socket for your 1/4" drive, even then it's a tester.
Before putting the new grill 'in' pre-tap the holes, put the screws in and remove. If you don't they will be difficult to due during installation.
Good luck and the result is 'SMOOTH, SMOOTH, SMOOTH'
Congratulations!!!
BTW, Walmart is the oil Mecca. Great selection and 5 quart jugs too. Most auto parts stores are pathetic.
Enjoy your rides people. :shades:
Log on to the "NBC4.tv" urls below for recent topical reads about Jiffy-Lube practices. Jiffy-Lube is a wholly owned and operated subsidiary of SOPUS - "Shell Oil Petroleum, U.S.". SOPUS blends and distributes motor oils under the, "FormulaShell", "Quaker State", and "Pennzoil" brand names.
http://www.nbc4.tv/investigations/8881193/detail.html
http://www.nbc4.tv/investigations/9156749/detail.html
You were right about the Motorcraft oil, it is a blend. A little under $10 for a 5 quart container at WalMart.
I'd heard of the problem of seal shrikage you mentioned and I was worried about using oils containing synthetics for this reason. Your reply has removed my doubts about this. Think I'll stick to the 3000 mile oil change regime, your comments about the small particulates makes me feel more comfortable with this.
I have a 1977 Buick, a 1996 Olds, and a 1986 Nissan 200SX as well as the new Azera. The first 3 have all had 2,000 mile oil/filter changes using non-synthetic oil. Although none have the high mileage of your 89 Toyota. I haven't had to top up the oil on any between changes. The Buick has the highest mileage, 145,000.
*Lemme guess - your '77 Buick's OHV V8 torquer's probably loafing along shy of 1,900 rpm at 70 mph while my '03 Sonata's DOHC V6 is buzzing along at nearly 2,500 rpm at that vehicle speed.