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That being said, if the car is well serviced and checks out thoroughly, you might get another 75K out of it before a major overhaul of some sort. Biggest issues are the climate control systems and a/c, which aren't very good and may fail periodically. Also the automatic door locks seem to go on the blink a lot....be careful also to note if there's a whine in the differential as you accelerate. Other than that, I can't think of any endemic problem....of course, with any diesel you have to watch for fuel contamination (algae and water in the fuel tank), so if you buy the car be sure to treat the fuel every tankful with a conditioner and cetane enhancer and every once in a while with a bio-cide for algae.
AS for the turbo, it should be quiet...if the car smokes excessively when started cold, this could indicate a worn turbo. A bad a/c system may be the climate control valve or the a/c compressor, both of which cost hundreds of dollars. So play with every knob and switch and make sure everything works!
thanks for all the info so far this is very helpfull.
The 300 series is a big 5-cylinder car that is smoother and quieter by a long shot, and for that reason is a popular used car. I think I could sell mine in a red hot minute for $4,000 (but I won't).
I think that trans shift pattern is adjustable. A conversion would cost you more than the car is worth I think if it's a 4-door, and if it's a coupe you really wouldn't want to mess it up by cutting holes in the floor, or having to weld this and that, etc. I think you could get this car to shift sooner. Conversions of this sort are a big job, especially with the pedal assemblies, driveshafts, etc. Even on an easy car, such as my Saab, the conversion cost me over $3,000, and that is a "bolt-in" affair. And besides, I've driven stickshift models of this car and they aren't very nice to drive...the shifter is not very positive, and it's a big car to be shifting all day I think.
If this were a 280SL, I'd consider it, since the car warrants a stickshift and the value is upwards of $30K....but on your car I just don't see either the economics or the conversion itself being very satisfying.
Thanks in advance
gixwomack--the used car guides are pretty accurate....go to www.traderonline.com and see what the reasonable (middle range) asking prices are and go by that.
Routine maintenance is average for a luxury car--figure $300-400 for a routine maintenance check twice a year, plus whatever expendable parts might come up, like tires, brakes, mufflers, etc.
I would not recommend getting involved with this car, as I see it as nothing but a huge money pit with no rewards at the end of a long, hard road. If I were you, I'd rather look for a nice 6.9 sedan....it's cheaper to buy, almost as fast, and easier to deal with. Around $12,000 should be enough to buy any nice 6.3, and around $9,000 should get you a lovely 450SEL 6.9. If you really want a big Benz, consider the later 560SELs, also in this price range and a much better car than either of the earlier big V8s.
Anyway, my dad still has the car, runs like a dream, looks like it could be a 1994 because '88 was the first year of the new body style, and the bonus is it has a manual transmission. It is quite rare, there are only about 10 in Canada, probably 30 in all of N.A. 1988 was the last year 7's came with a standard, and he's a big guy so he needs the room, but loves a stick. The best deal he ever got!
Also, they are very noisy compared to the MB 5 and 6cylinder diesels.
I'm not a big fan of the 7-series BMWs, at least not an a used car. I think owning one from the beginning is great, but buying one as a high mileage used car from a stranger is rather scary. They are complex and major component repair is expensive. Also, in spite of your dad's preference, I think rowing around in a stickshift in a car of that size is a chore (to me). This is a big tourer and needs an automatic. The stickshifts are "rare" because nobody wanted them.
The MB 190 2.3-16 is an interesting car, possibly the only interesting 190 there is. Definitely worth a look, even though it is an "entry-level" Benz and pretty bare-bones in trim and materials. On the down side, I think (I THINK) a 1986 190 2.3-16 would be a gray market car, so you might want to investigate that further, and see if an MB shop will work on it and, if possible, have the shop assess the level of quality of the conversion work to US specs.
Sort of a minor collectible.
When you say bare-bones does it mean it willhave no air-conditioning, etc? The ad. says it is "loaded" and Kelley's blue book confims it comes with A/C and ABS as well. Any more info. you or any other TownHall correspondent can give me will be appreciated. I have never owned a Merc. and this will be my first.
Sorry, by "bare bones" I meant that the trim levels and quality of materials is not particularly lavish or extravagant...the interior and exterior of the 190 is pretty modest and austere...but it should have a/c, sure.
I think a stickshift 16V 190 would be fun, I'd certainly investigate it further....but remembrer, it's a used car and so you have to do your homework here. The car's ID plate would identify if it conforms to US specifications or not. But I wouldn't drag my feet...this car will be bought if the price is right.
Dgraves, your neighbor will have to leave the car in the field, or better still soup it up and use it as a autocross race car!
Price isn't particularly low...these cars are not well-known nor are they particularly admired by collectors. By and large, the 190 didn't have a good reputation, and the 16V got caught up in the bad press.
The only "crazy" part is that your chopped coupe will not be worth any more than it is now (presuming in very nice shape, maybe in the low 20s)....while a "real" 3.5 cabriolet low grille is worth 3 or 4 times that.
So you will endure substantial expense for no financial benefits, but only the pleasure of a top down experience. Given that scenario, you may want to consider getting your top down jollies in a little Alfa Romeo or MGB for under $10K.
The MB coupes do not have the value of the convertibles, nor will they ever come even close to matching them--the only exception being the Gullwing, of course, which outpaces its convertible sibling the 300SL roadster.
Some people will tell you that you are ruining a "classic" but they are not really in touch with history or the market on that....true, I myself would be reluctant to chop a 3.5 especially, but really it's your baby and the car is not so rare or valuable that it's the Mona Lisa or a hand-built Ferrari...they made over 4,500 of your car, and maybe half of those are still around somewhere, so it's not a one of kind type of thing.
The 3.5 cabriolet is a great cruiser, and hard to beat even in a modern car if you want top down, 5-passenger luxury. It would be fun for tours and club events.
My problem with going to a 2-seat convertible is that I have an 11 year old daughter who loves to go to the ice cream stand and other great destinations in the summer with a friend in the back seat of a convertible. I had a Saab 900SE conv. (1997) but got out of it last year. It had a great back seat for kids. With only 2 seats, we'd eliminate the summer night rides with my wife, daughter and a friend, and my daughter won't be 11 forever. (I live in Michigan, where you have to appreciate each summer night.) I'd worry about buying an older Saab conv., plus I do love the unique style and feel of the 1970 3.5. Any other suggestions for good cruising convertibles with a good back seat? The 3.5 would be hard to beat, even if it is a fake cab.
That mileage is very high, and just about anything could go wrong at that high number...the car has essentially done all that Mercedes or any reasonable person might expect, so really you are in completely unknown territory. I would certainly expect some problems, yes, but perhaps the basic driveline could still be okay. I'd worry more about the history of the transmission than the engine.
Try to buy it cheap and keep your fingers crossed is all I can say. Personally, cars with this much mileage have to prove themselves to me through an examination and good service records; otherwise, if the car cannot sell itself, I'd consider it nearless worthless at such high mileage...perhaps a $3,500 car. I bought a very clean, spotless 1980 300D for $1,200 with 212K on it...and really, I wouldn't have paid much more.
My mechanic, who i've trusted for close to 20 years has a fellow customer (also a long time customer) selling a 1992 190E with 105K miles. with all the options Edmunds returns a private party sale price between 8400 and 9200 for average to good condition. The seller is asking 9000. Are there any things to be wary of in this model/year? Do I have a reasonable expectation of driving it to 200K miles if its properly maintained?
Regards,
Charlie
If the original Becker radio is still in the car, you can throw that over a fence and get a decent unit. Also, as with all Benzes, please check out the climate control system thoroughly to make sure everything is working just right. Same with the power windows...if they struggle, you will have future problems I think. Climate control and power windows were not MBs forte back then.
The 2.6 is a sturdy little car and with good care should last 200K yes. Of course, some components will wear out before then, but the basic driveline should be fine and the build quality is good. Price seems okay, too.
The owner was pretty fastidious regarding maintenance. It handled well and all was in order but for the radio. It got reset needing a code from the dealer(?)to be able to use it. The climate control seemed to be ok. I'm still on the fence but it sure looked good.
Have you worked all the dials and switches and windows and sunroof etc. Play with everything!\Also, if you can see the prior service/repair records, this will give you an excellent idea of what's ahead.
Some automakers recommend running a lot of accessories while jump starting, to sort of share the load of the possible voltage surge.
Black smoke is always a rich mixture..unburned hydrocarbons...could be a tune up problem, a bad injector, a bad sensor.
Probably the worst scenario is lots of WHITE smoke, which is usually indicative of a blown head gasket.
Would it be worthwhile to run some injector cleaner through the gas?
If anyone has a recommendation for a good mechanic in the Walnut Creek or Danville, CA area please pass along, just shop name, I can look it up and plan to get several inputs. Thanks again for the input on 280's and early 70's era.
The 280 SL is geared very low, so the car is really wound tight at 75 mph. It's one of the car's less desirable characteristics....I'm sure the car could pull a higher gear ratio.
Yeah, I bet the soft top has rotted, but you know, you never know. Be sure to get the German=type top reinstalled if you want the car to have any resale value...don't put an American style vinyl top on, it just doesn't look right on the car.
Also, the a/c systems on these cars are pathetic, so if you are expecting to stay cool in your hot summers, just forget it.
Price seems fair enough, miles are great! A nice 'little' car, but don't expect it to be worth anything in the future, because it won't be. It's just a nice used car--so don't sink a fortune into it.
They pulled the hard top at the dealer and with 4 guys working it, they got the soft top up and in place, took 4 tries and they had to dampen it to get it to streach, amazing after 30 years. Wife is now driving it just on nice days with the top off and the tune up, had forgetten about points and such, and they had to clean out break lines, mostly plugged. Since it had been repainted orignal burgundy just a few years back it is a great looker and fun to drive. Surprised at the nice sound from the 6 going up in 2nd and 3rd, but you're right, low gearing from the get go. Still have a few minor issues but will work them over time and with the weather in Nor Cal lots of days to enjoy the red roadster.
There is a broken chrome cover at the left of the drivers shoulder, through which the hard top latches. Any input on replacement? The guy at the dealer who basicly works older MB's said need to find a specialty parts dealer. Thanks again for any input and the prior as well.
Be sure to tell wivey to rev that car up...if you putt around town, you're going to foul the plugs time and time again.