Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

kyfdx · February 2015

Michaell said:
Dodge journey?

The Toyota dealer next to the Subaru dealer we are going to tomorrow has a couple of Venza Limited all-wheel-drive available. Discounted price of about $38,000

Rented a Journey once (in Colorado!). Good people hauler, but anemic acceleration and, as mentioned... feels cheap.. (and outdated, I think)

corvette · February 2015

The Journey now has the 3.6 liter Pentastar engine, which should solve the acceleration issues, but not the others you mentioned.

Michaell · February 2015

kyfdx said:

Michaell said:
Dodge journey?

The Toyota dealer next to the Subaru dealer we are going to tomorrow has a couple of Venza Limited all-wheel-drive available. Discounted price of about $38,000

Rented a Journey once (in Colorado!). Good people hauler, but anemic acceleration and, as mentioned... feels cheap.. (and outdated, I think)

Met the wife for lunch today (Bonefish Grill!). Pointed out a Journey ... she said it "looked like a Dodge". Which wasn't a compliment. Scratch that.

Showed her a picture of the Venza - she likes it. Almost got her to go to the Toyota dealer close to her office after lunch, but she begged off. We may hit the one next to the Subie dealer tomorrow afternoon.

Confirmed via phone that the Subaru dealer has two 3.6R's equipped the way we want on the lot. And that a Wilderness Green one is in transit.

Was told in no uncertain terms that she does not like the buying process - specifically, the time it takes to go through the finance office. Test drives and walk arounds - no problem. Has no intention of spending 4 hours at the dealer when it comes time to make a deal. She reminded me - again - of when she bought her Ford Tempo in Cheyenne back in the 80's - they brought her the car and the paperwork to her home and she signed everything there.

Sandman6472 · February 2015

Green is definitely nice but blue over ivory is a stunning combo, biased here of course since that's my combo but the Sube navy is a much richer looking blue, absolutely stunning! Think Nycar will agree with my sentiments here though red over ivory is nice. Over the long haul though, think the blue over ivory will look best a few years down the road and she'll be much happier in the long run. Once she sees it in the flesh, think she might just agree that blue/ivory vehicle is her new ride!!!

The Sandman

Michaell · February 2015

sandman_6472 said:
Green is definitely nice but blue over ivory is a stunning combo, biased here of course since that's my combo but the Sube navy is a much richer looking blue, absolutely stunning! Think Nycar will agree with my sentiments here though red over ivory is nice. Over the long haul though, think the blue over ivory will look best a few years down the road and she'll be much happier in the long run. Once she sees it in the flesh, think she might just agree that blue/ivory vehicle is her new ride!!!

The Sandman

Nope - we reviewed all the colors on-line. She's had blue before - the '99 New Beetle and the '05 VUE were both a bright blue. I'm just happy she didn't prefer a silver or grey color.

But - never say never. She may see the blue and change her mind.

nyccarguy · February 2015

Which blue?

Michaell · February 2015

nyccarguy said:

Which blue?

Lapis.

nyccarguy · February 2015

I do love my Lapis Blue. Although right now it is rock salt white/grey. The ivory interior isn't as bad to keep up on as I thought. I am very careful to make sure I put my jacket in the trunk. You'd get leather anyway, so it is a no brainer. I've seen the outback 3.6R in the Venetian Red/Ivory which also looks sharp!

Michaell · February 2015

nyccarguy said:

I do love my Lapis Blue. Although right now it is rock salt white/grey. The ivory interior isn't as bad to keep up on as I thought. I am very careful to make sure I put my jacket in the trunk. You'd get leather anyway, so it is a no brainer. I've seen the outback 3.6R in the Venetian Red/Ivory which also looks sharp!

I have to admit that I too like the red outback

sda · February 2015

nyccarguy said:
I do love my Lapis Blue. Although right now it is rock salt white/grey. The ivory interior isn't as bad to keep up on as I thought. I am very careful to make sure I put my jacket in the trunk. You'd get leather anyway, so it is a no brainer. I've seen the outback 3.6R in the Venetian Red/Ivory which also looks sharp!

I am approaching 34000 miles and the beige cloth interior still looks new. I am quick to address any stains and discourage any eating in the car. The black carpet seems harder to keep as it shows everything that gets tracked in. At least any thing dark such as grease from asphalt isn't as obvious as if the carpet was a lighter color.

nyccarguy · February 2015

great point. The black carpeting helps A LOT!

jayrider · February 2015

Tooling around Scottsdale in a Charger SXT rental. Better visibility than my LaCrosse and a great drive train. Firmer ride and a lot more road noise. Still nice with plenty of power for the likes of me. Looks like 82 degrees on the golf course today. Oh well.

stever · February 2015

Sweet - only going to hit 73° here today.

houdini1 · February 2015

jayrider said:
Tooling around Scottsdale in a Charger SXT rental. Better visibility than my LaCrosse and a great drive train. Firmer ride and a lot more road noise. Still nice with plenty of power for the likes of me. Looks like 82 degrees on the golf course today. Oh well.

Hit 'em long and straight !!

jayrider · February 2015

houdini1 said:

jayrider said:
Tooling around Scottsdale in a Charger SXT rental. Better visibility than my LaCrosse and a great drive train. Firmer ride and a lot more road noise. Still nice with plenty of power for the likes of me. Looks like 82 degrees on the golf course today. Oh well.
Hit 'em long and straight !!

At 69, I'm happy with straight --- long has become the new short.

Michaell · February 2015

Gojng to hit the Toyota and Subaru dealers this afternoon. I'll report back on the experience when I get home.

Sandman6472 · February 2015

Been using the sunroof everyday now, something I never thought I'd use honestly but with the weather being so spectacular, it's just a no-brainer for me. The wife hasn't opened hers yet which is just crazy because it's such a great bonus especially in this cool winter weather we've been having. The winter is much cooler than the past few, not cold but cool which is the best as we don't need the a/c or the heat...just open a few windows when we get home and it stays a comfy 72 degrees in the house. It's been getting down to the low 40's at night and yesterday it was 65 in the house when I got home from work so we are loving it. And having the roof is just the icing on the cake...I know if I had bought that BMW drop top a few years back, I'd have been using it a lot.
Now all I need to do is get them windows tinted by the end of April. The Tucson came with all but the drivers done already so I left it alone but now that none are done, I will have them done. A good friend who just bought a used 2015 A3 Quattro has given me the name of the guy she used and said they did an exceptional job so I will be calling them within a couple of months.

The Sandman

nyccarguy · February 2015

Great weekend to be a Chronic Car Buyer. Not that I'm in the market:). A dealer is advertising a $50,140 Ram 1500 Crew Cab (what does this mean in pickup truck language?) 4 x 4 with the diesel motor for $40,947. I'm sure you need to qualify for a bunch of rebates to get it for that price though.

Buick dealer advertising a $37,740 AWD Regal for $31,995.

Michaell · February 2015

Conditional punch! Deposit made on the incoming wilderness green outback. Should arrive in a few weeks.

sda · February 2015

Michaell said:
Conditional punch! Deposit made on the incoming wilderness green outback. Should arrive in a few weeks.

Congrats! Looking forward to reading about the specific details.

28firefighter · February 2015

Michaell said:
Conditional punch! Deposit made on the incoming wilderness green outback. Should arrive in a few weeks.

Well. That was easy?

Michaell · February 2015

'Twas a pretty painless process, though we haven't done the heavy lifting yet.

First stop was the Toyota dealer. Venza parked right in front of where we parked the car - wife dismissed it out of hand. "Too angular" was her comment. Never even got out of the car and drove next door to the Subaru dealer.

There was a Wilderness Green Outback 3.6 parked up front - but, it didn't have the option package we wanted. Salesguy went to find one that did. Brought back the Lapis Blue with Ivory interior. Quick walk around, with him explaining the features. Wife got behind the wheel; was surprised it "felt" as high, visibility wise, as the Mazda. 10 minute test drive of all surface streets, though the wife was able to exercise the right pedal enough to feel that it had enough power. Tried out the lane departure; she liked that feature as well. Not as much luck with the voice activated nav - she gave it her work address (sans city) and got a list of cities back east. I suspect practice will make perfect.

Back at the dealership, a quick test of the cross traffic alert system and the power liftgate were both met with approval by the wife. Head inside, right to the managers desk. Asked about the Green that was showed "in transit" - they confirmed it was and asked for a $500 refundable deposit to put it on hold.

Done and done. The dealer will contact the factory to expedite shipping. They figure a few weeks for it to arrive, then we'll negotiate the selling price and trade in.

Wife likes that it's more comfortable than the Mazda - not as harsh a ride. 18" vs 19" wheels (and higher profile tiles) might account for most of this.

So far, so good. But it's not over yet.

rayainsw · February 2015

'..she gave it her work address (sans city) and got a list of cities back east. '
I was surprised to find that the Nav system on the Charger
had Texas as the 'default state' ???
Resulted in similar initial results...
- Ray
Fixed now...

Michaell · February 2015

rayainsw said:
'..she gave it her work address (sans city) and got a list of cities back east. '
I was surprised to find that the Nav system on the Charger
had Texas as the 'default state' ???
Resulted in similar initial results...
- Ray
Fixed now...

Interesting observation ... I suspect that if (when) we consummate the deal, much studying of the manual will be necessary.

Hey @nyccarguy‌ - what do you think of the headlamps on your Legacy as compared to those on the BMW? I'm a little concerned that they may not be as good as those on the Mazda. And, the wife has been raving about the lights on the daughter's MINI.

stickguy · February 2015

I had trouble with the downstairs at first, until I read how to give it the commands, and now it works fine. There is a learning curve on that.

Michaell · February 2015

stickguy said:
I had trouble with the downstairs at first, until I read how to give it the commands, and now it works fine. There is a learning curve on that.

Yeah, I suspected as much.

nyccarguy · February 2015

@Michaell‌

Doesn't the 3.6R Limited come with Xenon Headlights? The Bi-Xenon headlights were one of my favorite creature features that my BMW had. The standard halogens that my 2.5i Premium Legacy aren't as good, but they get the job done.

Michaell · February 2015

nyccarguy said:
@Michaell‌

Doesn't the 3.6R Limited come with Xenon Headlights? The Bi-Xenon headlights were one of my favorite creature features that my BMW had. The standard halogens that my 2.5i Premium Legacy aren't as good, but they get the job done.

I just went back over the features list .. yes, HID are standard on the 3.6R. I think I'll want the wife to take a test drive at night just to be sure.

It does also feature the fog lamps that swivel with the steering wheel - neat.

Now to figure out the pricing - and whether I'm going to lease or buy. The current incentives end on 3/2; dealer thinks the car will be in a few days after that. They've (verbally) promised me that whatever deal is best when we close is what I'll qualify for.

TMV, near as I can tell, is about $34.9K. If I adjust for the outrageous $499 dealer fee they want to add, I'm at $34.4. Figure I'll offer $34.5 just to be safe. 7.9% sales tax on top of that. No tags or registration as part of the deal. I pay that separately to the county when I register and transfer plates; that will still run north of $600, most of which is personal property tax. Game time decision on whether we'll get an extended warranty. I'll need to research that.

It occurs to me that I didn't get a business card from either the salesman or the sales manager - hmmm.

sda · February 2015

The adoption of the dealer fee in the past 10 years irks me. And they have the be 'fair' and not show favoritism so it applies to everyone. I am seeing admin fees around here getting close to $1000, most $599 or higher. Feels like smoke and mirrors on getting a fair deal. One positive about living in SC, the sales tax is capped at $300. I am amazed at the tax rate of other states. Wow

Michaell · February 2015

sda said:
The adoption of the dealer fee in the past 10 years irks me. And they have the be 'fair' and not show favoritism so it applies to everyone. I am seeing admin fees around here getting close to $1000, most $599 or higher. Feels like smoke and mirrors on getting a fair deal. One positive about living in SC, the sales tax is capped at $300. I am amazed at the tax rate of other states. Wow

It's a fact of life here in Colorado, though there is one dealership group here that advertises "no dealer fee". They are a one price shop, so it all washes out in the end. I'm just hoping to get to a selling price that mitigates that fee.

Some states - NY, CA, OH - place a cap on the fees, but I'm sure the dealers aren't as willing to negotiate a lower selling price than those states that have higher fees.

Sales tax is based on where you live - state, county, city and regional (transit district) taxes are all different, and additive.

nyccarguy · February 2015

@Michaell‌

If it has HIDs, she'll be fine. I paid $1500 (somewhere around there) for the 5 year/100K Subaru Gold warranty. It includes a $100 deductible and some sort of tire insurance (it covers the cost of 4 replacement tires and is pro rated after 50K).

What are the lease rates & money factor for whatever lease term you choose? What's the 60 month & 72 month APR special they are offering right now?

Michaell · February 2015

nyccarguy said:
@Michaell‌

If it has HIDs, she'll be fine. I paid $1500 (somewhere around there) for the 5 year/100K Subaru Gold warranty. It includes a $100 deductible and some sort of tire insurance (it covers the cost of 4 replacement tires and is pro rated after 50K).

What are the lease rates & money factor for whatever lease term you choose? What's the 60 month & 72 month APR special they are offering right now?

1.9% for 72 months at the moment; lease numbers are 55% and .00030 for 36/15, though we may consider buying some extra miles up front, just to be sure.

Sandman6472 · February 2015

Love the lights on the A3, they really light things up but I just wasn't ready at the time to pay the extra price for the lighting package on the Golf...the sales guy tried to get me to upgrade but I declined. Don't do much night driving anymore since I gave up the long distance driving so don't miss it too much...yet. I think if I hadn't gotten the Tucson and had just gone from the Civic to the Golf, it would've been a yes on that package but honestly, if I hadn't gone the route I did, the Civic would probably still be in the garage since the Civic to the Golf would've been a lateral move. I did enjoy a lot about the Tucson when I had it but think that if I'd gotten the Encore, Trax, Mazda X-3 or the new Honda HRV, there would've been no Golf. But hind site is always 100% and I now have a vehicle I truly love like the Civic, so all is good.
When I was at the Audi store the other day, saw some awesome 17" alloys that would look perfect on the Golf but walked away...quickly. Think I was rushed a bit by the dealer to make a final decision on the wheels I have now. I do get where they were coming from, they wanted this situation ended and didn't want me to put anymore miles on wheels/tires I wasn't going to keep but I wish they had thrown the Geneva wheels into the mix since those were the ones I wanted originally. I got confused with all the different and similar wheel styles they were showing me and at the end, they just chose two '15 Jetta's outside and said choose one pattern and then we're done. Do like them but liked the Geneva's the best!

The Sandman

jayrider · February 2015

sandman_6472 said:
Love the lights on the A3, they really light things up but I just wasn't ready at the time to pay the extra price for the lighting package on the Golf...the sales guy tried to get me to upgrade but I declined. Don't do much night driving anymore since I gave up the long distance driving so don't miss it too much...yet. I think if I hadn't gotten the Tucson and had just gone from the Civic to the Golf, it would've been a yes on that package but honestly, if I hadn't gone the route I did, the Civic would probably still be in the garage since the Civic to the Golf would've been a lateral move. I did enjoy a lot about the Tucson when I had it but think that if I'd gotten the Encore, Trax, Mazda X-3 or the new Honda HRV, there would've been no Golf. But hind site is always 100% and I now have a vehicle I truly love like the Civic, so all is good.
When I was at the Audi store the other day, saw some awesome 17" alloys that would look perfect on the Golf but walked away...quickly. Think I was rushed a bit by the dealer to make a final decision on the wheels I have now. I do get where they were coming from, they wanted this situation ended and didn't want me to put anymore miles on wheels/tires I wasn't going to keep but I wish they had thrown the Geneva wheels into the mix since those were the ones I wanted originally. I got confused with all the different and similar wheel styles they were showing me and at the end, they just chose two '15 Jetta's outside and said choose one pattern and then we're done. Do like them but liked the Geneva's the best!

The Sandman

There are hundreds of after market choices of wheels for any car. All you need to do is pay for them.

graphicguy · February 2015

Michaell...sounds like a beautiful car. Congratz!

nyccarguy · February 2015

@Michaell‌

1.9% for 72 months sounds good. If you are at all worried about going over the 15K per year, then finance it. Subarus hold their value and I'm sure you won't be anywhere underwater after 3 years.

Michaell · February 2015

nyccarguy said:
@Michaell‌

1.9% for 72 months sounds good. If you are at all worried about going over the 15K per year, then finance it. Subarus hold their value and I'm sure you won't be anywhere underwater after 3 years.

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking.

Sandman6472 · February 2015

No, not putting anymore money into the Golf except window tinting in a month or two. Also, still deciding about my XM subscription and will see how low I can get them for a year subscription...would like to get that 6 month rate just doubled to make it a year rate. Not sure if that'll fly but if ya don't ask, ya don't get!!!

The Sandman

Michaell · February 2015

sandman_6472 said:
No, not putting anymore money into the Golf except window tinting in a month or two. Also, still deciding about my XM subscription and will see how low I can get them for a year subscription...would like to get that 6 month rate just doubled to make it a year rate. Not sure if that'll fly but if ya don't ask, ya don't get!!!

The Sandman

My 6 month renewal for Sirius/XM for the Elantra showed up in the mail last week. $104.xx - ouch. I may let the subscription lapse then give them a call and see how badly they want me back. I keep hearing about a 5 month deal for $20 - though if they want a credit card, I may pass.

Speaking of XM, if (hell, when) we trade in the Mazda, I should get a few checks back from various vendors:

1. Sirius/XM - year long subscription expires in August or September, seeing as how I can't roll it over
2. Gap insurance - about $200, according to the payoff doc I printed out last week
3. Extended warranty - just a couple years left on it, and may be the hardest to get back

jayrider · February 2015

sandman_6472 said:
No, not putting anymore money into the Golf except window tinting in a month or two. Also, still deciding about my XM subscription and will see how low I can get them for a year subscription...would like to get that 6 month rate just doubled to make it a year rate. Not sure if that'll fly but if ya don't ask, ya don't get!!!

The Sandman

Just renewed my XM yesterday --- about $94 for one year including tax. Very easy.

sda · February 2015

Michaell said:

sandman_6472 said:
No, not putting anymore money into the Golf except window tinting in a month or two. Also, still deciding about my XM subscription and will see how low I can get them for a year subscription...would like to get that 6 month rate just doubled to make it a year rate. Not sure if that'll fly but if ya don't ask, ya don't get!!!

The Sandman
My 6 month renewal for Sirius/XM for the Elantra showed up in the mail last week. $104.xx - ouch. I may let the subscription lapse then give them a call and see how badly they want me back. I keep hearing about a 5 month deal for $20 - though if they want a credit card, I may pass.

Speaking of XM, if (hell, when) we trade in the Mazda, I should get a few checks back from various vendors:

1. Sirius/XM - year long subscription expires in August or September, seeing as how I can't roll it over
2. Gap insurance - about $200, according to the payoff doc I printed out last week
3. Extended warranty - just a couple years left on it, and may be the hardest to get back

I think that is something a lot of folks aren't aware of, if you sell your call before the extended warranty expires, gap insurance, etc. you are probably due a prorated refund. Years back I was clueless. Traded my VW Fox for a Cabriolet at the same dealership that I bought the Fox. Some weeks later I received a decent refund which was a welcome surprise. This was done proactively on their part, which was a nice surprise as well. I continued to do business for years with them until they were sold and their management style changed and not for the better.

Sandman6472 · February 2015

So you got a price of $70/year which would work for me actually. Still have a month until they turn it off on me so will wait a few more weeks to be honest or will do the 6 month deal and in the beginning of month 6, see what I can do. As much as I do like it, still have an iPod to use or if I do end up getting an iPhone 5c, can use my iTunes. Just not sure, guess the impending new smartphone purchase has all my attention right now.

The Sandman

berri · February 2015

Please - no more blabbing Cousin Brucie!

au1994 · February 2015

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:
@Michaell‌

1.9% for 72 months sounds good. If you are at all worried about going over the 15K per year, then finance it. Subarus hold their value and I'm sure you won't be anywhere underwater after 3 years.
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking.

Congrats! Sounds like it will be a nice ride.

qbrozen · February 2015

I received my first offer to extend the siriusxm in the caddy. No thanks! I honestly no longer want the music at any price. It is far too often I find nothing on I'm interested in and wind up playing Pandora instead. The only thing I want to continue in the caddy is the live traffic updates. But, according to the siriusxm site, its $48/yr. I pay $10/yr to have it on my phone, so $48 is a bit rich for me. Maybe at $24, I'd keep it for convenience.

venture · February 2015

nyccarguy said:
@Michaell‌

1.9% for 72 months sounds good. If you are at all worried about going over the 15K per year, then finance it. Subarus hold their value and I'm sure you won't be anywhere underwater after 3 years.

Does your Legacy have remote start? If so, does it shut off when you open the door?

My Fusion doesn't, but my wife's new Forester does. It's a little irritating. The sales lady said it's a safety feature.

nyccarguy · February 2015

@‌venture

"Does your Legacy have remote start?"

No. I got a very lightly optioned Legacy Premium 2.5i - Slick Top (no moonroof) & Cloth Seats (They are heated though).

ken117 · February 2015

Being underwater on a car loan is not inherently a negative. Without the mischief of a prior loan being added, being underwater typically results from not paying a large downpayment at loan commencement. With a very low finance rate, say .9 percent or zero percent, there really is no significant difference whether the cash is paid up front, through higher monthly payments, or through a balloon type payment when the vehicle is disposed.

In some cases, there may be benefits to not paying any down payment. The money could be invested or could be used to pay something for which a higher interest rate loan would be needed.

Of course the key is to have a solid credit score and a nice income.

Michaell · February 2015

ken117 said:
Being underwater on a car loan is not inherently a negative. Without the mischief of a prior loan being added, being underwater typically results from not paying a large downpayment at loan commencement. With a very low finance rate, say .9 percent or zero percent, there really is no significant difference whether the cash is paid up front, through higher monthly payments, or through a balloon type payment when the vehicle is disposed.

In some cases, there may be benefits to not paying any down payment. The money could be invested or could be used to pay something for which a higher interest rate loan would be needed.

Of course the key is to have a solid credit score and a nice income.

ken - i would agree with you. While we are upside down on the Mazda, the low interest rate on the Subaru will still result in a lower payment than we're currently making. And, as has been previously noted, Subarus hold their value extremely well (at least, here in Colorado).

stever · February 2015

The local Kia dealer has a Soul+ with sunroof in stock in white. My wife is bugging me to go down and look at it so maybe I will. In a few days....

If I got moving I could actually beat @Michaell to the punch.

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