Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
Options
Comments
My personal opinion is that ever since the Castrol/Mobil court decision, Most all of the Major off the shelf synthetics have gone the way that Castrol has. Why shouldn't they as Castrol still charges premium prices for their Syntec that isn't a full synthetic anymore. As I've said before, compare the typical data information from todays synthetics to synthetics of years past and you will see the difference. Explain why the pour point of Mobil 1 synthetic has gone from -65 degrees F to -49 degrees F for the new SL formulation. This is getting closer to the pour points of a conventional oil. Mobil's conventional oil has a pour point of -38 degrees F. Not much of a difference.
I'm to the point of not worrying what I use as long as I change it on a regular basis. I doubt I'll see any oil related failures doing this.
Wayne
IMHO it seemed that age & condition of the engine, who manufactured it, antifreeze or air filter leaks, oil filter used, & city vs highway driving seemed to have as much affect on the condition of the oil as the particular brand of oil used. Like most things in life, too many variables to rely on broad generalizations. The guys who advocate whats best for "my" engine, or "me", might be on the best track.
I do change it at every 5k with synthetic now. Overkill perhaps. But, the car runs great, my wife is happy, and a new 530 is $45k. So, whats an extra $30 a year?
Do what's best for you and your car and share your experiences so we can all learn from them.
Happy motoring,
Jack
I could hardly believe your post when I first read it! I had thought that what you had posted was so obvious that everybody knew that and I for one had taken that as an assumption.
On second thought, it is probably not as obvious!
In effect that is what the mechanics have said about my TLC's after breaking into the valve covers and looking to check measure and possibly bill out for valve adjustment. (app 250 for a shim adjust if not within specs) They said the motor was way clean with almost no signs of wear and the valve specs were totally within factory specifications. This is with a 15,000 mile interval.
My other trucks are Chevy 4.3 motors. They have 200 hp, and when I change the oil they still do about the same,,,,they act like the difference in the old and new is not noticeable but they are stronger engines and it seems the oil may not be as stressed in them as the Nissan 4cyl is,,,maybe could go longer between changes if I wanted but it's easy to change and costs about $7 to change it.
Seems some engines (higher running rpm like 4cyls for example) work the oil harder and maybe could benefit from synthetics more possibly, I don't know....Chevron/Havoline works for me though
see y'all
Rando
Component CAS no. weight % range
1-Decene,hydropolymer 68037-01-4 70-80
hydrogenated
hydrotreated heavy 64742-54-7 1-5
parafinic distillate
heavy paraffinic solvent 64741-88-4 1-5
refined distillate
antiwear additive trade secret 1-5
ester trade secret 10-15
who knows what's in the current formula.
Technical assistance 1-800-458-4998
Customer service 1-800-458-8397
they might just be a poison control # or something. Someone can call and try to get some more info. I'll try either tomorrow or early next week.
Flash point 435F ASTM D-32
Pour point -40F
Specific gravity .86@60F
Viscosity @ 100F No data available
Viscosity @ 40C 65.2cSt
My only point in sharing the oil analysis results is that there are exceptions to just about everything, and most of all you need to verify your own personal assumptions.
Synthetics are better than dino? Frankly I agree, but there are examples where a dino brand, ULX-110, consistently achieves good results after 10K mile drain intervals, and several Castrol Synthetics are in serious trouble after 6K.
Leery of extended drain intervals? Never hurts to be cautious. But example after example of documented 10-15K oil analysis shows that it does work. What an opportunity for those so inclined.
Synthetics let you use extended drains? Generally true, but too many oil analysis show some well known extended drain brands struggling under 5K. Potential trouble for unsuspecting souls.
My car is at much greater risk from my own faulty or niave beliefs than from any oil company marketing hype. As Reagan said: trust, but verify. Especially oneself.
The definitive pronouncements are what get my dander up. The waters in Oilville are far too murky to permit such absolutes to exist.
You've made some very good points. You could take two identical cars, use the same type of oil and filter, with the same change interval, and still come up with two totally different analysis readings. No two would ever be the same.
There is one difference between dino and syn I don't understand. I know it's been discussed in this topic before, and many of you have stated that the color of your oil isn't a good indicator to use for determining when to change your oil. However, going back to the old days when I used dino, every car I used it in would turn the oil jet black by 3K miles. You couldn't even see the dipstick through the oil. Using syn, I haven't had a car yet that would turn the oil so dark that you couldn't see through it after 10K miles. I know many of you have said that this jet black oil may be fine, but I just can't stand running it in my engines. I prefer clean oil over black. Why is it that the syns stay clean so much longer, and isn't cleaner oil, better oil?
I sure like clean looking oil, even if it doesn't mean much. But I'll check it out on my vehicles and report back.
Yes, I'm sure cleaner oil is better oil.
I also thought several people here have noted that a darker color is often a good indication that the oil is doing its job; i.e., it is picking up and removing the stuff that it should be.
I'm now using Synpower in 2 cars. I really like it. Motor seems to run smoother and quieter.
Here's my theory on this, and obviously it's just a theory because I don't have the scientific means to prove it.
Dinos get darker sooner because they do a better job of removing the crud from your engine? I suppose it's possible, but not likely. My guess is that any syn will do at least as good of a job at removing crud as dinos do, if not a better job. I don't think the oil turns dark because it's removing crud, and here's why. Every car I've had has turned dino jet black within 3K miles, even new cars. I doubt that engines with less than 10K miles on them have enough crud inside to cause the oil to darken this quickly. I think the reason the oil darkens is because it gets saturated with carbon deposits. As you probably know, carbon is produced during the combustion process. Some of this carbon ends up in your oil, causing it to turn black. If this theory is correct, I don't understand what it is about syns that make them more resistant to this carbon saturation. At any rate, I would tend to believe that running carbon saturated oil in your engine is not a good thing.
So if you put the "racing" or for the purposes of this discussion less detergent oil in your crankcase what do you think would happen? Right, it would get less dark over the same period of time that the conventional oils would!
Also, the conventional oil gives off more waste components than a synthetic oil. So the additive pac can and does last longer than a comparable conventional oil.
Wal-Mart Syn: Flash 435 F, Pour -40F.
Chevron Supreme dino: Flash 435F, Pour -45F.
The Chevron Supreme appears as good for less money, although there's a lot more to oil than good flash and pour numbers.
Is it possible that in spite of the numbers, synthetic handles higher operating temperatures better and doesn't scorch?
In a word, Yes. One of the things that also happens is that the lower ash % (ability to form sludge {NOT GOOD} ) is lower in synthetic oil than conventional oil. So, lower ability to form sludge shows itself in cleaner oil.
I've been waiting for someone else to jump in and dispute claims such as 'dino oil is no good after 3k miles' and 'you can go 10k without worry on anything that says synthetic.'
It is a VERY pale color out of the bottle.Much ligter than Havoline SJ oil I have on hand.Does this tell me anything?I dunno.
It is obvious to me that the Chevron SL is "different" than the older dinos.And it's test results are much superior to the Havoline SJ.It's flashpoint is 453*(Mobil-1 is 455*).It's pourpoint is -36*(Mobil-1 is -49*).The V.I. is 135 to 145.The zinc is the same.These are close enough numbers to be negligible to me especially at 96 cents a qt.!
My question is whether they're enough better to warrant the extra expense, given that a car is a complex array of subsystems. Having a 250K engine in a car that falls apart at 200, would mean that spending extra $$$ to get the engine out to 300 would be wasted. This would be especially true with a car with automatic transmission since that cost is as great as the engine and they usually fail at 150K anyway (of course we could be talking synthetic ATF).
Personally.I think dark oil is related to proper suspension of dark particulates.I have used both dino/synths in the same engine,and used oil looks VERY similar.
Then I see disturbing analyses of synths like wtd's.I'll stick with 3,000-3,500 changes until there is finite proof that synths are superior.Superior in my car,not lab tests.
I'd sure like to see a dino stay as clean as a syn does, given the same amount of miles. I have yet to see this in any of my vehicles, or in any of my friend's vehicles. I'm not saying it can't happen, just that I haven't seen it. And again, like some of you are saying, it may not be bad for your engine to run black oil, but I just wouldn't get that "warm fuzzy" running it in my engine. Just the same as some of you not being comfortable with change intervals of longer than 5-6K miles, I'm not comfortable with dirty oil.