What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

houdini1 · March 2017

ruking1 said:
We must be looking at two different logic sets ? The (my display) "Zestimate" is - minus 17.27% (far) LESS than asking price. Aka, meaning "zestimate" MAY be closer to REAL current market prices, albeit, still too high: being the property has been on the market a long time.

Living in Nevada, can be an acquired taste, especially away from more recognizable urban & ski areas. Aka, been there, done that. (way less urban areas) But then on the other hand, CA's state individual income tax is # 1 / of 50 states @ 13% with calls for an even higher rate.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_income_tax NV's individual/corp are nada.

Over asking house prices are still pretty common, in this CA area. .

Aren't you both saying the same thing. You are saying the zestimate is $60,000. less than asking price, and he is saying price is $60,000. over zestimate.

ruking1 · March 2017

Yes! Differences again are logic sets! So "zestimates" are really useful (other) data points? The real questions are how to assign weighs in specific locations. Aka, how to use the tool? i.e.,. Don't make it to be a scalpel when it's a meat axe & vice versa?

gagrice · March 2017

I guess VW is playing their buyback program very well. Their sales are up while Ford and GM are down. The Jetta and Touareg seem to be the only real losers for VW.

http://media.vw.com/release/1347/

ruking1 · March 2017

Indeed! They have staked out very high ground!; compared against GM,Fiat Chrysler: just to to name two. When this whole "VW diesel-gate" thing started, (long about September 2015) & after the brouhaha dust had cleared, I had predicted this would resolve much the way it's been happening.

It does appear that they have some of the executive, as well as product "sacrificial lambs". I still think it marks a renewed TDI interest. VW"s leaving a vacuum in the TDI market niche that VW may re-enter @ a later date.

fintail · March 2017

I bet in 5 years, nobody but enthusiasts will even remember dieselgate, Some already richly compensated public sector suit types will have fond memories too.

ruking1 · March 2017

The VW 2003 Jetta TDI might be one example. The "gen" model is more than 14 years old . Yet the parts & logistical supply chain is alive & well. It's a no brainer to project how it will be in 15/16 years @ the 30 + years mark. I'm thinking diesel will be a larger % portion of the PVF than it is now @ 3 to 5%.

The small car % PVF will probably be smaller.

gagrice · March 2017

Well my slow leaking Michelin has made my decision to go with the Pirelli Scorpion Verde A/S Plus tires for me. Went in to have my tires rotated and check on the slow leak that has been with me about 6 months. Turns out it was a long nail right in the edge of the tire. So it cannot be patched. My guarantee would replace the tire. They have 29,000 miles on them. Discount Tire was happy to order a new Michelin. I decided to get the new tires instead. They gave me a Trade-in on the 3 good tires, which helped me decide. I am riding on the funny spare for the next 3-4 days till the new Pirellis arrive.

Meanwhile I got the check engine light on same as back in the Summer on our trip to Tahoe. It came on right after blasting around a Prius poking along on a two lane road out in the Borrego desert. So after I get my new tires on it is off to VW for repair of whatever is causing that light. It was an Oxy Sensor last time. $427 repair under warranty. I should still be covered under my 48 month 48k mile extended warranty. I would think if it is the same Oxy Sensor they have a design problem. I should be able to blast around a slow poke Prius up to 90 MPH without blowing out the sensors.

andres3 · March 2017

fintail said:
I bet in 5 years, nobody but enthusiasts will even remember dieselgate, Some already richly compensated public sector suit types will have fond memories too.

I wonder how many promotions in public sector jobs the government really "sticking it to VW" for dieselgate will create? I have a feeling a few careers were advanced at VW's expense.

andres3 · March 2017

gagrice said:
Diesel in Pahrump was cheaper than Las Vegas. Not sure why. What ever your cost of living in CA, it is far cheaper in NV. Las Vegas may be the exception. I have not checked as that is not appealing to me in any way. I want away from the rat race. Though with a VW I would have to go to LV for service. Pahrump has Chrysler and Chevy dealers. No Ford or any other foreign make. If VW buys back my Touareg, I would look at the Jeep GC diesel for sure. Thought LV is only 55 miles away. No emissions tests in NV. License. Under $100 to licence.

I go to Spring Mountain Motorsports Ranch in Pahrump, NV. I'm going in April again.

I would think the Ranch and town has some mechanics who would dabble in helping people with basic maintenance and service on a VW. Warranty work must be through a dealer though. They are big enough to have a Wal-Mart

xwesx · March 2017

Speaking of funny spares, I found that my Q7 does, indeed, have a spare tire. It is sorta strange in that it has this odd collapsible shape to it, and it requires inflation when you get it out to use it. But, the car also comes with a twelve-volt compact compressor, so I imagine it works well enough. And, it isn't a "donut" spare size, so it actually has a decent footprint to it.

This discovery helped me to have even less confidence in my salesman. LOL

ruking1 · March 2017

It would be logical to have the same package, on the same platform, across all models.

fintail · March 2017

Definitely some resume filler there. Of course, these are mostly cradle-to-grave unfireable positions anyway.

I am more interested in what will become of the settlement money.

andres3 said:

I wonder how many promotions in public sector jobs the government really "sticking it to VW" for dieselgate will create? I have a feeling a few careers were advanced at VW's expense.

ruking1 · March 2017

Yippee! CAFE standards will probably be rolled back! Hopefully this means less making of unwanted & UNbought vehicles! This will probably be bullish for TDI's. The timing is very interesting as US oil inventories come off highs. Natural gas Inventories are @ extreme highs also.

gagrice · March 2017

andres3 said:

gagrice said:
Diesel in Pahrump was cheaper than Las Vegas. Not sure why. What ever your cost of living in CA, it is far cheaper in NV. Las Vegas may be the exception. I have not checked as that is not appealing to me in any way. I want away from the rat race. Though with a VW I would have to go to LV for service. Pahrump has Chrysler and Chevy dealers. No Ford or any other foreign make. If VW buys back my Touareg, I would look at the Jeep GC diesel for sure. Thought LV is only 55 miles away. No emissions tests in NV. License. Under $100 to licence.
I go to Spring Mountain Motorsports Ranch in Pahrump, NV. I'm going in April again.

I would think the Ranch and town has some mechanics who would dabble in helping people with basic maintenance and service on a VW. Warranty work must be through a dealer though. They are big enough to have a Wal-Mart

Pahrump has two world famous venues. Spring Mountain and Front Sight Firearms Training Institute. Don't plan a trip without checking for rooms. Those two venues fill up every room and many people stay in Vegas while attending classes. The Shopping is on the North end of town. Only 3 stop lights in the entire city.

http://www.ignatius-piazza-front-sight.com/2017/03/01/with-25-new-ranges-nearing-completion-front-sight-just-hired-3-instructors-and-is-looking-for-100-more/

gagrice · March 2017

xwesx said:
Speaking of funny spares, I found that my Q7 does, indeed, have a spare tire. It is sorta strange in that it has this odd collapsible shape to it, and it requires inflation when you get it out to use it. But, the car also comes with a twelve-volt compact compressor, so I imagine it works well enough. And, it isn't a "donut" spare size, so it actually has a decent footprint to it.

This discovery helped me to have even less confidence in my salesman. LOL

I am running on my inflatable spare right now until my new Pirelli tires get here. I don't do any hard driving on it. Very substantial. I would not worry if I had a long way to get to service.

iluvmysephia1 · March 2017

Are you moving to Pahrump, gagrice?

ruking1 · March 2017

Tires have gotten almost absurdly weird, complicated, not to mention more expense, albeit not because of diesel.

Was the "VWA/American diesel-gate" really an American (EPA) global preemptive strike against (Germany) VW ? http://finance.yahoo.com/news/european-car-sales-flatten-vw-101522181.html aka, which AM oem has 25% of the AM market?

It might be one clue why GM left European markets & Chrysler was sold to both MB & Fiat There are rumors that Fiat Chrysler (white elephant) wants to be bought, i.e., by VW.

gagrice · March 2017

iluvmysephia1 said:
Are you moving to Pahrump, gagrice?

Just in the research stage presently. We want to simplify our life and expenses. Our friends and family are bailing out of CA. We don't want to be stuck shutting the lights out.

xwesx · March 2017

When I swapped to the Q7's winter wheels in Oregon, my father was a big fan of both the hubcentric wheels (as opposed to aligning the wheel on the lug studs) and of the cordless Milwaulkee impact wrench I use to change out tires. The longest part of the job was just lifting and lowering each corner of the vehicle.

In other news, I have the Q7 back now. The shop is convinced that the issue was excess moisture in the fuel. It seems to be running just fine now, and they didn't end up replacing anything on the car. So, I'm in wait and see mode now. When my oil comes in, I'll take a look into the fuel filter while I'm changing the oil, just to see if there is anything alarming there such as rust or metal flakes. If no, then I should be in pretty good shape.

I bought two 2.5G containers of DEF yesterday, and the car swallowed both of them. So, I don't know how large the tank is, but it is at least five gallons. That was somewhat encouraging, since it is plausible that using 3.5 gallons (plus whatever was in it upon delivery) over 5,100 miles is not too far out of spec if it is supposed to go through a tank every 10,000 miles.

Michaell · March 2017

xwesx said:
When I swapped to the Q7's winter wheels in Oregon, my father was a big fan of both the hubcentric wheels (as opposed to aligning the wheel on the lug studs) and of the cordless Milwaulkee impact wrench I use to change out tires. The longest part of the job was just lifting and lowering each corner of the vehicle.

In other news, I have the Q7 back now. The shop is convinced that the issue was excess moisture in the fuel. It seems to be running just fine now, and they didn't end up replacing anything on the car. So, I'm in wait and see mode now. When my oil comes in, I'll take a look into the fuel filter while I'm changing the oil, just to see if there is anything alarming there such as rust or metal flakes. If no, then I should be in pretty good shape.

I bought two 2.5G containers of DEF yesterday, and the car swallowed both of them. So, I don't know how large the tank is, but it is at least five gallons. That was somewhat encouraging, since it is plausible that using 3.5 gallons (plus whatever was in it upon delivery) over 5,100 miles is not too far out of spec if it is supposed to go through a tank every 10,000 miles.

That's good news, on both fronts.

ruking1 · March 2017

OMG, for sure your first paragraph is TMI !

Your post reminded me hefting heavy tires, for hoping not to drop the (in comparison: tiny) lug bolts!

It made me laugh when I recalled my local tire guru first asking me what PSI I wanted on the 2009 VW Jetta TDI's new tire set. I didn't even look up or skip a beat tas I told him. It's another reason why I supremely enjoy German auto engineering!

I'm glad my tire guru now does the tire rotations. I've since gone from 10,000 miles to 5,000 miles rotation on their recommendations.They even know & verify torque vales @ more importantly, use calibrated torque wrenches ! (Snap-On: TMI)

ruking1 · March 2017

http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a53906/monsanto-glyphosphate-roundup-epa/?ref=yfp

EPA & BIG pesticides: strange bedfellows? We already know what they've done with mining water?

It's a slow diesel news day. DEF consumption on par with previous interval (almost 2 ea 2.5 gal containers, app 4.5 gals @ app 13, 500 miles (yes, I fill soon after DEF lights) 12 VW Touareg TDI (60,000 miles).

gagrice · March 2017

Discount Tire came through again for me. Took the Touareg in for rotation and possible slow leak. The slow leak was a long skinny nail at the edge of the tire. No can fix. But the good news is the road hazard entitles me to a new Michelin tire. Rather than have 3 tires with 29k and one new tire I decided this was a good time to buy the Pirelli Scorpion A/S Verde Plus tires I was planning to buy in about 10k more miles. Discount tire had to order and that took 3 days. What they did was charge me for 3 new tires and counted the new Michelin I was entitled to as the fourth. They also gave me $25 each for the 3 tires that only have 29k on them. So I am very happy with Discount Tire. And the price was lower than Tire Rack at $205 each. I did learn something while waiting for installation. 19 inch wheels & tires are not very common. All the fancy wheels they sell are 16,17,18 & 20 inch.

So far only drove them home. Very smooth quiet ride. They are slightly wider than the 255/55 R19 Michelins. Hoping they improve my mileage some. I will keep you posted, if VW doesn't want to buy it back with my new tires. Have to recalculate my Spreadsheet to having the proper 265/50 R19 tires.

kyfdx · March 2017

I doubt they will be checking the tires, based on my turn-in experience with the A3 TDI.

ruking1 · March 2017

I may have (inadvertently) exaggerated the 2025 CAFE 54.5 mpg, REAL WORLD standard @ 40 mpg) by +4 mpg (TOO much, 10% according to this article)

..." Those regulations require the fleet of new cars and trucks to average 36 mpg in real-world driving by 2025, about 10 mpg over the current standard. Environmentalists warned Trump's decision could reverse years of reduced tailpipe emissions."...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/auto-industry-backs-commitment-fuel-175603652.html

So,...if that is true, the 2025 CAFE 54.5 mpg real world mpg discount is (actually) app MINUS -34 %.

This is "Alice Through The Looking Glass" @ it's finest! It's funny how the fake/real & vice versa standards, really & not so really works!? By these real world "realities", the diesels in all segments, already exceed ( currently)/ meet the 2025 54.5 mpg spirits & intents !?

Advantage diesels!

Counterpoint? LALA times? http://www.latimes.com/business/hiltzik/la-fi-hiltzik-auto-emissions-20170317-story.html?ref=yfp

ruking1 · March 2017

A feature like AWD, like any other has its pros & cons. One pro (for me)chain control.

If we had procurred a 5th full sized tire, NON AWD and used it in the rotation, the relative difference in tire tread depth/s would have been moot. We could have gotten a used to new tire &. @ considerably less cost.

AWD is "sensitive" to wider variances in tread depth, hence a requirement for four (new) "similar" tread depths .

gagrice · March 2017

ruking1 said:
A feature like AWD, like any other has its pros & cons. One pro (for me)chain control.

If we had procurred a 5th full sized tire, NON AWD and used it in the rotation, the relative difference in tire tread depth/s would have been moot. We could have gotten a used to new tire &. @ considerably less cost.

AWD is "sensitive" to wider variances in tread depth, hence a requirement for four (new) "similar" tread depths .

My thinking exactly. That variation could have been noticeable in handling and braking especially wet surfaces. I think I made the right decision. I will know more when I get 500+ miles on them and this tank of fuel.

ruking1 · March 2017

Today I took a good look @ the oem tires ( 14 MB GLK 250 BT) & I'm thinking (by tread depth measurement) 65,000 to 75,000 miles for commuting. The last tank posted 36 mpg (528 miles, 14.6 gal/ 15.6 gal capacity) Tire wear is close to dead even (width & depth) across all four treads. I love how this thing tracks in the mountains, especially on the upgrades & passing lanes!

The oxymoron: dry traction is @ the peak, as it gets closer to bald (2/32 nds in)

Be that as it may, I have the replacement tires down to three: Pirelli Scorpion Verde A/S Plus, Bridgestone H/L Alenza, Michelin Premier LTX, after 5 more rotations of 5,000 miles.The Bridgestone's have the most physical tread @ 13/32nds : followed by 10- 8.5 / 32nds in.

xwesx · March 2017

My Q7 towed its first trailer last night (and today). WOW! It wasn't a little trailer, but I hardly noticed it back there at all (aside from the harsh fuel penalty). I set the cruise at 69 and didn't have to touch a thing. It powered up the steepest of hills effortlessly.

xwesx · March 2017

However, it isn't all roses. Recall that I put five gallons of DEF (finally found that capacity is six gallons) in the tank on Wednesday evening..... Well, about four hundred miles later, it says I have 1,500 miles left. ?!?!?!?!?!?!

At this point, I'm in the middle of nowhere, so I keep driving. A hundred miles later, it has dropped all the way to zero. I had the car running all day today for fear of being stranded after turning it off. I was able to locate some DEF this evening, and added a 2.5 gallon container: It had no effect on the zero miles warning.

After letting it idle for a couple hours in my driveway tonight, I finally plucked up the courage to shut it off. I turned it off, it told me to go fly a kite, but after letting it sit in the on position for about thirty seconds, I tried to start it and it fired up. The warning cleared, and it seems good now.

I tried to add another 2.5 gallon container, but it wouldn't take more than a couple of ounces before the tank was clearly full. So, there's no way it was anywhere near empty when it was squealing at me on the trip (I towed a trailer down to Palmer last night, picked up some furniture, and then brought it back up to Fairbanks today). But, I think it was malfunctioning on the road, because every once in a while I would look in the rearview and see a bunch of billowing white exhaust. Not all the time, just a spurt of it now and again. I'm thinking the car is pushing too much DEF into the mix periodically.

houdini1 · March 2017

Sounds like your car is responding to the warning system rather than whether or not the tank is actually empty. Must be a bad sensor or something like that.

ruking1 · March 2017

Both a trip to the dealer and correction under warranty seems to be in order . My swag is the DEF sensor. No doubt a PITA!

So for example, (on gassers) 02 sensors were regular issue items on 1991 to 1996 Toyota Landcruisers. Even after all these years, the sensor vendors have NOT gotten sensors right!

xwesx · March 2017

ruking1 said:
Both a trip to the dealer and correction under warranty seems to be in order . My swag is the DEF sensor. No doubt a PITA!

So for example, (on gassers) 02 sensors were regular issue items on 1991 to 1996 Toyota Landcruisers.

Probably. I'll have to call the Audi CS number and see if I can have it looked at locally. I'm not going to travel ~400 miles any time soon to visit a dealer over this.

ruking1 · March 2017

Indeed! I can't blame you there!

I got the TLC's initially on the reputation for continued durability & reliability. Years later, I came to realized its legend was based a lot on the DIESEL TLC's. Everything has been since so "California "rized", I have since taken to taking everything with a grain of salt.

It hasn't hurt that we have a HUGE Toyota dealerin town, whose assistant service manager made my TLC's his mission since 1987 & a known Indy TLC specialist app 1 mile from the house. Even I know I've been spoiled over the years.

fintail · March 2017

I want to guess sensor issue for the DEF, too.

I notice diesel is 10 cents cheaper than RUG in my area this morning, time to fill 'er up.

ruking1 · March 2017

We cancelled a South Tahoe, CA, trip ( 420 miles R/T.). Snowfall so far has been Squaw Valley 623 in/Heavenly 600 in. The average season snowfall at Squaw Valley since 1949 = 450 inches. This is pretty easy to compute!

These kinds of winter conditions (extreme treatments ice, salt, sand, etc.,) normally cause damage to most other CUV's. Despite the therapeutic value in DIY car care: washing, etc., we've been sending both (working out to each, once per quarter) to a commercial detailing shop: spray down, hand wash: two, two buck systems, blow dry, interior wipe down, carpet clean vacuum. Both TDI's seem to have weathered these winter (nasty) conditions in stride.

ruking1 · March 2017

http://www.oil-price.net

It's a slow Diesel news day !...

WTI @ $ 48.78

Diesel @ $1.51

Gasoline @ $1.60

It's a very good time (from a fuel point of view) to get into detail cars!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/oil-market-major-turning-point-220000285.html

ruking1 · March 2017

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/porsche-premium-revs-17-250-060006819.html

Porsche!

gagrice · March 2017

xwesx said:

ruking1 said:
Both a trip to the dealer and correction under warranty seems to be in order . My swag is the DEF sensor. No doubt a PITA!

So for example, (on gassers) 02 sensors were regular issue items on 1991 to 1996 Toyota Landcruisers.
Probably. I'll have to call the Audi CS number and see if I can have it looked at locally. I'm not going to travel ~400 miles any time soon to visit a dealer over this.

I am wondering if it has to do with cold weather. Maybe the DEF heater is not working properly. I have yet to top mine off and give it a legitimate test. I know when it was new it went over 10k miles before the 1500 mile warning came on. I took it in and they supposedly filled it under warranty. 5k miles later lights on again. The service guy told me they just dump in 2.5 gallons and don't top it off so they won't spill any. Lame bunch. I have 10 gallons in the garage next time the warning comes on.

gagrice · March 2017

I still have not set up an appointment to have the check engine light analysis. Everything seems to be working fine. Got 29.2 MPG on the last tank of diesel after the light came on. I am thinking it is the same O2 sensor. If so I will pitch a [non-permissible content removed] to VW corporate. They may be a bit gun shy right now and make sure I am covered as long as I keep the vehicle.

andres3 · March 2017

Seems to me that avoiding the problems with DEF, DEF sensors, and DEF consumption could be one of the reasons to get a "rolling coal" type tune, and just bypass all the EPA CARB stuff for maximum mileage, performance, and minimum running cost.

gagrice · March 2017

Another way to avoid the hassles of emission testing is moving to a place they don't test. Several counties in Oregon do not require testing. Only Las Vegas and Reno have emissions testing in NV. I feel totally ripped off by CA not catching the fact my Touareg TDI is a gross violator of smog regulations. $50 down the Moonbeam toilet.

xwesx · March 2017

I don't think I would want it with the DPF and SCR systems gone. With them, its probably the cleanest running vehicle I've ever driven, but without it would just be another F350. I kinda like starting it up in the morning and having an invisible exhaust, rather than the copious fumes that fill my driveway from the tailpipes of my Subaru. Even with all this emissions stuff on it, the on board display says I'm averaging a smidge over 24 mpg so far on this local tank. With the temperatures we're currently having (well below zero in the mornings), my Forester tends to be closer to 19-20.

Seems ironic given the settlement situation, but scapegoats gotta be scapegoats!

xwesx · March 2017

gagrice said:
I am wondering if it has to do with cold weather. Maybe the DEF heater is not working properly. I have yet to top mine off and give it a legitimate test. I know when it was new it went over 10k miles before the 1500 mile warning came on. I took it in and they supposedly filled it under warranty. 5k miles later lights on again. The service guy told me they just dump in 2.5 gallons and don't top it off so they won't spill any. Lame bunch. I have 10 gallons in the garage next time the warning comes on.

Possibly? I'm nearing a hundred miles since I fueled up and reset the DEF system on Saturday night. Right now, I'm holding out hope of making it through a whole tank with no low-DEF warning! /sigh

I think yours is the Gen 1 system, which is where you have to open up the spare tire well to get to the DEF tank, yes? Man, if mine was like that, I would have probably just shot the car by now. Still, with that access, it is worthwhile to top the tank up anytime you have to add fluid at all.

ruking1 · March 2017

xwesx said:
I don't think I would want it with the DPF and SCR systems gone. With them, its probably the cleanest running vehicle I've ever driven, but without it would just be another F350. I kinda like starting it up in the morning and having an invisible exhaust, rather than the copious fumes that fill my driveway from the tailpipes of my Subaru. Even with all this emissions stuff on it, the on board display says I'm averaging a smidge over 24 mpg so far on this local tank. With the temperatures we're currently having (well below zero in the mornings), my Forester tends to be closer to 19-20.

Seems ironic given the settlement situation, but scapegoats gotta be scapegoats!

Fuelly.com lists 2014 Audi Q7 gas premium at 16.94 MPG. So your TDI's 24 mpg ( like model) is 42 % better. De facto, to come to any other conclusion, other than they are just fine with you burning more, costing more, polluting more & that is better for everyone is ...nonsensica, given their own standards !?

So for example do they really think in LA L A Land that getting rid of all passenger diesels will blow them into CARB/EPA N0X compliance? This is especially egregious, disingenuous when the county agency responsible for measuring emissions & compliance says that it will NEVER meet those N0X standards. Ergo, the FED has mandated gross N0X (non emission controlled) emitters!

gagrice · March 2017

XwesX: I think yours is the Gen 1 system, which is where you have to open up the spare tire well to get to the DEF tank,

Yes I have to lift up the cover and pull out the spare to facilitate filling the Def tank. Even then I splashed a little of it around. As for being Gen 1, I don't know. According to the court settlement, my 2013 Touareg TDI has the newer engine than Ruking's 2012. I don't think the Touareg ever went to the filler like the Q7 has. They were all under the blow up spare.

ruking1 · March 2017

Yes! The (2012 VW Touareg TDI) DEF access is at the middle of hub of the spare tire in the rear.

xwesx · March 2017

Ah, I see. I was a year off on both of yours - I was thinking it was 2012 and 2011, respectively.

However, it seems odd that Touareg did not go to the DEF neck co-located with the diesel neck, since the Q5 went this way, and those cars are otherwise very similar to each other. At least it isn't something that normally has to be done very often!

gagrice · March 2017

xwesx said:
Ah, I see. I was a year off on both of yours - I was thinking it was 2012 and 2011, respectively.

However, it seems odd that Touareg did not go to the DEF neck co-located with the diesel neck, since the Q5 went this way, and those cars are otherwise very similar to each other. At least it isn't something that normally has to be done very often!

Actually the Touareg, Cayenne and Q7 are all basically the same platform. Not sure why they did not bring the filler out with the fuel filler. Q5 and Tiguan are built on the same platform.

http://www.autotrader.com/car-reviews/2014-volkswagen-tiguan-vs-2014-audi-q5-whats-the-difference-229173

ruking1 · March 2017

With everything in flux and change, it will be interesting to see what platform Porche employs for its next gen CUV, (Cayenne, mid sized) slot or whatever marketing/practical concept it goes to/with. I might be terribly wrong, but I don't see them going to the VW Atlas platform.

While the Macan seems to be very popular, it seems to fill Porsche's entry-level slot in the compact CUV segment.

Given the 52 + years of the 911 platform & as long as Porsche vehicles profit $17,000 USD per, why fix what is not broke? In contrast, VW makes approximately $580. USD per.

What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

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