I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

andre1969 · March 2019

My issue with the Panther always had to do with intrusion from things that they don't take into account when calculating interior volume. For instance, the way the dashboard juts out. I've banged my knee a few times on the dash getting in, similar to what you might do on an old 50's car with the "dogleg" of a wraparound windshield. The transmission and driveshaft hump are also huge, and with the way the back seat is shaped, plus the rear wheel well intrusion, if you try for 3 across seating it's really uncomfortable.

None of these are enough of an issue to keep me from owning one, if I found a nice one at the right price, but just what I consider shortcomings. And, a lot of them could be handled with a stretch in wheelbase, which could move the driveshaft and its hump further forward from the passenger cabin, and/or move the rear axle back a bit. Overall, when you consider the Panther dates back to 1979, Ford did a pretty good job of updating it. And, they probably could have taken it even further, if they wanted to, but that market was simply shifting.

It's been ages since I've sat in one, so this may be a false memory, but the blockier '79-91 Panthers seemed like they were roomier inside.

stickguy · March 2019

They are low. Just raise the floor 3-4” and fix a lot of that.

berri · March 2019

Don't think it will sell though. Buyers like the higher crossover driver position and cops have so much stuff these days that they often need an SUV. Now put those things into a crossover and you may have a winner.

andre1969 · March 2019

As much as I'm lamenting the impending demise of the sedan, I just can't see myself getting excited about most of what's left on the market. I'm still using my Dad's '03 Regal for most of my driving, but it actually has a somewhat high seating position for a car, and good visibility all around, compared to newer cars with their higher beltlines, thicker pillars, and gunslit windows. But the last time I went to an auto show and sat in some cars, there was not one sedan left that really did it for me. Even the Charger/300, which I've thought about for years now, just don't wow me anymore. Any truck, crossover, or SUV still has a much higher seating position and better visibility than my Dad's Regal, though.

If I had to run out and get a new vehicle tomorrow, I could actually see it being something like a Durango...although I hear they're not long for the world, either. A couple years back, when my Ram got into a minor accident, I had a Dodge Journey as a loaner. And, even though the Journey is out of date, and not considered a top notch competitor anymore, I'll confess I did like it. Meanwhile, a friend of mine had an Accord as a loaner a few months back, and I rode in if a few times. Totally unimpressive. I know I've said this before, but I'm convinced that most of the manufacturers are putting compact car seats in their bigger cars these days, to make them feel roomier inside. I first noticed it with my Mom's 2008 Altima. But then I noticed it with my uncle's 20013 Camry, and more recently with this Accord loaner my friend had.

The seats in the Journey weren't exactly over-stuffed recliner-like, but they felt decent to me. At least, up front. I didn't try the back.

stickguy · March 2019

berri said:
Don't think it will sell though. Buyers like the higher crossover driver position and cops have so much stuff these days that they often need an SUV. Now put those things into a crossover and you may have a winner.

I believe that is the new design explorer. the platform was originally intended to be used for a full sized Lincoln sedan too.

andre1969 · March 2019

stickguy said:

berri said:
Don't think it will sell though. Buyers like the higher crossover driver position and cops have so much stuff these days that they often need an SUV. Now put those things into a crossover and you may have a winner.
I believe that is the new design explorer. the platform was originally intended to be used for a full sized Lincoln sedan too.

Isn't the current Explorer at least somewhat related to the current Taurus?

ab348 · March 2019

We were talking about the '85 Corolla GT-S yesterday, and one pops up on BaT today!

https://t.co/XPPeuro2O8

Michaell · March 2019

ab348 said:
We were talking about the '85 Corolla GT-S yesterday, and one pops up on BaT today!

https://t.co/XPPeuro2O8

And what, exactly, is a "Branded" title in Ohio?

stickguy · March 2019

Salvage. Collision write off in 2002.

I kinda like this. Just not a few of the mods.

stickguy · March 2019

andre1969 said:

stickguy said:

berri said:
Don't think it will sell though. Buyers like the higher crossover driver position and cops have so much stuff these days that they often need an SUV. Now put those things into a crossover and you may have a winner.
I believe that is the new design explorer. the platform was originally intended to be used for a full sized Lincoln sedan too.
Isn't the current Explorer at least somewhat related to the current Taurus?

I think so, in a roundabout way.

explorerx4 · March 2019

Explorer and Taurus were both made in Chicago. They were very closely related.

explorerx4 · March 2019

A silver Jaguar X Type wagon. Or maybe it was a Saturn wagon.

fintail · March 2019

Officially 20 years old today (per MB), designs age slower as time goes on:

tjc78 · March 2019

Still a great looking car, IMO

berri · March 2019

Clean, simple lines and angles make for classic designs.

kyfdx · March 2019

Don’t see many of these

stickguy · March 2019

Really? I see mail trucks all the time. 😎

Oh, the ranger? Saw one like that recently at my neighbors. Some kind of contractor type. Even had a stick. I kinda wanted it!

That one a splash?

kyfdx · March 2019

Yes, it is a Splash, step-side. I was too lazy to actually walk off the porch to get a close-up.

xwesx · March 2019

stickguy said:
The cops would like it too.

Or, you could just do this to it.

https://engineswapdepot.com/?p=25164

Of course the guy's name is Cleetus. LOL

xwesx · March 2019

andre1969 said:
As much as I'm lamenting the impending demise of the sedan, I just can't see myself getting excited about most of what's left on the market. I'm still using my Dad's '03 Regal for most of my driving, but it actually has a somewhat high seating position for a car, and good visibility all around, compared to newer cars with their higher beltlines, thicker pillars, and gunslit windows. But the last time I went to an auto show and sat in some cars, there was not one sedan left that really did it for me. Even the Charger/300, which I've thought about for years now, just don't wow me anymore. Any truck, crossover, or SUV still has a much higher seating position and better visibility than my Dad's Regal, though.

If you want a sedan, Andre, you should just get one soon while they're still around! Maybe a modern monster like a Lincoln Continental, Genesis G90, or a Volvo S90. Those are all really huge cars.

Mr_Shiftright · March 2019

xwesx said:

stickguy said:
The cops would like it too.

Or, you could just do this to it.

https://engineswapdepot.com/?p=25164
Of course the guy's name is Cleetus. LOL

It's hard, though, to hurl a manacled perp into an SUV--in a Crown Vic you can put him in sideways, no problem.

tjc78 · March 2019

xwesx said:

andre1969 said:
As much as I'm lamenting the impending demise of the sedan, I just can't see myself getting excited about most of what's left on the market. I'm still using my Dad's '03 Regal for most of my driving, but it actually has a somewhat high seating position for a car, and good visibility all around, compared to newer cars with their higher beltlines, thicker pillars, and gunslit windows. But the last time I went to an auto show and sat in some cars, there was not one sedan left that really did it for me. Even the Charger/300, which I've thought about for years now, just don't wow me anymore. Any truck, crossover, or SUV still has a much higher seating position and better visibility than my Dad's Regal, though.
If you want a sedan, Andre, you should just get one soon while they're still around! Maybe a modern monster like a Lincoln Continental, Genesis G90, or a Volvo S90. Those are all really huge cars.

Mmmm S90. Love those.

stickguy · March 2019

very comfy. but so darned big. I think something the size of the TLX is as big as I am ever going at this point. Short of getting a PU of course!

tjc78 · March 2019

Compared to some of the barges I’ve owned it’s just right!

bhill2 · March 2019

tjc78 said:

xwesx said:

andre1969 said:
As much as I'm lamenting the impending demise of the sedan, I just can't see myself getting excited about most of what's left on the market. I'm still using my Dad's '03 Regal for most of my driving, but it actually has a somewhat high seating position for a car, and good visibility all around, compared to newer cars with their higher beltlines, thicker pillars, and gunslit windows. But the last time I went to an auto show and sat in some cars, there was not one sedan left that really did it for me. Even the Charger/300, which I've thought about for years now, just don't wow me anymore. Any truck, crossover, or SUV still has a much higher seating position and better visibility than my Dad's Regal, though.
If you want a sedan, Andre, you should just get one soon while they're still around! Maybe a modern monster like a Lincoln Continental, Genesis G90, or a Volvo S90. Those are all really huge cars.

Mmmm S90. Love those.

That one gives me pause. I love Volvos, and have owned three of them. However, the idea of a 4000 lb car being driven by a 2 liter engine that is blown half out of its mind just puckers me up.

xwesx · March 2019

I dropped my grandparents off the day they bought a 2001 Ford CV. Was totally decked out, interceptor package and all (or whatever its called with the rear LSD, wheels, etc). Seemed like an incredibly nice, roomy car at the time. My mother has it now, and get in there and cannot fathom how such a big car has such terrible interior room!

tjc78 · March 2019

bhill2 said:

tjc78 said:

xwesx said:

andre1969 said:
As much as I'm lamenting the impending demise of the sedan, I just can't see myself getting excited about most of what's left on the market. I'm still using my Dad's '03 Regal for most of my driving, but it actually has a somewhat high seating position for a car, and good visibility all around, compared to newer cars with their higher beltlines, thicker pillars, and gunslit windows. But the last time I went to an auto show and sat in some cars, there was not one sedan left that really did it for me. Even the Charger/300, which I've thought about for years now, just don't wow me anymore. Any truck, crossover, or SUV still has a much higher seating position and better visibility than my Dad's Regal, though.
If you want a sedan, Andre, you should just get one soon while they're still around! Maybe a modern monster like a Lincoln Continental, Genesis G90, or a Volvo S90. Those are all really huge cars.

Mmmm S90. Love those.
That one gives me pause. I love Volvos, and have owned three of them. However, the idea of a 4000 lb car being driven by a 2 liter engine that is blown half out of its mind just puckers me up.

I rented one on a trip to Idaho. It had no problems on the desolated highways running up to highly illegal speeds. It was a fantastic cruiser, even with the base engine. If I could convince my wife to dump the Enclave there would be one in my driveway. I just can’t spend that much on a second car that rarely gets driven (wife and I work in same office)

andre1969 · March 2019

I remember sitting in some Volvo at the DC auto show back in 2018. I forget the model, but I remember I actually liked it. And, given the size and the luxury appointments and such, it didn't seem like *too* hideous of a price.

Honestly, I'm not that enamored with these high-tech, powerful little engines that are probably expensive to fix when they break either, but that seems to be the way the world is going. I wonder though, how some of them do, economy-wise, in real-world driving? Sometimes a bigger engine that doesn't have to strain as much, while it might not score as well in EPA testing, might do better in the real world, depending on how you drive it, simply because you're not revving the snot out of it all the time.

I seem to recall a pickup truck test, might have been Motortrend, where they tested one of the aluminum-ized F-150s when they first came out, with one of its high-tech little engines. IIRC, the Silverado, despite having a 6.0 V-8 and being heavier, got about the same fuel economy and similar acceleration.

fintail · March 2019

Similar engine is now the standard offering in a similar weight E-class as well. It's a thing now. I worry more about NVH than durability, as I don't plan to have it when miled up.

bhill2 said:

That one gives me pause. I love Volvos, and have owned three of them. However, the idea of a 4000 lb car being driven by a 2 liter engine that is blown half out of its mind just puckers me up.

texases · March 2019

Turbo 4 cylinders are now the standard engine for just about everything, it seems.

ab348 · March 2019

texases said:
Turbo 4 cylinders are now the standard engine for just about everything, it seems.

When I watch the current series of Wheeler Dealers it seems any car they do that has a turbo engine needs a turbo rebuild/replacement. Those undergo tremendous stress.

Mr_Shiftright · March 2019

ab348 said:

texases said:
Turbo 4 cylinders are now the standard engine for just about everything, it seems.
When I watch the current series of Wheeler Dealers it seems any car they do that has a turbo engine needs a turbo rebuild/replacement. Those undergo tremendous stress.

Probably 90% of those failures are due to poor maintenance or over-zealous tuning.

berri · March 2019

I've got a CRV. It gets good mileage generally, but in real hilly or windy weather it experiences a very noticeable decrease in fuel economy compared to a larger engine vehicle. So I think you are right Andre.

berri · March 2019

I believe I read that an eco boost 4 banger will be the standard engine on the upcoming all new 2020 Explorer. I think Ford offers that 4 banger turbo on the F-159 also. Don't know much about it though. I do wonder about longevity???

tjc78 · March 2019

Considering that the vast majority of pickups and SUVs never a tow a thing, I'd suspect they will be fine.

Mr_Shiftright · March 2019

No, but lots of people load them up with luxury options, so they're heavy.

ab348 · March 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:

ab348 said:

texases said:
Turbo 4 cylinders are now the standard engine for just about everything, it seems.
When I watch the current series of Wheeler Dealers it seems any car they do that has a turbo engine needs a turbo rebuild/replacement. Those undergo tremendous stress.
Probably 90% of those failures are due to poor maintenance or over-zealous tuning.

What kind of maintenance does a turbo need? Don't they work until they don't?

stickguy · March 2019

Chevy has a 4 banger standard now. Ford is a V6

roadburner · March 2019

Volvo's publicity-driven capitulation to the Safety [non-permissible content removed] has ensured that I will never consider a Volvo.

texases · March 2019

That’s been going on for 40 years, right?

Mr_Shiftright · March 2019

ab348 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

ab348 said:

texases said:
Turbo 4 cylinders are now the standard engine for just about everything, it seems.
When I watch the current series of Wheeler Dealers it seems any car they do that has a turbo engine needs a turbo rebuild/replacement. Those undergo tremendous stress.
Probably 90% of those failures are due to poor maintenance or over-zealous tuning.
What kind of maintenance does a turbo need? Don't they work until they don't?

Frequent oil changes! Also, in most cases, much more frequent spark plug changes and air filters. Another thing to check is the turbo plumbing, to make sure there are no pressure leaks. All the clamps and hoses need frequent inspection. Last of all, don't be clueless. Turbos generate a lot of heat, so keeping the car on full-throttle boost constantly while climbing a mountain pass--give it a break!

omarman · March 2019

ab348 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

ab348 said:

texases said:
Turbo 4 cylinders are now the standard engine for just about everything, it seems.
When I watch the current series of Wheeler Dealers it seems any car they do that has a turbo engine needs a turbo rebuild/replacement. Those undergo tremendous stress.
Probably 90% of those failures are due to poor maintenance or over-zealous tuning.
What kind of maintenance does a turbo need? Don't they work until they don't?

A co-worker of mine bought a new turbo EXP (now that's a mystery car!) and was a bit shocked when it needed an expensive turbo replacement after just a few years of moderate use-it was his daily driver. No racing, tuning, etc. He was told by the dealership that turbochargers were regarded as consumable items which were expected to wear out like brake pads and wiper blades. Good maintenance or not, turbochargers and brakes will indeed work until they don't!

andre1969 · March 2019

When my ex-wife's '88 LeBaron was finally, to put it nicely, "retired", the turbo was one of the things that was shot on the car. By this time it was 1997 or 1998, and the car had about 115,000 miles on it. In the car's defense though, it had been relatively reliable up through around 90,000 miles, which was when I let her have it in the divorce in 1996. My uncle had bought the car, used, in 1990, so I knew most of its history. Also, while my wife had it, the car had been stolen a few times, and taken on some joy rides. I doubt the joy riders were exactly gentle on it...

And, after the divorce, she didn't really have the money to take care of it, either, so that probably factored in.

How do superchargers tend to hold up, reliability-wise? While my 2000 Park Ave wasn't exactly reliable, the supercharger was never a problem issue. I did have the oil in it changed around 60,000 miles, as a precaution. I bought it at around 55-56K. One of the pulleys to the supercharger belt did break, back around 2013-14, and that made a mess. But, the supercharger itself never gave any issues. I think that car made it to around 116,000 miles when I quit driving it.

texases · March 2019

I do think modern turbos are way ahead of those from the '80s. They're everywhere, and I bet many are not getting lots of extra care. The discussion boards I'm on haven't seen a wave of failures...yet...

Mr_Shiftright · March 2019

I would hazard a guess that the turbos and superchargers on brand new cars shouldn't be your major worry 5-7 years down the road---that main worry would be the electronics. I suspect (unpacking crystal ball) that faulty electronics will send more cars in the future to the junkyard than faulty turbos.

berri · March 2019

yep, you think body shop stuff is expensive (and it is), just get a quote on things like digital display boards, these radar type devices tracking lane or object ahead, etc. Won't take long to total a vehicle and insurance rates will end up increasing to reflect that.

texases · March 2019

There was an article a couple of months ago about how a new car was totaled in a minor crash that took out lots of the electronic nannies.

Mr_Shiftright · March 2019

Many of the modern car's sensors, especially for adaptive cruise, automatic braking, etc, are located in the front of the vehicle---often the point of impact. So once those sensors are smashed, and the wiring harness ripped and yanked this way and that, and various modules disrupted, putting everything back together, testing the systems, aligning all the sensors----well, cross your fingers. Some modern cars have at least 50 modules, and they are all chatting with each other constantly. If one module on the BUS doesn't like what another is saying (or not saying), well things can get squirrely.

texases · March 2019

Not just cars...737 Max...

Mr_Shiftright · March 2019

I think that's more of an engineering problem than a repair problem at this point. Lots of airplane electronics are modular. They just pull 'em out as units. On cars today, you need a backhoe to get some of this stuff out.

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

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