Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

nyccarguy · July 2023

As odd as it is to me, owners get some sort of psychological hangup about having spent so much money on an old car like this, and then they start fearing the "what's next?" like the car is out to get them or something.

@xwesx - I’m definitely of this mindset for reasons unbeknownst to me. Looking back over the years, I always seem to get rid of a car not too long after I have some sort of not cheap maintenance or repair done. I guess it is what part of keeps me as a Chronic Car Buyer.

nyccarguy · July 2023

@roadburner - your ti is in exquisite condition. Even more impressive is that you actually drive it on a semi regular basis.

corvette · July 2023

@nyccarguy - I think either Baruth or one of the old-school TTAC writers penned something about old cars getting sent out to pasture, and bemused that it's often not the expensive repair like an engine or transmission that does them in, it's the first medium-sized repair after the big one is done that makes the owner realize that from that point forward, it's always going to be an older car with needs, and they often look for something new.

stickguy · July 2023

sda said:
While having my car serviced this morning, I sat in several CPO VWs in the showroom. Not surprising, all are overpriced. They have a 2020 GTI which I liked with the plaid seats, however I found the shoulder bolsters too tight on my frame but otherwise comfortable. The 2022 GLI seats fit me better. The GLI may have some potential as my next ride. We are trying to get another year of service from the TL which will coordinate with my daughter graduating from college. After graduating the Passat will become hers and a new ride for me. Subject to change..

my rule after college was, I got you through (mostly) on my dime, so when they got a job, I repo'd the car I was paying for and they could go get their own ride.

my son I let him keep the TL for the first year when he was working temp stuff and living at home but when he got finally a full time engineering job and moved away, he went with a new Jetta to get him started.

Princess was easy. the lease we got for her sophomore year ended a couple months after graduation, so she too went to the VW dealer and bought a new Jetta to commute with.

stickguy · July 2023

this one is for Bradd.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVMssN-nDiY

nyccarguy · July 2023

I didn’t look to see how much these are, but they definitely look better than the stock black:

28firefighter · July 2023

So, I’m starting to keep an eye out on deals for performance all seasons for the BMW.

The car comes standard with a staggered set - 225/40R18 in the front and 245/35R18 rear. If I keep the OEM sizing in the rear that leaves me the with the usual players - Michelin Pilot AS4, Continental DWS, Bridgestone Potenzas, or the Goodyear Eagle Exhilarate. All fine options and all within a hundred bucks or so installed depending on sales.

If I adjust the rear tire size to 235/40R18 or 245/45R18, a whole host of additional options open up including the very well regarded (and well priced) Vredstein Hypertrac. Any experience with what making a shift like that might mean either handling wise or safety wise? I know at minimum the speedo could read high or low.

corvette · July 2023

Finally tried the Fastr app on my phone to test the veracity of the 0-60 times quoted for the Maverick... I did two runs and got 5.95 seconds on the first run. The second run, I turned off traction control, and gave it about 2,000 rpms of beans before letting off the brake, and that one came in at 6.0 seconds. Car and Driver said theirs did it in 5.9 seconds, so I'm within spitting distance of that.

I instinctively filled up the tank with premium on the way home. I need to fill up with regular and repeat the test to see how much of a difference that would make. Also need to test the Prius, lol.

roadburner · July 2023

28firefighter said:
So, I’m starting to keep an eye out on deals for performance all seasons for the BMW.

The car comes standard with a staggered set - 225/40R18 in the front and 245/35R18 rear. If I keep the OEM sizing in the rear that leaves me the with the usual players - Michelin Pilot AS4, Continental DWS, Bridgestone Potenzas, or the Goodyear Eagle Exhilarate. All fine options and all within a hundred bucks or so installed depending on sales.

If I adjust the rear tire size to 235/40R18 or 245/45R18, a whole host of additional options open up including the very well regarded (and well priced) Vredstein Hypertrac. Any experience with what making a shift like that might mean either handling wise or safety wise? I know at minimum the speedo could read high or low.

I just went with the Michelins on my M235i. I also put them on the Club Sport, No complaints.

ab348 · July 2023

That’s close but not quite the same as what’s on my ATS. The fronts are identical but the rears on mine are 255/35R18. I went with the Michelin Pilot AS4, a very good tire.

kyfdx · July 2023

28firefighter said:
So, I’m starting to keep an eye out on deals for performance all seasons for the BMW.

The car comes standard with a staggered set - 225/40R18 in the front and 245/35R18 rear. If I keep the OEM sizing in the rear that leaves me the with the usual players - Michelin Pilot AS4, Continental DWS, Bridgestone Potenzas, or the Goodyear Eagle Exhilarate. All fine options and all within a hundred bucks or so installed depending on sales.

If I adjust the rear tire size to 235/40R18 or 245/45R18, a whole host of additional options open up including the very well regarded (and well priced) Vredstein Hypertrac. Any experience with what making a shift like that might mean either handling wise or safety wise? I know at minimum the speedo could read high or low.

245/45 just seems like the wrong size.

explorerx4 · July 2023

@28ff,
Unless you are going to track the car, I'd back off from the aggressive tires.

28firefighter · July 2023

Sorry. I meant to say 245/40/18 as an option vs the current 245/35/18 on the rear.

The wheel sizes between front and rear are different (18x7.5 in front, 18x8) so I don’t think a square setup is an option.

ab348 · July 2023

28firefighter said:

The wheel sizes between front and rear are different (18x7.5 in front, 18x8) so I don’t think a square setup is an option.

Yes, it is quite limiting. The ATS has 18"x8" wheels up front and 18"x9" in the rear.

28firefighter · July 2023

I may very well end up like the others and do the Michelins. I love them - was just curious if a small adjustment would enable me to have a wider variety.

laurasdada · July 2023

When buying mine, I mentioned (future) replacements, same suspects... Salesdude, who is also a car guy (he bought a used Ferrari F430 from a client, said he got a nice deal. But, yes, annual maintenance is a bit...), said to stick with the Pirellis, the best of the bunch in his humble opinion.
But I believe the Pilot 4AS and DWS 06 seem to top the TireRack charts.

kyfdx · July 2023

28firefighter said:
Sorry. I meant to say 245/40/18 as an option vs the current 245/35/18 on the rear.

The wheel sizes between front and rear are different (18x7.5 in front, 18x8) so I don’t think a square setup is an option.

225s will fit on an 8" rim without stretching.. Every 325i E46 with Sport package has 8" rims with 225s on them.

You just might not like the way they look, compared to the 245s. It helps that the rear wheels are designed to fill that wheel well, though.

I'd bite the bullet and put stock sizes on it.

explorerx4 · July 2023

I'm thinking about buying a full size truck and an Iowa dealer seems to have some big discounts.
Their discount includes one baked into the sticker, so a bit suspect.
Once I get back from vaca at the end of the moth, I'll look into it in more detail.

qbrozen · July 2023

@28firefighter said:
Sorry. I meant to say 245/40/18 as an option vs the current 245/35/18 on the rear.

The wheel sizes between front and rear are different (18x7.5 in front, 18x8) so I don’t think a square setup is an option.

You can definitely go with all the same but I would only do that if you feel it understeers as is.

jmonroe1 · July 2023

Time for a little bragging:

I mentioned last year that Son #1 and his youngest son (then without a driver’s license) entered the kick off event, a rally race for the Pittsburgh Vintage Gran Prix that starts next weekend. Last year they came in 3rd in a field of around 100. Today they came in 2 nd in a similar field. The team that won last year was a husband/wife team and they’ve won a lot of rally races around here so I’ve been told. So it was no surprise to anyone that they won again this year.

Last year they used my ‘15 Genny but this year he used his newly acquired ‘17 Chevy SS. Just like last year my son drove and my grandson was the navigator. And again this year a lot of the teams couldn’t believe a young kid could navigate that well. However, this year my son’s oldest (21) drove his ‘13 G37 and his uncle on his mothers side was his navigator. They came in 13 th. Of course his youngest brother wouldn’t let him forget it either.

As I understand it, it’s almost a given that since the winning team is so good at this, everybody else is just trying to come in 2 nd. The winning team drove their 3 year old (I think) Tesla S but they don’t like the speedometer accuracy in the Tesla so they use a couple lap tops logged into sites that provide your speed and also use a couple stop watches too. I guess you can say they take these rally races seriously.

When I told my grandson he should do the same thing if he’s serious about winning (and he is) he should do the same thing. He said it was all he could do to watch the speedometer and Waze that he pulled up on his phone and whatever you do when you get to the check points, so he has no plans of doing anything else. To this I say, if you aren’t willing to fight fire with fire then you ain’t really serious.

Maybe I can report round 3 next year if the do well.

jmonroe

roadburner · July 2023

When I was taking TSD rallying seriously I usually ran with a Timewise 798A rally computer:

We never won overall but we finished in the top 5 several times.

Michaell · July 2023

I did some TSDs when I was much younger, and living in CA. IIRC, the first stage was to calibrate the speedometer and odometer.

Did it all by hand - we may have had a manual stopwatch.

roadburner · July 2023

Michaell said:
I did some TSDs when I was much younger, and living in CA. IIRC, the first stage was to calibrate the speedometer and odometer.

Did it all by hand - we may have had a manual stopwatch.

My wife and I won 3rd place in the "Seat of the Pants" class(no computers) at Oktoberfest 1990. Since we trophied we were moved up to the top class in perpetuity...

Michaell · July 2023

roadburner said:

Michaell said:
I did some TSDs when I was much younger, and living in CA. IIRC, the first stage was to calibrate the speedometer and odometer.

Did it all by hand - we may have had a manual stopwatch.
My wife and I won 3rd place in the "Seat of the Pants" class(no computers) at Oktoberfest 1990. Since we trophied we were moved up to the top class in perpetuity...

I remember doing a rally in my dad's '70 Chevy pickup. By far the largest vehicle in the competition, that day.

stickguy · July 2023

If I tried to do one of those with my wife, I would be divorced by the end (or in jail)

xwesx · July 2023

28firefighter said:
I may very well end up like the others and do the Michelins. I love them - was just curious if a small adjustment would enable me to have a wider variety.

https://tiresize.com/calculator/

This will give you a lot of information regarding the different sizes. In general, if you keep it within 3% of the stock size, you won't have any issues and speedo differences are minimal.

kyfdx · July 2023

stickguy said:
If I tried to do one of those with my wife, I would be divorced by the end (or in jail)

My wife can't even pickup my phone and look at it for me, when it's on NAV.

qbrozen · July 2023

I gotta admit that rallying never appealed to me in the least. I can’t control my right foot and don’t want to.

stickguy · July 2023

I like to get places when I want to. Not when someone else tells me too!

roadburner · July 2023

@qbrozen said:
I gotta admit that rallying never appealed to me in the least. I can’t control my right foot and don’t want to.

Several years ago I was the navigator in a BMW CCA rally. I missed a route instruction and it put us several minutes behind. Fortunately we had just entered a 5 mile long free zone- meaning that there were no checkpoints for 5 miles. At the end of the free zone we were back on time but my driver had to practically drive flat out the entire time.

sda · July 2023

jmonroe1 said:
Time for a little bragging:

I mentioned last year that Son #1 and his youngest son (then without a driver’s license) entered the kick off event, a rally race for the Pittsburgh Vintage Gran Prix that starts next weekend. Last year they came in 3rd in a field of around 100. Today they came in 2 nd in a similar field. The team that won last year was a husband/wife team and they’ve won a lot of rally races around here so I’ve been told. So it was no surprise to anyone that they won again this year.

Last year they used my ‘15 Genny but this year he used his newly acquired ‘17 Chevy SS. Just like last year my son drove and my grandson was the navigator. And again this year a lot of the teams couldn’t believe a young kid could navigate that well. However, this year my son’s oldest (21) drove his ‘13 G37 and his uncle on his mothers side was his navigator. They came in 13 th. Of course his youngest brother wouldn’t let him forget it either.

As I understand it, it’s almost a given that since the winning team is so good at this, everybody else is just trying to come in 2 nd. The winning team drove their 3 year old (I think) Tesla S but they don’t like the speedometer accuracy in the Tesla so they use a couple lap tops logged into sites that provide your speed and also use a couple stop watches too. I guess you can say they take these rally races seriously.

When I told my grandson he should do the same thing if he’s serious about winning (and he is) he should do the same thing. He said it was all he could do to watch the speedometer and Waze that he pulled up on his phone and whatever you do when you get to the check points, so he has no plans of doing anything else. To this I say, if you aren’t willing to fight fire with fire then you ain’t really serious.

Maybe I can report round 3 next year if the do well.

jmonroe

I've been to that event, great fun. Congrats to a tremendous placing.

nyccarguy · July 2023

Michaell said:

roadburner said:

Michaell said:
I did some TSDs when I was much younger, and living in CA. IIRC, the first stage was to calibrate the speedometer and odometer.

Did it all by hand - we may have had a manual stopwatch.
My wife and I won 3rd place in the "Seat of the Pants" class(no computers) at Oktoberfest 1990. Since we trophied we were moved up to the top class in perpetuity...
I remember doing a rally in my dad's '70 Chevy pickup. By far the largest vehicle in the competition, that day.

My in laws were big into it back in the '70s & '80s.

ab348 · July 2023

I got roped into participating a couple of times in the '80s, once manning a checkpoint, the other time as a navigator. The first was utterly boring; the second was a disaster.

jmonroe1 · July 2023

@qbrozen said:
I gotta admit that rallying never appealed to me in the least. I can’t control my right foot and don’t want to.

————————————————
Yeah, rally racing ain’t for guys that can’t control themselves.

I heard a guy yesterday, who was the driver of a team that came in well down the standings, complain that rally racing separates the boys from the girls. He then said, “ I guess I’m still a teenage boy”.

jmonroe

jmonroe1 · July 2023

@roadburner said:

@qbrozen said:
I gotta admit that rallying never appealed to me in the least. I can’t control my right foot and don’t want to.

Several years ago I was the navigator in a BMW CCA rally. I missed a route instruction and it put us several minutes behind. Fortunately we had just entered a 5 mile long free zone- meaning that there were no checkpoints for 5 miles. At the end of the free zone we were back on time but my driver had to practically drive flat out the entire time.

————————————————
I’ll bet that 5 miles was the most fun part of the race.

jmonroe

roadburner · July 2023

jmonroe1 said:

@roadburner said:

@qbrozen said:

I gotta admit that rallying never appealed to me in the least. I can’t control my right foot and don’t want to.

Several years ago I was the navigator in a BMW CCA rally. I missed a route instruction and it put us several minutes behind. Fortunately we had just entered a 5 mile long free zone- meaning that there were no checkpoints for 5 miles. At the end of the free zone we were back on time but my driver had to practically drive flat out the entire time.

————————————————

I’ll bet that 5 miles was the most fun part of the race.

jmonroe

It was crazy. My son was riding in the back seat and had a ball.

andres3 · July 2023

roadburner said:

jmonroe1 said:

@roadburner said:

@qbrozen said:

I gotta admit that rallying never appealed to me in the least. I can’t control my right foot and don’t want to.

Several years ago I was the navigator in a BMW CCA rally. I missed a route instruction and it put us several minutes behind. Fortunately we had just entered a 5 mile long free zone- meaning that there were no checkpoints for 5 miles. At the end of the free zone we were back on time but my driver had to practically drive flat out the entire time.

————————————————

I’ll bet that 5 miles was the most fun part of the race.

jmonroe

It was crazy. My son was riding in the back seat and had a ball.

@roadburner

Do you have any experience with the Garmin Catalyst Track Coach device that only costs $1,000. Any buddies that used it yet? Heard really good things but all 3rd hand.

Thanks.

roadburner · July 2023

@andres3 I haven't heard ant first hand experiences either; sorry.

nyccarguy · July 2023

Uh - oh. Found a dealer with a ‘23 RAV4 Prime SE. black/black (everyone’s favorite) for almost $2,200 off sticker. There’s also $6,500 lease cash from TFS. Hmmmm.

corvette · July 2023

I've never driven one, but the RAV4 Prime is one of the few cars I'd consider giving up the Maverick for.

stickguy · July 2023

isn't that the plug in hybrid? I thought those were booked up for over a year on orders?

oldfarmer50 · July 2023

laurasdada said:
When buying mine, I mentioned (future) replacements, same suspects... Salesdude, who is also a car guy (he bought a used Ferrari F430 from a client, said he got a nice deal. But, yes, annual maintenance is a bit...), said to stick with the Pirellis, the best of the bunch in his humble opinion.
But I believe the Pilot 4AS and DWS 06 seem to top the TireRack charts.

OEM tires on my car were Pirellis. Not bad but didn’t give me the feeling of gripping the road. Also, they developed a horrible whine after about 10k miles. The Pilot AS4 were like night and day. Tons of grip and no noise so far.

ab348 · July 2023

Funny thing as I was on the Toyota Canada site yesterday looking at the 2 Prime models they offer here, the new Prius and the RAV. The SE is the lower-end trim and only comes with a black interior, at least up here. $53K in worthless Canadian dollars. I am highly dubious of the RAV as a vehicle I would want to have given the awful driving experience with the rental I had last year for a couple of weeks, although I have to believe they all cannot be as bad as that one was. I went and found a couple of reviews and they were positive but that seems like a lot of money for a fairly pedestrian vehicle.

nyccarguy · July 2023

ab348 said:
Funny thing as I was on the Toyota Canada site yesterday looking at the 2 Prime models they offer here, the new Prius and the RAV. The SE is the lower-end trim and only comes with a black interior, at least up here. $53K in worthless Canadian dollars. I am highly dubious of the RAV as a vehicle I would want to have given the awful driving experience with the rental I had last year for a couple of weeks, although I have to believe they all cannot be as bad as that one was. I went and found a couple of reviews and they were positive but that seems like a lot of money for a fairly pedestrian vehicle.

Speaking to a friend of mine who recently rented one, he echoed your experience. Again, he had a rental spec 4cyl as well and wasn't fond of the vehicle either.

nyccarguy · July 2023

stickguy said:
isn't that the plug in hybrid? I thought those were booked up for over a year on orders?

They were for a while. Toyota is CRANKING cars out.

ab348 · July 2023

CNBC reporting today that used car prices took a 4.2% decline in June and are down 10.1% compared to this time last year.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/07/10/manheim-used-car-prices-june.html

qbrozen · July 2023

@ab348 said:
CNBC reporting today that used car prices took a 4.2% decline in June and are down 10.1% compared to this time last year.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/07/10/manheim-used-car-prices-june.html

Their Cox resource seems to be all over the place. It is down 10% now but will be down only 1% by EOY, and yet somehow that equates to a steady decline.

“ The index, which tracks vehicles sold at its U.S. wholesale dealership auctions, remains elevated from historical levels but is down 10.3% compared with June 2022.”

——————————

“ Cox expects wholesale used vehicle prices to be down roughly 1.1% at the end of this year compared with December 2022. ”

——————————

“ Cox expects the used vehicle wholesale market to experience a “slow and gradual recovery” in prices to pre-pandemic levels by 2028.”

kyfdx · July 2023

nyccarguy said:

stickguy said:
isn't that the plug in hybrid? I thought those were booked up for over a year on orders?

They were for a while. Toyota is CRANKING cars out.

That is an Ally Bank lease that has the big incentive on the RAV4 Prime.

kyfdx · July 2023

I have 2500 miles on RAV4 rentals. I thought they were pretty good.

nyccarguy · July 2023

@qbrozen - I just saw you post your ebay listing on LH. That car is in amazing shape. I never realized the car had so few miles on it. Have you had ANY bites on it?

Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

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