I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

roadburner · March 9

My ti is almost 30 years old, and the only features that I wish that it had are heated seats and BT.

stickguy · March 9

just watched once upon a time in Hollywood (yeah, we are a little behind on movies). Definitely a car spotters dream. Some tasty 60's iron in it.

stickguy · March 9

roadburner said:
My ti is almost 30 years old, and the only features that I wish that it had are heated seats and BT.

good thing is, those are 2 things that can easily be added and nobody would even see them.

andre1969 · March 10

When I look at the '67-70 Eldorado, I can sort of see what they were trying to do with the '92, in that rear quarter window/C-pillar area. On the '92, I always thought that area looked like it needed work, as the vertical quarter window, and slanted backlite just seemed to clash with each other and the C-pillar looks awkward.

But, the '67-70 does the same thing, and the car looks great. But, the '67-70 just has more eye-pleasing proportioning, in general. I think the '92 looks a bit awkward, from some angles.

uplanderguy · March 10

I want to like the '92 Eldo, but it just doesn't look expensive-enough to my eyes. There was a low-mileage red one for sale a year or two ago, pretty sure i posted it here, that looked fairly nice, with the pinstripe whitewalls. The '92 Seville I liked better, and for me, to like a four-door better than a coupe at that time was unusual.

fintail · March 10

I am in the same boat about the 92 Eldo, C-pillar is a little awkward to me.

1992 is a fun year to think about, as there were a bunch of new designs. Also the year I got my license, so I remember it clearly. These show how the aging of automotive designs has maybe slowed a bit compared to the past. These are all 32 year old cars that were new designs then:

And these are what 32 year old cars that were modern when new looked like in 1992:

For sure the tires and chrome do a bit, but in 1992, a 32 year old car was usually already a vintage thing someone was holding on to. Today, many 32 year old cars are just cars.

uplanderguy · March 10

A reflection of me no doubt, but for me, the '90's are 'peak malaise', LOL.

fintail · March 10

uplanderguy said:
A reflection of me no doubt, but for me, the '90's are 'peak malaise', LOL.

I know officially, malaise is said to end around 1983 or so, but enthusiasts often drag it out to around 1990, as there were carryover or oddball cars after 1983. I see peak malaise as maybe 1978-82 or so, the most emasculated engines and the oddest designs and some now obscure imports. These were also finicky used cars by the time I started driving (my school had two driver's ed cars - one a nearly new Acclaim I was lucky enough to use, and an ancient-seeming Fairmont that had a rep for stalling). Malaise can have its charms, too, there were numerous cool enough cars during that time, although it took some a little time to grow on people.

IMO malaise started ending with the jellybean design cars.

uplanderguy · March 10

Funny, 'jellybean' begins malaise for me, although I'm well-aware of what most folks consider it, LOL.

Also, in the '90's I was busier with career, babies, and ill parents so cars went lower on my radar.

A friend of mine's parents bought a Lexus SC 380 I think it was--like the one in your pics, above. I know, "ABSOLUTELY BULLETPROOF RELIABILITY!!!!!", but the car did absolutely zero for me, at that price point. I remember looking online at rear-seat legroom and my Cavalier coupe actually bested it by a fraction of a point.

If I'm not at least a little excited....or, well, happy with the car, bulletproof reliability isn't the end-all for me.

andre1969 · March 10

Another thing I don't like about the '92 Eldorado is the front-end. I think they were trying to emulate the Allante to a degree, but it just manages to come off looking a bit too plain. The grille looks about like something you'd pull off of the refrigerator when you need to get the dust bunnies out from under it.

I think I like the '92-99 Eldorado better the '86-91 because it's bigger. But I don't think it's better looking. I actually find the '86-91 Eldo/Seville to be attractive cars. Just a bit on the small size overall, and perhaps looking a bit too much like the N-cars of the era.

The '92 Seville was a looker, though.

I always thought of Malaise as roughly 1973-82. I know people like to gripe about the horsepower cuts for 1972, but that was mostly gross-to-net. IIRC, GM actually cut some compression ratios for 1971, and some of the highest-powered engine options might have gone away, or got cut back for 1972. But most mass market cars in 1972 performed about as well as their 1971 counterparts. For instance, a '72 Impala with a 165 hp 350 probably did as well as the '71 with the 255 hp 350. But then in '73, they started cutting power across the board, not just the high-powered engines. And emissions controls got bad. I believe the 350-2bbl went from 165 hp to 145 hp. Consumer Reports tested a '73 Chevelle with the 350-2, and I seem to recall 0-60 a bit over 13 seconds, whereas the larger, heavier '72 Impala was good for 12. They also started putting in taller axle ratios, so even if those engines had the power, those loafy axles kept them from revving up too fast.

1982 always sticks in my mind, because I remember how much my grandparents learned to hate their '82 Malibu wagon. And it wasn't just those stationary rear windows; that was just the icing on the cake. That car was slow, and ate a couple of ECUs. Too bad Granddad didn't think to spring for the 305 that year, which you could still get in a wagon. I imagine it wasn't too common for them to be equipped that way, though. I think one reason a lot of people look at 1983 as the year we started to escape Malaise, is because the Mustang finally got a stronger 302. I'm sure the T-bird/Cougar helped as well. And for me at least, I welcomed the return of the 305/307 across the board in GM's midsized cars, and the end of those undersized V8s. For '81-82 it had been limited to wagons and CA/high-altitude models.

Wasn't 1983 also the year the 302 in the Crown Vic/Grand Marquis got fuel injection? I think it was TBI initially, but went to PFI a couple years later?

fintail · March 10

uplanderguy said:
Funny, 'jellybean' begins malaise for me, although I'm well-aware of what most folks consider it, LOL.

Also, in the '90's I was busier with career, babies, and ill parents so cars went lower on my radar.

A friend of mine's parents bought a Lexus SC 380 I think it was--like the one in your pics, above. I know, "ABSOLUTELY BULLETPROOF RELIABILITY!!!!!", but the car did absolutely zero for me, at that price point. I remember looking online at rear-seat legroom and my Cavalier coupe actually bested it by a fraction of a point.

If I'm not at least a little excited....or, well, happy with the car, bulletproof reliability isn't the end-all for me.

When I was a teen in the early 90s, the super angular earlier malaise cars seemed old but not in a good way, and rounded = modern and desirable. IIRC you had a jellybean car, a Caprice (which is another that doesn't look ancient today in the way a 1960 car looked in 1992).

Even Lexus of that era can have problem areas. SC was two models - 300 6cyl, 400 8cyl. They were pretty expensive - maybe on par with a period Eldo, and definitely a posh product.

uplanderguy · March 10

I did buy a new '93 Caprice Classic, not because I loved it, but it was better value than the Lumina we had been considering (the Caprice had ABS and driver's airbag standard, among other things). We bought well because it was unpopular, which is almost a badge of honor with me, LOL.

You are probably more in tune with what cars cost in the '90's, but I thought my friend said that Lexus coupe (six-cylinder) was 40K or low 40's. I didn't think Eldos were that high. I could well be wrong on both counts, and unlike FB car guys, I'm OK to admit it.

I'm old-skool even for my age, but I hated when plastichrome inside went away. I'll take plastichrome over just plastic, any day. I like turn signal levers, column-shift levers, door handles, radio knobs, to be bright-metal or even bright-metal plastic, and I like some bright trim on the panel and doors. I never got used to the era of flat-black plastic turn signal levers, shift levers, radio knobs, et al.

I also missed when frameless door glass largely went away.

andre--at the time I hated them, but I've grown to appreciate the later versions of the '86-91 Eldo and Seville. Really, totally unlike anything else made at the time by anyone. American styling, out and in.
My only complaint was that the seats seemed so thin.

ab348 · March 10

andre1969 said:

I always thought of Malaise as roughly 1973-82.

I think you’re pretty much spot-on, though I’d probably extend it a few years later into the ‘80s until manufacturers found ways to start increasing HP under the emissions regime. It’s easy to blame govt regulations for the malaise era and they certainly played a major role. Bumper standards beginning in ‘73 wrecked the looks of most cars, emissions killed both HP and driveability, and fuel economy standards made for lots of underpowered cars. In the early part of that era oversized barges were still popular, while by the end cars were smaller but manufacturers hadn’t solved issues of ride, NVH, and quality with those newer, lighter designs. Styling generally took a step backwards then as well.

uplanderguy · March 10

Speaking recently of tapered B-pillar in late '70's Fleetwood Broughams, how 'bout this for a tapered B-pillar:
1968 Dodge D200

I can actually remember one of these (well, some year in this '61-71 style) in our town when I was younger.

stickguy · March 10

now that is a real Truck's truck.

fintail · March 10

IIRC in 1992 a SC300 based around 35K, and a SC400 around 40K. I am not sure if they carried ADMs etc. That was a chunk of change then, and I have to believe an Eldo was around 35K then too.

Yeah I remember the "whale" Caprice was a little polarizing, and at the time I was not a fan - although it grew on me with time, and today I have no problems with it. I think it was just too big of a jump at once for my eyes. For whatever reason, the Crown Vic wasn't as jarring to me. Speaking of jellybean, I also disliked the 90 Celica when it debuted, but it eventually became normal to me.

Plastichrome is fine if it doesn't fade or peel

Might as well make it real chrome then, but I think for a lot of that one needs to go back to an early 70s or even 60s car.

uplanderguy said:
I did buy a new '93 Caprice Classic, not because I loved it, but it was better value than the Lumina we had been considering (the Caprice had ABS and driver's airbag standard, among other things). We bought well because it was unpopular, which is almost a badge of honor with me, LOL.

You are probably more in tune with what cars cost in the '90's, but I thought my friend said that Lexus coupe (six-cylinder) was 40K or low 40's. I didn't think Eldos were that high. I could well be wrong on both counts, and unlike FB car guys, I'm OK to admit it.

I'm old-skool even for my age, but I hated when plastichrome inside went away. I'll take plastichrome over just plastic, any day. I like turn signal levers, column-shift levers, door handles, radio knobs, to be bright-metal or even bright-metal plastic, and I like some bright trim on the panel and doors. I never got used to the era of flat-black plastic turn signal levers, shift levers, radio knobs, et al.

I also missed when frameless door glass largely went away.

andre--at the time I hated them, but I've grown to appreciate the later versions of the '86-91 Eldo and Seville. Really, totally unlike anything else made at the time by anyone. American styling, out and in.
My only complaint was that the seats seemed so thin.

fintail · March 10

Those crew cab Dodge trucks make me think of the truck in the somewhat creepy alien abduction movie "Fire in the Sky":

uplanderguy · March 10

I always thought those side marker reflectors on the '68 and later Dodge trucks resembled the tops of driveway markers.

andre1969 · March 11

fintail said:
Those crew cab Dodge trucks make me think of the truck in the somewhat creepy alien abduction movie "Fire in the Sky":

Now I'm feeling the desire to chase down that idiot in the woodgrain Taurus wagon who flipped me off and yelled out the window "Burn my dust! Eat my rubber!!"

andre1969 · March 11

I think the jellybean era might have been a bit of a malaise period for GM specifically, as they didn't seem to take as well to aerodynamics as Ford did. It was also the era that saw GM fall from its mighty perch. I remember saving an old clipping from the auto section of a local newspaper, that mentioned in 1985, 7 of the top 10 selling car nameplates were GM.

They were, in no particular order: Cavalier, Celebrity, Caprice (most likely combined with Impala), Cutlass Ciera, Cutlass Supreme (both coupe and sedan combined), Delta 88, and Century.

Ford had two, the Tempo and Escort. Rounding out that list was an import. I'm thinking it was the Sentra, but according to the stats on Wikipedia, the Accord outsold the Sentra that year, but I'm definitely remembering it as a Nissan. Maybe it was the Stanza? I couldn't find sales stats for the Stanza, but do remember that early/mid 80's generation seemed like a really popular car.

For 1986, I remember reading that GM was down to 6 of the top ten. They added the Grand Am, but lost two. Cutlass Supreme and Delta 88, I think. I'd imagine the '86 Taurus made it to that list. Also, as those import quotas were lifted, and the Japanese cars got larger, that put some pressure on the domestics.

GM tended to do its best with midsized cars, personal luxury coupes, and large cars. Unfortunately, the large car and personal luxury coupe markets became less relevant over time, and GM seemed to botch its response to the Taurus. I think there's always been a bit of overlap between compact and midsized cars, but in the later 80s and 90's, the distinction really seemed to blur. In 1980, for example, nobody who genuinely wanted a midsized car would have looked to a Japanese import, because they simply didn't offer cars in the US that were midsized in the way we thought of them. But by 1990, cars like the Accord, and Camry were becoming a viable alternative to what domestic US midsized cars had become.

uplanderguy · March 11

In my mind, the jellybean era made cars eventually seem more the same across manufacturers, and also was when wheels started looking like plastic wheelcovers, plastic wheelcovers themselves became ubiquitous, and interior color choices seemed to diminish, on top of the ramping up of flat black plastics--the advent of widespread gray interiors. Of course, I realize that time marches on.

I got so sick of that with rentals, I made it a point to get either beige or black inside instead of gray when I bought cars, not that those were way better. Funny, when Chevy introduced 'Pewter' in '72, I liked it, and again when they introduced 'Oyster' in '79, which was pretty light, I liked it. But then, those weren't everywhere. When I bought my '93 Caprice, I had them search for one with the dark maroon interior. I wouldn't take gray as a second choice.

Speaking of those cars, although I always p**s and moan about droopy rear wheel openings, today I'd take a '91 over a '93. If you ever looked close, the way they opened up that rear wheel opening for '93 was really done on the cheap. And I like the gloss black around the side windows, '91 only. I do like that GM made wagons on that body, which Ford didn't. I didn't care for Ford's vent window up against a vent window, but the Mercury got around that.

I was almost delirious to see the red interior on the C8 I ordered, with brushed metal trim inside.

On a side note, only because I was curious, a couple weeks ago I looked at dealer count of various makes in the U.S. I wouldn't have expected this, but Ford and Chevy have three times the number of locations as Toyota and Honda do. When I looked, Ford and Chevy were within five dealers of each other. Of course it's not like the old days, but one thing I always liked about Chevy back then (and Ford too, really), was that there were dealers everywhere.

There are two Chevy dealers within ten miles of me, which is nice as I use the best service coupons they send out. Until 2009, there were two more within ten miles of me. Where I bought my C8 is thirty miles away. They're delightfully rural, and small....not sure how he survived 2009 but his grandfather opened the place in 1928.

andre1969 · March 11

I think I lucked out a bit in the plastic wheelcover department. The only car I ever had with them was my 2000 Intrepid. However, they were silver, the same color as the car, and were what I thought was an attractive pattern, so I didn't mind it.

Actually, the 2003 Regal I inherited from Dad had them, too. But, it was also silver. And, by the time I got the car, all four of them had been missing, for quite some time. I never did ask Dad what happened to them when he was alive, so I never did get to learn the whole story. I honestly didn't care too much about what that car looked like, so I just drove it with the exposed black steel wheels. Somehow, I got used to the way it looked.

Nowadays though, even most cheap cars still have alloys, or at least some kind of styled steel wheel. So when I see plastic hubcaps, they really seem to stick out. And they're often done up in a pattern that draws attention to the fact that they're just wheelcovers.

roadburner · March 11

I had winter rubber mounted on steel wheels for my wife's 3er and 5er. BMW actually sold some decent looking wheel covers so I bought a set for the winter months.

uplanderguy · March 11

The last car I had with bright metal wheelcovers was my '82 Monte Carlo. At the time, I wished the car had Rally Wheels, but in hindsight, they were a good-looking cover IMHO.

Well, now that I think about it, my '93 Caprice Classic had wire wheelcovers.

I don't love the cars, but the '88 GM FWD midsizers, and the '90 Lumina, offered coupes, which I liked the choice of in that size class. I do remember the Lumina coupes seeming to be tight on headroom, and the rear seat cushions were very low, like sitting on cushions on bleachers, LOL. Decent legroom and styling though I think. Not great, but decent.

To this day, I could like an '88 Monte Carlo LS. I'd rather a '78 Malibu Classic coupe, but I think in all reality, my old-car days are behind me.

For anyone slightly interested, yesterday I received a pic that included my '66 Studebaker Cruiser, from the current owner, among his many other Studes of all vintages. I posted a pic to the 'Postwar Studebakers' page.

fintail · March 11

re: jellybean and GM, it's almost like at first they didn't want to run with it all the way - the mid 80s styles up to and including the Corsica have rounded features, but angles too. Maybe some stylists weren't sold on it. But then for MY 1991-92, they finally jumped in feet first and joined the trend.

My last car with wheelcovers is the fintail - all my MBs since have wheels, I think the last MB sold in the USDM with wheelcovers was the 1983 240D (aka cheapest model but still cost as much as a top of the line Cadillac or Lincoln). Canadian spec early 00s W203 C-class could have plastic wheelcovers, but never offered here I am pretty sure. I think my dad's S-10 Blazer and maybe the 93 Grand Caravan had wheelcovers, all other modern cars since the mid 80s had wheels. For my mom, her current Camry (LE) has wheelcovers, but I remember the Taurus and Tempo had wheels.

fintail · March 11

andre1969 said:

fintail said:
Those crew cab Dodge trucks make me think of the truck in the somewhat creepy alien abduction movie "Fire in the Sky":

Now I'm feeling the desire to chase down that idiot in the woodgrain Taurus wagon who flipped me off and yelled out the window "Burn my dust! Eat my rubber!!"

Eat my road grit, liver lips!

uplanderguy · March 12

I used to goof on the Ron Howard movie which I think was called "Eat My Dust". I remember the TV commercial with him trying to sound like a tough guy, yelling "Eat My Dust!", but still sounding not unlike Opie.

andre1969 · March 12

I always liked "Grand Theft Auto," so one time I tried watching "Eat My Dust" which came out in 1976, the year before. It was kind of painful, as I recall. GTA, was at least fun, in a moronic sort of way. One of the highlights of it was Marion Ross (Mrs. C. herself) flipping off a cop. It's tagline was "See the World's Greatest Cars Destroyed!" or something like that. But most of them were just old junkers. Although, there was a Porshe that gets wrecked, towards the beginning. And the starring car, a 1959 (I think) Rolls Royce.

Corman's "Cannonball" was also a fun movie, although a bit darker, as it actually had people getting killed in it. One memorable moment from that (which was deleted the last time I saw it) was a guy with a bad German accent saying "Schtoopid Amelican Caas! Dey loook like Tootsie Rolls on Veels!" Meanwhile, he's driving a De Tomaso Pantera, which I believe was made primarily for the US market?

And at one point, there are signs for the Pennsylvania Turnpike. Yet you see palm trees here and there.

Spoiler alert: The Pantera had a bomb planted in it, set to explode when the car hit 160 mph. Never noticed it before, but whatever they blow up is a really, REALLY bad mockup of a Pantera...

Also, when it blows up, that '73 Polara police car in front is running blocker, keeping the driver from passing. I didn't know a '73 Polara could go 160 mph...

kyfdx · March 12

Test

uplanderguy · March 12

That's a Studebaker.

kyfdx · March 12

uplanderguy said:
That's a Studebaker.

Yeah.. I was testing our photo upload. It works!!

stickguy · March 12

I think Andre proved that a few hours ago!

kyfdx · March 12

stickguy said:
I think Andre proved that a few hours ago!

Dragging a file worked all weekend. It's uploading from your photo roll that wasn't working.

andre1969 · March 12

I was actually having problems uploading over the weekend. When I mentioned the vague similarity I saw between a '92 Eldorado and the '67-70 in the C-pillar area, I tried to post a pic of the '92. It wouldn't let me copy and paste from the source website like I usually do. I even tried saving it to my computer and uploading it, but that didn't work either.

For that "Cannonball" mockup Pantera, I had the movie playing on the computer (found it on Youtube) and just did a screen capture. I was honestly surprised that it pasted!

uplanderguy · March 13

Found this outside the Service Dept. of my dealer in Beloit, OH yesterday. Not sure if customer's or employee's car.

Note wheel which resembles plastic hubcap.

I don't remember enough about these cars to know if the body-colored grille was because of a trim level, or just a model-year change in the run.

I will give this car props as I'm thinking it's probably the last domestic hardtop with frameless door glass.

uplanderguy · March 13

Had the car into the dealer for a few days because the gap on the right side of the tonneau was bigger than the left, which bugged fussy me. Considering they don't have a body shop, I was pleased with how they finessed it to be better. I asked if they'd wash the car as when I'd dropped it off, I'd driven 30 miles in rain. I'm used to dealer car washes being rather spotty (no pun intended), but I was pleased to see the car washed, dried, and tires blacked. I'm still liking this dealer.

kyfdx · March 13

Awesome!

gsemike · March 13

@uplanderguy that's an alloy wheel with a hub cover that just looks like an autobarn plastic wheel cover

That does look like a nice example though

fintail · March 13

On the Eldo note, I've restarted my non-winter jogging, and on my route today saw a 92-97 Seville on these wheels (but not chrome), looked to be in decent enough condition:

Also noticed a couple of cars I would spot sitting outside last year are gone - a series 3 XJ6 and a mid 60s Chevy pickup.

stickguy · March 13

I actually liked the design of that vintage Seville.

texases · March 13

I agree. It's one of the cars that demanded my attention when it came out. Loved it.

explorerx4 · March 13

To me it looks like a TBird copy of that era.

texases · March 13

Not seeing it. Much stronger front end and roofline on the Seville, to me:

explorerx4 · March 13

@texaes, the previous to 89 generation.

texases · March 13

explorerx4 said:
@texaes, the previous to 89 generation.

Another one of the designs I liked.

uplanderguy · March 14

I liked those '92 Sevilles right away too....especially the taillight treatment, wall-to-wall CHMSL in back, and the individual chromed "SEVILLE" lettering on the trunklid.

tjc78 · March 14

Yeah, good looking car for sure. If I recall the press liked the STS version.

ab348 · March 14

uplanderguy said:
Found this outside the Service Dept. of my dealer in Beloit, OH yesterday. Not sure if customer's or employee's car.

Note wheel which resembles plastic hubcap. " alt="" height="20" />

I don't remember enough about these cars to know if the body-colored grille was because of a trim level, or just a model-year change in the run.

The body-color grille was a feature of the Eldorado Touring Coupe, which was a step up from the regular sport coupe model.

uplanderguy · March 14

Ah yes, the "ETC"!

tjc78 · March 14

@ab348 said:
The body-color grille was a feature of the Eldorado Touring Coupe, which was a step up from the regular sport coupe model.

Tinted windows would do wonders for that car.

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles