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As to your first question, probably not since a simple balance shaft matter is not related to ECU control of emissions or general engine performance. Getting to the balance shafts belt involves much the same work as accessing the timing belt with commensurately similar labor charges. If it were me, I'd have the Honda dealership which did the timing belt and balance shafts belt replacements do the tear-down. (There're actually two balance shafts which counter-rotate. If either is out of sync, mucho vibration.) Check your work order receipt to verify whether the balance shaft belt was replaced. If it turns out the dealership's brainiacs "timed" the balance shafts belt incorrectly, you'd have every reason to expect the repair to be done without charge. Take your complaint straight to the dealership's general manager - he has the power to over-rule the service manager and make things happen. If it turns out that it's their mistake, then it's their problem. If necessary, take 'em to small claims court.
Mrbill
I'm experiencing the door thing too ... sort of a rubbing sound.
I have a question for you. You mentioned no dealership will admit to knowledge of this issue, with reference to a TSB. Do you have a TSB number that you are referring to? What was the TSB that was distributed to Honda's service departments, and when?
Thanks!
I really would want to have that checked because I feel that must be the cause of the vibration.
What sort of potential problems could this create, the longer it goes unchecked?
Most dealers look at age, overall condition, and miles on the car when offering a trade in value. I've witnessed them take the car for a short drive around the block, some have just drove the car thru their lot.
If they would complain of a rattle, I would be shocked. They realize that the car is used, and a rattle is nothing unusual.
Now is a rattle something that you should live with, I would have to say no. It will be interesting if the BBB is willing to go after a rattle, when they most likely have cases they feel take higher priority.
Mrbill
If the balance shafts are merely out of sync, maybe nothing other than the vibration aggravation. I'm still interested in whether the balance shaft belt was replaced by the dealership in the other city. Even if you neglected to keep your copy of the paperwork, the dealership would have the information in their computerized records. But I'm even more interested in whether you've noted any drop in performance and fuel economy since having the timing belt replaced. If so, the intake and/or exhaust valves may be mis-timed in relationship to the pistons' travel and that could have eventual mechanical consequences if it hasn't already.
Any PNP Sirius tuner can be installed inside the Accord. Check out the Install Garage forum on Sirius Backstage (http://www.siriusbackstage.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=13). I think my install is buried on the 5th page back from the current front page.
This is an update on my case which I posted in message 12216. My original post was dated 21st September 2005 (the first day) so I will continue where I left off. The dealership was unable to trace the source of the problem even at the end of day 2 and the chief technician said it maybe a problem with the brake calipers. They had the calipers shipped overnight from Honda and installed the new calipers on Friday ( day 3). They then called me to inform me that the car was fixed and that I could go and pick it up. Before I took the car out of the dealership, I test drove the car but the noise was still there. I created a big fuss over it and the GM of the dealership and the salesperson took the car for a test drive without me. They come back claiming that the problem was solved. I told the GM to speak with the technician who was with me during the test drive and it was confirmed that the problem was not solved. I still took the GM for a test drive and showed him the noise. He was convinced.
He finally agreed to try and get me a replacement for the car. One week after my post on this forum I took delivery of my 2nd new car. Though it was not the same color as the first (san marino red), I do not think I settled for less since they replaced it with a black ( almost as good). As of today I have about 900 miles on the car. Last week I thought I heard the same noise with the 2nd car but I just finally gave up and decided that I will drive it for a week or two before I start to diagnose it again. I also think I have developed the rattle in the passenger side door when I have the window down. I am just not in mood for the frustration of discovering these problem, especially with such lousy weather. I am in NJ and its been raining for 7th straight day. I will start trying to check for the suspension noise again on this car soon. Wish me luck. :confuse:
If you can find my post described how I fixed this problem, the noise will go away.
The noise is really annoying, I know.
a bad gasket causing compression loss would affect the engine through out its driving range though wouldnt it. so then what would cause my my intermiten power loss? cat was just checked. and found to be in good condition unless it can burn out in less than 3 days. and there really wernt any problems between then and yesterday.
The BBB has opened a case for me, and someone from Honda Mediation called and left a message. It will be interesting to see what happens.
My guess is your intermittent problem will become a constant problem with time. As the head and block heat up, the leak could come an go, sediment in the coolent and loose pieces of the gasket could also act as a temporary plug. The spark plug could also be fouling out, and hard acceleration may just be cleaning off the plug with a wash of unburned gas, allowing it to fire again.
All that unburned fuel going into the exhaust isn't doing your new cat any good.
Mrbill
The front tie rod bushings are shot and the associated steering column rattle is worsening.
The total estimate for the work is $900 with tax (rear struts & tie rod bushings). I declined the repair and need to dump this lemon before the tranny fails (next).
So glad I didn't buy a useless extended warranty because none of these repairs are covered.
If you have bought the EW, the repair costs would have paid for the EW itself.
Struts are parts of suspension. Tie rod busings are parts of steering system.
And they are all covered under chassis category!
"Suspension, Steering and Brake System"
------ Well.... that's NOT what I'd expect to see before making a decision.... "Brake System" is a very general description I'd say, does is cover Rotors? Calipers? Brake Pads (of course, not)?
So WHERE do you get a DETAILED LIST of what's covered under the extended warranty? Any educated consumer would expect to see that list first, before purchasing it....
Calipers, yes!!
Before purchasing an EW, there is a list of components covered and NOT covered by EW (on the contract) given out by the dealer. If one is not sure, ask.
I can't post the contract, but here's the link:
http://www.curryhondacare.com/coverage.cfm?CFID=529242&CFTOKEN=80822375
Your saying that just turning on the heat makes the car vibrate?? Where does the vibration feel like its coming from, engine, interior? does the car have to be moving to vibrate? when you say heat, are you also turning on the defrost where the A/C is kicking in?
Mrbill
I don't remember everything in the article, but I do remember the comment that seals and gaskets may not hold as well when switching, so you may be leaking the oil and not burning it.
Mrbill
So now, how do I get Honda to look again at something they claim wasn't messed up in the first place? I'm inclined to believe it must be the balancer belt since I've gone and fixed everything else they claimed was the problem and the vibration still occurs.
I can't really say if I noticed any drop in performance and fuel economy since having the timing belt replaced. Just the vibration problem.
Any tips of how to have Honda fix what I believe to be their screw up would be really helpful.
Thanks!
Not always - if the head gasket's blown and leaking vacuum during engine cool-down, drawdown from the coolant recovery tank could be affected because cool-down may just be drawing against the leaking head gasket(s) without affecting the liquid level in the coolant recovery tank at all. It's worth checking, but a normal level in the coolant recovery tank wouldn't be proof of healthy head gasket(s).
"All that unburned fuel going into the exhaust isn't doing your new cat any good."
True, but the potential expense of a new catalytic converter may be the least of kazuma1's problems. Two additional points:
1> When the igniition system's misfiring, there's unburned fuel being pushed past the piston rings during the compression stroke directly into the oil sump as an unwanted oil diluent.
2> There's also coolant being drawn into the cylinders during the intake stroke because of the leaking head gasket(s) and then pushed past the piston rings during the compression stroke, too, into the oil sump as per above. These two contaminants result in a lube oil witch's brew due to partially oxidized fuel fragments - just increasingly collecting to react in the oil and form sludge.
Result? BIG trouble. In addition to the problem I described, antifreeze glycols are both extremely corrosive and erosive to bearings due to their ability to mix with both oil and water. Even a little glycol content in the oil is a bad near-term thing. kazuma1's being hit with a triple whammy that'll cost him big time if this problem continues unchecked much longer. Submitting a sample of the current oil for a $20.00 analysis would prove beyond a doubt whether there's antifreeze contamination in the motor oil. (Do a search for "Blackstone Laboratories" if you're interested, kazuma1.
Hopefully not too many miles and time has passed, and all it would need is the gasket.
A good friend of mine has picked up a few Ford Freestars that had blown head gaskets, a half a days work, and he was able to turn them back into good runners again with just a gasket.
Mrbill
I am trying another dealer to see if they will goodwill these items or at least give a heavy discount. The place I take it to now just went through a major staff and management change.
48k is too early for these items to fail. I think most people buy Hondas for reliability, I know they are not perfect but this is ridiculous.
And they are all covered under chassis category!"
That would be nice if it's true, but the reality is that the EW, itself, would have to be reviewed for listed exclusions. "The devil's in the details."
yes all very good points about the now diluted oil sitting in my engine lol!
i havnt pulled it apart yet and will know more once i get the head off the block.
but im having some problems with the trouble codes.
codes are -- 1, 6, 12, and i believe 43 (i got 4 long lights then 3 short)
every ones input is greatly appriciated and thank you. im going to tear her down this weekend so ill post my findings monday.
-cs
Let me repharse that, turning on anything to do with the vent makes this really awful vibration......noise and feel. Whether I turn on the defrost with the AC or turn on just the heat, as soon as I turn something to do with the vents it'll happen. The car can be sitting parked or in motion and it'll still have that terrible vibration with any vent attempts. The extreme vibration is not inside the car, its almost definitely coming from under the hood. (You can tell how much I know about car mechanism) I would have no clue what exactly but definitely under the hood. Its not a slight vibration its a really awful one. That's why its so upsetting. Any ideas or fixes?? =(
Julie
Turning on the heater fan w/ A/C would turn on the compressor which is belt driven, again loading down the engine more.
here is something to try.
Turn on the ignition, but don't start the car. Turn on the heater fan and see if you hear the vibration. If it's there, then the only thing that could be going on is for some reason the fan itself is vibrating. Maybe something fell into the fan, throwing it off balance and vibrating. I once had a mouse that decided to make his home in the squirrell cage fan in my old 88 Accord. That really made it vibrate. What is puzzling is the fan is located in the passenger area, just behind the glove box. Again, if it does vibrate, your problem is with the fan itself.
Another thing that could be going on under the hood would be if you hear the vibration while the A/C or defrost is ON, or the engine is up to temperature and the fans are turning on. There may be something that was washed up into the area where the 2 electric fans are located just behind the radiator. You will easily see them just by looking under the hood, maybe a foot or so in from the front of the bumper. Just look, DONT reach down there!! You don't want the fans to turn on and you get caught. Do you see anything that doesn't look like it doesnt belong? If so, wait till the car has set overnight, making sure the engine is cold, before you reach down there and remove whatever may have wash up and wrapped around one of the fans.
Another possibility with the fans again would be something was washed up, caught one of the fans and damaged or broke off one of the blades. That would throw it off balance and cause a good vibration. Again when the engine is cold, you can turn the fans by hand looking for a missing or bent blade.
Good luck, hope this helps
Mrbill
However, I have been feeling the same thump under the same conditions that everyone has posted here and I know it is not because of the ABS self test or the climate control/ac. I even make sure my cc/ac is off before turning my car off. This thump may feel similar but it is not caused due to the same two conditions you have described and it is definitely not normal to me.
First, I have an 05 ex v6 coupe barely 4 months old. It is quite akward and bothersome to experience this problem even if it seems minor because it is a new car and its a Honda.
Second, I just brought in my Accord for its first oil change today and decided to address the problem along with my other problem with the brakes grinding. (I love the Accord, this is my first but I am a bit disappointed already) I got it back and they resurfaced my rotars for the barking concern and as for the "thump" they decided to rotate my tires as the solution to that concern. Honestly, I don't think it will solve the thump but at the same time I haven't had a chance to drive it enough given that this "thump" happens randomly.
I hope to find out exactly what is going on then to just have someone tell me that its nothing because it is and its not normal.
I would suspect that there is some dirt accumulated there. I know the dipstick fits in really TIGHT, so even with just a tiny bit of dirt, it would not go in. Try cleaning it with some cloth.
There is only one right way to go in, I think.