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Comments
"All hogwash" is a pretty extensive claim. Let's break it down a little shall we?
Is the claim that "one gets a very good deal" hogwash? I hear plenty of complaining about how the deals aren't the best one could possibly do, but do you really think that EDFE pricing isn't at least a pretty good deal?
Or are you saying that the claim that "there is a minimum of muss and fuss" is hogwash? Customers are getting in and out in an hour or two without any negotation whatsoever. For that to be hogwash, there must be some sort of problems I'm not aware of. What muss and fuss exists that makes that claim hogwash?
Or are you saying that the above two points are true, but that there is still no value in for the average consumer? Well, thousands and thousands of consumers are voting with their wallets that it is a good value. Are they deceived? I'm sorry, I have more faith in them than that.
GM has done the same thing before.
How's EDFE any different from Saturn's one-price pricing policy.
The two are quite similar, but there are some very significant differences:
First, you get EDFE on a much, much greater variety of cars and trucks, including most of the popular ones, not just some fairly new line of relatively small cars. If you are brand-loyal to GMC trucks, you can get a GMC truck under this scheme. That wasn't possible with saturn before.
Second, it's clear that these prices are pretty darn good. One couldn't always say that about the saturn prices.
I think GM made a poor decision for a short term gain. Now that the program is over the shoppers will demand it's return. The constant rebates and promotions like this do nothing for long term business.
I used to work for a company that did the same thing. Mortgage tomorrow's business for today's shot in the arm sales.
So...the quality salespeople leave only to be replaced with short term people who know nothing and will last three months.
I hope GM can stay in business. I really do.
Sure I made more in July than June. Units delivered increased 131%. Payable gross well lets just say it didn’t increase 131%. Was not even close to 100%
Reminds me of the 2 ways to make money “you can make a slow dime or 2 fast nickels.”
Joe Verde and Grant Cardone need to go back to selling if they really believe a sales consultant can make 6 figures a year in today’s market.
Ford's meddling in Mazda engineering and production is minimal, that's why.
Ken
I wasn't talking about what commissions a salesman makes on EDFE vs Saturn.
I was talking about the pricing policy. What that price is is rather irrelevant - whether invoice or MSRP or under invoice, or whatever.
If you tell me EDFE is better than Saturn's policy because the products covered are more diverse and better, I'll certainly believe you but that's irrelevant to my point as well.
My point is simply this.
With EDFE you pay a set price + any options + doc fees for any car.
With Saturn, you did the same.
You don't negotiate anything with the dealer, except a trade in if you have one.
(Actually you might negotiate for dealer installed options/financing, but that's also the same in both cases)
And in both cases, a savvy consumer can get a better deal/better car for the money without these pricing policies. And a non-savvy consumer is benefited.
I do agree that the salesmen involved would probably make less money with EDFE than with Saturn if he moves the same number of units, but profits from new car sales aren't what keeps dealerships in business from what I hear. It's the service departments and used car sales. So creating more floor traffic exposes more consumers to a dealership's more lucrative lines of business, which I believe is the main reason for this pricing scheme. If the number of GM vehicles on the road increases, everybody in GM benefits, with the possible exception of the salesmen who have to do more work and maybe not much more/maybe even less sales commisions.
Sure if you’ve been in the business 15 years, don’t take Ups and have the repeat and referral business with a closing ratio of 80% because you already have a report with them and they come to you as serious buyers, I’m sure it’s possible.
I believe it was Grant Cardone who said, “if I knew how you bought your last car I’d know how to sell you this one.”
Every store has a few that make good money but most don’t. That is why every store has their 15% staff that has been with them for eons and the other 85% are a revolving door.
I recently interviewed a guy from a nearby domestic store. He said they had, I think 25 salespeople. He had been there eight months and he said only two people had been there longer.
My next alternative is now $2k more than what I could've bought the first car for!
I guess I am learning the hard way.
With EDFE you pay a set price + any options + doc fees for any car.
With Saturn, you did the same
Sorry that I gave you more detail than you asked for. To answer your question. Yes. They are both 1 price no haggle pricing. The difference with Saturn there is between $900 and $1800 in profit built in. With the GM employee pricing there is not. The savy of the savy could not beat the GM employee price EVER.(not including any incentives) People use the rebate angle, but over half end up using the low APR from GMAC. That really didn't change over the last couple of months. So for most it is a much better deal. ANd as far as the savy shopper who will fight for that extra $300 off the price to put the deal together and then finances the car saves a whopping $6 a month on a five year loan, You wonder why there is so much turnover in the car business.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Market demand I guess!
:sick: :lemon:
Course they aren't floor grunts selling Fords and Chevys.
There is a big disparity in salesperson quality at the mass market stores. It will be hard to convince anyone with talent and a desire to make a good living to work in a domestic store from henceforth.
I've been called a lot of things but not a "floor grunt."
I think your right. I have a friend who sells for a local import dealer. Not even the largest in town. They don’t advertise for positions because they have a waiting list of sales people wanting to go to work for them. He makes about 3x what I do.
Best part of all is the shortest tenure on staff is just under 3 years.
I had 3 consecutive deals with a total of 4 trades totaling $800. These are the customers that really did get great deals. One of these customers was such a bad pay, just to get FMCC to buy the deal he needed $2,000 down, had no cash so we gave him $1,500 allowance on his $200 and $300 trades. So FMCC bought it. Think he got a great deal??? :mad:
It doesn't look like any of the guys in the business have an answer for you. They are probably in disbelief that you haven't figured this out on your own.
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I'm a consumer just like you but that's as far as it goes. Sounds to me like you have fallen in love with a piece of sheetmetal that has wheels, happens all the time. Bad, bad thing for you, a very good thing for salesman and dealers. The dealer that you thought was your friend, because of previous purchases, turns out that he isn't. Does this surprise any car buyer out there or just you? Salesman and dealers are in business to make money, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this but you have to understand this. If the beauty you want is in such demand you are just going to have to wait and pay the freight when it shows up.
As far as the GM putting the "car in hold status", again this doesn't sound like a friend to me. If I had a friend that did this, he's off my Christmas list NOW.
How long do you want to wait before trying another dealer?
Maybe you should try falling in love with something else. Kind of like when the girl you were giddy about in high school didn't look at you twice, so you moved on. This experience may be one of the best lessons to learn from.
I'm going to make the assumption that you are over 25, therefore, I can't comprehend anybody at that age still doing flips over a vehicle of any type. I hope you get just as excited about being with your family.
Somehow I don't think you are going to take any of this as advice but I sincerely wish you luck with your purchase.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I think its a salvage car, wonder if he got it re-titled?
Either way, I'd run from that car.
Sorry that I took that comment as you saying that you worked for GM. I was letting everyone in this room know that the salespeople are suffering through this program that you keep refering to as a scam. It isn't. You are entitled to your opion but please don't misrepresent yourself.
I doubt any newbie could get the "best deal". Even seasoned vets (who are consumers), are still amateurs. Remember, car salesman do this day in and day out. Folks like myself do this once every few years.
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But to get a decent deal, I'd recommend a Carmax where they sell new cars or do your negotiating over the internet, that is if you can find a dealer that will do that. Just make sure they stick to what they agreed to.
Oh yeah, something hinky here, no doubt ...... open up the trunk and look on the inside of the lid ....
Terry.
That must be some aquarium you live in ..l.o.l.....
Some dealers pay $50, others pay $100, some maybe $75, could find a few that might pay $150 ... as whole, $75 seems to be the going rate .... it all depends on the store, the management and their view of employee pricing ........ 25% on the extra profit ..? what extra profit ..? most stores have raised their pack by $350/$500+ and employee pricing has cut back the dealer profit by 2% ... now I "know" you're not in the car biz --- just some poster .... where do you guys come from.? ..l..o..l.....
Terry.
PS: that even includes north Texas
We get killed on packs though since the dealership takes between 1% and 3% of the sale price depending on model. No share of the F&I money for us either although we do get very good used and new car volume bonuses.
Terry.
Actually, no ..... the market has changed by leaps and bounds since the first Dodge Caravan in 1983, when folks looked for manual trannys and 5 passenger people haulers and even that didn't last long .... your not a population, you're a small itty bitty market of 0.3% that doesn't come around enough to make it profitable for the manufacturers or the dealers .....
Terry
Manufacturer options are something we have to live with. They figure most people will start out looking at base or close to base...see all the options they can get for only a thousand more...then see even more options for a couple thousand more.
How much more money you think a manufacturer, then the dealership, makes on a loaded with options vehicle, and dealer add ons, as opposed to selling just the base? The base usually coming very well loaded.
It's not about what the customers want...it's what they will buy.
"Should I try buying in another state or something?"
I'm just a consumer like you, so take this for what it's worth.
I wouldn't buy something that I was dead set against either but is it really worth it to go to another state to buy a car? Unless the $800 to $2000 you mentioned is going to break the bank, sometimes these additional options are nice to have and can grow on you. Like when I bought my first new car ( 66' Bonneville) it sat on the floor with power windows, I didn't want power windows (some people back then said " they give you more problems than they are worth" ) so I was going to order one identical to it but without the power windows. I thought twice about this and since the dealer was willing to work with me over this option, I bought the car as it sat on the floor. I NEVER regretted this and now look at what has happened, almost all cars have power windows. Same kind of thing happened when the auto makers started providing most cars with power steering and power brakes, nobody would consider any vehicle without them today.
I'm a little reluctant to say that without having a vehicle equipped the way most people want them will hurt resale value because if you are like me (and nobody wants to be like that) resale value doesn't mean anything, I keep my cars a lot longer than most. However, if you trade often you will probably regret having what is perceived as a "stripped down model" !!!
Just my thoughts.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I myself, and probably a lot of people cannot live without AC, power windows/locks/mirrors. just 3 years ago, I think power seats, memeory seats, and navi aren't worth the money. Now that I have a car with lumbar support, power/memoery seats, navi, premium sound, I feel they're necessities. I might still be ok without navi and premium sound, but I cannot live without lumbar support anymore, and memory seats are certainly very convenient especially after car wash or valet.
I think my next necessity is going to be cooling fans under the seats, I could really use the cooling seats in this CA weather.