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Comments
The main problem, of course, is that the driver's steering wheel air bag didn't inflate fast enough. That seems to me to be a relatively easy thing to fix, as opposed to redesigning the whole cabin or something. The video of the test showed that the cabin area held up pretty well. If Hyundai can fix the air bag sensor, I think they could get a much better result from this test.
If they were supposed to go off then the failure rate is 1/3. In the test where they failed to deploy the dummy's head ended up hitting the B-pillar. I find it hard to believe that because this is frontal impact, the side airbags are not supposed to deploy.
And anyways, if they are not supposed to deploy, does that the fact that they did 2 out of 3 times mean that their sensors are defective as well?
And if something deploys when it is not supposed to, that is a problem even if it has a beneficial consequences.
Personally, I think all the air bags should be set to go off in the event of any crash above a certain speed.
Seems to be more prevalent when the car is warming up for first couple of miles. Also seems to be worse at low acceleration.
I now have 4200mi on my car and it still does it.
Can't wait to see how bad it is going to be when winter comes and the temps get below 60F.
Have also noticed that at about 40mph when the xmisssion is in overdrive, if you back off on the gas the car seems to bog down. When I have done this with any other vehicle this has not happened but I get more of a coasting feeling.
The transmission seems to shift perfectly when under hard acceleration. Maybe you're only supposed to drive the Elantra as if you were on a racetrack. ;-)
http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/summary_small.htm
And PLEASE don't tell me the 10/100 bull that the dealer will spit out. First, it's a marketing ploy to try and boost sales - second, have you ever found the service experience to be pleasant when you had to fix your car? $40-75 JUST to LOOK at the damn thing, and then, unless it's MAJOR, they'll always try to find something you didn't do as part of maintenance - something like transmission fails at 40,000 miles and you didn't change the transmission fluid at 30,000 !!! No way, I'll stick with a reliable car thank you.
Just curious... how could you not be at least a little impressed by a car that you believe tests out on a par with Civic EX but costs thousands less and has tons more standard equipment? Also, how can you say the reliability record of the Elantra GT is "spotty" when the car has been selling for only a couple of months, and its brother the GLS only since last fall in its present form? From comparing owner experiences of the GLS and GT to that of the 2001 Civic on Edmund's forums, it appears to me that they all have their share of first-year glitches.
I really like the GT, but the safety ratings are certainly a concern. Basically - I'm buying on price, safety and reliability. The price is right...the reliability was a question...and I thought the safety (according to NHTSA) was comparable. Now I'm not so sure.
I was only tempted by the GT because of the great looks which wasn't one of my primary criteria. I just got annoyed with all the Civics I saw on the road.
Its fair to say that Hyundai should step up to the plate, validate these results, and issue a recall if necessary. That would restore my faith in their determination to sell car car that is safe and reliable....in which case I might be swayed to buy it in September as it would satisfy my three decision points.
Anyone who thinks a recall on the airbags or their sensors - even if barely necessary - is silly and bad for resale is kidding themselves. Those test ratings are bad for resale.
Right now - I'm back to buying a Civic. I hope there is more to this story by September...because I would love to have the better looking, less expensive, more amenities car be safe.
Saw an interesting note on another board--the 2002 Kia Spectra (replacement for both the Sephia and Spectra) is based on the Elantra platform, according to the post. I saw a '02 Spectra sedan the other day and it was very sharp, even classier looking than the Elantra I think. This could make it very interesting next year if Hyundai/Kia has two solid compacts to go up against Civic and the rest.
Kyle
A new elantra with ABS (pkg 5 I believe) will set you back $15,000.... and you can't get a sunroof with the abs.
You can get a new civic EX Sedan with side airbags (includes abs and sunroof) now for under $17,000.
Now.... If you don't car about abs, dealers are letting LX Sedans go for $15,000.
So, even in EX vs. GLS configurations, the difference is $2000 - $3,000 in favor of the Hyundai. BUT.... and here's the big BUT....
Number one: Honda is offering 3.9% financeing for 3 years (and 5.9% for 5 years) which will save a bundle in interest over the average loan rate in the country now (8.9% I've read). AND in 3-5 years, trade-in prices on civic will be exceptional compared to the hyundai. So, when you factor in the better resale and lower interest and the fact that honda dealers are selling at close to invoice, the civic $ is the same or in some cases (at trade-in time) LESS EXPENSIVE than the elantra. I like the elantra very much, but I really don't keep my cars longer than 2-3 years so I need something reliable, affordable and with good resale. That's why I'm leaning civic over elantra. Also, coming out of a VW, let me tell you... You could have a 50 year/500,000 b2b warranty but there is NOTHING worse than dealer service departments. While no car is perfect, my experiences with honda civics and accords in the past has been good.... rarely if EVER did I have to take my car to ANY shop other than routine oil changes. While hyundai (elantra in particular) build quality has improved dramatically, they still have to prove themselves..... raw data over the next couple of years.... before I take the plunge.
I do agree that if you plan to keep a car for only 2-3 years and like driving the Civic as much as the Elantra, the Civic makes more sense because of its traditionally high resale value--assuming you can get a decent deal on the Civic.
I'll go 1st. These were the qualities, I looked for when shopping.
1.) Roomy Interior-
2.) Value Pricing-
3.) Attractive Styling-
Thank you in advance!
Repectfully,
Larry
2) looks -same as above
3) standard equipment
http://www.alldata.com/includes/tsb/honda_notice.html
I don't see how they are "hiding" any defects by encouraging use of their Honda-trained techs.
And why should Alldata make a profit (it's $24.95 per year for the first vehicle, $14.95 for additional vehicles) off information Honda has paid to investigate, develop, and distribute? Sounds like they are looking for a free ride and encouraging folks like you to complain to Honda when they don't get it.
By the way, BMW doesn't want Alldata publishing their stuff either. I'd say that's pretty good company to be in.
twist
BTW, you can get BMW TSBs from ALLDATA and they never requested ALLDATA to limit access to their TSBs.
2. Driver comfort relating to a good adjustable seat with lumbar and height adjustments, good leg room, and a fully functional, proper height center arm rest/console.
3. Hatchback versatility.
Result: Elantra GT
Honda's are better than Hundai's for many reasons, but here's one:
Honda: put the key in: ding, ding, silence
Hundai: put the key in: ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong ding dong
never ends. and that would make you a ding dong for buying it.
'nuff said
thanks civic owner, u reminded me of my ding dong that i get every time i put in the key because i put the key in the ignition and leave my door open all the time, i'm gonna go buy a honda now so i don't get that ding dong, because thats why hondas are so great, no DING DONG!
hondaowner civic and elantras have all their goods and bads, why don't u give all of us a better reason why honda is better for u than the ding dong
Thanks for clarifying your statements. I still disagree with you on the fuel economy point. Yes, the Accord has comparable mpg to the Elantra (26/32 Accord vs. 25/33 Elantra) while the Accord has 10 more horses and weighs more. That's impressive. But all the other cars you mention that have more power than the Elantra also have lower mpgs, while all the small cars you listed that have higher mpgs than the Elantra have less power, in almost every case at least 10% less. Take 10% off the mpg ratings for the other cars and the Elantra's mpg is pretty close. So considering the power output of the Elantra compared to cars of comparable power, it's not doing too bad--not as bad as you made it out to do in your initial post anyway.
Re the natural-gas Civic, I was comparing gasoline cars. If we want to get into the esoteric stuff, we could talk about hybrids, electric cars, fuel-cell cars etc. and the discussion of mpg would get really convoluted.
Re the Sentra SE, that doesn't exist anymore, but when it did (last year) it had 145 hp, more than the Elantra. So it should be faster. The Sentra SE-R has 165 horses so it had better be a lot faster than the Elantra. Still, 0-60 in 8 secs. is not bad for a $13,000 econobox.
Re crash tests, I respect your opinion on the importance of the IIHS offset crash test. I wish the Elantra had performed better in that test also--shoot, I drive one. I just didn't like the generalization that the Elantra performed poorly in all crash tests.
BTW- I forgot that they added that stupid muffler to the SE to boost power to 145. The Civic GX was to prove a point w/emissions- ULEV & SULEV vs. LEV & SULEV. The whole problem with that argument, though, was the fact that the GX is natural-gas. Cleanest internal combustion engine, yes; cleanest gasoline engine, no. Just a point of interest that was really a weak factor in my greater point of Civic emissions.
The disappearance of the SE model pretty much says that that engine is dead, eh? With the G20 heading out next spring, that's the end of the road for that thing. The end of an era has come. Oh well, whatever.
Anyway, kudos, Backy, for your admirable poise and competence throughout this thread! Good people do still exist.
Happy holidays!
Hyundai,especially the elantra, is
making Hondo owners and dealers a little defensive and nervous. My Brother-in-Law, Andres, was very anti-Hyundai. He bought his new Civic
just a few months before I purchased my Elantra GLS. Once I got it he asked me to come by and let him have a look. Well,he looked at it pretty hard, inside and out, trunk and engine, asked about the price and warranty then slammed the door. "Pretty good" he said "can I drive it?" "Sure!" I tossed him the keys.
His verdict? He thinks I got the better deal, and he has revised his opinion of Hyundai.:)