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So far, I can't see many differences. The areas with parks and shopping malls now have new icons of trees and presents. The voice is a bit different and there are new prompts. It now says "System is showing the American Restaurant Icons". They seemed to added the word "icons" all over the place and it's a different woman's voice. There are some places that were not on the map before that now appear. But there are others still missing. The POI database is improved (at least here in LA). Stores that have been out of business for 10 years are gone and places that were missing now seem to appear---although it is still not perfect.
It did not upgrade the software to add any of the voice commands for the stereo system like are found in the 2002. I really don't know what the software upgrade actually did. I have called Denso to ask since the Dealer had no clue and the DVD case just had a small book showing the map coverage areas. I'll let you know what Denso says and if I find any other significant changes in the maps. It is version 2001.1 now, just like is found in the 2002 cars.
BTW, I did try to make a DVD copy (for backup purposes...of course), but the disk is now 6.5GB. Too large for the burner (4.77GB max). Oh well. But I'm sure if you talk to corporate, they will bend and give you the update for free too. You can very easily install it yourself if you want.
I spoke to the dealer and Lexus Customer Svcs about the update and they said for those who have an 02 Lexus, their current version is the most updated. The next update for 02 cars will be in the fall.
By the way, where is the DVD located? Is it in the trunk or located in or under the dash somewhere? It is astounding to me that Lexus would even considering charging a dime to replace a DVD. They're taking us for a ride!!!
"...Detailed Maps For Nearly 90 US Metropolitan Areas; Owners Of Lexus Satellite Navigation System Are Entitled To 2 Free National Database Upgrades Display ..."
I got the Custom Pkg on my 02 LS which includes additional options not included in the Nav/Levinson pkg. So I can't tell you if you've got a good deal or not.
However, there are a few websites that will display dealer cost and MSRP. In fact, the Edmund.com new car web site has the data there for you. Also try cars.com, caranddriver.com, kellybluebook.com. Hope this helps.
Great data on the 2 free navigation updates!
I'm going to search through my documentation to see where this comment might be written and will post the page number on this website for everyone. It's always better to go into the dealer with chapter and verse to get the quickest satisfaction.
Colors - don't go by old LS400 model colors as many of the new ones are different other than white, black and silver. The mystic gold is very different than the old cashmere, the midnight pine is radically different than the old dark green as is the black cherry etc.
Tuned LS400 - saw my first one today on the Henry Hudson Parkway in NYC. Silver with all tinted glass, lower body panels, huge tires and beautiful wheels. This car really looked like it was on tracks the way it handled and it seemed lower to the ground - if that is possible. The guy was really rolling and I certainly couldn't keep pace with him as I was in my truck. But the car was abolutely stunning. When Lexus sells tuned cars directly through dealers I'm sure they will be a big hit. This car looked as good or better than any MB S AMG that I've ever seen.
I don't know where you live, but I bought a base LS430 with heated seat and roof for 51,700 (list 57,000 and change) in suburb of Chicago three days ago.
Anyway, I asked the question about updates to the NAV system for the 02 LS430. Here is a copy/paste of the response I got from Lexus customer service...
______________
The first update for your Navigation System is planned to become available around October, 2002. The dealer will replace the Navigation Digital Versatile Disc (DVD) to perform this update. 2000 and newer model year Navigation vehicles are not eligible for free Navigation System updates. The earlier model vehicles were eligible for Navigation System updates because they were still in the infant stages.
All Lexus dealers are independently owned and operated and will have different pricings for parts. Please contact your local Lexus dealer to obtain the pricing for the Navigation System update. I am sorry for any inconvenience this situation has caused you.
If you have any further concerns, you can also reach the Lexus Customer Satisfaction Department at 1-800-255-3987, Monday through Friday, 6:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m., Pacific Time.
Sincerely,
Aya Nakahara
Customer Satisfaction Representative
My father and I got a Mystic Sea Opalescent for my mom this past winter. It was her second choice after one of the "dark" colors. But, once again, those colors show dirt, scratches, and swirls easily, so she decided on the Mystic Sea. It's absolutely beautiful, and you don't see too many of them around, so you feel a little unique. It also looks great even after 4 weeks without a wash. But, you should see it on an LX470, as your opinion may differ. As for me, I'm looking at a BMW 325ci, as my first "new" car. What do you think? I value the opinion of the members of this board. Thank you...
Jeff
After all, how long would even the most extreme customer keep his car? Surely not much longer than twenty years. I think that Lexus should be able to foot the cost of the update disc every few years or so. It would even be ok if they simply just tacked on the future cost to the nav. option.
Personally, though, before the LS with Nav., i simply used maps that were years old, so I am sure that I will continue to do the same with the current DVD.
I think that Lexus is better than Benz when it comes to charging extra for what should be std. options. Eg., i think that on the 600 series Benzes, you have to pay extra for the parking control as well as the Distronic cruise control.
With the LS it's std.
I wonder why it is that Benz simply doesn't just make all of that stuff std. and simply add $10K to the price.
He's been a European buyer for the last 15 years and never thought to look at Japanese luxury. Now he may be done with the Europeans. Unless you give it a test drive you'll never know any better and end up badly overpaying for a much lesser car. What's even more incredible is some of these people are stretching themselves thin to buy that 3 pointed star. It's also amazing how many people that are still out there who wish MB and BMW still had the lux market to themselves.
By the way I've decided I'm going to switch jobs at the end of the summer so I've already told my sales guy to get me into the SC430 and get me out of my Midnight Pine lease. I'll be back to busing into NYC. I love that SC430. My wife thinks I'm nuts and she'd never part with her silver LS430. But she does admit she'll drive it often if I can pull it off. I'll let you know what happens. It's several months off.
I'll keep the LS430 to lease end if I can't get out of the lease. It's incredibly convenient to have a third car. But I'd love it if I can get that toy car to play with. With an LX470 and my wife's car I have plenty for family hauling. By the way that GX470 Lexus is coming out with looks great particularly with the dvd entertainment system. I may go there and save some money when the LX lease is up. So the SC 430, if I get it would just a personal car that we'd use from time to time and end up with only about 6-7k miles per year. I'd likely buy it at lease end with that kind of low mileage. Always wanted a lux sport car to play with. I think Ray Catena - who I deal with in NJ will do everything in their power to get me a lease switcheroo. But this is all end of the summer stuff. I'm just launching the process.
I ordered a personalized dark grey floor mat for my mom last winter for her mystic opal/charcoal int. LS430. It has the Lexus emblem embroidered in the center with her name right below it. It's just as good, if not better than the factory mats, and looks OEM, although it isn't. It cost me about $125. Check out autoanything.com
Jeff
Also to: pcbrs --> Thanks for the tip on autoanything.com. I'll check it out. As long as lexus is suggesting a carpet cleaner like Scotchguard, I may just give it a try first. But it sounds like a pain the you know what that never really goes away.
________________
Lexus recommends the use of Scotchguard type products on polyester material to help repel fluids, which could help keep fluids from soaking in and drying between the polyester fibers. Scotchguard type treatments are applied to the surface and will wear off at some point. Lexus does not use Scotchguard or any other stain resistant treatment at the factory.
Who were you dealing with at Germain? I live close to Columbus and haven't been able to work the deal that I'm trying to get locally and would like to try elsewhere..................Thanks!
Has anyone else heard of this? I used to have an Infiniti Q45 and the brakes lasted to 60K before they had to be changed. It is exactly the same commute as I have with the Lexus.
Do I really have to change the brake pads once a year? Any one else with experience with this would be appreciated.
Some of you Lexus folks amaze me, always bringing up MB and BMW when nobody mentioned them in order to justify your purchase. That said, the LS430 is a fine car, but clearly isn't for everyone. The E-Class has long been praised for being just the right size and price and it's popularity shows that.
Nickel-n-diming: Every luxury car maker does it except Acura. One upside to this is that one MB is not just like another MB. Every single Acura RL on the road is the same, either with or without a Nav System. Mercedes' cars, along with BMWs are more "custom" made than most. You don't see many identical cars. Yamahar6, maybe a S600 buyer doesn't want Distronic or Parktronic. Part of what makes the S-Class, 7-Series and even the LS430 so alluring is you can get them your way (gosh that sounds familiar). But, when did these things become standard on the LS430? Aren't they part of a gulp(!) 14K unseperatable option package, now thats beyond nickel and diming. Don't you have to get the Nav System to get the ML sound system on the ES300 or LS430? What about the guy who doesn't care for or doesn't need a Nav system, but wants the sound system?
M
Has anybody seen the Maybach website? The ultra-high-end market seems to be filling out. The cars we are discussing a just 2nd or 3rd tier. Hardly worth an argument.
You can purchase some of the options separately, or at least that's what my dealer stated. The ML sound system, which is still the best I've ever heard, was a $1200 stand alone option on my mother's car. A 6 CD in dash speaker system is standard on the LS430. I can't believe a CD player is an option on so many $35K+ cars by MB. Do MB owners prefer casette decks? That's an extreme form of nickel and diming, of course. I'm guessing MB owners tend to be more savvy about technology.
Jeff
Well that I have no issue with. It's the "how could they" question that's silly to me. The assumption is that you're a fool if you buy anything else in the 50K+ class other than the LS430.
Maybach:
http://www.maybach-manufaktur.com/d/language.html
ljflx,
Sure I've noticed Lexus being brought up on the S-Class board, usually during the shopping phase. The difference there is that S-Class or MB owners in general don't usually make the statement "they don't know any better" or "how could they purchase..." when referring to Lexus cars. You (my friend) and others are the mains ones that make those types of statements about Benz owners. You and again, others act like MB owners couldn't have possibly cross-shopped a Lexus and came away not buying one. The way I see it if Lexus was such the holy-grail of luxury cars it would be obvious without all the irrelevant talk and MB wouldn't even be worth of mentioning.
pcbrs,
Which model Lexus are you talking about, because according to their website the ML is only offered with the Nav system on the ES300 and LS430. What was that about a Correction???? A 14K option package is just ridiculous. What if someone doesn't want all that stuff? MB offeres greater customization i.e. you get what you want, nothing you don't want. I agree with you on MB and CD players, it's a downright shame for MB to not at least offer a standard single-slot CD player. Agreed. BMW and Audi have already done so however. But back to nickel and diming, Lexus does it just as much as Mercedes. They (luxury car brands) all do except Acura.
M
I have to agree that most of the luxury brands do nickel and dime a lot, to keep their base price low, except for Acura. As I'm shopping around for a BMW 325ci right now, I can see how BMW and MB are the worst about this. It's ridiculous how much one has to pay to get some options in a BMW. It's still a great car, so I'm considering a european delivery to save some money. Lexus is a more reliable brand, but I really don't like the IS300's interior design. Unfortunately, no LS board members have replied with advice regarding 325ci... I guess different demographics, but I prefer non-biased opinions.
Anyway, I was just trying to correct the misinformation you seem to have about LS430 options. The website gives you a general idea of the options available and packages. My mother's LS430 was purchased in Hawaii, where a Nav is really useless. The ML was purchased as a standalone. Many people do this, for one reason or another. I think one owner just preferred not to deal with the touchscreen for audio controls. Before you judge these cars, check them out at a dealership and go for a test drive, or price one out with a salesperson. It's a fun experience, and you might end up buying one. My mom still absolutely loves her car. =D Hope this clears things up. See ya.
Jeff
The same goes for BMWs. There are several options which are not on the website, but can be ordered on your car, if you know the option code. Did you know the BMW 330s can be optioned with power rear sunshades? Also, the exterior and interior colors are not "locked" into only certain configurations as suggested by the website. So my point is, you don't know what configurations are possible unless you go to the dealership.
Jeff
M
(2) My comment was not a MB v. Lexus attack, nor was it a suggestion that anyone would have to be crazy to buy an A6 or a 540. But even a partisan like you would have to agree (although perhaps not publically) that the E is nowhere near the car the LS is. I wouldn't buy an S for a lot of reasons, but you would have to be blind to say that it isn't a terrific car, but the S and the LS compete in a whole different world than the E. ALL I was saying was that a 6 cyl. E cannot compete at any level with the LS; it is a miracle of marketing and so-called "prestige" that MB can sell cars at this sort of premium. The S vs. LS v. XJ v. A8 v. 7 competition presents an interesting set of trade-offs and value judgments; reasonable minds can differ and I could hardly doubt the wisdom of any choice w/in this segment (although I might disagree with that choice). E vs. LS is a joke. If you seriously contend that the 6 cyl. E competes successfully with the LS, I have to question your objective detachment.
And that tired old isolation chamber crap just doesn't work vis a vis the E; a 540 sport unquestionably handles "better" for hard driving than an LS (and better by far than the E); but I have driven the E many times, and I am just not buying your suggestion that the E handles better than the LS. Especially in that underpowered 6 cyl. configuration. Slower, smaller, less luxurious, noisier, and much less for your dollar. (The E55 is another matter altogether).
I don't know why you and others can't grasp that the current E-Class was not designed to compete with the LS430. The LS430 is a S-Class caliber car. NOBODY IS COMPARING THE E WITH THE LS430. Nobody is saying the E is a better car. Again, not everybody wants the LS430 for many reasons, handling, styling, price etc. Whats tired to me is the quieter argument, when we're talking about a decibel or two at the most, yeah you can't hear yourself talk in the E due to the noise. Someone bought an E instead of an LS430, get over it.
M
"You think a E430 or E320 Sport doesn't handle better than a LS430?? Well guess what they do"
"[T]he E320 Sport would easily handle better due to less weight compared to the . . . LS430."
Hmmm . . . .
But we can agree that the "E-Class was not designed to compete with the LS430. The LS430 is a S-Class caliber car." That was my point.
M
Do the rear heated seats cover the seat back?
If you get an option with climate control seats, I guessing that you don't need heated seats? Also, I'm guessing the climate control seats cover the entire seat?
thanks in advance,