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Midsize Sedans 2.0

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    MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 241,337
    brian125 said:

    @Michael with your Accord test drive .

    Did you find yourself hitting your head when getting in / out of Accords new sloped roof line?

    Did you put the A/C / heat unit on high to see if it was loud / noisy.

    I did not hit my head getting in or out - and, I fully expected to.

    Did not put the A/C or heat on a high fan speed - didn't know this was a potential problem

    I may test drive the EX down the road - I'll try to remember those things.

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    2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2014 MINI Countryman S ALL4

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    brian125brian125 Member Posts: 5,244
    My 2013 model was a big improvement from previous years compressors.

    23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE

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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    Honda must be cranking out the new Accords. Just glanced at inventory at my local dealer, and down to 25 2017 models left, and showing 41 2018s. Don't think trying for premium prices is going to last very long (if it still is happening!)

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,311
    Some auto sales for Oct....

    Civic 30,319 +15% ytd 314,699

    Accord 26,740 +4.7%

    Camry 26,252 -11.2% ytd 308,759

    Corolla 23,177 -19%

    Sentra 18,341 +29.5%

    Altima 17,863 -12%

    Fusion 17,536 -6%

    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
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    benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,311
    edited November 2017
    Civic is pulling away from Camry at this point. Which will be the bestselling car for 2017? Look for Toyota to pile money on the hood of the new Camry. Sales seem to be faltering for the new Camry, perhaps because of the strange front-end styling?
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
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    benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,311
    edited November 2017
    More complete sales #s for midsize/full-size for Oct....

    Accord 26,740

    Camry 26,252

    Altima 17,863

    Fusion 17,536

    Malibu 14,647

    Sonata 7,595

    Optima 7,554

    Legacy 4,538

    Passat 3,937

    Mazda6 2,125

    Sales of the Passat and Mazda6 are collapsing....
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
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    benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,311
    edited November 2017
    More complete sales #s for compact/midsize for Oct....

    Civic 30,319

    Corolla 24,667

    Sentra 18,341

    Elantra 14,733

    Cruze 11,129

    Focus 10,095

    Forte 9,219

    Jetta 9,217

    Impreza 6,733

    Mazda3 4,534

    Mazda is again in trouble with its top-rated Mazda3, with sales declining 35% compared to last year.
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
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    benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,311
    Sales of the top midsize SUVs for Oct....

    Rav4 34,086 +34.1%

    Rogue 30,286 +43%

    CR-V 27,773 -4.7%

    Equinox 25,272 +28.5%

    Escape 23,064 -1.9%

    Cherokee 16,138 +19%

    Forester 13,430 -12.4%

    Compass 11,207 +81%
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
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    brian125brian125 Member Posts: 5,244
    edited November 2017
    @benjaminh nice job putting the sales numbers together......... some thoughts / predictions

    Camry with there odd front styling will be #1 or 2 for 2018

    At what point does Mazda pull the plug on there 6 ?

    The 2018 Equinox has potential to crack the top 3 w/ new look, updated Tech and Touchscreen

    The Malibu may pass the Fusions spot in 2018 out gunning them in sales.

    Deep discounts with the 18 Elantra should keep them a @3 or 4 in sales for 2018

    VW Passat is in trouble



    23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE

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    brian125brian125 Member Posts: 5,244
    What happen to Chrysler's 200 sedan ??

    23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE

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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    200 was discontinued.

    Passat and 6 way overdue for a remodel.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    brian125brian125 Member Posts: 5,244
    OMG.......... a moment of silence for the Chrysler 200 :disappointed:

    23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE

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    akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    brian125 said:

    OMG.......... a moment of silence for the Chrysler 200 :disappointed:

    The fact that most people don't know it's gone should tell you why it's gone....
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    brian125brian125 Member Posts: 5,244
    edited November 2017
    Akirby

    Speaking about gone..... how bout Volvo. All vehicles launched after 2019 will have a Electric motor / battery or Hybrid. Talk about coming out of the closet. Brave move.

    Big Oil will be throwing around a lot more dirty money to Congress / Car industries

    23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE

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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    brian125 said:

    OMG.......... a moment of silence for the Chrysler 200 :disappointed:

    No, that moment of silence already happened the day it was introduced. :p
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    berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    Wonder if buyers are cutting costs and going for the larger Civic instead of a midsized sedan? Maybe the Accord sales down the road will shed some light on it. Toyota design does seem a bit too far out there. Noticed Lexus and its front end has been experiencing sales declines. I suspect more conservative makeovers down the road for US/Canada Toyota and Lexus models. Asia may like the new design cues, but I don't think the western hemisphere is falling in love with it.
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    iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    Subaru Impreza sales are low to the flow.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

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    suydamsuydam Member Posts: 4,676
    I think the Civic IS a midsize Car now.
    '14 Buick Encore Convenience
    '17 Chevy Volt Premiere
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    brian125brian125 Member Posts: 5,244
    edited November 2017
    At almost 6'2 most midsizers and smaller Civic's, Corolla, Sentra, etc are not driving friendly for the big man. That was the main reason I got rid of my 13 Accord.

    I sat in a 18 Accord ( disappointed ) my head pretty much hit the pillar / window getting in and out.

    The new Lincoln Continental front seats are a dream. One of the Best driving seat I every sat in. I asked the dealer if he could make this seat in a lazy- boy and del. to my house.

    23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE

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    suydamsuydam Member Posts: 4,676
    I can certainly understand that concern. One of my sons is 6’3”. When he sat in a Malibu it looked like a toy car. He drives an Impala now. I do think the Civic has grown to be the size the Accord used to be, and that’s why the Civic is now the sweet spot for a lot of folks.
    '14 Buick Encore Convenience
    '17 Chevy Volt Premiere
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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    True on the civic. Pretty much same with the Elantra, or Jetta. Mid sized to me, and plenty big. Mama bear sized! Only thing that prevented me from really onsiderng the civic was I didn't like the seats in most models, and the high end model was a bit pricey and seat cushion still woefully short.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    brian125brian125 Member Posts: 5,244
    edited November 2017
    Stick, Congrats on your new Elantra. White is sharp looking on that model.

    First impressions yet with ride, handling, Mpg, quality of vehicle?

    23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE

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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    Only put about 25 miles on so far. But it looks darned snazzy in the garage! But so far, really impressed by the powertrain. Fast, quick response. Ride is sporty but sharp handling.

    Mpg so far looks good. Planning to take a little road trip Saturday as a shake down cruse.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    Great new rig, stick. The white does it well and it sounds like it snaps off the line pretty nicely. Sweet.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

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    MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 241,337
    stickguy said:

    Only put about 25 miles on so far. But it looks darned snazzy in the garage! But so far, really impressed by the powertrain. Fast, quick response. Ride is sporty but sharp handling.

    Mpg so far looks good. Planning to take a little road trip Saturday as a shake down cruse.

    Yeah, I figured most of the miles were put on from the drive home after you picked it up.

    Glad to hear you have good things to say.

    After some consideration, I may take another look at this when the time comes. As much as I like the Accord, I'm not sure how I feel about having to go to the EX trim level to get heated seats and satellite radio. :angry:

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    akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    I saw a Civic sedan today and thought that it was just as big as my 90 Accord sedan.
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    explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 19,323
    @Stickguy,
    Does the Elantra have a tire pressure readout?
    It's handy to have when you are evaluating ride and handling.
    The last couple of mid size rentals I had it and their natural ride was softer than my Fusion because the tires had good pressure.
    In an unfamiliar car, you may not be sure if the ride/handling is due to the tires or suspension.
    2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    yes it does. I scrolled through it once when I was out and all the tires were at 33-34. I didn't checked recommended but that seemed about what I would expect.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    sdasda Member Posts: 6,987
    Even after 4+yrs. and 72k I continue to be amazed by the mpg the Accord gets on trips. Just got back from a weekend trip to Knoxville, TN. That meant traveling up and down the mountain around Asheville, NC. The car is a good long distance traveler though I wish it was a tad quieter especially when driving over broken pavement. The lesser mpg show is my local city driving. The 39.8 was from Knoxville to my driveway, about 250 mi. The 39.1 is the complete trip summary.


    2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav

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    berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    There is a reason Honda does well in resale.
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    nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,437
    @sda

    Have you considered a different brand of tires when it comes time to replace? A set of Michelin MXM Pilot ZP (Zero Pressure) literally transformed my 2011 BMW 328xi when I replaced the stock run flat tires.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

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    tbirdmarcotbirdmarco Member Posts: 3,838
    @benjaminh nice job on compiling all of the sails numbers for Oct!
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    andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729
    Still getting subpar mileage out of the Optima on mostly highway driving. Sure, there's traffic, but it's got to be at least a 50/50 mix and 26 MPG is making me angry. Saw the sticker for the car again the other day and it says 39 for the highway based on EPA number reported by Kia. Someone's lying, or they put -40W-100 oil in it.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
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    andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729
    benjaminh said:

    More complete sales #s for midsize/full-size for Oct....

    Accord 26,740

    Camry 26,252

    Altima 17,863

    Fusion 17,536

    Malibu 14,647

    Sonata 7,595

    Optima 7,554

    Legacy 4,538

    Passat 3,937

    Mazda6 2,125

    Sales of the Passat and Mazda6 are collapsing....

    Both the Passat and Mazda 6 suffer the same problem in my opinion.

    Lackluster engines, with no option to upgrade (3.6 Passat very rare). Also, they both have slushy auto boxes if I recall correctly.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
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    andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729
    benjaminh said:

    More complete sales #s for compact/midsize for Oct....

    Civic 30,319

    Corolla 24,667

    Sentra 18,341

    Elantra 14,733

    Cruze 11,129

    Focus 10,095

    Forte 9,219

    Jetta 9,217

    Impreza 6,733

    Mazda3 4,534

    Mazda is again in trouble with its top-rated Mazda3, with sales declining 35% compared to last year.

    Could Mazda's sales decline be a lack of pricing incentives and dealerships not being willing to negotiate on price?
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    the 6 has one of the best performing ATs in the class. One of the best things about the car. Passat, like the Jetta, works OK but probably nothing special. just normal.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    edited November 2017
    It's your leadfoot, andres3, with your 2017 Kia Optima. How much does your Optima weigh? Come on! Ghastly mileage suffers with quicker accelerations per mile.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

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    andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729
    edited November 2017
    I give my lead foot a 3 MPG penalty or so. There's still a delta to be reckoned with. I honestly think if I'd have gone with the Accord Sport I'd be doing at least 2 MPG better, maybe 3.

    The Optima is said to be pretty light at about 3,200 pounds.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
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    iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    We'll, to me your 2017 Kia Optima looks twice as good as the Honda Accord of any model year. To me, advantage goes to Kia.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

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    wayne21wayne21 Member Posts: 259
    andres3 said:

    Still getting subpar mileage out of the Optima on mostly highway driving. Sure, there's traffic, but it's got to be at least a 50/50 mix and 26 MPG is making me angry. Saw the sticker for the car again the other day and it says 39 for the highway based on EPA number reported by Kia. Someone's lying, or they put -40W-100 oil in it.

    I have never owned a Kia, but I always get a rental when I travel and I request an optima. (I've gotten camrys, sonatas, altimas, optimas and even an accord - yes there are accord rentals.) I found the optima to be fun to drive and in mixed driving (70 hwy/30 town) I always get between 35 and 37 mpg. IF I were going to buy a midsized sedan it would be an optima.
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    iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    wayne21 - you have great taste in cars, man.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

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    sdasda Member Posts: 6,987
    Last Monday I visited a Honda dealer to test drive the '18 Accord EXL and Civic Touring. My thought is the Touring which is fully loaded and shares a variation of the same platform and engine as the Accord yet is about $3k cheaper might be a viable alternative. They only had a Civic EXT with Sensing. I also drove an Accord EX. Both are nice cars and drive well. The Civic has good room, felt very responsive, rode and handled well. Noise level was moderate and had a solid feel. The seat didn't fit me well, too much lumbar support which isn't adjustable. Perhaps with some fiddling I could find a comfortable position. The Accord was impressive yet not that much better than the Civic. It felt heavier and not as responsive yet was quieter and had a better ride, though not significantly so. Interior presentation was better and a notch better in quality. I don't care for the I pad looking audio. It seemed to be easy to use and the volume and selector knobs had a nice tactile feel. I need a more extensive drive to determine which one I'd choose but have surprised myself that at this point I give the Civic my nod. It just felt fun to drive and is an agreeable size.

    2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav

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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    I haven't seen the Accord yet, but your comments about the Civic agree with what I thought about it. The only aspect I did not like was the driver's seat.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    sdasda Member Posts: 6,987
    Locally and including my travels to Knoxville and back last weekend I have yet to see an '18 Accord in the wild. Hondas are very popular in our area so this surprises me. Are they selling? I've seen plenty of the '18 Camrys.

    2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav

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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    think I saw 1 Camry. If I saw an Accord, I didn't realize it. Though in passing it could resemble a Civic.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Drove my friends' brand-new 2017 Civic EX and tried out all the gadgetry. It's a pretty nice car for the money, and I must say fit and finish are top notch for the price range. I think Lane Watch would be particularly good for drivers who have to compete with bicycles on the street.
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    andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729
    wayne21 said:

    andres3 said:

    Still getting subpar mileage out of the Optima on mostly highway driving. Sure, there's traffic, but it's got to be at least a 50/50 mix and 26 MPG is making me angry. Saw the sticker for the car again the other day and it says 39 for the highway based on EPA number reported by Kia. Someone's lying, or they put -40W-100 oil in it.

    I have never owned a Kia, but I always get a rental when I travel and I request an optima. (I've gotten camrys, sonatas, altimas, optimas and even an accord - yes there are accord rentals.) I found the optima to be fun to drive and in mixed driving (70 hwy/30 town) I always get between 35 and 37 mpg. IF I were going to buy a midsized sedan it would be an optima.
    I'm getting 10 MPG less then that lately. If I was getting 35 MPG it would be a no-brainer. Maybe I've got a dud.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
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    iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    Lead foot, andres3. I'm tellin' ya.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

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    thebeanthebean Member Posts: 1,217
    I saw two 2018 Accords in the wild today. First ones I have seen here in Dallas area. Man, do they resemble the Civic. Only real clue other than the size is the tail lights. I guess they are a bit higher - wife's Civic is pretty low.
    2015 Honda Accord EX, 2019 Honda HR-V EX
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    stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,558
    2. Wow.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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