..."Ruking & Gagrice. Do your "thing" & tell me why I should buy a Volkswagen Jetta TDI Premium over a Honda Civic EX-L. #1 on my list is the Jettas 100 ft lb of torque advantage. Keep in mind I've got 3 other Hondas in my garage/driveway. My beloved 2001 Prelude Type SH (150K miles), my wife's 2011 Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation (42K miles), & my 160 CC lawn mower;)"...
Low hanging fruit would be to press your 2001 Prelude into commute service. It is an almost no brainer swag you own this outright and for a while. NO monthly payments are way cool, diesel or no diesel ! The corollary is it is also true when you outright own a diesel ! A spin off will probably be your insurance will be cheaper for a 12 year old car vs a 2013/2014 TDI. This is not even to mention not paying for another cars insurance. The consumables costs would increase ( OCI's, tires, brake pads and rotor replacement cycles,) but you would get that ANYWAY, new or used.
What are mpg figures for your Prelude and wife's 11 Honda Pilot.
the Leaf is definitely not a highway car. Although it drives great on the highway and will approach 100 mph for some reason, it depletes the battery SO FAST!
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
It seems the Passat Sedan TDI would be more comfortable and handle better than say an Accord. My last Accord experience (2 weeks rental) left me wondering why people buy them. I have lots of friends with Honda mini vans, SUVs and PU trucks. I just don't get it I guess. I can say from personal experience I would not consider the CR-V or Accord.
If you have time and like the sportier ride and handling. I would watch for the GTD to be sold here. We drove the Beetle TDI while our Touareg was getting the 20 day once over and wash. And it was a fun little car to drive. Roomier than they look from outside. Quiet and comfy relatively speaking. I doubt it is nearly as quiet as our Touareg at 70 MPH. Only the top of the line Lexus Sedan is quieter.
Just reading a MT 7 car comparison. The Accord was by far the noisiest at 70 MPH and WOT. Camry was the quietest. Still 67 db is far noisier than I would tolerate on long highway trip.
My Prelude was my DD for the 1st 9 years of its life. It is a 5-Speed manual & still drives like a car with less than 1/2 its age. I like driving it because I want to, not because I have to. I'm not trying to completely cheap out and not buy a new car. I'm just asking for your help about which new car to buy:) I actually joined fuelly about a month ago (I'm ctcarnut). I'll check later & get back to you.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Does Edmunds run noise tests? I can't seem to find their decibel readings at WOT and 70 MPH cruising. I would be curious how the Passat TDI matches up the the CamCord for noise.
I don't think your long term Passat has been through many mud puddles. Of course we have not had much rain in So CA this year.
Just occasionally; I see requests come in for that now and then on the help links but not sure how many people care. Other than Hondas, you don't see many complaints around the forums about noisy cars.
It's also a quiet ride. I'm not thrilled with the sealing properties of the driver door's weather stripping, which lets in more wind than I'd like (though it's not nearly as bad as the seals on our long-term GTI), but there's minimal noise from the tires.
That was exactly my complaint with the USA built GMC Hybrid PU truck. Is that an indictment on US workers? Maybe the VW workers would feel better as UAW workers, where building a solid car is not high on the list of priorities. If I heard wind noise from around the door seals, I would be getting rid of the car.
Thankfully my Touareg was built in the Porsche factory in Slovakia. Where fit and finish are extremely important.
I don't know why they even do WOT tests for noise. What matters is cruising noise. If one car makes a bit more than its competitor during WOT, but also has that little extra urge in your back when you give 'er, and also often equates to superior FE due to freer flowing intake and exhaust, then I say give the thing a break. We spend so little time at WOT, it is a pointless and moot spec.
Thankfully my Touareg was built in the Porsche factory in Slovakia. Where fit and finish are extremely important.
I would appreciate that too, but IMO, a superior design is one in which even less than enthusiastic assembly workers end up with a perfect-fit finished product every time. Idiot proof assemble-ability design if you will.
I don't know why they even do WOT tests for noise.
It does seem a bit worthless. For the record the worst WOT vehicles I have driven were 4 cylinder gas with CVT. And the Subaru I test drove was horribly noisy maintaining 55 MPH up a long grade. That was the only CVT vehicle I have driven and enough to turn me off on them.
I would appreciate that too, but IMO, a superior design is one in which even less than enthusiastic assembly workers end up with a perfect-fit finished product every time. Idiot proof assemble-ability design if you will.
That is very true. I just like to pull the UAW chain whenever the opportunity arises. I think poor design and cutting corners is a big factor. I have never heard any complaints on wind noise with the triple seal used by Buick. How much more would it cost to use better seals? The GMC seals kept falling off their tracks. I asked the service people if it would help to glue them in place. His response it will void the warranty. The odds on me EVER buying another GM product is Nil.
If I was getting one now (discounting what I now have) it would be the 13 Passat TDI.
If that is too big for your commute purposes, next in line would be the Golf TDI.
If you are ok with the so called "de contented" version, the Jetta TDI.
Be aware that the Passat seems to average better mpg than either Golf or Jetta.
While I LIKE the Honda Civic, I have to say that 4/4 drivers (house hold) would choose the Jetta TDI (when given the choice). 3/4 drivers HATE the Civic (when compared).
The Civic has been on many road trips ( R/T San Jose to Portland, San Jose to Seattle, San Jose to Los Angeles, San Jose to San Diego). It in no way compares to any TDI, other than both get you from point A to point B and return. It does post good mpg numbers, albeit lower speeds than the TDI's.
..."I just like to pull the UAW chain whenever the opportunity arises. I think poor design and cutting corners is a big factor. "...
Another factor which makes this SOS DD is the fact that the UAW have been bigger SHAREHOLDERS owners of GM, compliments of the US government giving them what, 17% ownership! So they have had shareholder and BOARD representation in addition to actually building the vehicles.
Carl Icahn the corporate shaker upper takes far smaller stakes and he is quite successful in shaking up the targeted corp company.
..."2011 Honda Pilot 2,119.5 miles tracked 7 fill ups 16.9 avg mpg"...
GEEZ 83% better mpg !!!! ????
Interesting when compared with the VW T TDI @ 31 mpg. Fuelly puts the VW T gasser in the same ball park as the HP.
So for example, we get 15 to 17 mpg on the SOS DD trip with the TLC's. (same ball park with the HP?) In truth it is not even a real comparison (even as I compare them) for in the last caravan trip, I was easily 20 mins ahead of both and we started FROM the same EXACT time and place. I hung back a lot to make sure the "herd" was doing ok. Thank technology for cell phones and walike talkies when closer.
More on point of what you asked, the 4 drivers get normally get a range of 38 to 44 mpg on the 09 Jetta TDI. The commute is a low of 40 to sometimes 44/45. So we can call it more like 41/42. (using your 23.1 as the comparison mpg) Further anomaly is the 6 speed DSG transmission. I would swag better mpg with a 6 speed MANUAL, but that is purely a swag@ 1 to 3 mpg better.
Something I've been curious about for some time now...given how aware you are of costs per mile, and also given that your family (the ones who put so many miles on the 2 TLCs, the Civic and JSW TDI) why do you keep not just one gasser TLC but TWO!?? between the pair of them, surely they could be replaced with a couple of other reliable, AWD capable (assuming the AWD capability is necessary?) vehicles that would literally pay for themselves over the years.
Or put another way...better still.. since I do assume that you have valid reasons for keeping BOTH TLCs going all this time, why haven't you (years ago) sourced a pair of 3.3 4 cyl diesel powertrains for them? The fuel savings alone surely would pay for that chore to find and swap? I say this not lightly and on the surface, the costs to purchase and re and re, actually would usually take a LONG time to make the numbers work, but I say this cuz you have indicated you plan to keep these two gas guzzlers going for 100's of thousands of miles still...and all the while, gas is just going to keep going up, which further supports biting that diesel engine swap.
UAW have been bigger SHAREHOLDERS owners of GM, compliments of the US government giving them what, 17% ownership! So they have had shareholder and BOARD representation in addition to actually building the vehicles.
Sounds like some other crappy car company out there whose name escapes me.
Oh yeah, Volkswagen. Why would anyone buy one of their cars? State of Saxony owns a bunch of it and the union sits on the board. Better run the other way.
Well the good news it is down from 5 The short term goal ( since we put a lot LESS miles on them) is now 6 more years or 25 years old. My swag is @ 25 years it will be another no brainer to 30 years old. Both have been on their own for 5 to 9 years and both LOVE no payments !! Pick a payment any payment x 60 to 108 months, not bad for savings?
From skimming I've done, it sounds like there's no clear leader between Powerstrokes, Cummins and Duramaxes. I'd probably go with the one that has the best USB interface on the dash.
The mileage you are getting with your barely broken in Toaureg is remarkable. However good mileage it gets, it still costs A LOT more than my wife's 2011 Pilot & it is NOT available with a 3rd row which we use quite often having 3 kids under the age of 7.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
The Honda's Pilot, MDX share the Odyssey's frame (the three models that I know of) . The Acura MDX is really a gussied up (upgraded/market, etc) Pilot version. Indeed the MDX costs more than the VW Touareg.
For my .02 cents a no brainer would be a Honda Pilot TDI.
A LOT more than my wife's 2011 Pilot & it is NOT available with a 3rd row which we use quite often having 3 kids under the age of 7.
That is the reason my Wife's grand daughter was so happy to get our Sequoia. They haul kids around a lot. They also visit family in Tahoe on a regular basis. They have a VW Sportswagen TDI that is too small for the family and they wanted the safety of 4X4 the Sequoia offered. So they will suffer with your wife at 15-17 MPG. I hope to get the Touareg up over 30 MPG with some trips we have planned. Just filled the Nissan Frontier and it cost 24.4 cents per mile. That was driving down and getting the cheap stuff at Costco at $3.77 a gallon. Last local fill up was 3.99 per gallon. That would kick the price up to 25.8 cents a mile. Right about $3 more to drive my PU to Costco than the Touareg.
As far as buying the Touareg. We decided leaving all the money to the kids was kind of foolish. Besides I needed a new toy. ;-)
I really like the new diesels, but in your position, and your history with Honda, I would definitely check out the upcoming 2014 Honda Accord hybrid. Close to 50 mpg combined. Edmunds has a review.
there are plenty of 2 door golf TDIs in new england! i remember the 1979 da-glo VW rabbits, including diesels, those were among the earliest, with 1980 being the first usa-built year.
I see a lot of TDI Jetta's, from the current and the last two generations, and totally agree with the 60/40 split you mentioned on the Golf.
I will just make it easy. I would say that 60/40 is about the right percentage line between all the models available as GAS or TDI. The TDI line enjoys a good reputation in the DC area, especially with the educated, international population. The TDI badge is known in many, many countries.
Again though with VW, the base warranty is 3/36, and VW has not yet shaken it's reputation for expensive repairs. I hear you guys say "Diesels last forever, and "shes just getting broken in at 100k".
Well, unfortunately, the rest of the car at 100k is still wearing like any other car, and expensive to keep up out of the warranty and free service period.
..."Again though with VW, the base warranty is 3/36, and VW has not yet shaken it's reputation for expensive repairs. I hear you guys say "Diesels last forever, and "shes just getting broken in at 100k".
Well, unfortunately, the rest of the car at 100k is still wearing like any other car, and expensive to keep up out of the warranty and free service period."...
I would agree that VW has not yet overcome its (US market) reputation for unreliability (truly a self inflicted GSW). However, I do have to say I have spent more on repairs for the 04Civic than I have the 03VW TDI Jetta for (LIKE MILES in my case 120,000 miles) This includes scheduled and unscheduled maintenance. This is true even as Honda (Civic) has the reputation as appliance like, and VW has the reputation as a DIY er or needs mechanical attention. Again this is WITH the assumption that ANY car (gasser or diesel, etc but you drew the gasser/diesel comparison) should be able to go 100,000 to 120,000 miles between major tune ups. Now I would prefer 200,000 to 240,000 miles but... I can dream......
LOL. Or the one with the biggest "Laramie Longhorn" or "Lariat" badge on the side. The new RAM's is shaped like a belt buckle and is as big as an I-PAD.
Well, unfortunately, the rest of the car at 100k is still wearing like any other car, and expensive to keep up out of the warranty and free service period.
That rang a bell with me. As I found parts for my 1978 Honda Accord to be extremely expensive compared to my Ford Escort back in the 1980s. So I looked up a common part that fails after a few years on many cars. The drivers window regulator. I went to PartsTrain.com for a look. A VW driver's side window regulator W/O motor is $100.95, Honda driver's side window regulator is $108.95.
Just a quick look for rebuilt VW and Honda engines looks like the Honda gasser may be more to have rebuilt than the VW TDI. Too many variables to be certain.
No. No variables. My Passat power window motor was $500, and the regulator was $220 at the dealer. Then it was $500 labor to put it in. This is an estimate from last December.
This is a common repair on the driver side. Now, I pulled a motor and regulator at the junkyard for my niece, who was crying over that estimate and needed the window functional to pass inspection.
This was the second motor for that window. My original one failed at 87k.
When you said not many people worried about noise in cars. That got me to thinking as that is a big thing when I am cruising down the Highway listening to Itzhak Perlman. Think about this:
Normal conversation at 3' 60-65dB
Which means if the outside noise coming into the vehicle is over 65 db you have to yell for the person next to you to hear. That is one of the tests that caught my eye on the diesel SUVs tested. The Touareg TDI 64 db at 70 MPH makes normal conversation pleasant. The new Lexus LS460 at 63 db imperceptibly better. However the Honda Accord at 69 db is noticeably worse. If all you listen to is Hip Hop and Rap Crap, no big deal I suppose.
Perceptions of Increases in Decibel Level Imperceptible Change 1dB Barely Perceptible Change 3dB Clearly Noticeable Change 5dB About Twice as Loud 10dB
Something to think about if your music tastes ever advance past Led Zeppelin and Metallica. ;-)
The only vehicle we have kept past the warranty is my Wife's 1990 LS400. When she was using the Lexus dealer for repairs it was outrageous. We found a very competent Lexus Indy shop and the prices went well below half the dealer prices. I would never take a vehicle to the dealer for repairs I have to pay for. Unless they matched the indy prices. I had to rebuild the engine in my Honda Accord at 68k miles so I am no fan of Honda. Had cooling problems from day one. And the dealer was not able to fix it. If you are going to keep any vehicle past warranty do some research and find a good independent shop. Or sell it before the warranty runs out.
They are now up to 23 mpg hwy for a full size with a 2014 V8. Beats Ford Ecoboost V6 in mpgs. No info out there yet on the all alum redone 4.3 V6 with 295 HP.
My ears ring so I don't like it too quiet. I got stuck on hold with a doc's office today playing some "Top 40" classical stuff and thought I was going to have to hang up and cancel my appointment by email. :-)
My ears ring but low frequency noise is the worst for me. Nothing pushes me to road rage like those idiots with that 150 db Boom Boom crap polluting the entire neighborhood. Where are the donut munchers when that happens?
Amazingly the low diesel rumble at idle is just about below my level of tinnitus. Once it warms up nearly impossible to hear in or out of the vehicle. The screaming of a little 4 banger gasser trying to keep up with traffic is just plain annoying.
The 2014 Ram V6 with 305 HP is rated 17 city/ 25 highway with the new 8 speed transmission. Ram is claiming the Eco Diesel will get 30 MPG highway. With towing equal to the V8 Hemi. Should be the truck to beat next year.
That H EPA of 30 mpg for a so called "light truck" is really a game changer, whether gasser or diesel !
If a gasser could do it, believe me, (just on diesel implementation $$'s dollar savings alone) they would have brought it to market. Of course the "Torque Flight" is the ZF licensed 8 speed A/T, a competitor to the Aisin 8 speed A/T.
Perhaps you and I are of the age group where (to me anyway) Torque Flight tm brings less than sterling memories. Obviously the group is probably NOT the target market?
Now if the Nissan/Cummins TDI 8 cylinder PU truck can get close to, at or even slightly above 30 mpg, you will have a real horse race here. It would also be a real game changer for an 8 cylinder to get 30 mpg, EPA H! Not to even mention 550 # ft of torque !? I did not get a sense of what A/T it is mated to. But anything less than a ROBUST 8 speed would be a strategic mistake.
I see the Nissan/Cummins going the wrong direction. A Nissan Frontier with a MB 2.1L twin-turbo diesel inline-4 engine would be ideal. And offer well over 30 MPG for 90% of PU needs. 200 HP and 369 ft lbs of torque is plenty for a PU that is as big as most people need for a work truck. My Frontier V6 only has 281 ft lbs of torque and rated to tow 6500 lbs. I rarely get over 17 MPG. Potentially it would double the mileage. It would put me in line to trade up.
I am not real sure why the small truck segment is not being nurtured /expanded. IF I had to guess, without further research, it would seem there is too much cost and not enough profit demographic to supports its continuance. It almost seems like yesterday Toyota closed the Fremont, CA plant (now Tesla) that among others, made the Tacoma (small truck) AND for the CA market !! ?? I would agree with your logic, IF I wanted/needed a truck. I have read that not only did the Tacoma have high resale value but was pretty bulletproof.
But it would seem that Nissan wants to slug it out with FORD, GM, Chrysler in the bigger honker segment (aka "light truck" segment). To a lesser extent CUMMINS DIESEL has at least some say in the matter, as I am sure reputations and capital are also at stake.
Nowadays? Plugs. Thats about it. What else on modern gas engines? Tranny/transaxle oil change at 100k.... Buy an engine with a chain, not a belt......save cash there. I wonder if the new diesels need injectors at service intervals as the older ones did. I know I still have to do injectors at regular intervals on the CAT engines I run. Even the remans are not cheap.
The Civic's plugs were VERY expensive ($40?), but I was careful to get the oem recommended ones. It also required a TB/water pump change (120,000 miles). This took longer and cost more than the TDI's. Valve adjustments are required. Tune up done. Then required antifreeze and thermostat change. Transmission fluid change required. Add to that the front brake pads and rotors needed changing. Then the normal air/cabin filters and 20,000 miles OCI. Oh and the Honda's alignment tends to wander. So was I unhappy? Absolutely not. I knew this before I bought the thing. But yes it did cost considerably more than the TDI's. Now if I had taken it to the local Honda dealer, it would have been way more than considerably more on the TDI. But this area has access to an excellent Indy shop. T
Wonder not about the TDI injectors @ service time: NO.
Comments
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
I am sure the transportation portion threads through EVERY category.
Low hanging fruit would be to press your 2001 Prelude into commute service. It is an almost no brainer swag you own this outright and for a while. NO monthly payments are way cool, diesel or no diesel ! The corollary is it is also true when you outright own a diesel !
What are mpg figures for your Prelude and wife's 11 Honda Pilot.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
If you have time and like the sportier ride and handling. I would watch for the GTD to be sold here. We drove the Beetle TDI while our Touareg was getting the 20 day once over and wash. And it was a fun little car to drive. Roomier than they look from outside. Quiet and comfy relatively speaking. I doubt it is nearly as quiet as our Touareg at 70 MPH. Only the top of the line Lexus Sedan is quieter.
Just reading a MT 7 car comparison. The Accord was by far the noisiest at 70 MPH and WOT. Camry was the quietest. Still 67 db is far noisier than I would tolerate on long highway trip.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
2013 Volkswagen Passat TDI: A Look Underneath
I don't think your long term Passat has been through many mud puddles. Of course we have not had much rain in So CA this year.
It's also a quiet ride. I'm not thrilled with the sealing properties of the driver door's weather stripping, which lets in more wind than I'd like (though it's not nearly as bad as the seals on our long-term GTI), but there's minimal noise from the tires.
That was exactly my complaint with the USA built GMC Hybrid PU truck. Is that an indictment on US workers? Maybe the VW workers would feel better as UAW workers, where building a solid car is not high on the list of priorities. If I heard wind noise from around the door seals, I would be getting rid of the car.
Thankfully my Touareg was built in the Porsche factory in Slovakia. Where fit and finish are extremely important.
I would appreciate that too, but IMO, a superior design is one in which even less than enthusiastic assembly workers end up with a perfect-fit finished product every time. Idiot proof assemble-ability design if you will.
It does seem a bit worthless. For the record the worst WOT vehicles I have driven were 4 cylinder gas with CVT. And the Subaru I test drove was horribly noisy maintaining 55 MPH up a long grade. That was the only CVT vehicle I have driven and enough to turn me off on them.
I would appreciate that too, but IMO, a superior design is one in which even less than enthusiastic assembly workers end up with a perfect-fit finished product every time. Idiot proof assemble-ability design if you will.
That is very true. I just like to pull the UAW chain whenever the opportunity arises. I think poor design and cutting corners is a big factor. I have never heard any complaints on wind noise with the triple seal used by Buick. How much more would it cost to use better seals? The GMC seals kept falling off their tracks. I asked the service people if it would help to glue them in place. His response it will void the warranty. The odds on me EVER buying another GM product is Nil.
If that is too big for your commute purposes, next in line would be the Golf TDI.
If you are ok with the so called "de contented" version, the Jetta TDI.
Be aware that the Passat seems to average better mpg than either Golf or Jetta.
While I LIKE the Honda Civic, I have to say that 4/4 drivers (house hold) would choose the Jetta TDI (when given the choice). 3/4 drivers HATE the Civic (when compared).
The Civic has been on many road trips ( R/T San Jose to Portland, San Jose to Seattle, San Jose to Los Angeles, San Jose to San Diego). It in no way compares to any TDI, other than both get you from point A to point B and return. It does post good mpg numbers, albeit lower speeds than the TDI's.
Another factor which makes this SOS DD is the fact that the UAW have been bigger SHAREHOLDERS owners of GM, compliments of the US government giving them what, 17% ownership! So they have had shareholder and BOARD representation in addition to actually building the vehicles.
Carl Icahn the corporate shaker upper takes far smaller stakes and he is quite successful in shaking up the targeted corp company.
2011 BMW 328xi
1,596.6 miles tracked
5 fill ups
20.4 avg mpg
$.205 cost per mile
2011 Honda Pilot
2,119.5 miles tracked
7 fill ups
16.9 avg mpg
$.228 cost per mile
2001 Honda Prelude
280.4 miles tracked
1 fill up
23.1 mpg
$.178 cost per mile
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
2,119.5 miles tracked
7 fill ups
16.9 avg mpg"...
GEEZ 83% better mpg !!!! ????
Interesting when compared with the VW T TDI @ 31 mpg. Fuelly puts the VW T gasser in the same ball park as the HP.
So for example, we get 15 to 17 mpg on the SOS DD trip with the TLC's. (same ball park with the HP?) In truth it is not even a real comparison (even as I compare them) for in the last caravan trip, I was easily 20 mins ahead of both and we started FROM the same EXACT time and place. I hung back a lot to make sure the "herd" was doing ok.
More on point of what you asked, the 4 drivers get normally get a range of 38 to 44 mpg on the 09 Jetta TDI. The commute is a low of 40 to sometimes 44/45. So we can call it more like 41/42. (using your 23.1 as the comparison mpg) Further anomaly is the 6 speed DSG transmission. I would swag better mpg with a 6 speed MANUAL, but that is purely a swag@ 1 to 3 mpg better.
Or put another way...better still.. since I do assume that you have valid reasons for keeping BOTH TLCs going all this time, why haven't you (years ago) sourced a pair of 3.3 4 cyl diesel powertrains for them? The fuel savings alone surely would pay for that chore to find and swap? I say this not lightly and on the surface, the costs to purchase and re and re, actually would usually take a LONG time to make the numbers work, but I say this cuz you have indicated you plan to keep these two gas guzzlers going for 100's of thousands of miles still...and all the while, gas is just going to keep going up, which further supports biting that diesel engine swap.
Sounds like some other crappy car company out there whose name escapes me.
Oh yeah, Volkswagen. Why would anyone buy one of their cars? State of Saxony owns a bunch of it and the union sits on the board. Better run the other way.
But we digress. :shades:
Jetta TDI Premium - $25,955 + destination
Passat TDI SE w/ Sunroof - $28,295 + destination
Golf TDI w/ Sunroof & Naviagtion - $27,995
All cars equipped with 6 Speed DSG
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
I posted my first two fill ups on Fuelly 1076 miles tracked.
$4.05 Avg. Price/Gallon
$86.46 Avg. Price/Fuel-up
$0.161 Avg. Price/Mile
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
For my .02 cents a no brainer would be a Honda Pilot TDI.
That is the reason my Wife's grand daughter was so happy to get our Sequoia. They haul kids around a lot. They also visit family in Tahoe on a regular basis. They have a VW Sportswagen TDI that is too small for the family and they wanted the safety of 4X4 the Sequoia offered. So they will suffer with your wife at 15-17 MPG. I hope to get the Touareg up over 30 MPG with some trips we have planned. Just filled the Nissan Frontier and it cost 24.4 cents per mile. That was driving down and getting the cheap stuff at Costco at $3.77 a gallon. Last local fill up was 3.99 per gallon. That would kick the price up to 25.8 cents a mile. Right about $3 more to drive my PU to Costco than the Touareg.
As far as buying the Touareg. We decided leaving all the money to the kids was kind of foolish. Besides I needed a new toy. ;-)
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
i remember the 1979 da-glo VW rabbits, including diesels, those were among the earliest, with 1980 being the first usa-built year.
I will just make it easy. I would say that 60/40 is about the right percentage line between all the models available as GAS or TDI. The TDI line enjoys a good reputation in the DC area, especially with the educated, international population. The TDI badge is known in many, many countries.
Again though with VW, the base warranty is 3/36, and VW has not yet shaken it's reputation for expensive repairs. I hear you guys say "Diesels last forever, and "shes just getting broken in at 100k".
Well, unfortunately, the rest of the car at 100k is still wearing like any other car, and expensive to keep up out of the warranty and free service period.
Well, unfortunately, the rest of the car at 100k is still wearing like any other car, and expensive to keep up out of the warranty and free service period."...
I would agree that VW has not yet overcome its (US market) reputation for unreliability (truly a self inflicted GSW). However, I do have to say I have spent more on repairs for the 04Civic than I have the 03VW TDI Jetta for (LIKE MILES in my case 120,000 miles) This includes scheduled and unscheduled maintenance. This is true even as Honda (Civic) has the reputation as appliance like, and VW has the reputation as a DIY er or needs mechanical attention. Again this is WITH the assumption that ANY car (gasser or diesel, etc but you drew the gasser/diesel comparison) should be able to go 100,000 to 120,000 miles between major tune ups. Now I would prefer 200,000 to 240,000 miles but... I can dream......
http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2013/04/2013-ram-1500-laramie-longhorn-editio- - n-gorgeous-or-gaudy.html
I'm sorry man, but if I really wanted a mount with that much leather and expense to own, I'd buy my daughter a horse.
-but..... then I would surely need a trailer and a RAM truck to tow it! It's a Paradox!!!! Noooooooo!
That rang a bell with me. As I found parts for my 1978 Honda Accord to be extremely expensive compared to my Ford Escort back in the 1980s. So I looked up a common part that fails after a few years on many cars. The drivers window regulator. I went to PartsTrain.com for a look. A VW driver's side window regulator W/O motor is $100.95, Honda driver's side window regulator is $108.95.
Just a quick look for rebuilt VW and Honda engines looks like the Honda gasser may be more to have rebuilt than the VW TDI. Too many variables to be certain.
This is a common repair on the driver side. Now, I pulled a motor and regulator at the junkyard for my niece, who was crying over that estimate and needed the window functional to pass inspection.
This was the second motor for that window. My original one failed at 87k.
Normal conversation at 3' 60-65dB
Which means if the outside noise coming into the vehicle is over 65 db you have to yell for the person next to you to hear. That is one of the tests that caught my eye on the diesel SUVs tested. The Touareg TDI 64 db at 70 MPH makes normal conversation pleasant. The new Lexus LS460 at 63 db imperceptibly better. However the Honda Accord at 69 db is noticeably worse. If all you listen to is Hip Hop and Rap Crap, no big deal I suppose.
Perceptions of Increases in Decibel Level
Imperceptible Change 1dB
Barely Perceptible Change 3dB
Clearly Noticeable Change 5dB
About Twice as Loud 10dB
Something to think about if your music tastes ever advance past Led Zeppelin and Metallica. ;-)
My ears ring so I don't like it too quiet. I got stuck on hold with a doc's office today playing some "Top 40" classical stuff and thought I was going to have to hang up and cancel my appointment by email. :-)
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Amazingly the low diesel rumble at idle is just about below my level of tinnitus. Once it warms up nearly impossible to hear in or out of the vehicle. The screaming of a little 4 banger gasser trying to keep up with traffic is just plain annoying.
http://www.examiner.com/slideshow/2014-ram-1500-to-reach-for-30-mpg-with-new-eco- diesel-power-train#slide=4
If a gasser could do it, believe me, (just on diesel implementation $$'s dollar savings alone) they would have brought it to market. Of course the "Torque Flight" is the ZF licensed 8 speed A/T, a competitor to the Aisin 8 speed A/T.
Perhaps you and I are of the age group where (to me anyway) Torque Flight tm brings less than sterling memories.
Now if the Nissan/Cummins TDI 8 cylinder PU truck can get close to, at or even slightly above 30 mpg, you will have a real horse race here. It would also be a real game changer for an 8 cylinder to get 30 mpg, EPA H! Not to even mention 550 # ft of torque !? I did not get a sense of what A/T it is mated to. But anything less than a ROBUST 8 speed would be a strategic mistake.
But it would seem that Nissan wants to slug it out with FORD, GM, Chrysler in the bigger honker segment (aka "light truck" segment). To a lesser extent CUMMINS DIESEL has at least some say in the matter, as I am sure reputations and capital are also at stake.
Tranny/transaxle oil change at 100k....
Buy an engine with a chain, not a belt......save cash there.
I wonder if the new diesels need injectors at service intervals as the older ones did. I know I still have to do injectors at regular intervals on the CAT engines I run. Even the remans are not cheap.
The Civic's plugs were VERY expensive ($40?), but I was careful to get the oem recommended ones. It also required a TB/water pump change (120,000 miles). This took longer and cost more than the TDI's. Valve adjustments are required. Tune up done. Then required antifreeze and thermostat change. Transmission fluid change required. Add to that the front brake pads and rotors needed changing. Then the normal air/cabin filters and 20,000 miles OCI. Oh and the Honda's alignment tends to wander. So was I unhappy? Absolutely not. I knew this before I bought the thing. But yes it did cost considerably more than the TDI's. Now if I had taken it to the local Honda dealer, it would have been way more than considerably more on the TDI. But this area has access to an excellent Indy shop. T
Wonder not about the TDI injectors @ service time: NO.