What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

ruking1

Chicken little day in the crude oil prices, currently @ $81.36 BOE !!!

SLOW SLOW SLOW drop in RUG/PUG/D2 prices @ the pump !!!!

Enviro con phony narratives are being CRUSHED !!! Not too much talk from the Iranians about sinking a tanker ship in the Straits of Hormus (LOL, aka blocking tankers filled with CRUDE oil from getting to market )

The good news will be operating D2 products will be less per mile driven (over like models) once @ the pump prices CRASH.

Mr_Shiftright

I think US and Saudi Arabia are depressing the price of oil (with a glut) to put the squeeze on Iran and Russia, which will both suffer budget shortfalls as a result. .

ruking1

Mr_Shiftright said:

I think US and Saudi Arabia are depressing the price of oil (with a glut) to put the squeeze on Iran and Russia, which will both suffer budget shortfalls as a result. .

SA has gone on record saying it needs $50. per BOE to comfortably operate its KINGDOM's policies. The US also HATES its (own) domestic oil industry, so a couple of birds with less stones. IF @ the pump prices are artificially held high, then a lot more money is MADE during the process of the chicken little scenarios.

xwesx

As far as pump prices, demand doesn't vary much with a change in price, so that inelasticity means the suppliers have absolutely no reason to drop the prices significantly. This represents a highly profitable time for them to offset those "leaner" moments when the crude price is rising and there's public opinion pressures to not dramatically raise prices.

Mr_Shiftright

The oil industry can do whatever it wants of course, but slowdowns in Asian economies, coupled with increased US production and export, and the Saudi disinclination to cut back production, all points to the reason why crude oil prices have dropped. It's almost as if we are subsidizing the Iran/Russia sanctions via a money slot at the gas pump.

ruking1

Mr_Shiftright said:

The oil industry can do whatever it wants of course, but slowdowns in Asian economies, coupled with increased US production and export, and the Saudi disinclination to cut back production, all points to the reason why crude oil prices have dropped. It's almost as if we are subsidizing the Iran/Russia sanctions via a money slot at the gas pump.

Not to swell your head, but you are 100% CORRECT !!!

The "FREEZE FRAME" of US market prices: even as logically and from a free market perspective should CRASH, are so PROFITS by government/s mainly and oil food chain WAY secondarily will make WAY more. So it is truly a (hidden) tax. So we are to be happy with a $.30 cent per gal drop by XMAS!!!

So slow news diesel day filled for 30 mpg @$3.89.

RUG @$3.49 PUG @$3.69

stever

Cheapest diesel here is $3.29. (Paid $2.77 for regular myself)

Cruised around quite a bit today and saw no stinkers.

xwesx

stever said:

Cheapest diesel here is $3.29. (Paid $2.77 for regular myself)

I'm downright shocked by those prices! A FULL dollar lower than here on all fronts!

gagrice

Glad to see all are here and accounted for. My Touareg TDI is headed in for the 20k mile service this month. Just put 2600 miles going to Oregon. Interesting on diesel prices the cheap Safeway and Shell stations are selling B20. I was tempted. Just do not want to void my warranty. Best price was Union 76 in Roseburg, paid $3.49 on the CC. Only had to fill 4 times in 2600 miles. Overall average in the 28 MPG range. Have to fill to get a true average. Lots of mountain driving up to 7800 elevation at Crater lake. Several passes going to coast and back. Best tank was 682 miles on 23.4 gallons. I have got to learn to keep my foot out of it passing on those backroads we travel. I cannot imagine kicking it up to 95 MPH does not use some fuel. I love the torque that gives you the opportunity to blow most vehicles off the road.

PS
Had a very nice visit with SLorenzen and his lovely wife while in Oregon. Look forward to spending time with them on our next trip.

slorenzen

Gary,

It was really nice to meet you face to face last week! We will also look forward to seeing you and your bride once again.

BTW: My daughter FINALLY had her baby on the 15th. As she was at least a week overdue, this one was a WHOPPER!

10 lbs., 2oz.

gagrice

slorenzen said:

Gary,

It was really nice to meet you face to face last week! We will also look forward to seeing you and your bride once again.

BTW: My daughter FINALLY had her baby on the 15th. As she was at least a week overdue, this one was a WHOPPER!

10 lbs., 2oz.

That is a great big one that did not get away. Congratulations! We really enjoyed our time in Cottage Grove, such a nice little town. I think I can get my wife to consider a move to Oregon.

The Touareg was flawless the entire 2600+ miles we traveled. Have not filled since we got home so not sure of the overall mileage. About 28 MPG.

ruking1

Congradulations are in order to the new grandparents !

I am alo glad that Gagrice had a good trip up yonder in the Pacific Northwest ! Sounds like you and the Mrs. are enjoying the Touareg.

Filled @ a Chevron in Irvine, CA for $3.39 with Vons .20 per gal discount for 15.9 gal, 529 miles.

Interstate 5 was done about the speeds mentioned by Gagrice. We ran the slow lane (50 miles or more of 183 miles leg, 80-90 mph) with a CHP in the fast lane that we could not keep pace with. We finally past him when he decided to head back the opposite way on patrol. The altitude was app 4200 ft later @ the grapevine. The normal rolling parking lot was the LA area traffic. Weather was gorgeous !

xwesx

Congrats on the new grandchild, slorenzen! I hope you didn't buy any newborn outfits!

slorenzen

xwesx said:

Congrats on the new grandchild, slorenzen! I hope you didn't buy any newborn outfits!

She doesn't fit newborn!

They are using size 1 diapers and outfits from the start!

houdini1

Congrats slorenzen ! I remember when our first son was born back in 1968, we would buy the large size disposable diapers and cut them in half ! Yes, we were very poor !

ruking1

ruking1 said:

Congradulations are in order to the new grandparents !

I am alo glad that Gagrice had a good trip up yonder in the Pacific Northwest ! Sounds like you and the Mrs. are enjoying the Touareg.

Filled @ a Chevron in Irvine, CA for $3.39 with Vons .20 per gal discount for 15.9 gal, 529 miles.

Interstate 5 was done about the speeds mentioned by Gagrice. We ran the slow lane (50 miles or more of 183 miles leg, 80-90 mph) with a CHP in the fast lane that we could not keep pace with. We finally past him when he decided to head back the opposite way on patrol. The altitude was app 4200 ft later @ the grapevine. The normal rolling parking lot was the LA area traffic. Weather was gorgeous !

The return mileage 505/15.3 gal, with the low fuel lamp going off. Traffic was pretty light in all return directions, by way of Highway 101. Weather was absolutely gorgeous.

xwesx

Which one did you take, ruking? The Touareg or the GLK250?

ruking1

The 14 MB GLK 250 B/T was taken. So the average of 2 tankfuls was 33.14 mpg. (H EPA 33) Given the range of conditions, speeds and how I drove, I am not unhappy with this mpg (average) result. Could the mpg have been significantly better/worse? YES !!

I am merely surmising, but IF it had been a GASSER under the exact same scenario, (14 MB GLK 350) I probably would have been happy posting 20/23 mpg and fueling 3 to 4 times instead of 2 !! ?? We also didn't have any in transit phone meettings.

xwesx

Nice! I ask because I am seriously considering getting one of those. My wife thinks I've lost it, and I probably have... LOL

ruking1

xwesx said:

Nice! I ask because I am seriously considering getting one of those. My wife thinks I've lost it, and I probably have... LOL

The wife likes both. (she is NOT a "car" person) I think she would prefer the compact CUV, IF she were to drive it on a daily basis. We had 5 folks in it for a pretty short trip for lunch. I almost had to apologize to a 6 ft 4 passenger for how tight it was for him in the front seat. She and our daughter took it for a lot of trips to local shopping malls and LA LA LAND's traffic . To me, the GLK 250 B/T handles closer to a tall sports car. When she's a passenger (to and from the mountains) , for sure I am guessing the Touareg

On the other hand, a 6 ft 2 relative is happy as a clam in the rear of the Touareg TDI and for up to a 3/4 hour trek.

stever

There's a story in the WSJ today that says that "Ford Motor Co. spent five years and some $3 billion developing a lighter-weight version of its F-150 pickup that burns less fuel. And that’s the problem: gasoline prices have plummeted 15% in the last four months as it geared up to sell the new model."

Diesel has gotten cheaper too but I haven't seen the big drops there like I have with gas.

If the trend continues (and if the cheap gas just isn't a temporary way to hammer Putin's economy), then why spend more to buy a Ford when the Dodge/Chevy is cheaper and will only save a few bucks in gas?

That argument cuts into diesel sales too, leaving torque or towing capacity as the main drivers to switch from a gasser.

Fleet CAFE requirements could be the saving grace.

xwesx

I read quite a bit about the new truck, and it is truly impressive how much technology went into this new generation. It almost inspires me to buy one, except that I would still have a gasoline-powered vehicle, and that's just not where I want to go.

Take this technology, offer it in both the V6 Ecoboost and diesel formats. Forget the traditional gas guzzlers. Coup de grâce!

As far as the GLK250/Toureg, the real factor is FE vs. space needs. Toureg = Forester fuel economy but with more space. GLK250 = *nearly as good as* Fiesta fuel economy but with Forester space. Cost is pretty much a wash between the two. So, since the Forester space is plentiful and entirely adequate, I'm leaning toward that size with the FE bump. Of course, I could go with a FWD TDI wagon, but the difference in ride height, comfort, etc., just tugs at me. Is that I'm getting old (no offense intended to anyone!)?

ruking1

To me, FORD did not go far enough. But I am hardly a customer, even WITH the points I am making.

Drop a diesel engine (one advantage better mpg) in a F150 (can it cost 3 billion?) and lose even more weight. There are two nexus' here but weight is a +/- 1 mpg per 100 #'s as a general rule.

I think this gave the RAM diesel a HUGE and significant competitive advantage. This also extends the time that RAM can switch to lighter weights, IF that is in the cards. I read an article that it cost FORD $600. per vehicle to lighten. What was seldom advertised was they charged app $5,000 more. Needless to say most diesel folks did not spend this much more?

So for another example, one 3.0 L diesel engine vs 4 gassers??? (6.2L, 5.0 L 3.7 L, 3.5L TT)

Unless the business killing and costlier CAFE standards are rescinded, shorter term considerations such as falling fuel prices are really "consumer" stimulates. This is in line with the .01 cent +/- = $ 1 billion. As such in the context of CAFE standards, they are merely distractions, however desirable.

Let me give one OLD but NEW example, the 03 VW Jetta TDI. For 12 MY's, that has easily gotten and still gets 48 to 52 mpg. They literally HATED it then. Yet the CAFE standards ( going forward even then) are designed to get MORE of higher mpg vehicles in product lines by 2025?

Another example is the cost per mile driven (CPMD) has gone from .037 cents (50 mpg) to .0788 ($3.89 per gal) 213% / 12 my's or 18% increase per year. (principle here: using WAY less that costs WAY MORE???)

Now are there ANY reasonable expectations that when cars with high fuel mileages are more available that fuel prices will be CHEAPER??? i.e., $1.85 per gal ??? While it would be dream, I would be delusional to expect that. The truth is also no matter WHAT energy source is used, the costs will be equivalently HIGHER and pretty close to equal.

ruking1

xwesx said:

I read quite a bit about the new truck, and it is truly impressive how much technology went into this new generation. It almost inspires me to buy one, except that I would still have a gasoline-powered vehicle, and that's just not where I want to go.

Take this technology, offer it in both the V6 Ecoboost and diesel formats. Forget the traditional gas guzzlers. Coup de grâce!

As far as the GLK250/Toureg, the real factor is FE vs. space needs. Toureg = Forester fuel economy but with more space. GLK250 = *nearly as good as* Fiesta fuel economy but with Forester space. Cost is pretty much a wash between the two. So, since the Forester space is plentiful and entirely adequate, I'm leaning toward that size with the FE bump. Of course, I could go with a FWD TDI wagon, but the difference in ride height, comfort, etc., just tugs at me. Is that I'm getting old (no offense intended to anyone!)?

I would just spend more time in any to all that you are considering, especially since you are in no rush. Any to almost all local dealers were helpful in multiple test rides, FYI, deals, etc. and in many cases over night test drives. This went across almost all makes (that I was interested in) Honda's, Toyota's , Audi, VW's, MB's, Lexus, BMW's, etc. I had been doing that for @ least 2 my's or more in the case of the GLK 250 B/T. In fact the MB dealer's GM had a hand in selling me a 04 Honda Civic that a family member still has.

xwesx

ruking1 said:

Unless the business killing and costlier CAFE standards are rescinded, shorter term considerations such as falling fuel prices are really "consumer" stimulates. This is in line with the .01 cent +/- = $ 1 billion. As such in the context of CAFE standards, they are merely distractions, however desirable.

Exactly. Disappointing timing, perhaps, to mottle the new F150's release which, no doubt, touts improved fuel economy among other things, but they should be focused 100% on the longer term.

I just don't see how no diesel is a viable option in that continuum.

xwesx

ruking1 said:

I would just spend more time in any to all that you are considering, especially since you are in no rush.

Good advice, and I'll definitely do that. Unfortunately, these marques do not currently have local sales dealerships, so will have to time such test drives in concert with trips south (Anchorage). That's entirely doable, though, and the Anchorage dealers generally have a rather copious inventory....

ruking1

Much is made about the fuel efficiency B/E. It goes without saying that Individual figures will vary.

Here is one (of probably MANY) nifty calculator, by Yahoo finance lifestyle. http://finance.yahoo.com/calculator/lifestyle/aut04/

Using the MB 350/250 BT as an example, the cost differences (MINUS- 500 MSRP) makes the fuel cost savings (app 54 miles per day= $1,650/12= $138 per mo) realizable in the first year.

So if I keep it 10 years (same mileage) cumulative savings of $16,500 projected (BUT probably more given the normal projected YEARLY increases, for app 142,560 miles)

xwesx

Trying to explain that to people generally falls on deaf ears. That calculator lays it out in black-and-white, though, so it's harder to deny! Well, okay, so they use pretty colors....

The reason to buy a new car is *never* justified by way of fuel economy alone.

ruking1

xwesx said:

Trying to explain that to people generally falls on deaf ears. That calculator lays it out in black-and-white, though, so it's harder to deny! Well, okay, so they use pretty colors....

The reason to buy a new car is *never* justified by way of fuel economy alone.

I took the "risk" of linking a calculator that illustrates what I have said normally. The idea was that most on this board can be a bit more thoughtful about the subject. Of course, what anyone may decide would be what they... MAY decide. The gasser to diesel percentages are 95% GASSER and less than 5% diesels. (passenger vehicle fleet diesels) I have also read that gas/hybrids are now app a tad less than 2% of the total PVF (265.6 M)

Again, not to glaze anyone's eyes over with the math, but that is app 13.28 M diesels with 50% passenger cars or 6.641 M diesel CARS. or app 2.5%.

in my case on the B/E alone, I would have to ask the question what (like model) gasser, gasser hybrid, electric, etc., would prompt me to move from 31, 35, 40, 50 mpg diesels. ???? A quick and dirty look would indicate (LIKE MODEL) GASSER, etc of 62, 70, 80, 100 mpg !! These are TALL orders indeed !! ??

So even with the advent in 2025 ( 10 years, CAFE) standard of 54.5 mpg, of those like model diesels, GASSERS @ that time would not likely offer no real incentive/s

Here is "on the other hand" POV.

"Buy The Used BMW, Not The New Honda"

http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/buy-the-used-bmw-not-the-new-honda-1648995594

aka, get the USED diesel. (coincidently, diesel engines are nicely broken in @ app 30,000 to 50,000 miles)

Back story would be, now the board knows why I got the NEW 04 Honda (for the 2nd AND 3rd 100,000 and UP mileage) !!!

stever

If you ask me CAFE standards have already been watered down too much. We get "concept" cars that only exist to hammer the curve instead of real fleet gains. Diesel fans should be the ones complaining about that the most, if you want more choice in the marketplace. Otherwise you're just gonna get more range anxiety choices.

Forget aluminum. The answer, Mr. Braddock, is plastics.

Advocacy Group Says That Fuel Economy Is America's #1 Criteria When Shopping For A New Car (Washington Post)

xwesx

That's all well and good, but build us a prototype first that is all-plastic outside of the necessary drivetrain components and wiring, and then start touting its benefits.

ruking1

stever said:

If you ask me CAFE standards have already been watered down too much. We get "concept" cars that only exist to hammer the curve instead of real fleet gains. Diesel fans should be the ones complaining about that the most, if you want more choice in the marketplace. Otherwise you're just gonna get more range anxiety choices.

Forget aluminum. The answer, Mr. Braddock, is plastics.

Advocacy Group Says That Fuel Economy Is America's #1 Criteria When Shopping For A New Car (Washington Post)

I have read the "average" (real) mpg is 24 mpg. There are economics, laws, rules and regulations AGAINST lighter vehicles. Whether that changes appreciably remains to be seen.

So for example, Corvette has SERIOUS issues getting much below 3300 #'s (aluminum and "fiberglass") . Yet it is still capable of 29 mpg (H EPA). So whether it as a V8 with 465 # feet of torque, or a I4 "fuel efficient motor; each would do better with MINUS - 500 to 1000 #'s less.

stever

xwesx said:

That's all well and good, but build us a prototype first that is all-plastic outside of the necessary drivetrain components and wiring, and then start touting its benefits.

Fiberglass. Stick some carbon in it along with the glass for the "frame" and you're there.

houdini1

stever said:

If you ask me CAFE standards have already been watered down too much. We get "concept" cars that only exist to hammer the curve instead of real fleet gains. Diesel fans should be the ones complaining about that the most, if you want more choice in the marketplace. Otherwise you're just gonna get more range anxiety choices.

Forget aluminum. The answer, Mr. Braddock, is plastics.

Advocacy Group Says That Fuel Economy Is America's #1 Criteria When Shopping For A New Car (Washington Post)

It might be true that most people cite fuel economy as their number 1 priority, but they should be looking at depreciation. Buying a new car is an expense, (unless you use it in a business to make money) and the cost of fuel is much less than depreciation.

stever

Good point. It always amazes me how many people think a car is an "investment" instead of an expense (seems like I just read a good thread about that over in Buying and Selling).

houdini1

stever said:

Good point. It always amazes me how many people think a car is an "investment" instead of an expense (seems like I just read a good thread about that over in Buying and Selling).

Someone over there was also talking about how hybrids and electrics depreciate much faster than conventional ICE cars. Typically they also cost more initially than conventional cars. Save a few pennies on gas and lose your shirt on initial costs and depreciation. That is why electric cars have never made any sense to me.

I guess a lot of people want to feel that they are doing their part for the environment, no matter the cost. They forget about all that coal burning to produce electricity.

stever

Prices on a used Prius does look pretty good right now, or so I've heard. Solar does too, but I'm tapped out right now.

houdini1

Buying a house will do that to you. You must have paid cash !

stever

Ha, I wish. Prices aren't bad here but it's not the UP.

gagrice

stever said:

Ha, I wish. Prices aren't bad here but it's not the UP.

My kids are going through sticker shock in Oregon. At least double for a comparable property in Indiana/Kentucky. They are loving Oregon, so that is great. And much closer for my drives to visit. At the rate I am driving the Touareg TDI, I will use up my 48k mile warranty in about 2.5 years. Only about half as much fuel though.

ruking1

houdini1 said:

stever said:

Good point. It always amazes me how many people think a car is an "investment" instead of an expense (seems like I just read a good thread about that over in Buying and Selling).

Someone over there was also talking about how hybrids and electrics depreciate much faster than conventional ICE cars. Typically they also cost more initially than conventional cars. Save a few pennies on gas and lose your shirt on initial costs and depreciation. That is why electric cars have never made any sense to me.

I guess a lot of people want to feel that they are doing their part for the environment, no matter the cost. They forget about all that coal burning to produce electricity.

Yes that is the REAL disingenuousness !!! 40 to 45% of US energy is provided by coal fired plants. IF and WHEN they manage to KILL coal plants, does anyone think electrical rates will go DOWN !!!! ???? GEEZ, delusional would be the hope rates stay the SAME !!

Getting a NON coal fired plant @ that future time to replace a closed or mothballed coal fired plant will be ANOTHER next to impossible Don Quixote quest. This will raise the rates even MORE !!!!

stever

gagrice said:

I will use up my 48k mile warranty in about 2.5 years.

Time flies. This house will be paid off before I know it (although I'll be 92 then and probably won't know it ).

Expecting a load of propane today. Love to get rid of that but we don't use much energy and solar would probably be a 30 year payback. Plan to get some bids anyway though.

ruking1

Surprise surprise? Or Is this really a surprise? Or REALLY no surprise?

"7 Most Efficient Pickup Trucks of the 2015 Model Year"
ERIC SCHAAL
OCTOBER 23, 2014

Read more: http://wallstcheatsheet.com/automobiles/7-most-efficient-pickup-trucks-of-the-2015-model-year.html/?a=viewall#ixzz3GykNpgq7s".

Is there anyone that wonders why no gasser hybrid?

Where's the "aluminum" one? (lead from behind engineering, aka me 2 ?)

For my .02 cents, while I do NOT tow; I was surprised the 12 VW T TDI towing capacity (7,500#'s: correction 7,700#'s) was only bested by one PU truck on this list.

gagrice

stever said:

gagrice said:

I will use up my 48k mile warranty in about 2.5 years.

Time flies. This house will be paid off before I know it (although I'll be 92 then and probably won't know it ).

Expecting a load of propane today. Love to get rid of that but we don't use much energy and solar would probably be a 30 year payback. Plan to get some bids anyway though.

I hate filling my propane tank. Always $350+. I have used a whole tank in December. That was before we got the benefit of GW and warm winters the last two years.

You are in a great area for Solar. I think the lease programs are the safest way to go. Who washes them when you get a dust storm? Who fixes your leaking roof when they penetrate the water barrier? I would only consider a ground based system. Easier to clean and no chance of messing up your roof.

gagrice

ruking1 said:

Surprise surprise? Or Is this really a surprise? Or REALLY no surprise?

"7 Most Efficient Pickup Trucks of the 2015 Model Year"
ERIC SCHAAL
OCTOBER 23, 2014

Read more: http://wallstcheatsheet.com/automobiles/7-most-efficient-pickup-trucks-of-the-2015-model-year.html/?a=viewall#ixzz3GykNpgq7s".

Is there anyone that wonders why no gasser hybrid?

Where's the "aluminum" one? (lead from behind engineering, aka me 2 ?)

For my .02 cents, while I do NOT tow; I was surprised the 12 VW T TDI towing capacity (7,500#'s( was only bested by one PU truck on this list.

That Ram is tempting me to trade in my Nissan Frontier. Problem, I don't want to spend that much money. The added capacity on trips would be nice. 4 door with shell and I would double the capacity of the Touareg for hauling stuff. Maybe when I am ready to trade the T-Reg.

Built like I would want it is about $41k. Less than a T-reg or Grand Cherokee.

ruking1

gagrice said:

ruking1 said:

Surprise surprise? Or Is this really a surprise? Or REALLY no surprise?

"7 Most Efficient Pickup Trucks of the 2015 Model Year"
ERIC SCHAAL
OCTOBER 23, 2014

Read more: http://wallstcheatsheet.com/automobiles/7-most-efficient-pickup-trucks-of-the-2015-model-year.html/?a=viewall#ixzz3GykNpgq7s".

Is there anyone that wonders why no gasser hybrid?

Where's the "aluminum" one? (lead from behind engineering, aka me 2 ?)

For my .02 cents, while I do NOT tow; I was surprised the 12 VW T TDI towing capacity (7,500#'s( was only bested by one PU truck on this list.

That Ram is tempting me to trade in my Nissan Frontier. Problem, I don't want to spend that much money. The added capacity on trips would be nice. 4 door with shell and I would double the capacity of the Touareg for hauling stuff. Maybe when I am ready to trade the T-Reg.

Built like I would want it is about $41k. Less than a T-reg or Grand Cherokee.

Indeed ! Additionally, one can't help but wonder what would be the mpg, handling and driving dynamics, IF RAM were to drop 700 to 1,000 #'s.

While it is not a front and center issue with the VW T TDI, we benefit as the latest gen iteration did DROP app 440 #'s.

I can certainly FEEL the app 728# (4774-4246) differences between the 12 VW T TDI and the 14 MB GLK 250 BT.

stever

gagrice said:

Roofs, surprisingly to me, require a lot of maintenance here. No rain but lots of sun I guess. Most solar is rooftop but I can see some ground panels just a block away.

Not much diesel news. Prices are down worldwide.

"Numbers provided by Edmunds.com reveal that diesel-powered vehicles sold in the U.S. have risen steadily as a percentage of sales since the 2009 model year."

Scott Sturgis’ Driver’s Seat: Diesel vehicles climb in cleanliness and popularity (post-gazette.com)

houdini1

gagrice said:

ruking1 said:

Surprise surprise? Or Is this really a surprise? Or REALLY no surprise?

"7 Most Efficient Pickup Trucks of the 2015 Model Year"
ERIC SCHAAL
OCTOBER 23, 2014

Read more: http://wallstcheatsheet.com/automobiles/7-most-efficient-pickup-trucks-of-the-2015-model-year.html/?a=viewall#ixzz3GykNpgq7s".

Is there anyone that wonders why no gasser hybrid?

Where's the "aluminum" one? (lead from behind engineering, aka me 2 ?)

For my .02 cents, while I do NOT tow; I was surprised the 12 VW T TDI towing capacity (7,500#'s( was only bested by one PU truck on this list.

That Ram is tempting me to trade in my Nissan Frontier. Problem, I don't want to spend that much money. The added capacity on trips would be nice. 4 door with shell and I would double the capacity of the Touareg for hauling stuff. Maybe when I am ready to trade the T-Reg.

Built like I would want it is about $41k. Less than a T-reg or Grand Cherokee.

Maybe by then you can buy a diesel Amarok !

gagrice

houdini1 said:

Maybe by then you can buy a diesel Amarok !

The Amarok diesel would get my attention for sure. Hard to beat German handling and build quality. I am good on the PU for a while. Still have extended warranty on the Nissan to 70k miles. Just hit 56k and only put 2k this year so far. It sits most of the time except local errands, hauling trash etc. Lexus even less miles. It went 6 months between gas stations. Drove it to town to fill and wash it. Just takes up valuable space in the garage.

gagrice

We get stuck with Tacoma and Frontier in the 3rd World. What's not to like about 36 MPG UK/30 MPG US???

The Volkswagen Amarok only comes as a double-cab in the UK, but that doesn’t seem to have hampered its popularity. And it was crowned Best Pick-Up at the Auto Express New Car Awards 2013 thanks to its mix of rugged practicality, strong, efficient engines and quality feel. All models use 2.0-litre diesels, and while these trail some competitors on capacity, they punch above their weight in terms of power and fuel consumption. Selectable or permanent four-wheel drive also guarantees impressive off-road ability.

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/volkswagen/4x4