What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

stever

I talked to a Prius owner last Saturday. He had a 2010, and said all he'd done to it was a set of tires and some oil changes, and just a few of those since the interval was 10,000 miles.

I told him that was my interval on my Caravan too, since I was out of warranty.

ruking1

stever said:

I talked to a Prius owner last Saturday. He had a 2010, and said all he'd done to it was a set of tires and some oil changes, and few of those since the interval was 10,000 miles.

I told him that was my interval on my Caravan too, since I was out of warranty.

Prius mileage? Tires, car?

Nothing to do with diesel. But a GREATER context of 11+ years (AVG AGE) of the PVF and yearly US drivers average of 12,000 to 15,000 miles.

Make your car last 200,000 miles
ConsumerReports.org By Jim Travers
March 19, 2015 4:30 PM

https://autos.yahoo.com/news/car-last-200-000-miles-203000458.html

In relation to my take (AND assumption) that ANY car should be able to go to a MAJOR TUNE ( 100,000 to 120,000 miles) with normal maintenance and MULTIPLE major tunes, anything less than 200,000 to 240,000 miles should be SNOOZZZZZZE ville.

stever

144k, last change was at 137. No idea on the tires - seem to be newer Michelins that were on the rig when we got it last April.

What's a tune-up?

ruking1

stever said:

144k, last change was at 137. No idea on the tires - seem to be newer Michelins that were on the rig when we got it last April.

What's a tune-up?

What? This thing uses oil? I thought it was a hybrid!!!! ????

144,000 miles on Prius tires beats my 113,500 on the 03 Jetta TDI !

Kudos !

stever

"In Europe, reports of diesel's demise are greatly exaggerated, but it's true that the sector has probably peaked. It's not just that the prices of alternative, fuel-efficient vehicles like hybrids and EVs grow more competitive every year. It's also that most of the world has moved on."

Is The Diesel Dead? (thecarconnection.com/)

Lots of smog in Paris still, going on a week now. (Mashable)

ruking1

As IF there were NO smog in relatively diesel LESS (PVF) US metro areas !!! Moving on in SLOW SLOW SLOW MO?

The GREATEST population of hybrids (Prius's) in the LA metropolitan area has almost ZERO % measurable effect on air quality. ZERO change in singing the BLUES on air quality. Exponentially GREATER % of spare the air days.

The greater context: 1. higher fuel prices (Europe has even HIGHER fuel prices) 2. better fuel mileage (Europe has even HIGHER mpg) 3. WAY cleaner Gasser fuel 4. over all LESS mileage driven. 5. 25% PVF small cars 6. HIGH COSTS

So given 45 years of constant environmental conservatives PUSH to small cars (from folks that want need other than small cars), optimistically the change is @ .0056 % per year! So optimistically how is EV growing? That might be the good news!? But this certainly can NOT be the good news

Germany’s Nuclear Costs Trigger Fears
As utilities struggle, taxpayers might need to cover reactor-shutdown expenses
Germany is trying to find a site suitable to store radioactive waste.
By NATALIA DROZDIAK and JENNY BUSCHE
March 22, 2015 5:58 p.m. ET

http://www.wsj.com/articles/germanys-nuclear-costs-trigger-fears-1427061504?KEYWORDS=nuclear

The US nexuses are electrical from COAL AND NUCLEAR! Don't want fracking? What will replace natural gas?

I'M HELPING !? Got me a COMPACT TDI (cuv).

ruking1

The disappointing dozen: Cars that fail to measure up
ConsumerReports.org By Jeff Bartlett

https://autos.yahoo.com/news/disappointing-dozen-cars-fail-measure-140000640.html

Interesting list, there are 4 Toyota/Lexus products, three other Japanese, three are American, two are European.

On topic, no diesel made CR's " bottom feeders" list.

stever

Seems about right, except maybe the Versa.

Diesel drops while gasoline rises, EIA says (fleetowner.com)

ruking1

stever said:

Seems about right, except maybe the Versa.

Diesel drops while gasoline rises, EIA says (fleetowner.com)

So in that sense, even when ULSD costs more per gal, CPMD: FUEL is normally CHEAPER. (like model)

Advantage, advantage: diesel.

IF and WHEN the states tax diesel fairly like RUG/PUG, (they should actually tax diesel LESS for using LESS) the fairness will add another advantage.

qbrozen

ruking1 said:

The disappointing dozen: Cars that fail to measure up
ConsumerReports.org By Jeff Bartlett

https://autos.yahoo.com/news/disappointing-dozen-cars-fail-measure-140000640.html

Interesting list, there are 4 Toyota/Lexus products, three other Japanese, three are American, two are European.

On topic, no diesel made CR's " bottom feeders" list.

Wow. Some big surprises on there. Although it is CR, so take it for what its worth.

ruking1

Indeed ! Especially if one is interested in any of those makes and models.

CR no matter how one sees it, does use a set of parameters which some to all may/may not apply to any individual consumer. So I see CR as one more "evaluation tool in the box", ala, Reader's Digest.

So for example, the 12 VW Touareg TDI is rated WELL for towing up to app 7,700 #'s. It is totally N/A to me. So whatever points earned on that section are (UP TO) TOTALLY lost on me.This is not to say I do not know nor appreciate the more buried advantages/benefits- points/ratings. But truthfully, most would be clueless to ...don't care. The other side of that would be, it could be rated total "CRAP" in towing. FF to me, I would not care, aka, still buy it.

henryn

ruking1 said:

The disappointing dozen: Cars that fail to measure up
ConsumerReports.org By Jeff Bartlett

https://autos.yahoo.com/news/disappointing-dozen-cars-fail-measure-140000640.html

Interesting list, there are 4 Toyota/Lexus products, three other Japanese, three are American, two are European.

On topic, no diesel made CR's " bottom feeders" list.

Interesting observation on the Toyota Tacoma.

“ The cabin's high floor and low roof make access tricky and compromise the driving position.”

A few months ago, I had an argument/disagreement/debate here in these forums. I slammed the Tacoma for having limited headroom, and someone who owned a Tacoma was arguing the point with me.

ruking1

Actually a good example, a 5 ft 6 in woman (avg height, 115 #'s) would be totally fine with it, say vs a 6 ft 5, 250 #'s man who wants to wear a TALL western hat or hard hat: HATED it.

As it applies to diesel, I am not upset in the LEAST, at any to all reactions to diesels from someone that is used to RUG/PUG (95% + of the PVF).

Rewind to the 1980s MB 300 D, would be enough to cure ANYONE of liking (NON TURBO "weak" @ best)) DIESELS per se. (not that many have ever driven them, let alone know what it is.)

All I do is (to anecdotally) post my thoughts, experiences. Folks will decide what to do with their dollars.

nyccarguy

Too bad I'm not in the market. A dealer not too far away from me in NY has 2 leftover 2014 E250 4Matic Blue Tecs still on their lot: http://www.mbnanuet.com/new/e250_bluetec/new-mercedes-e250_bluetec-for-sale-nanuet-

And it is almost April. I'm sure at some point they will just add these to their loaner fleet. What's a good price for a car like that? $15K off sticker?

fintail

That 62K one sounds nice, I like the colors, good options - keyless, lane tracking, lighting. Nice car. I bet around 50K could get it.

nyccarguy said:

Too bad I'm not in the market. A dealer not too far away from me in NY has 2 leftover 2014 E250 4Matic Blue Tecs still on their lot: http://www.mbnanuet.com/new/e250_bluetec/new-mercedes-e250_bluetec-for-sale-nanuet-

And it is almost April. I'm sure at some point they will just add these to their loaner fleet. What's a good price for a car like that? $15K off sticker?

ruking1

nyccarguy said:

Too bad I'm not in the market. A dealer not too far away from me in NY has 2 leftover 2014 E250 4Matic Blue Tecs still on their lot: http://www.mbnanuet.com/new/e250_bluetec/new-mercedes-e250_bluetec-for-sale-nanuet-

And it is almost April. I'm sure at some point they will just add these to their loaner fleet. What's a good price for a car like that? $15K off sticker?

Interesting the 15 GLK 250 BT has short of 6,000 miles.

ruking1

SLOW diesel news day

USLD @ $2.99

RUG @ $2.99
MG @ $3.09
PUG @ $3.19

nyccarguy

ruking1 said:

nyccarguy said:

Too bad I'm not in the market. A dealer not too far away from me in NY has 2 leftover 2014 E250 4Matic Blue Tecs still on their lot: http://www.mbnanuet.com/new/e250_bluetec/new-mercedes-e250_bluetec-for-sale-nanuet-

And it is almost April. I'm sure at some point they will just add these to their loaner fleet. What's a good price for a car like that? $15K off sticker?

Interesting the 15 GLK 250 BT has short of 6,000 miles.

They also have 3 GL 350 Bluetecs with 31 - 32K miles asking about $50K. That's about what a new ML would cost and a helluva lot more vehicle:)

gagrice

They also have 3 GL 350 Bluetecs with 31 - 32K miles asking about $50K. That's about what a new ML would cost and a helluva lot more vehicle:)

I am surprised they are not sold. Our MB dealer said every GL350 BT they get is pre-sold. And the market for the discontinued R350 Bluetec is very hot. It does look like they have increased the availability from when we were looking. The same dealer now has 4 in stock at about $75k.

ruking1

Damn things are BARELY even broken in yet ! ??

TMI is full compression PSI takes app 30,000 to 50,000 miles to fully develop. in English, better mpg should start to develop.

Further down the TMI tree, while I have been posting the 54,000 miles mpg on the Touareg TDI, I fully expect the GLK 250 BT's to get app 1 to 3 mpg better with the mileage mentioned above.

This is WAY off topic, but more emphasis is given to the 16.5 M +2014 NEW car sales. Probably just as important, probably more so, are the 44 M in 2014 USED car sales !! This goes fairly under reported to not reported @ all !!!

I'd really would have not many issues buying a new to 5 year old USED TDI. The new car buyer takes the depreciation hit. The used car buyer pays more profit to a dealer, but doesn't take the new car depreciation hit. I would look for one that was in motivated dealers inventory, OFF lease scenarios or sellers that for whatever reasons, soured on diesels.

So for obvious reasons, the dealer that sold me the 12 VW Touareg TDI (now 3 years old) wants it back, putting me in a new 2015/2016 with ZERO down and ZERO %. This scenario is GREAT if/when one can use the IRS's Section 179 protocols. It can be used for USED CUV's also !!!!

stever

My Quest's mpg only quit going up when I got a "tune-up" around 124k. Took another 10,000 miles to start creeping up again.

Good point about used car sales. That's where the real money for dealers is too. That, and servicing the used cars that break down out of warranty lol.

ruking1

Yes, that is where the 100,000 to 120,000 miles major tune can be weaved in. (or in my case 50 % in/50% OUT ( my mantra of ANY car should be able to hit major tune miles, no sweat)

Things like adding AD BLUE, wipers, tires, alignments, brake pads, rotors, brake fluid change, above and beyond tune ups start hitting (oil, air, fuel, cabin filters are part parcel of SCHEDULED maintenance ). But realistically, this stuff is normal, normal. A lot of folks just like to freak out when various things starts happening. i.e., selling the $100,000 Porsche because it needs an oil change, etc.

But the larger TDI's actually have higher mileage intervals between "major tunes". So for example, on the 12 Touareg, (neither does the 14 GLK 250 BT) it does NOT need a TB/WP (timing belt/water pump) change @ 120,000 miles. So as a practical matter, the miles are more @ 180,000 to 240,000 miles (60,000 miles minor maintenance intervals.) Now, VW/MB don't BLARE this out, but you can read between the lines in the service intervals oem manuals. So for example, @ 30,000 miles OCI's, I anticipate only 7 oil changes to get me to 240,000 miles. Defacto, the real issue then becomes UNSCHEDULED repairs. So IF I can use for comparison a TLC W 250,000 + miles on it, I project LESS $$$ issues with it than the ultra reliable durable Toyota.

gagrice

So for obvious reasons, the dealer that sold me the 12 VW Touareg TDI (now 3 years old) wants it back, putting me in a new 2015/2016 with ZERO down and ZERO %. This scenario is GREAT if/when one can use the IRS's Section 179 protocols. It can be used for USED CUV's also !!!!

No big surprise there. Not many used Touareg TDI available in CA. Narrowing mine down there are only 9 TDI LUX in the US with under 30k miles. Only one in White with Saddle Brown leather, and it is in Boston. I am waiting until they put in the NAV system that will duplicate your smartphone Google maps etc. Some Audi models have that. Then if offered that kind of deal I would trade. If the trade-in was fair. Biggest killer in CA is that 8% tax on every car purchase. May have to buy a home in Oregon and switch residency. No sales tax. Same income tax. Property tax about the same. I am looking into IRS's Section 179 protocols.

ruking1

So true ! Per $10,000, tax @ 9.5% = $950. Just the SAVED taxation alone (not buying again) will pay for a pretty big unscheduled repair. In addition, LABOR to repair autos has been non taxable.

..."Santa Clara County has a higher sales tax than 72.1% of California's other cities and counties"...

CA STATE has one of the highest income tax rates (tops @ 13.3%) ALSO. So that per $ 10,000 spent can be up to $1,330. So really ,one might need to EARN $11,330. So when one looks at NV's state rate of ZERO % ......

gagrice

You live in one of those CA cities that stick the knife into you on sales tax. There are several cities in San Diego County I will not shop in that have higher sales tax. I think the highest is 9.75%, it is 8% in many cities and the county.

ruking1

..."An impressive 80 percent of SportWagen buyers opted for a TDI when the longroof still wore a Jetta badge, and 40 percent of those cars were ordered with the six-speed manual. Thus, the rare desire for a manual, diesel configuration is still very much alive here. "...

http://www.autoblog.com/2015/03/25/2015-volkswagen-golf-sportwagen-video-first-drive/

stever

ruking1 said:

So for obvious reasons, the dealer that sold me the 12 VW Touareg TDI (now 3 years old) wants it back

Call me cynical, but the "we want your used car" letters are a pretty common marketing technique with most dealers/brands. The latest versions include a "hand signed" Post 'Em note affixed to the letter.

That said, sometimes you can get a good deal if, as @gagrice says, they don't lowball your trade too much.

nyccarguy

gagrice said:

They also have 3 GL 350 Bluetecs with 31 - 32K miles asking about $50K. That's about what a new ML would cost and a helluva lot more vehicle:)

I am surprised they are not sold. Our MB dealer said every GL350 BT they get is pre-sold. And the market for the discontinued R350 Bluetec is very hot. It does look like they have increased the availability from when we were looking. The same dealer now has 4 in stock at about $75k.

Diesels do not sell very well here in the NY market. The Prius is king of fuel sippers here. I see a maybe a handful of diesels every week (VW Golf or Jetta, Porsche Cayenne, and maybe a GL 350). I'll see if I can remember and start tomorrow AM and keep a record until next Friday (my birthday, I'll be 39). Those 3 CPO GL 350 BlueTec MBs at my local dealer don't seem to be priced that bad. CarMax shows only 2 GL 350s within 250 miles of me. A 2011 with 34K with a $42K asking price and a 2010 with 51K and a $38K asking price.

ruking1

stever said:

ruking1 said:

So for obvious reasons, the dealer that sold me the 12 VW Touareg TDI (now 3 years old) wants it back

Call me cynical, but the "we want your used car" letters are a pretty common marketing technique with most dealers/brands. The latest versions include a "hand signed" Post 'Em note affixed to the letter.

That said, sometimes you can get a good deal if, as @gagrice says, they don't lowball your trade too much.

At some levels, I am sure they would not do this marketing effort, if it did not achieve the or some desired results. My take is they do it for higher resale models. I even got one for the 2003 Jetta TDI. So all three were targeted.

Another might be VW is probably spending a lot less marketing monies by targeting members of the population who have in the past to DO buy diesels ! Another might be the repair of the 2009 Jetta TDI's HPFP issue. IF it happens again and they pick up the cost of that possible future repair, I think it a fair expectation I would probably not change brands AND still buy diesels.

stever

I agree that it does work - that's why they'll do it even if your car is twelve years old. Doesn't matter if you drive a Benz or a Forte.

ruking1

stever said:

I agree that it does work - that's why they'll do it even if your car is twelve years old. Doesn't matter if you drive a Benz or a Forte.

As popular and as reliable as Toyota is, I have not bought one (TLC) since 1997, (18 years). Any of the local ones just do not deal. This works against me, for we have a HUGE regional dealership in town and the service manager, I have known and dealt with for app 27 years. I do continue to kick the tires and he arranges for me to take overnight or longer for those I am interested in. It is good to stay abreast.

stever

Now, just think about how much money you'd save on diesel you'd save if you cut back to one car like we did.

gagrice

stever said:

I agree that it does work - that's why they'll do it even if your car is twelve years old. Doesn't matter if you drive a Benz or a Forte.

I think the deal would work for both in the 2-3 year old vehicle. You should have it paid down to approximate current value. So just trade up and keep paying for 2-3 more years. I would consider it if the vehicle had the improvements I wanted like Audi Connect.

http://www.audiusa.com/technology/intelligence/audi-connect

gagrice

This looks like good news. The only glitch in a near perfect vehicle, is the NAV. This looks like what I want.

LAS VEGAS, 2015 International CES (North Hall, Booth 2231), January 5, 2015 — QNX Software Systems Limited, a subsidiary of BlackBerry Limited and a global leader in software platforms for connected embedded systems, today announced that infotainment systems powered by the QNX® Neutrino® Operating System (OS) and QNX middleware technology are now shipping in several 2015 Volkswagen vehicle models, including the Touareg, Passat, Polo, Golf, and Golf GTI.

The systems include the RNS 850 GPS navigation system in the Volkswagen Touareg, which recently introduced support for 3D Google Earth™ maps and Google Street View™. The system also offers realtime traffic information, points-of-interest search, reverse camera display, voice control, Bluetooth® connectivity, rich multimedia support, four-zone climate control, a high-resolution 8-inch color touchscreen, and other advanced features.


http://www.qnx.com/news/pr_6116_2.html

stever

Ford switched to QNX last year. Funny that it's co-created by a guy named Dodge.

ruking1

The interesting thing are those cars seem to be targeted to what a lot of CA/TX (etc) metropolitan to suburban folks do. I think also in a lot of cases, it does service as a mobile office. A RV Sprinter could be motel room, mobile business office, transportation, restaurant, recreation.

I think back to those local GTG times, when we got familiarity outings with the earlier VW self driving car technology. They also put any to all of us that wanted to take a spin, in a driverless car.

ruking1

stever said:

Now, just think about how much money you'd save on diesel you'd save if you cut back to one car like we did.

Indeed, IF the 12 Touareg TDI was available in 1987, it would easily (2015) have 1,330,000 miles on it !! @ 30 mpg? YES !! The trick would be how to get 2 to 4 people to up to 4 places @ the same time.

But then you would need a spare for all the critical times it needed to hit the shop for scheduled to unscheduled maintenance:

1,774 fuelings, 672 washings, 266 rotations, 52 waxing, 45 oil/filter changes, 33 fuel filters, 27 sets of tires,14 to 28 sets of WW wipers, 22 brake pad/rotor changes, 14 alignments, 11 "major tunes" 5 sets of shocks, off the top of my head.

ruking1

But some N/A market work vans and CUV's?

http://www.autoblog.com/2015/03/14/mercedes-volkswagen-north-america-investments-jeremy-clarkson-kurt-busch-gm/

gagrice

stever said:

Ford switched to QNX last year. Funny that it's co-created by a guy named Dodge.

Ford had the best rated NAV a few years back. I have an email out to the person at VW that was supposed to keep me posted when they get a new update from NavTeq. I would much rather dump that whole system and switch to the QNX solution. It is so much faster and more robust. Pretty sure Audi has already switched to them. Probably the only thing that keep BlackBerry from going belly UP. BBRY peaked in 2007 at $230 a share. It is now trading in the $9 range. If it were not for the US government buying them they would likely be history. So QNX looks promising.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeUagMzXN4Y&feature=youtu.be

stever

672 washings, 52 waxing.

Wow, I might wash a car once or twice a year. What's wax - is that like one of those "tune-up" things?

Ford had a lot of complaints when they had Sync, at least from the JD Power crowd. MSFT blamed it on the initial "contract" coders and I guess it got better when it went in-house at Microsoft. QNX sounds like an improvement.

Today's stinkpot was *drumroll* .... a gasser, not the F-350 I idled next to for a couple of lights.

ruking1

stever said:

672 washings, 52 waxing.

Wow, I might wash a car once or twice a year. What's wax - is that like one of those "tune-up" things?

Ford had a lot of complaints when they had Sync, at least from the JD Power crowd. MSFT blamed it on the initial "contract" coders and I guess it got better when it went in-house at Microsoft. QNX sounds like an improvement.

Today's stinkpot was *drumroll* .... a gasser, not the F-350 I idled next to for a couple of lights.

Anyone that "shrills to apologizes to fan boy's/girl's " for gassers either ignores or never has gone through the gassers (to be non PC) CRAP times.

RUG/PUG used to be RLG/PLG. To run a RLG/PLG product with RUG/PUG was a disaster.

There also was a 10 to 15 year period where RUG/PUG products were simply BAD.

I haven't stated this in a while but one BIG mistake was not implementing ULSD @ the time they converted to UNLEADED. Some easy mistakes to point out were implementing MTBE and the follow on, ethanol.

They WANT hybrids to EV's ! OK ! They will not allow CRITICAL "RARE EARTH" US mining ! So where is rare earth mining abundant? GEEZ Afghanistan !!!???? And its a long time source for opiates !!! Just WONDERFUL !! Whose got top billing for franchise access? China and Al Qaida ? Got to love strange bedfellows !! We all know how beneficial and environmentally friendly the opiate trade has been over the last hundreds of years. Of course the track record of China and Al Qaida with Iran in the mix is totally encouraging.

ruking1

gagrice said:

stever said:

Ford switched to QNX last year. Funny that it's co-created by a guy named Dodge.

Ford had the best rated NAV a few years back. I have an email out to the person at VW that was supposed to keep me posted when they get a new update from NavTeq. I would much rather dump that whole system and switch to the QNX solution. It is so much faster and more robust. Pretty sure Audi has already switched to them. Probably the only thing that keep BlackBerry from going belly UP. BBRY peaked in 2007 at $230 a share. It is now trading in the $9 range. If it were not for the US government buying them they would likely be history. So QNX looks promising.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeUagMzXN4Y&feature=youtu.be

I am not sure why the oems didn't just do a solid platform with multiple batteries for electronics recharge with added embedded solar panels to arrays in the roof, trunk, hood or dash boards. (modular/modularity)

xwesx

That looks like an awful lot of clicky for something one uses while driving.

I prefer the non-nav / stay-connected-to-everything route: Get in the car, start it, set the radio, buckle up, and go!

henryn

stever said:

672 washings, 52 waxing.

Wow, I might wash a car once or twice a year. What's wax - is that like one of those "tune-up" things?

Ford had a lot of complaints when they had Sync, at least from the JD Power crowd. MSFT blamed it on the initial "contract" coders and I guess it got better when it went in-house at Microsoft. QNX sounds like an improvement.

The Sync system in my 2013 F150 sucks. Period. Nothing else need be said.

houdini1

ruking1 said:

gagrice said:

stever said:

Ford switched to QNX last year. Funny that it's co-created by a guy named Dodge.

Ford had the best rated NAV a few years back. I have an email out to the person at VW that was supposed to keep me posted when they get a new update from NavTeq. I would much rather dump that whole system and switch to the QNX solution. It is so much faster and more robust. Pretty sure Audi has already switched to them. Probably the only thing that keep BlackBerry from going belly UP. BBRY peaked in 2007 at $230 a share. It is now trading in the $9 range. If it were not for the US government buying them they would likely be history. So QNX looks promising.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeUagMzXN4Y&feature=youtu.be

I am not sure why the oems didn't just do a solid platform with multiple batteries for electronics recharge with added embedded solar panels to arrays in the roof, trunk, hood or dash boards. (modular/modularity)

I'm not sure why they don't just duct tape an ipad to the dash.

Michaell

houdini1 said:

ruking1 said:

gagrice said:

stever said:

Ford switched to QNX last year. Funny that it's co-created by a guy named Dodge.

Ford had the best rated NAV a few years back. I have an email out to the person at VW that was supposed to keep me posted when they get a new update from NavTeq. I would much rather dump that whole system and switch to the QNX solution. It is so much faster and more robust. Pretty sure Audi has already switched to them. Probably the only thing that keep BlackBerry from going belly UP. BBRY peaked in 2007 at $230 a share. It is now trading in the $9 range. If it were not for the US government buying them they would likely be history. So QNX looks promising.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeUagMzXN4Y&feature=youtu.be

I am not sure why the oems didn't just do a solid platform with multiple batteries for electronics recharge with added embedded solar panels to arrays in the roof, trunk, hood or dash boards. (modular/modularity)

I'm not sure why they don't just duct tape an ipad to the dash.

You mean like Audi, BMW and Mazda seem to be doing lately?

gagrice

xwesx said:

That looks like an awful lot of clicky for something one uses while driving.

I prefer the non-nav / stay-connected-to-everything route: Get in the car, start it, set the radio, buckle up, and go!

I did not think I would like using a NAV until we bought the 2007 Sequoia. It has some good features and bad. At the time we did not have a smartphone or GPS. It was kind of neat to put in an address and have a turn by turn navigation. Of course within a month it took us on a dirt road with a locked gate. We soon went back to our AAA maps where ever we were going. I knew it had to have better routing, and 8 years later I believe some NAV units are still in the Beta stages. The exception would be Google, that seems to be serious about keeping their maps up to date along with their POI database. Add in Gas Buddy and it is quite useful. We still carry AAA maps as my wife is old school. We rarely know where we will end up staying the night so hotel search with Google is a real time saver. Having it all on the NAV screen in the vehicle just seems close to perfect.

PS
We don't have any decent radio stations, and SiriusXM has gone down hill over the last several years. So an infotainment center has been great. Several 1000 pieces of music with search is to our liking. My wife travels so much better with an endless supply of classical music at her fingertips. Amazon offers MP3 on many albums now.

xwesx

Yes, I agree that technology items are a good thing! I do enjoy having my iPod tied into my cars' audio systems. Our Forester has a mini-audio jack (e.g., headphone-out port on the iPod), so that requires some fumbling with the device either before heading out or by the passenger. I admit that I've tried fiddling w/ it while driving, and it's just a distracting, frustrating PITA.

On the Fiesta, it links in using a USB interface, so I can push a button and tell the car what I want to hear. Cool stuff.

And, I'm not against tech in a car. I just don't like the idea of me (or other drivers around me) looking at a screen and pushing a bunch of touch-screen commands to get something done rather than watching what is going on around me. My one gripe with the Flex that's on my short-list, actually. Everything is supposedly on voice-command, but there are no actual knobs, switches, or buttons for HVAC. You have to navigate menus if you want to do it by hand. ?

ruking1

Does anybody really think that a gasser hybrid could have got 115 % BETTER that the AVG truck @5.7 mpg for 12.2 mpg)?

I like some of these "technology goodies"

..."Most of its accessories, including the air conditioning are run off the battery, instead of belts attached to the engine. There’s a waste heat recovery system that uses the exhaust to generate additional electricity by boiling water like a power plant, and solar panels on the roof of the trailer that can fully run its climate control system on a sunny day."...

It makes me wonder what %'s of the 115% better mpg that each is responsible for.

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2015/03/26/freightliner-supertruck-hauls-goods-sips-fuel/

gagrice

And, I'm not against tech in a car. I just don't like the idea of me (or other drivers around me) looking at a screen and pushing a bunch of touch-screen commands to get something done rather than watching what is going on around me.

My wife makes sure the driver keeps his eyes on the road. She blocks my view when she is making changes. I have never been one to talk on the phone while driving. And I really don't like texting. I wonder if the Flex does not use QNX system. If Ford switched. I like the Flex, if it was offered with a diesel it would be on my list.