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What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

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  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    This word & phrase almost cracks me up: "sustainable" overall solution ! :p Sorry The Newsweek article got erased somehow. It was a word and phrase used by the VW CEO in Newsweek.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Diesels!
    http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/03/01/volkswagens-sales-are-crushed-again-as-the-diesel.aspx
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    EPA wants more information on Mercedes' diesel emissions (autoblog.com)
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,415
    Looks like more test vs real world discrepancies. Greenies and our beloved lawyering cabal don't seem to be able to grasp that
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    664# ft ! Audi Q7 T TDI/V8! & electric compressor, 8 speed A/T! MONSTER? !
    http://www.autoblog.com/2016/03/03/audi-sq7-tdi-official/

    This is almost too creepy to comprehend. My wife even drives the 2012 VW Touareg TDI (406 # ft scary) fast. Needless to say I drive fast, but not as scary.

    Total TMI: The new 7700 # rated trailer hitch does not seem to make an mpg difference.

    Moving Up?

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/volkswagen-going-fight-america-152005371.html
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I think VW is doing darn well considering they cannot sell diesels. They were off 13% over Feb 2015 and are off 13.85% for the year so far. That means to me they replaced about 10% of their diesel sales with gassers. Hard to top 78% increase in Tiguan sales. That is not a cheap CUV.

    http://media.vw.com/release/1152/
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Yes. And I think if they get the greenlight for diesels, it's going to be a good thing!

    Poor truck sales http://news.yahoo.com/u-regulators-seek-more-input-truck-fuel-efficiency-173307080--finance.html & we wonder way there is job loss?
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Any one using the so called "diesel premium" as a reason to not buy, might have priorities misplaced? http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2016/03/car-loan-amounts-payments-rise.html/
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited March 2016
    "Thanks a lot, Volkswagen."

    VW Scandal Clouds Prospects for Other Diesel Makers at Geneva Motor Show (NY Times)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    stever said:

    "Thanks a lot, Volkswagen."

    VW Scandal Clouds Prospects for Other Diesel Makers at Geneva Motor Show (NY Times)

    The article highlights (defacto) just how bankrupt the C02 emissions standards are in the global warming scenarios! It also highlights the siren call for burning WAY more fuel, not less! The implication that burning gasoline has ZERO N0x generation & ZERO indirect deaths.

    But then the ratio problem remains !? (42 gal per barrel oil yields 19 gal gas/10 gal diesel.) In addition, there is also a HUGE glut on the OTHER/remaing 13 gals! Even I have not talk too much about that ! As you can see, it's a bigger problem ( 13 gal vs 10 gals) than what to do with diesel!!!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    ruking1 said:

    Any one using the so called "diesel premium" as a reason to not buy, might have priorities misplaced? http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2016/03/car-loan-amounts-payments-rise.html/

    Golf Stationwagen starts @ MSRP@ $22,445...
    http://blog.caranddriver.com/2016-volkswagen-golf-sportwagen-limited-edition-more-for-less/

    "Diesel gate" for dummies ;)B)

    ..." It’s a tricky legal situation, as neither the EPA nor the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration can force individual owners to update their cars. Several bills in Congress have proposed banning registration renewals for car owners who don’t complete recalls"...

    http://blog.caranddriver.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-vw-diesel-emissions-scandal/
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Heh, I forwarded the Edmunds blurb about the SportWagen Limited Edition to my wife twenty minutes ago.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Yes! With average auto transaction prices of $33,000 and average amount financed at $ 29,550, raging bargains come to mind. !?
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited March 2016
    There's always VW's reliability reputation nagging in the back of my mind. But all cars are pretty reliable these days. May be a bit too low of a seating position for us. Be fun to look though.

    I'm also dealing with my lovely wife, who has been enamored of floaty rides since shuttling an LTD cross-country back in her college days to earn a few bucks. Now you know why the Encore is high on our list.

    Biggest loser from Dieselgate?

    May be Tesla. (investors.com)
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,107
    That Sportwagon SE looked good...until 'included sunroof'...I don't want no steenkin' sunroof!

    And Tesla already had problems trying to go downmarket with the '3', what with the Bolt. Now VW/Audi/etc. will be strongly focused on them. And Tesla reliability makes VW look great!
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    That's what caught my eye and the only feature that would really entice my wife to drive to the dealer - not only a sunroof, but a panoramic one.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Thankfully, I was able to get three/four diesels without sunroofs. I got a significant discount off on the 2009 for having a sunroof. A panoramic sunroof would be a deal breaker, for me.p

    Now to Japanese diesels ...Wait till the can of worms spills open all over gassers!

    http://www.wsj.com/articles/some-japanese-diesel-cars-on-road-emissions-higher-than-in-lab-tests-1457082484

    Are we expecting a couple of suicides, ala, Aubrey McClendon? http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2016/03/03/911-calls-aubrey-mcclendon-swerved-and-hit-wall/81260914/
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Is lithium the new gasoline?

    ..."In June 2010, the New York Times reported that American geologists were conducting ground surveys on dry salt lakes in western Afghanistan believing that large deposits of lithium are located there. "Pentagon officials said that their initial analysis at one location in Ghazni Province showed the potential for lithium deposits as large as those of Bolivia, which now has the world's largest known lithium reserves."[50] These estimates are "based principally on old data, which was gathered mainly by the Soviets during their occupation of Afghanistan from 1979–1989" and "Stephen Peters, the head of the USGS's Afghanistan Minerals Project, said that he was unaware of USGS involvement in any new surveying for minerals in Afghanistan in the past two years. 'We are not aware of any discoveries of lithium,' he said."[51]"...

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium

    http://finance.yahoo.com/video/lithium-next-gasoline-064900647.html
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Here's a better look @ Audis (DIESEL) SQ7 V8 electric compressor 663# ft of torque, more station wagon look! http://news.yahoo.com/despite-dieselgate-audi-debuts-most-173015324.html
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Diesel gate settlement, months away?
    http://www.autoblog.com/2016/03/06/vw-miss-diesel-emissions-deadline/
    But then there are 360 months in a 30 year loan!? LOL!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Tesla excessive emissions!?
    http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/news/a28417/singapore-government-fines-tesla-model-s-owner/
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    ruking1 said:

    Tesla excessive emissions!?
    http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/news/a28417/singapore-government-fines-tesla-model-s-owner/

    It was the UN figures that makes the Tesla a gross polluter. Unless you live where electricity is zero polluting, the Tesla is rightly charged with the pollution. In a country that uses mostly Coal it is likely far worse than a diesel car. The Passat TDI puts out 135 g/km. About half as polluting as the Tesla. B)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Yup! I hope it is a total wake up call for the skeptics to the anti diesel folks on this thread ! It is just another example of the total bankruptcy of the Eco cons narratives! United States electrical grid remains fully 19% nuclear, 7 % other & 67% fossil fuels = 93 % " hated" supplied.

    Slow diesel News Day! ULSD is @ $ 4.40

    (Norway :D 10 NOK per liter, ULSD, 8.5 to 1 @ that conversion, RUG= 14 NOK )
  • stevedebistevedebi Member Posts: 4,098
    ruking1 said:

    Yup! I hope it is a total wake up call for the skeptics to the anti diesel folks on this thread ! It is just another example of the total bankruptcy of the Eco cons narratives! United States electrical grid remains fully 19% nuclear, 7 % other & 67% fossil fuels = 93 % " hated" supplied.

    Slow diesel News Day! ULSD is @ $ 4.40

    (Norway :D 10 NOK per liter, ULSD, 8.5 to 1 @ that conversion, RUG= 14 NOK )

    ULSD $4.40? It is 1.99 here in SoCal!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Yes! Folsom, CA Costco $1.99 !
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,107
    ruking1 said:

    Tesla excessive emissions!?
    http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/news/a28417/singapore-government-fines-tesla-model-s-owner/

    You'll appreciate that the government's claimed emissions are 2X too high, according to other sources in the art
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Is it possible the UN R101 test includes energy consumed in the manufacture of the car? Of course they may just think this fat cat can afford a $130k car what's $20k more??? Big difference from here where the Tax Payers get shafted on every Tesla.


  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    IF the reply is not a fake, no less than the CEO of Tesla actually reads these kinds of articles (in R/T)

    Given the l(ban) lack of diesel sales, in a fact VW increased gasser/hybrid/EV sales about roughly 12.8 %.! Too bad they couldn't do this while selling diesel's. Overall of course, diesels are normally 20 to 25%, so there's a net " loss "

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/volkswagen-global-sales-down-12-percent-in-february/2016/03/11/1f833b9c-e793-11e5-a9ce-681055c7a05f_story.html
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    While this should be no surprise to many on this board, Fintail hit the nail squarely on the head:

    . ..."Die Welt went through VW’s party donations, and all it could find was $7,500 paid 2012 to the Democratic Party in Tennessee."...

    ( The implication, this was the sum total of political contributions in the whole USA, my sic)

    when money changes hands overseas, we ( for the US corporations) call that " bribery". when it happens domestically… ah, ...we are all smart enough to ...connect the dots. ...

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/bertelschmitt/2016/03/13/at-volkswagen-a-disastrous-dieselgate-week-promises-to-become-the-new-normal/#45d878a63be1

    From the article, I do not get that VW's large to larger owners: sovereign wealth funds, big labor unions and big governments (Lower Saxony) get the writing on the wall, aka, the extent of the damage of the "earthquake." They understand even less, the changes that need to be made going forward.

    TMI: The Porsche brand ownership lost the first round . Are these rounds 2, 3, 4, 5?
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited March 2016
    Could be close, but my guess is that the dealer lobby has more clout than any manufacturer. Ford and GM may be right there with them, but outside of the factory towns, there's probably not much love for VW, Toyota, Kia and the rest compared to the local dealers and their connections.

    Really surprised at VW - their leadership culture must be way too insulated. This thing is going to drag on and on, when they could have done a Tylenol mea culpa and been mostly back in business by now.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    No less a personage then Warren Buffet has entered the "auto dealership" concept. Auto dealerships, in effect sell any, any: any type, any brand, etc. but make no mistake I think that GM (Government Motors ) brands will be integral to how Warren Buffet consolidates auto dealerships.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited March 2016
    Quite the Forbes article you found @ruking1 - some new info in there (new to me at least) and none of it helps VW's case.
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,107
    Wow, at least VW's focusing on innovation! New and improved cheat codes!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    The auto industry is trying to contain this to only VW. But the fact of the matter is it's epidemic throughout the industry. It's easy to keep in mind that the US market is approximately 95 to 97% gassers. Not that EPA lab testing is not useful., but I think it's time for the politics that shape this to get REAL and stop the fantasy of "EPA lab" testing.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited March 2016
    Maybe a sale to Peugeot would work - give them the factory and dealer network. (thecarconnection.com)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    I'm not sure a brand like VW would want to go away. After all, GM is still number 2/3 world wide despite having declare bankruptcy, not too long ago. They sure discharged a lot of debts and other obligations after the bankruptcy. Not only that, the US government pretty much guarantee their future success after stepping in soon after. Or perhaps that was the plan all along. Keep in mind that VW only has about 2.5% of the US market. An American (VW) bankruptcy would be a literal drop in the bucket for VW. I believe American bankruptcy laws would allow VW to start up operations almost as soon as it declared bankruptcy. So for every bankruptcy discharged dollar in US penalties, the US would get back (VW) pennies on the dollar.

    I'm not sure who said it first, but perception IS reality!? http://www.motortrend.com/news/the-trouble-with-vw-america-still-doesnt-get-it-the-big-picture/
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    stever said:

    Maybe a sale to Peugeot would work - give them the factory and dealer network. (thecarconnection.com)

    They need to fire their design people. Though a diesel van would be nice.

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Just got invitation letter to a "lottery" for the 2014 MB GLK 250 BT from the (CA) Air Resources Board. (ARB) If this particular car is selected for 1 month "emissions testing", upon return they'll give you a $5,000 check. They provide a comparable vehicle for that time. The car will be washed, vacuumed and fueled on return. Pick up and delivery for both vehicles at your home or workplace .

    What would you do? What shall I do? B);)
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Nice - do you feel lucky? :)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    stever said:

    Nice - do you feel lucky? :)

    Yes. Worst that can happen is ours is not selected.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    Talk about putting ones' head in the mouth of the lion (CARB) :D ? !! They pretty much had all the (particulars) information! ? I am sure they even have the results of the last smog inspection ! It i pass with flying colors, as mentioned on this board. :DB) Would paranoia make one think comments are tracked on his board ? :D

    While I like to think that this particular MB GLK 250 BT & we were selected (totally) @ random, the selection may have been specifically targeted.

    Speaking of the devil, don't look now… Look at the " 6 SUV's that rarely need repairs"? list. http://www.bankrate.com/finance/auto/dependable-suvs-2.aspx

    Look whose 8 speed A/T hit the 2017 Toyota Highlander as an option? B)http://www.motortrend.com/news/2017-toyota-highlander-first-look-review/
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    10 reasons why?...http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidkiley5/2016/03/15/dieselgate-aside-ten-reasons-why-volkswagen-cant-succeed-in-america/#5ce894a91d50
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    ruking1 said:

    Just got invitation letter to a "lottery" for the 2014 MB GLK 250 BT from the (CA) Air Resources Board. (ARB) If this particular car is selected for 1 month "emissions testing", upon return they'll give you a $5,000 check. They provide a comparable vehicle for that time. The car will be washed, vacuumed and fueled on return. Pick up and delivery for both vehicles at your home or workplace .

    What would you do? What shall I do? B);)

    I would take it in a NY second. Of course millions of diesel fans will hate you if your diesel proves MB is also big fat cheaters. :p
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    edited March 2016
    It will take a lot more than a good 8 speed transmission to make the Highlander look good.

    As for VW they need to add some models like the T6 and UP to their lineup. I really like the looks of the VW CrossBlue. In a 4 cylinder diesel it could take the place of the Lexus. If MB ever gets off the pot with the GLC 300 Bluetec with 9 speed transmission it may be our baby. Last I read the last of this year as the 2017 model. Mercedes improved the looks for my eyes.


  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    gagrice said:

    ruking1 said:

    Just got invitation letter to a "lottery" for the 2014 MB GLK 250 BT from the (CA) Air Resources Board. (ARB) If this particular car is selected for 1 month "emissions testing", upon return they'll give you a $5,000 check. They provide a comparable vehicle for that time. The car will be washed, vacuumed and fueled on return. Pick up and delivery for both vehicles at your home or workplace .

    What would you do? What shall I do? B);)

    I would take it in a NY second. Of course millions of diesel fans will hate you if your diesel proves MB is also big fat cheaters. :p
    gagrice said:

    ruking1 said:

    Just got invitation letter to a "lottery" for the 2014 MB GLK 250 BT from the (CA) Air Resources Board. (ARB) If this particular car is selected for 1 month "emissions testing", upon return they'll give you a $5,000 check. They provide a comparable vehicle for that time. The car will be washed, vacuumed and fueled on return. Pick up and delivery for both vehicles at your home or workplace .

    What would you do? What shall I do? B);)

    I would take it in a NY second. Of course millions of diesel fans will hate you if your diesel proves MB is also big fat cheaters. :p
    Yes! Let's see what MB would offer!? B)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited March 2016
    I thought a lot more folks would chime in on this latest bit of "anecdotal" CARB news!

    Evidently (my swag only),

    CARB surmises that Mercedes-Benz BT's (MLK 250) are possible "cheaters"and/or maybe exceeds N0x and other emissions.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited March 2016
    Dieselgate is just too painful to watch. :p

    Sounds like VW can't get approval to fix their diesel Passats in the EU now, per the WSJ.
  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,351
    Well, they can always sell their cars in Cuba.

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • jpp75jpp75 Member Posts: 1,535
    gagrice said:

    It will take a lot more than a good 8 speed transmission to make the Highlander look good.

    As for VW they need to add some models like the T6 and UP to their lineup. I really like the looks of the VW CrossBlue. In a 4 cylinder diesel it could take the place of the Lexus. If MB ever gets off the pot with the GLC 300 Bluetec with 9 speed transmission it may be our baby. Last I read the last of this year as the 2017 model. Mercedes improved the looks for my eyes.


    I'd also like to see VW bring the Amarok over here, I've always liked those when traveling abroad.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I'd also like to see VW bring the Amarok over here, I've always liked those when traveling abroad.

    If VW were to offer the Amarok TDI in the US, I would sell my Nissan Frontier in a heartbeat and buy the Amarok.


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