Real-World Trade-In Values

28firefighter

stickguy said:

sign up to my favorite motto to live by. "It is better to ask forgiveness than to ask for permission"

I tried this with a TV - it failed and the TV was returned. I'm not bold enough to try it with something as expensive as a car. 

Michaell

28firefighter said:

stickguy said:

sign up to my favorite motto to live by.

"It is better to ask forgiveness than to ask for permission"

I tried this with a TV - it failed and the TV was returned. I'm not bold enough to try it with something as expensive as a car. 

ding ding ding

I'd be looking at something like another $100-150/mo more on the payment - no way the budget stretches that far.

Mrs. @breld was the worst offender at the table today - 'go for it' she says.

Then, we talked about the Pacer wagon she drove as a teenager. :laughing:

xwesx

28firefighter said:

I tried this with a TV - it failed and the TV was returned. I'm not bold enough to try it with something as expensive as a car. 

Hahha! Yeah, I was going to say that I strongly suspect @stickguy does not walk that talk.....

breld

So, is there a rule of thumb on what amount over auction (or trade) represents a strong deal?

Generally, I've targeted $3,000 over, thinking that's a fair profit and generally a good deal as a buyer. Perhaps a bit more if I really have to have the car; a bit less if I want an aggressive deal.

qbrozen

I target $2500 over auction as fair for both parties.

sda

stickguy said:

sign up to my favorite motto to live by.

"It is better to ask forgiveness than to ask for permission"</blockquote

Amen!

breld

qbrozen said:

breld said:

Hey Q - this one is a little odd for being so new:

2017 Dodge Durango R/T
5,000 miles
Silver over black
Every option - tech group, sunroof, captains chairs, DVD system, "blacktop" package.

Apparently traded in here in CO at a Mercedes dealer.  

Any clue on what the dealership would have paid on such a thing?

about $36k

For the sake of coming up with a difference, can you tell me current values for my Durango?:

In CO,
2014 Durango SXT Plus (AWD)
26k miles
Gray over black
Navigation, Rallye Package, 2nd Row Captain's Chair

Thanks!

qbrozen

$21k-$21.5k trade

breld

Okay - so $36k trade value on the 2017 R/T, $21k on my 2014 SXT. Difference of $15k plus, let's say $2,500 profit - for a $17,500 difference.

They bottomed out at $18,500 today. Not all that bad really. More of a question of whether it's worth it to me for the upgrade.

Not that it matters (the only difference is the difference, right?), but the sales manager, who seemed a bit irked at me for being open about auction values and such, claimed they took in the R/T trade at $39k, so they're not budging much on that side of things. Doesn't really matter though - they're obviously over-allowing on my rig, offering $23k trade.

Thanks for the response Q!

Michaell

breld said:

Okay - so $36k trade value on the 2017 R/T, $21k on my 2014 SXT. Difference of $15k plus, let's say $2,500 profit - for a $17,500 difference.

They bottomed out at $18,500 today. Not all that bad really. More of a question of whether it's worth it to me for the upgrade.

Not that it matters (the only difference is the difference, right?), but the sales manager, who seemed a bit irked at me for being open about auction values and such, claimed they took in the R/T trade at $39k, so they're not budging much on that side of things. Doesn't really matter though - they're obviously over-allowing on my rig, offering $23k trade.

Thanks for the response Q!

Funny how a little knowledge can annoy sales folks.

breld

Yeah, I really try to be transparent about my approach to pricing, but without being presumptuous. I like to provide some support for why I'm offering what I'm offering, so they don't think I'm just throwing numbers out willy nilly.

When I simply stated that I generally target somewhere around auction value plus $2,500 or so, the sales manager snickered and asked if I ever actually get that (remember, this is at a very nice Mercedes dealer). I just simply replied, "sometimes."

To be fair, he understood the approach and tried to show me that the auction values may be higher than what I thought (but he struggled to find any data on such a new vehicle).

qbrozen

I would have said "often I do better than that but I'm feeling generous today."

I have pissed off countless salespeople and GMs. But it is the few who have said "yeah that's fair" that make it worthwhile.

Now, granted, $18.5k difference is actually correct if you use auction value, not trade value.

breld

So, trade is generally a little lower than auction, with dealers hedging their bets a bit?

Are you saying the $18.5k difference is a decent/good offer then?

Thanks!

stickguy

still seems like a lot of money to still end up with a Durango, even if it does rumble better.

breld

Fair point, and basically what's making me hesitate.

I knew when I got this fairly basic model that if I liked it, I'd consider upgrading.

Things that I'd be gaining - leather, upgraded stereo, power hatch, ventilated seats, rear heated seats, USB ports, safety suite (BSM, lane assist, active cruise, etc), the Hemi and "upgraded" transmission, and 3 model years and an almost full bumper to bumper warranty.  

All at a cost of course, including a few MPG. 

qbrozen

18.5k is fair.

Michaell

breld said:

Fair point, and basically what's making me hesitate.

I knew when I got this fairly basic model that if I liked it, I'd consider upgrading.

Things that I'd be gaining - leather, upgraded stereo, power hatch, ventilated seats, rear heated seats, USB ports, safety suite (BSM, lane assist, active cruise, etc), the Hemi and "upgraded" transmission, and 3 model years and an almost full bumper to bumper warranty.  

All at a cost of course, including a few MPG. 

You'll never use the rear heated seats since it will be long gone before next winter rolls around.

:laughing:

breld

It snows in April and May here - you know that!

andres3

The Subaru salesman acted like I was from Mars when I said I wanted the Outback at $1,000 under invoice.

tjc78

Michaell said:

Fair point, and basically what's making me hesitate.

I knew when I got this fairly basic model that if I liked it, I'd consider upgrading.

Things that I'd be gaining - leather, upgraded stereo, power hatch, ventilated seats, rear heated seats, USB ports, safety suite (BSM, lane assist, active cruise, etc), the Hemi and "upgraded" transmission, and 3 model years and an almost full bumper to bumper warranty.  

All at a cost of course, including a few MPG. 

You'll never use the rear heated seats since it will be long gone before next winter rolls around. :laughing:

My wife brought up a good point when we were looking at SUVs.  Heated rear seats are pretty much useless considering in our case there will be two car seats back there pretty much 100% of the time.  

@breld
It would be a tough sell for me, although with the Hemi it's a much different vehicle.  Tough call.  

stickguy

with the Durangos, I know it is hard to project, but realistically, which one is more likely to take a steep depreciation hit in say the next 9-12 months (AKA a Breld automotive lifespan)? Some cars tend to get creamed early, then stay relatively flat for a bit. So you never want to buy on at the top of the mountain, when it is about to start on a quick descent!

kyfdx

stickguy said:

with the Durangos, I know it is hard to project, but realistically, which one is more likely to take a steep depreciation hit in say the next 9-12 months (AKA a Breld automotive lifespan)? Some cars tend to get creamed early, then stay relatively flat for a bit. So you never want to buy on at the top of the mountain, when it is about to start on a quick descent!

9-12 months? How about 9-12 days?

annoyingcars

any estimates on 2016 Ford Escape Titanium FWD w/2.0L engine and Nav? 5k miles, NorCal. black int/ext
very good condition, just whatever normal wear and tear for the age.

thanks!

qbrozen

About $20k

breld

kyfdx said:

stickguy said:

with the Durangos, I know it is hard to project, but realistically, which one is more likely to take a steep depreciation hit in say the next 9-12 months (AKA a Breld automotive lifespan)? Some cars tend to get creamed early, then stay relatively flat for a bit. So you never want to buy on at the top of the mountain, when it is about to start on a quick descent!

9-12 months? How about 9-12 days?

Hey now! I'll have you know that I've had my Durango for many, many days. Weeks even.

machine1973

I'd like to turn in a 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited 4x4. 10 months remaining on 36 month lease. Total monthly is 456.66. Cincinnati, OH. Can you tell me what it's worth? 18,015 miles.

Michaell

machine1973 said:

I'd like to turn in a 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited 4x4. 10 months remaining on 36 month lease. Total monthly is 456.66. Cincinnati, OH. Can you tell me what it's worth? 18,015 miles.

What color - inside and out?

What condition - good tires, interior?

machine1973

very good condition. dark gray ext, black interior heated/cooled seats, heated rear seats

qbrozen

Missing one of the most important details: which engine?

andres3

Early lease returns - Who has a lot of experience with this?

If you are way under-miles, it seems it would perhaps be easier. But time is money too, right? So let's say you hit the 36,000 mile threshold 6 months early. Wouldn't the manufacturer rather have the car back 6 months early then just have you park it 6 months? Or do they not care and just want their money?

stickguy

They don't care. It's the dealer that wants to make a sale.

qbrozen

andres3 said:

Early lease returns - Who has a lot of experience with this? If you are way under-miles, it seems it would perhaps be easier. But time is money too, right? So let's say you hit the 36,000 mile threshold 6 months early. Wouldn't the manufacturer rather have the car back 6 months early then just have you park it 6 months? Or do they not care and just want their money?

Each manufacturer has their own rules. I was able to turn my Nissan in early and just pay what I owed. Was not able to do the same when the wife had a Mitsubishi. We had to park it and wait it out. 

kyfdx

andres3 said:

Early lease returns - Who has a lot of experience with this?

If you are way under-miles, it seems it would perhaps be easier. But time is money too, right? So let's say you hit the 36,000 mile threshold 6 months early. Wouldn't the manufacturer rather have the car back 6 months early then just have you park it 6 months? Or do they not care and just want their money?

It doesn't matter if they want it back early or not. They'll use your contractual obligation to extract the maximum amount possible from you.

Mr_Shiftright

It's all about the numbers--nothing personal in it.

andres3

Mr_Shiftright said:

It's all about the numbers--nothing personal in it.

That's what I figure; so it comes down to whether they value time (say 6-months) as something substantial enough to persuade a buyer/lease returner to not let it just collect dust for 6 months.

sparky112

What do you suggest i take no less then for my honda Crv awd lx in NJ?

Its exterior is white diamond inside is all gray. 

Has appearance pkg which is pinstripe and smokey headlights extended side view mirrors as far as i know.

Kept it sparkling clean all 3 yrs

Already evaluated by honda financial inspector.

Its a lease w residual value $15265 and has 18,135 miles on it

Oh and im not being lazy i looked at KBB too and its close to my residual value so thats why im confused with the process that value was based on 15000 miles per year so shouldnt i have some value to use toward a new lease. 

Also is there anywhere else i can take it and sell it?

I used to hear a commercial but now i dont maybe called something like cars for cash? Can i do that if its on lease all my payments are made already. Maybe it be easier and faster?

Thank you

xwesx

Since you say you have had it for three years, then I'll guess that we're talking about a 2014 model?

sparky112

Yes sorry. 2014 model Thought i typed that

qbrozen

trade value is only about $14k. Carmax or Carsense might give you $15k. Residual is usually closer to retail value rather than trade value. Retail for a car like yours would be more like $18k.

If all you owe is your residual of $15,265 then, yeah, you might get someone to take it off your hands for that and avoid the disposition fee, if any.

sb55

Q
This is for my son. He has been looking at 2004-2007 range Toyota Tacoma in Northern VT. Rusty ones with over 150K miles are in the $8-9000. range.
I found this one with a lot less miles:
http://www.martysautovt.com/vehicle-details/used-2006-toyota-tacoma--milton-vt-id-17333222

Any idea of if this is a good deal?

stickguy

Those are nutty prices. Better off getting a new one. Or a domestic, even if full sized.

sb55

@stickguy
You're right. Tacoma prices are stupidly high. A 2009 4 cylinder one with 150,000 miles was on Craigslist yesterday for $9500.00. My son called about it and it was already sold to a Dealer for $10,500. 
Unfortunately he doesn't want full size and he wants a manual transmission. That cuts out a lot of inventory. 

qbrozen

sb55 said:

Q
This is for my son. He has been looking at 2004-2007 range Toyota Tacoma in Northern VT. Rusty ones with over 150K miles are in the $8-9000. range.
I found this one with a lot less miles:
http://www.martysautovt.com/vehicle-details/used-2006-toyota-tacoma--milton-vt-id-17333222

Any idea of if this is a good deal?

13k trade, $14k auction, $17k retail. So looks like a good deal if it checks out.

sparky112

qbrozen said:

trade value is only about $14k. Carmax or Carsense might give you $15k. Residual is usually closer to retail value rather than trade value. Retail for a car like yours would be more like $18k. If all you owe is your residual of $15,265 then, yeah, you might get someone to take it off your hands for that and avoid the disposition fee, if any.

Thank you
So when i go to the dealership does he buy my car for what i was gonna get it for at the $15000, my residual value then have opportunity to sell it at max up to $18000 if he wants, therefore i can use some of that as a bargaining tool toward my new lease...or am i grasping at straws? I did see it selling for close to 18000 in my area. 
Thanks in advance

andres3

I hate to ask this, but:

2016 TTS 13,000 miles, daytona gray pearl, red Nappa leather interior with black interior, fully loaded with all available options (all boxes checked) less the red painted calipers.

Great condition as it is 1 year old at the end of April. Oh yeah, it has a leaky rear-diff.

San Diego CA

28firefighter

andres3 said:

I hate to ask this, but:

2016 TTS 13,000 miles, daytona gray pearl, red Nappa leather interior with black interior, fully loaded with all available options (all boxes checked) less the red painted calipers.

Great condition as it is 1 year old at the end of April. Oh yeah, it has a leaky rear-diff.

San Diego CA

Lol. Come on man. Really?

breld

@andres3 - judgment is the last thing coming from me since I often trade out of a car early, but what's up?

qbrozen

sparky112 said:

Thank you
So when i go to the dealership does he buy my car for what i was gonna get it for at the $15000, my residual value then have opportunity to sell it at max up to $18000 if he wants, therefore i can use some of that as a bargaining tool toward my new lease...or am i grasping at straws? I did see it selling for close to 18000 in my area. 
Thanks in advance

Not sure I understand what you are saying. They'd probably list it at 19-20. If it is a Honda dealer, I'd imagine they'd CPO it. I don't see any equity here to bargain with. Really think, at best, you don't have to pay the disposition fee.

qbrozen

andres3 said:

I hate to ask this, but:

2016 TTS 13,000 miles, daytona gray pearl, red Nappa leather interior with black interior, fully loaded with all available options (all boxes checked) less the red painted calipers.

Great condition as it is 1 year old at the end of April. Oh yeah, it has a leaky rear-diff.

San Diego CA

Not sure I should help you. Haha.

Leaky diff is going to be pretty obvious. They are going to fix it, aren't they??

About $43k trade if they don't mind the drips.

andres3

breld said:

@andres3 - judgment is the last thing coming from me since I often trade out of a car early, but what's up?

Well, mainly the problems with the Haldex clutch and rear-differential both having been leaking. I haven't been given a call yet today, which as me a bit irked as it is almost noon (no updates on the action plan or how long it might take to get parts).

I love the car, but this is a bad omen, and the timing couldn't be worse. I need a trackable car for the weekend of the 7-9th.

Probably not a viable option, but I'd even consider another TTS (though depreciation will probably dissuade me). Just exploring my options.

I have no compunction or guilt to tracking an A3 quattro loaner while mine is in the shop, but I'd really REALLY REALLY rather track my TTS. I doubt my wheels/tires would fit the A3 correctly, so that's part of it. A lot of money tied up in those wheels and tires. Not even sure my wheels would fit a Golf R as they may have a bit less clearance for the width of a 255/35R19 on 19x9 wheels.