Postwar Studebakers

uplanderguy

I have both the Corgi and the Matchbox. My Corgi is a metallic turquoise.

When I was a kid the Wagonaire was my favorite Matchbox. The roof slid open even on the Matchbox version. It came with a hunter holding a rifle, and a hunting dog. I have neither now.

The high, wraparound taillights were unusual for that time but the idea has since been seen much later.

I can remember a silver '64 Commander Wagonaire with red interior in our town. A kid in my grade would be picked up in it from grade school. It had the really nice '64 full wheelcovers as I recall.

The boxy shape and high, glassy roofline really did maximize cargo space in a car of that wheelbase.

uplanderguy

Posted by Richard Quinn today on Facebook. I'd not heard the story before. The pic is in front of the Studebaker Administration Building in South Bend, where I've been several times in my life. Dewey Smith, on the right, was assigned to the Phillipines and he and his wife were taken prisoner by the Japanese and put in concentration camps. Upon release in 1945 Smith had lost 45 lbs. from his already-slim frame. The couple returned to South Bend where he eventually returned to work at Studebaker for a couple more decades.

uplanderguy

Those plaques that say "The Studebaker Corporation" and "Administration Building" are on display in the Studebaker National Museum.

fintail

The Wagonaire was cool enough that GM decided to copy it for the high trim variant of the Envoy during the Bush bubble. I suspect the original sold better (and is definitely more fondly remembered).

uplanderguy

I mentioned this some years back, but before that Envoy was released, the curator at the Studebaker National Museum Archives reported that GM requested Wagonaire blueprints from them. No illusion that they were trying to copy them, but probably just wanted to see an overview. I always thought that was pretty cool.

uplanderguy

I had posted a pic of this car not long ago, but Lou Costabile posted his video coverage of the car very recently online. The story of the car is cool, and that it has its original body, frame, and engine, in an era of 'tribute' race cars. I wish it had the "Avanti Supercharged" fender tags, but it was built before Studebaker started installing those, even though they sent the dealers a letter telling them to contact customers of sold cars to see if they wanted them installed on their car for free (as the original owners of my old white Skytop had done). Apparently since the dealership itself was running this car, they didn't feel the need to add them back then.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grZaSU6LxLc&feature=share&fbclid=IwAR3l-2SSnHSsU9v1dKFr-9-fBS5mmKGzKlCC9IbAMiOiiv8UlCZl1TRbdEg

uplanderguy

Seeing the interior views in that clip remind that a Lark, even a low-line one like this, was unusual in the compact class then, as there is no exposed hard metal at the bottom of the instrument panel, and the door panels are all vinyl and have no exposed metal surfaces. Conversely, the instruments are covered in glass, not plastic, and surrounded with bright metal, not plastic; not as safe probably but doesn't look quite as cheap IMHO.

ab348

This from Hemmings today via the Studebaker National Museum:

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2020/01/29/sleeping-in-cars-part-2-the-rarities-the-pioneers-and-the-missed-opportunities

fintail

Watch out for that first step, it's a doozie.

I wonder if one of these ever turned up at a Stude dealer for servicing:

uplanderguy

Thanks--I had seen that Stude photo before; in fact had seen it in color before at some point.

I would be scared to death driving that thing, or riding in the back!

It's a '65, which means it had Chevy 283 two-barrel power, at the most, ugh.

I see like is usual in the RV world, the chance to give it "the treatment" (the odd painted section down the side) was apparently overwhelming. It was red in the color pic I'd seen.

A small, unusual thing--Studebaker wheels were always off-white in the '62-66 model years, but they aren't on this particular car.

uplanderguy

In that pic of the 'Benz, I guess it's an illusion that it looks like the 'cab' per se, is wider than the 'bed', but I think it's because of that opening section behind the door someone added.

uplanderguy

Butzer Bros. Studebaker in Ephrata, PA, the oldest Studebaker dealer in the country, getting ready for demolition here in 1970. Note M-B 180 out front.

uplanderguy

Last new Studebaker built which was sold to the public, sent to a dealer in Lockport, NY. It's the second-from-last Studebaker built. It's the rare 1966 Olive Green Metallic, which I like, with the 'Champagne' (off-white) all-vinyl interior, which I also like. Harrah's had the vehicle in their collection for a lot of years.

http://www.autoinformant.com/car_pages/1966-studebaker-wagonaire-station-wagon/

ab348

That was a handsome building.

fintail

Building only made it 60 years, sad, probably equivalent to the mid-century buildings being lost here to be replaced by more "luxury" condos for residency purchasing "investors" and generic office towers. Ponton was also getting old in 1970, maybe the owner rustproofed it.

fintail

Speaking of Stude buildings, the old dealer location down the street for me is really on borrowed time now. The business that was once in the building has been gone for 2 months now, and the adjacent business in a small building has also now vacated, along with the adjacent old strip mall being cleared out. It's all going to be razed for a generic new office tower development, I believe, and if some of those condos I mentioned above were in the mix, I wouldn't be shocked.

sda

fintail said:

Speaking of Stude buildings, the old dealer location down the street for me is really on borrowed time now. The business that was once in the building has been gone for 2 months now, and the adjacent business in a small building has also now vacated, along with the adjacent old strip mall being cleared out. It's all going to be razed for a generic new office tower development, I believe, and if some of those condos I mentioned above were in the mix, I wouldn't be shocked.

That’s all they do locally. Rarely is an older building repurposed. They are routinely razed and new high rise office, condos go up. Worse it pushes low income people out who have little hope of finding something nearby to rent. This has added to the growing homeless population.

imidazol97

Repurposed: This is a former AC Delco plant that closed 30 or more years ago. I think it made shock absorbers or brake bands. It was bought by a fellow who's made a business of closeout merchandise and a bunch of electronic merchandise that was related to NCR's business in Dayton long ago. It's across from the Dayton Dragon's ballpark.

I refused to ride the industrial elevators they had to take people up to the 4th floor where electronics was. I walked the stairs. Long ago a building in downtown Cincinnati had a car crushed with the parking lot worker in it. I just don't trust those elevators.

Mendelson's has been a standard for decades for flea market level junk and early computer stuff.

This is a mock up of what the end outcome for this building is to be.

fintail

To be fair, most of the old buildings here can't be repurposed - they are too small, and the land is too valuable, so one has to build up. For reference, the old Stude dealer, a 3300 sq ft building on a 13000 sq ft lot, sold for 7.8MM last summer. The other business, a lube shop, an 1800 sq ft building on a 12500 sq ft lot, sold for 4.8MM in late 2015 And the strip mall, a 60000 sq ft building on a 3.3 acre lot, sold for 45MM in 2016. It's pretty nutty here, not much in the way of "affordable" housing, even for those with decent incomes. We're SF or Vancouver part II.

sda said:

That’s all they do locally. Rarely is an older building repurposed. They are routinely razed and new high rise office, condos go up. Worse it pushes low income people out who have little hope of finding something nearby to rent. This has added to the growing homeless population.

uplanderguy

I wasn't able to log in for a few days for whatever reason. Thanks for posting those repurposed buildings pics. The Studebaker Body Building in South Bend has been repurposed as a technical (computer) facility of some sort and looks great as it's the tallest building in the downtown area. "Mayor Pete" announced his campaign from there.

Here's a 1962 ad I've always liked. The white on both these cars is elegant IMHO:

uplanderguy

Photos taken this morning of the interior of the Studebaker Administration Building in South Bend; used by permission of the photographer, Timothy Janowiak. In 1969 Studebaker sold this building for $1 to the South Bend School Administration Corporation, who used it until 2008. Sadly, it has been unoccupied since then. I've toured the building in 1990, then three times afterwards--the last time in 2018. It had deteriorated with each visit. The heavy woodwork is in the executive offices; the bathroom shown is off the President's office; the mural of 'The History of Transportation' on the inside walls starts with ancient vehicles and ends with 1940's Studebakers. The open area on the one floor was where a typing pool was located. It is remarkably unchanged inside from Studebaker days. Its future is undetermined. Four floors in total, plus a basement.

fin, this is across the street from where that '60 Benz is parked that you had looked at.

uplanderguy

fintail

Wow, impressive preservation, surprised the scavengers or hipster architectural salvage people haven't looted that place.

I assume it's the brick building at far left:

uplanderguy

That's it. I was sorry to see a couple of the first-floor windows boarded up last time I was in town. My last tour, there was evidence someone cut down a chandelier but couldn't get it out, and some spray paint graffiti on one interior wall ("Racism Sucks").

When I first saw that 'Benz, I thought it was sort-of hipster cool that it was the era that had been sold through Stude dealers, and it was sitting across the street from the Corporate office building. The owner saw me outside his second-floor apartment window and came out to talk, telling me he thought it might get some attention there when the International Studebaker Drivers' Club Meet was in town in 2017.

That neighborhood has declined since I first started visiting South Bend with any regularity, in 1988. Last tour of the building I participated in, in 2018, there was a group of us so I wasn't scared, LOL. Cool to see one guy parking his Avanti and a couple Lark-types parking on the street to the left of the building for the tour.

uplanderguy

October 1963 photo inside the building. I was in kindergarten, LOL. Production in the U.S. would end only two months later.

The 'history of transportation' mural (frieze?) ends with 1910 Studebakers, when the artwork was done. My memory of it in the earlier post was wrong.

fintail

Are the murals tile or painted? They knew how to design things then, and built them to last. Workmanship is a forgotten art. I assume if the building is not saved, the nearby museum will rescue a lot of that stuff.

That Ponton is within potential restoration, but not economically feasible. It doesn't look too rotten and appears complete, but quality body/paint/chrome would exceed the value of a restored car. I remember that neighborhood looked a little rough, but not nearly enough to make me leery. Then again, it was a cold Saturday morning and virtually deserted.

uplanderguy

The murals are painted.

I first went to an international meet there in 1988, shortly after I bought my first Stude, the white '63 Skytop. At that time, the original Studebaker Museum was in the old Freeman-Spicer Stude/MB (and later Chrysler) dealership building just on the other side of that railroad overpass. The building is gone now. The meet was on a lot of streets surrounding the museum (but not S. Main St., the street in front of the Administration Building). I was in hog heaven. I'd never seen so many Studebakers in one place in my life--really, that many don't show up at our International Meets now (dying/aging membership of course). It was hot as hell and the old Union Station just behind and ever-so-slightly north of the Administration Building was air-conditioned and they were selling snacks and cold drinks in there. It was/is a beautiful building.

Back to the Administration Building--the lobby was remodeled in 1961 and still looks like it, LOL. Semi-circular receptionist desk in the center, and they used to have two current models on display in the lobby. I have seen a pic in our magazine of a 190SL on display there, probably late fifties or early sixties of course.

fintail

I wonder if aging membership is a thing for maker specific car clubs in general. MBCA meets are also heavily slanted towards the retiree demographic. There are some younger people, even younger than me lately, which is a good sign, but we are in the minority.

That illuminated false ceiling definitely has a mid century vibe, but with the angularity of the building itself, it doesn't clash too bad.

benjaminh

Enjoyed the pictures of building as it originally was. But it's also interesting to see what it looks like today. Poignant. Thanks.

uplanderguy

Thanks; I love the history as well as the cars.

fin, I think defunct marques have the problem in a more advanced state, of members dying/getting too old. The Packard club in my local area disbanded because of this. Studebaker lasted ten years longer than Packard, and tended to be less-expensive (in general) than Packards, so I think these things brought boomers into the fold more, but even boomers are of course dying off and getting older.

The international club was 13K members thirty years ago. It's about 10.8K now.

benjaminh

For the reasons you mention, I've started to try to make it more of a priority to get to the various car museums within driving distance of Louisville. A few in my driving range have already closed down in the 21 years I've been here.

It's about 5 hours to South Bend from where I live, if you include a stop or two along the way, and so when I finally get there I'm going to need a B & B to make that work. Maybe this summer I can get my wife to go with me on a tour....

uplanderguy

I love the Studebaker National Museum, and it has some real top-quality stuff there, including prototypes, but know that it's not huge. It is two floors plus overflow in the basement. Lots of carriages including the one that took Lincoln to Ford's Theater--personally, I'd be happy if the whole building was postwar cars and trucks. But I'd see if I could wrangle a tour through the Archives Building next door too. Next door to the Archives Building is the Avanti Guest House, full of Avanti stuff on the walls, but I wouldn't call it a B&B! Near the museum is the Oliver House B&B I believe it's called....beautiful from the outside. If you need advice on a trip, there, I'll happily help.

uplanderguy

I'd recommend a visit to the Gilmore near Kalamazoo, MI, and also the Auburn/Cord/Duesenberg and National Auto and Truck Museum in Auburn. I think fin would second that!

uplanderguy

Posted this car over a year ago...but other than a dark-colored Gran Turismo Hawk, this is the Studebaker I'd like to own the most. I'd get rid of my low-mileage original '66 Cruiser in a heartbeat for this car...a '63 Cruiser with Skytop and the optional broadcloth upholstery--I have never seen another one. Probably the most-European American car you could buy then--especially in the compact field:





The front bumper guards are one hole in too close, which drives me nuts. Dealers sometimes did this wrong, or in replacement over the years it happened. My OCD would make me change that, LOL.

fintail

Yep, 10/10 would do again for all of those museums, definitely worth the trip. The RV/Motorhome Hall of Fame in Elkhart (not far from South Bend) is also a fun detour if you are into that kind of thing. Hopefully all of these places can weather changing demographics, I think they'll be OK in the short term anyway. I can't imagine it is easy to run a car museum. The big German makers all operate their own museums in the homeland, all worth a visit as well, they can be subsidized by the maker and maybe not rely on cash flow as much.

I have to imagine MB cars had some influence on Stude when that 63 Cruiser was made.

ab348

Article posted on Hemmings today about a Studebaker drag racer, Ted Harbit.

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2020/03/04/a-little-studebaker-v-8-history-with-one-of-the-most-successful-stude-drag-racers

kyfdx

benjaminh said:

For the reasons you mention, I've started to try to make it more of a priority to get to the various car museums within driving distance of Louisville. A few in my driving range have already closed down in the 21 years I've been here.

It's about 5 hours to South Bend from where I live, if you include a stop or two along the way, and so when I finally get there I'm going to need a B & B to make that work. Maybe this summer I can get my wife to go with me on a tour....

Have you been to the Lane Auto Museum in Nashville?

If you like weird stuff, that's the place to go.

uplanderguy

Article posted on Hemmings today about a Studebaker drag racer, Ted Harbit.

Thanks for the notice. He's pretty legendary in Stude circles. He's driven that red supercharged Lark of his ("The Stude Tomato") at the "Pure Stock Muscle Car Drags" in Michigan and even at his advanced age has embarrassed a Big Three car or two or three. He also has driven his friend's one-owner '64 R3 Lark Challenger there and has spanked quite a few other performance cars.

He's a retired teacher from Indiana and noticed a new female teacher there (in the '60's) was driving an Avanti. He ended up marrying her.

uplanderguy

I can also recommend the Lane Museum in Nashville. When I was working there in 2006 someone locally recommended it to me and a coworker and we enjoyed it. It's much oddball stuff in my memory, but very cool.

fintail

I wonder if any Stude-MB dealerships were like this. I found this image online, not sure where it is from (likely European), I suspect it was made in 1960 by the illustrated cars. Lots of action going on here:

imidazol97

The local Studebaker (Packard) store had a Benz in the corner of the showroom which had only 2 other cars in it.
I don't recall when the Packards showed up in that store. I recall my brother-in-law was a mechanic there when I was little.

uplanderguy

A fair amount (but not all) Studebaker dealers got Packard starting with the 1955 model year. My hometown Stude dealer did that, although he had originally signed with Packard in 1941 and dropped them, or was dropped by them, in around 1950 beforehand. A good friend of mine who writes for Hemmings Classic Cars was the son of a Packard dealer that added Studebaker about that same time. Packard benefitted, in terms of sales outlets, more from the buyout of Studebaker than the other way around.

uplanderguy

Back to the Ted Harbit article: A certain former moderator used to say that only a non-original Studebaker could do what Ted Harbit had done to other Big Three cars...in fact, cheating was implied. It's interesting in the article from yesterday, that Ted said he had opened up the engine of the car to prove it's stock. I had to laugh--I mentioned to that moderator once how I'm sure that Ted and the owner of the '64 R3 Lark Challenger--one a retired teacher and the other a retired university music professor--were the 'Bonnie and Clyde' of immoral stock-automobile shenanigans, LOL.

fintail

One for you to examine, uplanderguy

uplanderguy

Thanks, I hadn't seen that. I really should follow BaT. I do "Barn Finds", which for some reason tends to irritate me more than it should.

That '63 sure presents nicely. Sometimes I think I was a fool to sell my old one, which this one resembles. It was beginning to need some refreshing; blue smoke upon start-up among some other things.

Most the love in the S.D.C. is for '64's, which I do like a lot but the '63 hardtop has its charms. As I've mentioned many times, I'd love a '63 Cruiser (sedan). In a perfect world of Larks, I'd like a '63 and a '64. For a guy like me who didn't want to spend much money, I got a nice, solid, original, Cruiser now with Chevy power. Thought that would make getting service easier. Funny thing, the engine's the only thing that I've had to have stuff done to since I got the car, LOL.

My general OCD makes me point out these non-authentic things about the '63 on BaT:

1) Wheel covers from a Gran Turismo Hawk; '63 Lark full wheel disks had the band of white
2) Front bumper guards one bolt in too close on each side
3) Mirror placement on front fenders (although those are Stude mirrors, correct-year)
4) Interior door panels missing bright trim in the centers. (Amazingly, the seat covers are NOS or a fussy upholstery-shop repro. Most people leave out the Lark 'bird' on the rear seat back.)

fintail

I posted it just for the OCD nitpicks

BaT is a mixed blessing, fun to browse, but encourages speculation and the flipping industry, which harms enthusiasts not attached to a 6 figure income and/or trust fund.

uplanderguy

Saw this pic this morning. North side of the Administration Building in South Bend in 1938, with the New York Central 20th Century Limited blowing by:

uplanderguy

1963 Studebaker Shareholder Meeting at Notre Dame. First 1:30 shows cars on display, including M-B's. I'll take the dark-colored '63 Cruiser at about 1:14. If it were a Skytop, supercharged, and disc brakes, I'd be especially appreciative, LOL. Note: no sound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6LpuZEPzx4

uplanderguy

Sheesh fin, that white Lark hardtop you posted above is bid to $20K with three hours to go! That would be the highest non-Avanti-powered Lark hardtop I've ever seen.

fintail

BaT carries a "tax" of sorts, it seems so much there goes for far more than expected or would be reasonably assumed in a normal market. Speculators, shills, I don't know what it is.

Cool video clip, interesting the fintails all have wide whites (possible through MY 1964), and the then-new pagoda SL on the turntable, also on wide whites.