Iluv, good luck whichever way you go. I know so much about bugs because I bought my first car - a used '66 Bug, and I drove it from 63K when I got it to 235K when I finally sold it! My brother had a 1970 and my best friend had a 1971 Super Beetle. We took apart and rebuilt his engine, so the Bugs are where I learned about cars and car engines. I could tune up my '66 very quickly and easily.
In my experience it will be harder to find interior-type parts than anything mechanical. But I suspect that it would still be easier to find old interior parts of a '60s-vintage bug than even some American cars from the '80s or '90s.
Interesting you say that about vintage Bug interior parts because that was one my questions for the guy selling the '67 VW Bug, what does the interior look like. He said it was in pretty good shape but the seat was out in the back and "they just bought some material and made a makeshift back seating area." Not a deal-breaker for me, I've seen some of those while I've been perusing the net for 60's Bug's and I actually like some of them.
I picked up a 'hot VW's' magazine at Megalow-Mart® in Ruidoso, NM, and consumed the information like a piranha while my wife shopped. I may order that magazine for home consumption...it's chock full of helpful information and personal restoration articles left and right.
Thinking of taking an early morning cruise by the lot here in a tad and looking in on my...umm...his Bug. It's good that his starting point is $3,000. That is right in the sweet spot for 60's Bugs where they're possessing some real decent bodies and paint and wheels and tires.
1967 VW Beetle in red and missing it's front bumper
Funny, I don't feel I need to rush ta buy this one near me but it is the best one I've seen near here so far. The one pictured above has the stock VW Bug wheels on it.
For how long then? 20 years? 40 years? Chrysler been through a bankruptcy and two or three owners since 1993.
I'm sure there has to be a statute of limitations at some point. FWIW, when GM went through that saddle tank fiasco on their '73-87 trucks (and newer, on 3/4+ tons, Suburbans, full-sized Blazers, etc), even though they were exonerated, they did some kind of good will measure. I think it varied, depending on the age of the vehicle.
In the case of my '85 Silverado, my grandmother still owned it at the time, and GM gave her a rebate voucher. I think it was good for something like $1000 off the purchase of a new GM vehicle (can't remember if the truck had to be traded or not), but after a certain amount of time it dropped to $500, and then expired.
At the time, I think the truck was only 9 or 10 years old, wasn't getting driven a whole lot (Granddad had died in 1990, and it was his truck), we figured it wasn't *that* dangerous and nobody in the family really needed a new vehicle at the time. So we just let it expire.
I wonder how hard of an impact it's taking to make these old Grand Cherokees burst into flames? From some of the pictures I've seen, it often looks like the body's still in pretty good shape. So it's not like the Crown Vics that the police were complaining about, where it would usually take a 70 mph hit into a stationary vehicle to get them to blow. Or the GM trucks, where again, it would usually be a high-speed impact to get them to explode (and even then, sometimes it took a model rocket igniter to do it!)
In contrast, I think it only took an 11 mph rear-end impact to not only get a Pinto to leak fuel into the passenger compartment, but also jam the doors shut, making it harder to exit the car.
The other alternative is to do like the Japanese do - make inspections required, and make them so onerous and expensive, we all wind up buying new cars every ten years or less.
>How long then>? As long as it takes to fix the ones that are still on the road that they can find. I just had a recall on my 9 year old Pontiac Vibe. I've never had a problem with it, but apparently enough vehicles have to warrant a recall. If there's a clear defect that is dangerous they have to fix it.
My Mercury Grand Marquis has a fuel shut-off device that activates if the car gets hit. I accidentally bumped loading a plastic tote full of paints and solvents in the trunk on Benner and Tabor in NE Philly and couldn't get the car to start. I had it towed to a nearby garage on Oxford Avenue. The mechanic took one look, hit a reset button on top of the device which is located on the inside of the left quarter panel, turned the key, and it fired up right away. Boy, was I embarrassed! Luckily, the guy didn't charge me and the tow was covered by AAA.
I think Ford has used fuel shutoffs for awhile now. I remember back in college, my then-girlfriend's friend had a Ford Escort. 1989 I think. And this was the summer of 1989, so it couldn't have been any newer than that. Anyway, one night her car wouldn't start. And yep, it was a fuel shutoff switch, or something, that had gotten bumped.
So the new CTS is going to compete price-wise, when optioned up, with the new Audi A6?
Well, if the ATS is meant to compete with the 3-series / A4 / C-class, it stands to reason that the CTS will now go head to head with the 5-series / A6 / E-class.
I agree. I expect if anything that it will send even more buyers to German brands if it only means a couple of grand more to do so. Buyers in this class who are wanting that level of performance and luxury that comes with the 50 -60 grand pricetag are going to buy the real deal.
Caddy has shot themselves in the foot with this proposition, hopefully they've budgeted for incentive spending...
And man is it an ungainly, ugly mess. Hope it looks better in the flesh. :sick:
Caddy has shot themselves in the foot with this proposition, hopefully they've budgeted for incentive spending...
Leave it to GM to rush an offering! They did OK with the ATS but really, for the same price, just forget it and buy the 3'er if you really want the real thing. The ATS is close but the play would have been the value price which Caddy's ego can not comprehend.
Ditto the CTS.
Note to GM: Beat the Koreans at the lux game by over delivering at a lower price-point. Anyone at home???
I agree. I expect if anything that it will send even more buyers to German brands if it only means a couple of grand more to do so. Buyers in this class who are wanting that level of performance and luxury that comes with the 50 -60 grand pricetag are going to buy the real deal.
On the contrary, I think there are many people who would prefer to buy the American brand if the car is comparable to the German or Japanese brand. Reading the consumer reviews of the ATS show this to be the case. Many of the owners felt it was equal to or better than the 3-series at a lower price point.
Of course not all would agree with that but I know I would prefer to buy a domestic brand over a foreign brand, especially if the features, price, driving characteristics, reliability, etc, were similar.
" Many of the owners felt it was equal to or better than the 3-series at a lower price point. "
That may be true but I bet you those were not former BMW owners...there's a difference, in such a mature market as the USA, between "getting" market share with brand new buyers, and "stealing market share" from someone else.
If they don't graduate from ATS to CTS then Cadillac is relegated to fighting it out in the most difficult market segment there is.
Delivering a better value proposition than the Germans and beating the Koreans is easier said than done, don't you think? There's no question that Cadillac has very tough competition, but the ATS and XTS are selling very well.
"Well if it does, it is outclassed I think, by a far margin. Cadillac is going to have to upgrade the interior materials for one thing. "
I was reading a few months ago in either MT or C&D how Caddy had planned on using $5 door handles for a new car.....bean counters said no way....Gotta use the $1.50 ones.
As much as they try sometimes I don't think GM will ever learn. How long before they fly company jets to DC to beg for more of our money?
As I recall that was for the new flagship model that we haven't seen yet, and the bean counters had been overruled, but I may be remembering it wrong. In any case before we condemn Cadillac for the pricing can w at least wait to see the car and what is included in that price? I am pretty sure that unlike the similar priced German cars that the caddy will at least include leather instead of "leatherette" like the German cars ( now wether the leather will look like leatherette is another matter that we won't know until we see it). In any case everyone seems to expect Caddy to see the car at a loss, if the car is comparable in quality, performance and perhaps has more features why shouldn't its base price be close to the Germans? If it falls down in one or more of these areas than it will be discounted quickly ( as apparently the Germans are from the post above that stated their prices were soft). I also doubt fully loaded that the CTS will come close in price to the Germans ( but we shall see).
While I agree the ATS is a great car from Caddy out of the box, it has stiff competition. As you can see, no hint of conquest sales there...
My point regarding the value the Koreans are offering in the lux segment is a strategy completely ignored by Caddy for the ATS and now they are loosing the price advantage which the CTS had. Most likely the UAW have a hand in that! Easier said than done is spot on!
Now here is the more difficult part....
CTS Sales 2012 = 46,979 (2005 Sales = 61,572) BMW 5 Series 2012 = 56,798 Mercedes E-Class 2012 = 65,171 Audi A-6 2012 =18,998
The second gen CTS was the best Caddy produced in decades but as you can see, raising it's price in stiff competition could drive sales away since it WAS the value proposition in it's segment. I'll bet it's an even better car that the outgoing one but expecting sales to grow as the value equalizes within the higher price bracket isn't going to gain conquest sales afaic. I expect sales will continue at the 38 -40K annual rate.
Caddy XTS sales ytd = 12,450 Caddy DTS sales 2011 full year = 11,589 (2006 sales =58,224)
XTS is doing fine so far but far below the DTS's best year.
the simple up/down knobs (I'm not even talkin' key fob here!) on the '67 VW Bug? That's a ridiculous way to engineer the doorknobs...kinda borders on overengineering.
Ya think? As I ponder a move and a causing of WWIII here in the iluv home of south-central NM, my...umm...someone's for sale 1967 white VW Bug with 4-speed transmission and cool wheels and nicely-treaded tires sits just west of town awaiting a new life with somebody.
People 40 and over are simply not going to switch from BMW to Cadillac at this point. I just can't see it.
Apparently some did, according to these Edmunds ATS reviewers:
this is a great car, period. Is it a great value? Compared to a similarly equipped 3 series, absolutely. I was ready to "pull the trigger" on a $56K 3 series but couldn't justify its value, especially with that pathetic plastic screen sticking up out of the top of the dash board, really? CUE, like your first smart phone or new computer operating system, needs understanding. However, it's appalling to see Consumer Reports slam ATS's rating because of CUE--shame on them. The ATS is fun to drive, the sound system is outstanding, cabin noise is non-existent and it handles like a dream --better than a 3 series
have owned two M3s and an S4 among other cars. But after test-driving the 3.6 ATS and comparing prices, the Caddy ATS won hands down for me. For handling, ride comfort, and braking, ATS beats the others. Yeah, M3 is quicker by .7 sec to 60 ... not a big deal unless you take your ride to the track every weekend. Mileage: 19mpg city, 29 highway(!), 24 combined so no complaints there especially as compared to M3. This car is a pleasure to drive with its great handling, and it feels good to have finally cut the cord to those overpriced Germans. CUE is not perfect but is far from a deal-breaker. Overall: this car is a winner and I have NO regrets with this purchase.
Having owned several BMW's, I thought I'd never own any other brand(especially a Cadillac). When my last BMW's lease was up in Dec 2012, I looked at both the 535 and 335.... lease prices were insane! Additionally, I had a hard time telling the 3 from the 5 series, and interiors were blah! After reading several reviews of the ATS, I decided that a test drive wouldn't hurt, my expectations not being high, I was pleasantly surprised, and, frankly, somewhat stunned how well the ATS drove! After several more test drives(2.0T AWD vs. 3.6 AWD) I now an ATS in my garage!
But nonetheless....interesting...what are their ages I wonder?
Also, let's talk to them in 12 months and see how the car holds up.
I thought it was interesting that in Yahoo Answers, under "Car Makes", where younger people tend to go to talk about cars, they don't even list Cadillac as a brand.
I'd be more curious to see what happens when the new caddy owners have their first experience dealing with warranty issues with a GM dealership. GM service departments are famous for the "could not duplicate" answer to warranty issues.
Apparently some did, according to these Edmunds ATS reviewers:
Every make suffers from some amount of customer "breakage", so its not surprising to see the comments you posted. And, IMO, that's a good thing, because without it, we wouldn't ever really get true comparison opinions from long-term owners.
I think the ATS is a good product, but its got a stiff uphill battle ahead of it, going after the 3-series luxury-performance vehicle range provided by the German (and Japanese) brands already entrenched in that segment.
Ya think? As I ponder a move and a causing of WWIII here in the iluv home of south-central NM, my...umm...someone's for sale 1967 white VW Bug with 4-speed transmission and cool wheels and nicely-treaded tires sits just west of town awaiting a new life with somebody.
Schweet!
This one's got better paint and it's front bumper, and is creme colored instead of white, but it's the same model year and good lookin', too!
I'd be more curious to see what happens when the new caddy owners have their first experience dealing with warranty issues with a GM dealership. GM service departments are famous for the "could not duplicate" answer to warranty issues.
I believe you are confusing Chevrolet with Cadillac. If you've never owned a Cadillac, never had the pleasure of engaging with a Cadillac dealership, and their truly outstanding service department, then you really have no idea of how nice an experience it is. I have never been treated better in my life than when I bought a used Cadillac still under warranty. Never. Not by anyone, anywhere. If I could afford a new Cadillac, I would be driving one. Period.
I purchased a 2006 Cadillac CTS in May 2010. Since the purchase, I have had several car repairs resulting in thousands of dollars. I make sure that I receive regular oil changes and follow recommendations for Mobil 1 oil only. I have to purchase approximately 6 to 8 quarts of the oil to add to my engine between oil changes. I had my mechanic assess the vehicle and there are no leaks. The car simply "drinks" oil. This is quite an expense since an oil change is approximately $100 and a quart of Mobil 1 oil is $10 a quart. This is simply unacceptable. I have read many complaints where people have lost their engines over oil consumption. It's simply not fair to the consumer to have to bear this expense for a product that is supposed to be trusted. In addition to this, I am putting brakes on my vehicle (front and back) twice a year. This is unheard of. There needs to be some accountability and responsibility for the makers of this vehicle.
I purchased a 2012 Cadillac SRX about 8 months ago. The lift arms that keep the back hatch up both had to be replaced. I have had an ongoing intermittent problem with the display being static or shutting completely off. The vehicle is having an idle problem when the vehicle is stopped and when accelerating. When I expressed my frustration to the service manager, he told me, "Well, GM makes the car; we have nothing to do with that." I responded that they "sold" me the car. I want the vehicle fixed and I don't want to bring the car in for a third time for the same problem.
My 2012 Cadillac CTS had steering problems, steering wheel locked while driving and engine was running! The local dealer checked the car and said there is nothing wrong with it since no error codes exist upon inspection! Safety issue + bad dealer = killing machine.
>service departments are famous for the "could not duplicate" answer to warranty issues.
I think you are confusing them with Honda's service on the VCM, CVT, transmissions for decades on their models including the Acruas. And then there's the sludging from toyota that didn't exist for years in their minds followed by runaway acceleration. And now we have many recalls from both. And I'm sure all we have to do is look for some unhappy owners of the cheapest brands, Kia and Hyundai.
I've found the Chevy dealer for my Cobalt to be exceeding careful and friendly. They took very good care of us after the purchase--but when I was in for any service, I noted that they treated ALL the customers the same.
The old wives tales about mistreatment at GM are just slow to die.
I have owned several new Chevys and Fords. One each Volkswagen and Mazda. One not-new but under warranty Cadillac. I owned the Mazda for 3.5 years and it never saw the service department, so I cannot speak for Mazda service. Chevy and Ford dealership service departments tend to vary from mediocre to bad to worse. With the recent VW, I visited two service departments. The first, where we purchased the car, was very typical, reminded me of the average Chevy or Ford service department. The 2nd (am I allowed to name it here? What the h***, West Houston Volkswagen, they deserve the plug) is seriously trying to reach that elite status that I have only seen before from Cadillac dealerships.
I have never been to a Mercedes or BMW dealership, not even to look at their new cars, much less have cause to visit their service departments. I would hope that they are as nice to do business with as Cadillac. I cannot imagine that they are any better.
On edit: I forgot to mention Mopar. My last dealings with a Dodge dealership service department was around 1994. They were so bad, so crooked, I contacted Chrysler Corporation and offered them documentary evidence of the dealership charging them for warranty work that was not performed. Chrysler was not interested, never responded. I have never set foot in one of their showrooms since.
A truly great dealership can make the ownership of a mediocre auto pleasurable, just as a rotten dealership can make life somewhat miserable in the ownership of a great auto.
I've experience it both ways. The Pontiac/Cadillac dealership my family patronized in my hometown was excellent. Funny, GM cut that dealership during its downsizing and financial woes.
At the same time, the nearest VW dealership (30 miles away) was widely known as being anything and everything but professional. That dealership ended up costing VW a lot of sales back in the 70-80's. Crooked doesn't adequately describe them.
No, he is correct. My experience with GMC's "Could not duplicate" response to the Yukon MAP sensor went 3 times unanswered until I invoked the "Lemon Law" documentation.
All of a sudden, the dealer hooked up with "GM Technical" and discovered the problem.
If you've never owned a Cadillac, never had the pleasure of engaging with a Cadillac dealership, and their truly outstanding service department, then you really have no idea of how nice an experience it is.
While I'm glad that you have had a great experience, you are in the minority. Only way to get A1 treatment in a GM dealership is to know one of the owners, GM, Service Manager etc. When bean counters run the company you will find quality and service lacking for the sake of the bottom line.
Greg, if that poster had hung around here long enough, he'd know that only negative stuff about GM ever comes out of that person's keyboard fingers. And that's no wive's tale.
2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
While I'm glad that you have had a great experience, you are in the minority. Only way to get A1 treatment in a GM dealership is to know one of the owners, GM, Service Manager etc. When bean counters run the company you will find quality and service lacking for the sake of the bottom line.
Your post seems to have few facts and alot of bias. Perosonally my experience with a Saturn and Chevrolet dealership have been great.
Anectodaly, my niece a few years back stood around a half an hour at a Toyota dealership without help. When she finally talked to a salesperson she felt as if they sold her a car they were doing her a favor. She bought a Honda instead.
In my own experience, purchasing a Nissan was not a pleasant experience. However buying a Chevrolet for my son was absoultely painless and buying a Saturn for my wife was almost a pleasure.
It seems to me GM dealers have to treat their customers better to win back and gain customers, and I have found that to be the case.
The Caddy dealer in my town seems to have a good enough rep - I haven't heard horror stories (the word usually gets out - BMW and MB people had to shape up some time ago). I think the Japanese makes have reformed the sales and service business to where most dealers know what to do - now just concentrate on the product.
I still think GM/Caddy needs to offer 110% of the competition spec at 80% of the price (at most) to woo people in - offering 105% for 95% won't do it. ATS might be close to doing that. It's a good move to bump the new CTS upmarket a notch, as IMO it did not legitimately compete with the 5er/E/A6 before. The new entrant doesn't get to define the market.
That is right. It does cut both ways. That's why the "everyone" example of GM's characteristics always bad has been a joke for me and it's not tolerable. It's time for reality about all brands. I had a Buick store (Pontiac, GMAC, Chevrolet) that was top notch. Ironically, they lost the Buick franchise in the dust up.
Comments
In my experience it will be harder to find interior-type parts than anything mechanical. But I suspect that it would still be easier to find old interior parts of a '60s-vintage bug than even some American cars from the '80s or '90s.
Interesting you say that about vintage Bug interior parts because that was one my questions for the guy selling the '67 VW Bug, what does the interior look like. He said it was in pretty good shape but the seat was out in the back and "they just bought some material and made a makeshift back seating area." Not a deal-breaker for me, I've seen some of those while I've been perusing the net for 60's Bug's and I actually like some of them.
I picked up a 'hot VW's' magazine at Megalow-Mart® in Ruidoso, NM, and consumed the information like a piranha while my wife shopped. I may order that magazine for home consumption...it's chock full of helpful information and personal restoration articles left and right.
Thinking of taking an early morning cruise by the lot here in a tad and looking in on my...umm...his Bug. It's good that his starting point is $3,000. That is right in the sweet spot for 60's Bugs where they're possessing some real decent bodies and paint and wheels and tires.
1967 VW Beetle in red and
missing it's front bumper
Funny, I don't feel I need to rush ta buy this one near me but it is the best one I've seen near here so far.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I'm sure there has to be a statute of limitations at some point. FWIW, when GM went through that saddle tank fiasco on their '73-87 trucks (and newer, on 3/4+ tons, Suburbans, full-sized Blazers, etc), even though they were exonerated, they did some kind of good will measure. I think it varied, depending on the age of the vehicle.
In the case of my '85 Silverado, my grandmother still owned it at the time, and GM gave her a rebate voucher. I think it was good for something like $1000 off the purchase of a new GM vehicle (can't remember if the truck had to be traded or not), but after a certain amount of time it dropped to $500, and then expired.
At the time, I think the truck was only 9 or 10 years old, wasn't getting driven a whole lot (Granddad had died in 1990, and it was his truck), we figured it wasn't *that* dangerous and nobody in the family really needed a new vehicle at the time. So we just let it expire.
I wonder how hard of an impact it's taking to make these old Grand Cherokees burst into flames? From some of the pictures I've seen, it often looks like the body's still in pretty good shape. So it's not like the Crown Vics that the police were complaining about, where it would usually take a 70 mph hit into a stationary vehicle to get them to blow. Or the GM trucks, where again, it would usually be a high-speed impact to get them to explode (and even then, sometimes it took a model rocket igniter to do it!)
In contrast, I think it only took an 11 mph rear-end impact to not only get a Pinto to leak fuel into the passenger compartment, but also jam the doors shut, making it harder to exit the car.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
For as long as they exist. Lesson: Make the best products!
There are alternatives if it gets too hard for any company!
How long should Bernie Madoff be on the hook??
Exactly. Or "Get out of the way", as Lee Iaccoca once said!
Priced new small aircraft lately? A new two seater Cessna starts at $149,900.
Oh, yeah, good luck with THAT.... :surprise:
Well, if the ATS is meant to compete with the 3-series / A4 / C-class, it stands to reason that the CTS will now go head to head with the 5-series / A6 / E-class.
I haven't sat in any of them so I can't comment on that.
Caddy has shot themselves in the foot with this proposition, hopefully they've budgeted for incentive spending...
And man is it an ungainly, ugly mess. Hope it looks better in the flesh. :sick:
Welcome to the new reality! The Big 3 just forgot the value equation. Toyota had it but forgot it all the same. You kill people you fix it. Period.
Oh, yeah, good luck with THAT....
Exactly! Let's see how much sales Caddy steals from the Germans and the Asians.
Leave it to GM to rush an offering! They did OK with the ATS but really, for the same price, just forget it and buy the 3'er if you really want the real thing. The ATS is close but the play would have been the value price which Caddy's ego can not comprehend.
Ditto the CTS.
Note to GM: Beat the Koreans at the lux game by over delivering at a lower price-point. Anyone at home???
On the contrary, I think there are many people who would prefer to buy the American brand if the car is comparable to the German or Japanese brand.
Reading the consumer reviews of the ATS show this to be the case. Many of the owners felt it was equal to or better than the 3-series at a lower price point.
Of course not all would agree with that but I know I would prefer to buy a domestic brand over a foreign brand, especially if the features, price, driving characteristics, reliability, etc, were similar.
That may be true but I bet you those were not former BMW owners...there's a difference, in such a mature market as the USA, between "getting" market share with brand new buyers, and "stealing market share" from someone else.
If they don't graduate from ATS to CTS then Cadillac is relegated to fighting it out in the most difficult market segment there is.
I was reading a few months ago in either MT or C&D how Caddy had planned on using $5 door handles for a new car.....bean counters said no way....Gotta use the $1.50 ones.
As much as they try sometimes I don't think GM will ever learn. How long before they fly company jets to DC to beg for more of our money?
Mercedes C-class sales = 38,263
Caddy ATS sales = 15,274
Audi A-4 sales ytd = 38,530
While I agree the ATS is a great car from Caddy out of the box, it has stiff competition. As you can see, no hint of conquest sales there...
My point regarding the value the Koreans are offering in the lux segment is a strategy completely ignored by Caddy for the ATS and now they are loosing the price advantage which the CTS had. Most likely the UAW have a hand in that! Easier said than done is spot on!
Now here is the more difficult part....
CTS Sales 2012 = 46,979 (2005 Sales = 61,572)
BMW 5 Series 2012 = 56,798
Mercedes E-Class 2012 = 65,171
Audi A-6 2012 =18,998
The second gen CTS was the best Caddy produced in decades but as you can see, raising it's price in stiff competition could drive sales away since it WAS the value proposition in it's segment. I'll bet it's an even better car that the outgoing one but expecting sales to grow as the value equalizes within the higher price bracket isn't going to gain conquest sales afaic. I expect sales will continue at the 38 -40K annual rate.
Caddy XTS sales ytd = 12,450
Caddy DTS sales 2011 full year = 11,589 (2006 sales =58,224)
XTS is doing fine so far but far below the DTS's best year.
We'll see the price comps soon enough.
2013 Tesla Model S: Hit and Miss Door Handles
Locking and unlocking the doors on a Tesla sounds like a pain too. And they aren't "cheap" either.
Ya think? As I ponder a move and a causing of WWIII here in the iluv home of south-central NM, my...umm...someone's for sale 1967 white VW Bug with 4-speed transmission and cool wheels and nicely-treaded tires sits just west of town awaiting a new life with somebody.
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Cadillac's only hope is newbies. People 40 and over are simply not going to switch from BMW to Cadillac at this point. I just can't see it.
Apparently some did, according to these Edmunds ATS reviewers:
this is a great car, period. Is it a great value? Compared to a similarly equipped 3 series, absolutely. I was ready to "pull the trigger"
on a $56K 3 series but couldn't justify its value, especially with that pathetic plastic screen sticking up out of the top of the dash board, really?
CUE, like your first smart phone or new computer operating system, needs understanding. However, it's appalling to see Consumer Reports slam ATS's
rating because of CUE--shame on them. The ATS is fun to drive, the sound system is outstanding, cabin noise is non-existent and it handles like a dream
--better than a 3 series
have owned two M3s and an S4 among other cars. But after test-driving the 3.6 ATS and comparing prices, the Caddy ATS won hands down for me. For handling,
ride comfort, and braking, ATS beats the others. Yeah, M3 is quicker by .7 sec to 60 ... not a big deal unless you take your ride to the track every
weekend. Mileage: 19mpg city, 29 highway(!), 24 combined so no complaints there especially as compared to M3. This car is a pleasure to drive with its
great handling, and it feels good to have finally cut the cord to those overpriced Germans. CUE is not perfect but is far from a deal-breaker. Overall:
this car is a winner and I have NO regrets with this purchase.
Having owned several BMW's, I thought I'd never own any other brand(especially a Cadillac). When my last BMW's lease was up in Dec 2012, I looked at both
the 535 and 335.... lease prices were insane! Additionally, I had a hard time telling the 3 from the 5 series, and interiors were blah! After reading
several reviews of the ATS, I decided that a test drive wouldn't hurt, my expectations not being high, I was pleasantly surprised, and, frankly, somewhat
stunned how well the ATS drove! After several more test drives(2.0T AWD vs. 3.6 AWD) I now an ATS in my garage!
But nonetheless....interesting...what are their ages I wonder?
Also, let's talk to them in 12 months and see how the car holds up.
I thought it was interesting that in Yahoo Answers, under "Car Makes", where younger people tend to go to talk about cars, they don't even list Cadillac as a brand.
Every make suffers from some amount of customer "breakage", so its not surprising to see the comments you posted. And, IMO, that's a good thing, because without it, we wouldn't ever really get true comparison opinions from long-term owners.
I think the ATS is a good product, but its got a stiff uphill battle ahead of it, going after the 3-series luxury-performance vehicle range provided by the German (and Japanese) brands already entrenched in that segment.
I hope Cadillac succeeds. Time will tell.
Schweet!
This one's got better paint and it's front bumper, and is creme colored instead of white, but it's the same model year and good lookin', too!
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I believe you are confusing Chevrolet with Cadillac. If you've never owned a Cadillac, never had the pleasure of engaging with a Cadillac dealership, and their truly outstanding service department, then you really have no idea of how nice an experience it is. I have never been treated better in my life than when I bought a used Cadillac still under warranty. Never. Not by anyone, anywhere. If I could afford a new Cadillac, I would be driving one. Period.
I purchased a 2006 Cadillac CTS in May 2010. Since the purchase, I have had several car repairs resulting in thousands of dollars. I make sure that I receive regular oil changes and follow recommendations for Mobil 1 oil only. I have to purchase approximately 6 to 8 quarts of the oil to add to my engine between oil changes. I had my mechanic assess the vehicle and there are no leaks. The car simply "drinks" oil. This is quite an expense since an oil change is approximately $100 and a quart of Mobil 1 oil is $10 a quart. This is simply unacceptable. I have read many complaints where people have lost their engines over oil consumption. It's simply not fair to the consumer to have to bear this expense for a product that is supposed to be trusted. In addition to this, I am putting brakes on my vehicle (front and back) twice a year. This is unheard of. There needs to be some accountability and responsibility for the makers of this vehicle.
I purchased a 2012 Cadillac SRX about 8 months ago. The lift arms that keep the back hatch up both had to be replaced. I have had an ongoing intermittent problem with the display being static or shutting completely off. The vehicle is having an idle problem when the vehicle is stopped and when accelerating. When I expressed my frustration to the service manager, he told me, "Well, GM makes the car; we have nothing to do with that." I responded that they "sold" me the car. I want the vehicle fixed and I don't want to bring the car in for a third time for the same problem.
My 2012 Cadillac CTS had steering problems, steering wheel locked while driving and engine was running! The local dealer checked the car and said there is nothing wrong with it since no error codes exist upon inspection! Safety issue + bad dealer = killing machine.
I think you are confusing them with Honda's service on the VCM, CVT, transmissions for decades on their models including the Acruas. And then there's the sludging from toyota that didn't exist for years in their minds followed by runaway acceleration. And now we have many recalls from both. And I'm sure all we have to do is look for some unhappy owners of the cheapest brands, Kia and Hyundai.
I've found the Chevy dealer for my Cobalt to be exceeding careful and friendly. They took very good care of us after the purchase--but when I was in for any service, I noted that they treated ALL the customers the same.
The old wives tales about mistreatment at GM are just slow to die.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I have never been to a Mercedes or BMW dealership, not even to look at their new cars, much less have cause to visit their service departments. I would hope that they are as nice to do business with as Cadillac. I cannot imagine that they are any better.
On edit: I forgot to mention Mopar. My last dealings with a Dodge dealership service department was around 1994. They were so bad, so crooked, I contacted Chrysler Corporation and offered them documentary evidence of the dealership charging them for warranty work that was not performed. Chrysler was not interested, never responded. I have never set foot in one of their showrooms since.
I've experience it both ways. The Pontiac/Cadillac dealership my family patronized in my hometown was excellent. Funny, GM cut that dealership during its downsizing and financial woes.
At the same time, the nearest VW dealership (30 miles away) was widely known as being anything and everything but professional. That dealership ended up costing VW a lot of sales back in the 70-80's. Crooked doesn't adequately describe them.
All of a sudden, the dealer hooked up with "GM Technical" and discovered the problem.
No "old Wives Tale" there. Just fact.
While I'm glad that you have had a great experience, you are in the minority. Only way to get A1 treatment in a GM dealership is to know one of the owners, GM, Service Manager etc. When bean counters run the company you will find quality and service lacking for the sake of the bottom line.
Your post seems to have few facts and alot of bias. Perosonally my experience with a Saturn and Chevrolet dealership have been great.
Anectodaly, my niece a few years back stood around a half an hour at a Toyota dealership without help. When she finally talked to a salesperson she felt as if they sold her a car they were doing her a favor. She bought a Honda instead.
In my own experience, purchasing a Nissan was not a pleasant experience.
However buying a Chevrolet for my son was absoultely painless and buying a Saturn for my wife was almost a pleasure.
It seems to me GM dealers have to treat their customers better to win back and gain customers, and I have found that to be the case.
Reality hurts some of the posters so much they are blinded! :shades:
Other customers just purchase better products.
General Motors Recalls SUVs Over Fire Risk
GM says owners should park the vehicles outside until they’re repaired.
I still think GM/Caddy needs to offer 110% of the competition spec at 80% of the price (at most) to woo people in - offering 105% for 95% won't do it. ATS might be close to doing that. It's a good move to bump the new CTS upmarket a notch, as IMO it did not legitimately compete with the 5er/E/A6 before. The new entrant doesn't get to define the market.
That is right. It does cut both ways. That's why the "everyone" example of GM's characteristics always bad has been a joke for me and it's not tolerable. It's time for reality about all brands. I had a Buick store (Pontiac, GMAC, Chevrolet) that was top notch. Ironically, they lost the Buick franchise in the dust up.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Apparently they're using the same supplier.
Supplier's fault if an import; manufacturer's fault if American.
Actually, to me it's always the manufacturer's fault, ultimately.
Exaclty. They ALLWAYS follow. Never lead.