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I like it because they both evaluate the vehicles and you get a better idea than from just one reviewer.
Anyway, I contacted them via email and Tony says that GLOBAL (TV network) is going to start broadcasting the show's new season on February 24 (date "may" change).
They will be getting a Sedona for a long term test vehicle, which I am very much looking forward to.
So, for those of you who can get GLOBAL and Driver's seat, I thought you might like to know.
Tony did say that they had tested one last year, and he said he quite likes it. He had been to their R&D plant in Korea, and says the facilities are VERY IMPRESSIVE.
So, it looks like good things are coming from Kia, as if you didn't already know! - Greg
I finally closed the deal on my Kia Sedona, EX plus 6 full options.
Thanks for your responses, it helped me to establish a reference point to offer a reasonable price range to the last dealer and we closed a deal within 15 minutes, there was not much haggling. By the way the edmunds' invoice number are corrected, the dealer invoice includes the dealer hold back, the hold back was added together with invoice price, it is 5XX.00 on the top of edmunds' invoice number. (Dealer invoice - hold back = edmunds' invoice), 5% over edmunds' invoice is possible. Cash deal.
Thumbs up to Steven Creek Kia in San Jose, I just didn't expect such a prompt, good deal in a premium Auto row in the heart of Silicon Valley.
I loved it that's all I could say on my way home.
We are bringing a Sedona home on Monday night and keeping it for about 24 hours. I was quite surprised that the salesman offered to do this, even without me asking. On a hot model, they really don't need to do this, plus he is tying up one of his vehicles to boot.
So far I've been pleased with the treatment from Dick Scott Kia. It's on Michigan Avenue (U.S. 12), about 1/4 mile west of I-275. This is about 5 minutes north of I-94, so not too far from Toledo.
I haven't talked price with them yet but I'll keep you posted.
The Detroit-area dealers don't seem to be high-volume and I don't get the sense that they are willing to, or need to, deal.
The purchase you mentioned re: $1200 off MSRP - was this at Ricart? Was it a separate transaction, or was a trade-in involved? Would you recommend this dealer, or others? What kind of stock/availability have you noticed in the Columbus area?
Thanks in advance.
Yesterday, I spoke with a Grand Rapids (Mich.) dealer - Keller Kia - via phone that a friend recommended as very courteous and professional. It's a fairly big Kia store (#2 or #3 in Mich. volume). The salesman was very polite and helpful on the phone.
I asked him to give me a ballpark idea of the price range in which they are selling Sedonas. (I prefaced this with, 'I know they are selling well and many dealers are selling at full MSRP.') He said they are selling many of them fairly easily at MSRP but that he would be willing to negotiate a little bit below that right now because the car market is a little slower in the winter. I took that to mean a few hundred bucks but not much more than that. He said that probably on March 1 or so, his store would probably start selling them at full MSRP again.
Take it for what it's worth, but that seemed to me like legitimate info and not a sales pitch-- the guy was not pushy, didn't ask for my name & phone number, etc.
The current Kia-sponsored finance rates are 0% up to 36 months, 4.9% 37-48 months, and 5.9% 49-60 months. These are good through Feb. 28. I would expect March's program to be pretty good since the prime rate is still low and won't be rising much in the near future, but it might change a little, as Kia's rates seem to bounce around from month to month.
For the folks who want(ed) an ABS-equipped Sedona, how tough is/was it to find one?
Still we manage to all get along. I really don't have any hatred for the Sedona. I really wish them the best of luck.
An inexpensive, quality van with modern features that proves to be just as reliable as an Accord or Camry is only good for the consumer in the marketplace.
TB
I like the current MPV but the 2.5L Duratec V6 was always a turnoff for me. Nice engine but not enough grunt to pull around a minivan (even a smaller one such as MPV). Now if I could just get the Duratec in my 95 Contour running smoothly again. But that would be getting off topic from my off-topic post...
bluedevils:I bought my EX with ABS through the local dealer 2 miles from my house, Crown Kia in Dublin (a Columbus suburb). They are a new Kia dealer and were willing to give me at least $1,000 off MSRP on a fully loaded EX. Talk to Randy at Crown...tell him Mike sent ya.
Sedonas with ABS are very hard to find. When I bought my Sedona in early December, Crown Kia was the only dealer that had Sedonas with ABS. They had two. Luckily one of them was the right color.
The other Columbus Kia dealers had lots of Sedonas (LXs and EXs), but none had ABS. Crown Kia is currently sold out of Sedonas with ABS.
Good luck!
The ride in this van is quiet and smooth in all modes and terrain - much better than expected. The transmission shifts are soft and smooth - watching the tach is the only true cue for what is happening. The cruise control worked extremely well with no lag on climbs. There is some tire whistle on certain kinds of pavement at high speeds, but it is well within tolerable limits. The shock absorber "ka-thunks" over frosty/pot-hole-repaired pavement is loud, which I attribute to the tight suspension.
Highway presence is excellent meaning that it has a solid, responsive, tight feel. Highway passing performance is phenomenal. Rear visibility is restricted; the generous side mirrors address this fairly well. Cornering on windy little roads is better than average with some understeer but no adverse roll, even at higher than posted speeds.
My wife removed her sweatshirt and said it was the warmest car she'd ever ridden in. The rear heat was off most of the trip and everyone was comfortable. FWIW.
I know others feel differently, but I love the gear shifter location. Used the overdrive off switch to control descents in the NY mountains and once shifted into third - worked well and smoothly.
I think I am still breaking in the driver seat; still tweaking the positioning. It is comfortable, but the shoulder blades ache after about two hours. It's tough to determine what seat adjustment will alleviate that.
Excellent3, here are the mileage numbers.
Date Miles gallons MPG
2/2/02 273 13.33 20.48
2/3/02 347 15.419 22.50
2/8/02 250 15.197 16.45
2/9/02 345 14.132 24.41
The squawk list (none significant):
*Slight pull to the left, but not consistent - will request an alignment check
*Rear window sprayer - high speed dribble - I suspect a bad nozzle, twisted hose or weak pump *Time to change the oil (personal preference after heavy duty trips).
*Brake pedal solenoid click (as descibed by previous posts)
*No air from driver side middle rear overhead vent when in heater mode
Bottom line is that the van is an excellent long-haul cruiser, and the family and I can't wait to do it again!
What are the opinions of the board...is buying the extended warranty a good idea for the Sedona? If you bought one, what did you pay?
Can anyone recommend a good dealer in the New Jersey/Tri-State region?
Phil
On an unrelated note, I noticed a couple of the Edmunds Sedona consumer reviews mentioned a strong coolant smell. We also had that intermittently, had the shop check that out, too. They pressure checked, found nothing wrong and suggested that the coolant was over-filled at the factory. Not sure how that works, but the overflow tank is and never was close to the full line, even when hot. I haven't paid enough attention to be sure if the level is going down, nothing on the ground.
Love it otherwise.
Phil
Phil
The other really nice part is the addition of the 5 speed automatic.
To make it somewhat topic related the HP/weight ratio tilts even more in favor of the MPV with the 200HP 3L, relative to the 4700# Sedona.
I believe the Sedona has more torque, (expected with 3.5L) so if you plan to tow something, it still may be the better choice.
But I have to believe the MPV is more maneuverable than the Sedona. This was far more important to me than raw power.
Ironically, the only speeding ticket I've earned in the past 6 years was in the underpowered MPV. I also hear the 2000 model will get up to 105 and run like that without drama. I even understand an 11 year old and 2 year old can sleep through the whole thing.
The wife on the other hand...
TB
With regards to Bluedevil's question on the ABS. I too found this somewhat difficult to find. I vivsted 4 dealers and phoned two others. Two of the dealers I visited had no ABS models on their lots. The other two (one where I bought our car) each had only one each ( and we got one!) Of the two I phoned, one had none, and the other had two, but was far enough away that I was only making the trip if I didn't find one closer.
Regarding some other issues already brought up. One of the things I checked today was the rear heater. It does appear that the rear heat is thermostatically controlled by the setting up front (my son held his hand over the vent and told me if it go warmer and cooler, not the ultimate science, but I figure he has to sit back there anyway) He did tell me that the vent in the middle row drivers side did feel cooler than the others. I'll check into it more.
Bluedevils: My mother lives in GR and just bought an Optima from KiaTowne. I coached her a bit on how to use the site (Edmunds) and what to expect. She paid 1500 less than TMV and was quite happy with the experience.
stressed that I am not interested in haggling. He did state that the EDMUNDS quotes are accurate. I feel that with the newly released safety rating that it may now be difficult to get well below MSRP. (opinions please)
He also commented that in this area the vans are selling for a few hundred less than MSRP. Could anyone recommend a dealer/salesperson?
For those who might be considering a Sedona purchase, here is some insight:
First, brief history:
Purchased Sedona 7/20/01, Houston. $22710 + TTL. Loaded, with every option except Homelink, and spoiler.
Problems/Dislikes:
1. First week; leak of wiper fluid. Dealer said seals in washer pump were defective. Replaced under warranty in 2 days. Problem solved.
2. @ 7500 miles; check engine light. Dealer said it was because gas cap not tight. I now believe that this was indeed the problem. The boss and I (translation: wife and I) now twist the gas cap excessively after each fill up. Problem solved.
3. 7500 miles - present; Engine whines and groans, sounding like a power steering pump on a GM p/up. Dealer said "could not duplicate", nothing done. Whine still present, no better no worse. Not sure if problem.
4. Transmission hesitation: When vehicle is cold, seems to be a slight delay in tranny when throttle is initially engaged. Not really a problem, just something that the boss needs to be aware of. (translation: wife removed lead from shoe)
5. Rear heater; No temp control. Can be managed, however.
6. Key FOB: Only 1. Gimme a break, KIA!
Likes:
1. Value; However I slice this pie, I got a good deal. A lot of vehicle for the money. Quad 5 star rating, best warranty in business, good build quality. (translation: My wife loves that van!)
2. Engine; It has considerable power, and torque.
3. Sliding doors; No need for power doors.
4. HWY mileage; 23-24 on hwy. (If I drive)
5. Interior ergonomics;
6. Pretty much, everything not listed on first list.
In short, I really like the van.
If you are looking for a mini van, you owe it to yourself to check out a Sedona. I like this van better than Sienna, Ody, Windtstar, and DC products. I had an Astro, and certainly didn't want to make THAT mistake again!
RGDS to all
Hokum
That has been my biggest holdback with other minivans. The tumble under seat is great in the MPV and ODY but with the 3rd row stowed, it becomes a 4 passenger vehicle . . . with a family of 5 it makes it difficult to do extended traveling because seating options are limited when you are carrying a lot of luggage. I personally don't like to carry luggage on the roof of the vehicle but that may be my only option with some minivans out there. I am currently on the final year of a 3 year lease with a Dodge Caravan Sport. The Caravan has had absolutely no problems to date and it gives me the option of converting into a 5 passenger vehicle with rear cabin storage. I even looked at the GM vans because they can be had with 8 passenger seating with a fold down 3rd row bench (but the crash test ratings of the GM vans, particularly the offset crash scores, have made me leary of purchasing a GM van). Just curious what Kia had to offer in that department.
Phil
1) If you look at the MPV site, Sedona is a major subtopic and referenced constantly.
2) There were comments doubting the Sedona would do well on the crash test and then, guess what? It has the highest crash rating possible. Yes, better than MPV.
MPV forum used to be like the Sedona forum, open-minded, willing to reference other competitive vans without getting defensive. But it isn't anymore. Someone mentions Sedona and a bunch of angry bees swarm and chase him away. You'll see that my comment just references the crash data site and then there were defensive comments about Sedona being in the shop all the time? Sedona is 3+ years old in Asia and Europe and it does not have any negative reputation for reliability although the much bigger NA engine is a newer offering. One should not compare a Sportage to a Sedona just because they share the same badge.
As for the 4700 lbs. I think the Odyssey is in the same neighborhood at about 4,300. From an engineering point, lighter is better, all things being equal, so this did not sound good to me until I drove one. The weight to some extent is a product of a very robust and crashworthy body structure. The solidity of this van is top-notch, it feels extremely rigid like a Mercedes. If it had a 3-point star on it, it would fool a lot of people.
You are right on one thing, the Sedona site is very good. Smart people are drawn to a good product. I hang at the Sedona site more often now because of this and I have a bit of sense of ownership since I started the Sedona site. You are definitely a van type of guy so you should take a test drive some day. It is an excellent product but different then the "nimble, tossable" MPV. I have to say my 2 favorite vans are Sedona and MPV.
1. Anyone seen maintenance books like Chilton's for the Sedona? Just like having one for routine problems, not for major maintenance. (Nice to know where hidden bolts, etc are).
2. When does timing belt have to be changed? Salesman said "80K...I think"...well beyond what I'd guess of 60k.
3. Saw posting on changing out plugs at 28k. Is this true? Hard to believe in this day when platinum plugs make 100k routine on other models. Esp with the covered engine.
Thanks for the info, gang.
The Kia Sedona EX does NOT even have ABS as standard equipment @ $21,590. It also lacks many features of the Odyssey, Grand Caravan and T&C although it does have some nice features that they do not have.
Odyssey and DC minivans have far superior rear heating where the temperature can be controlled. Ody and DC also have controls for rear quarter windows so the driver can open or close them.
EPA gas mileage of 15/20 is pathetic compared to Ody 18/25 where the Ody has much more HP and Torque. The DC 3.8L that also has more HP and Torque than Sedona 3.5L. Compare the numbers:
Vehicle and engine HP Torque Gas Mileage
Kia Sedona ...3.5L....195....218........15/20
Honda Odyssey 3.5L....240....242........18/25
GC eX /T&C eX 3.8L....215....245........18/24
The Kia may have a lower MSRP but can not compete for performance or fuel economy with Ody 3.5L or DC 3.8L engines.
2. Engine timing belt: Check every at 30k miles and replace at every 60K miles.
3. There are 3 types of Spark plugs.
(a) RC10PYP4: Inspect every 12.5k miles, replace at every 25k miles.
(b) PFR5N-11: Replace at every 60k miles.
(c) RC10PYPB4: Replace at every 60K miles.
My old Previa has more passenger volume than any of the mini vans you mentioned, but I seldom use it to carry any bulky item except for passengers only, I learned my lesson when I tried to save some bucks and used the Previa to move my new bedroom set home, I damaged the back of the second row car seat, and I twisted my right foot when I moved the bedroom set up stair by myself, for me "Big" is not necessary better.
ABS brake is not a standard equipment, this is a complain of non issue, just order EX the 6 full options, you still have 10k deposit in your bank.
Rear quart windows buttons controlled by the driver, again it is a non issue, Sedona does have this same feature.
Sedona EPA mileage is a bit conservative, if you scroll back the messages, you can find some real mileage data reported by the Sedona owners.
I don't race my van with the children and infant on board, I don't want to break their necks, again for me this is a moot point. I don't purchase a mini van because it is 1 second quicker in 0-60 miles.
PS: I handed the Kia brochures to co-workers. :-)
Bottom line is every person has different needs, and will be swayed one way or the other by a miriad of circumstances. The Sedona is simply another option and for some to say one is "better" than the other blatantly is out of line. Anyone reading these posts can surely see that even as owners, our Sedonas are not perfect, we learn to accept certain minor deficiencies and move on. The Ody is a good van, but not without its problems. Time will tell if the Sedona will hold its value better than other Kias, I believe it certainly is on the right track. The Ody has a proven track record in this category.
It appears that $1,000 under MSRP for a loaded Sedona EX is an attainable price, here in Michigan (and from the Columbus dealer with whom I spoke).
Here are the data for your reference, Honda Odyssey is 0.3 inch wider than Sedona in rear hip room. You may review your data again.
Interior Dimensions Honda Odessey LX
Hip room
(in., front/middle/rear) 57.8/67.0/49.1
Interior Dimension Kia Sedona EX
Hip room
(in., front/middle/rear) 58.7/65.1/48.8
Would anyone reccomend buying the extended basic warranty?
Does anyone know something about "gap" insurance?
Thanks for your feedback!
4-5 yrs+ it evens out a bit better at least, with the difference in residuals closer to the difference in initial cost. Depreciation also depends heavily on how much mileage you plan to put on the van, too.
HOWEVER, my understanding is that residuals are really just a guestimate the lender is using of what the vehicle's wholesale value will be at the end of a lease, and the Sedona's are undoubtedly based on past depreciation of other Hundai/Kia models, which has not been good to put it politely. The Sedona is a largely unproven quantity at this point, and if they hold up well over the next couple years, and there is a stronger than anticipated demand for used, the wholesale value may be much better than typical for Kia. It's a guessing game, but in general the durability seems to be pretty good to this point, which is a good sign for long term performance. If you look at the boards it's obvious that no manufacturer makes a perfect van. The Kia warranty does make it a little easier to sleep at night. I personally would not consider buying another brand - and would not compare prices - without factoring in the cost of a similar extended warranty for the other brands. It's just a necessity on an investment this big.
So, at this point you are probably going to take more of an initial hit in value with the Sedona vs. Honda/Toyota. If you are financing, gap insurance might not be a terrible idea for the Sedona, depending on what it costs. Another factor to consider is that vehicles with lower depreciation are probably also more expensive to insure.
My personal feeling is that if you plan to keep the van long term (since things tend to even out a bit better in the long run) the value of driving what best meets your needs and likes is going to be worth more than the potential difference in depriciation.
I should also add that the Windstar's residuals seemed even worse than the Sedona's (wasn't considering Caravan/T&C because of their lower crash test scores, but I'm sure they depreciate pretty quickly too).
As stated in previous posts, the standard warranty on Kias is so good that Kia's extended basic warranty really isn't worth much.
Cheers,
Phil
Thanks for the post. 60K about right for the changeover. I've seen complaints from drivers whose cars (not Kia) having belts now rated for 100k, since it requires belt tensioners for a lot more $. Seems that belt tensioners last around 140-50k, and no mech will change a timing belt at 100k and take a chance on blowing the engine when a tensioner fails. So, Sedonna owners, when 120K approaching expect a more extensive and expensive timing belt change out than at 60 K miles. BTW, pretty much applies to all cars that use timing belts.
Dash is gray on all the models I saw down to the lower area where interior color takes over. KIA Sedonna brochure also has a good picture of this when you look at the tan interior.
RE residual value: concur with Philliplc's post. The longer you drive it, the better the deal becomes. If in doubt, give it to charity and take the tax deduction.
RE insurance: After 5-6 years, probably wouldn't get much out of the insurance company anyway, so drop the comprehenisive and keep collision...they hit you...they pay anyway. You hit them, your insurance pays for them, and you don't get anything but your 5 star crash rating. Gap insurance keeps you from having to pay difference in loan vs depreciated value of your car. Don't know about cost of the gap insurance but it varies widely, just like insurance rates from different carriers...I don't trade that often.
I have a source for a good steel luggage platform for a class III hitch (2" square receiver) $45 (when on sale) at Harbor Freight salvage (and they have a website). Shipping over $50 free. Watch for specials. Also great for tool/gadget folks. 20' jumper cables VERY handy in a parking lot where you can't get cars nose to nose.