Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

snakeweasel

graphicguy said:

Ink used to have negative connotations. Today? It’s a way to make your own personal statement about yourself. 

The problem about using tattoos to make a personal statement is that tattoos are far more permanent than personal statements. A lot of people have tattoos that they regret (or is it regert?)

dino001

driver100 said:

I looked at the Enterprise site and I can get a 2017 with low 30s mileage for about $14k. I get another $1000 off as an employee. I don’t see it as a big enough bargain for my particular tastes when I can get a brand new 19’ for a few thousand more.

I agree. Those are crazy prices for used vs. new.

I think a lot of used car asking prices are derived from MSRP's, not actual transaction prices. Also, except of course places like Enterprise, Carmax, or Avis car sales, most used car prices can be negotiated down, sometimes much more significantly than new vehicles, as original spreads are higher. However, I also discovered long ago that used car pricing can be all over the place, sometimes completely irrational, sometimes taking advantage of a particularly ill-informed customer base. I remember once taking a trip to several Talahassee area dealers (when I was in the grad school) just before the new semester was about to start (Tally is basically government and universities) and I recall chuckling at some of the posted priced. They were absolutely insane, but I can see how this scam worked - a 19-year-old kid comes to town with some money from his/her parents, knows nothing about nothing, thinks of course he/she knows everything, doesn't even ask anyone for help and gets into this 5-year-old Mustang, or whatever at 15% APR and sky high price. Or worse - trades a boring family car from dad/mom for another set of "exciting" wheels. This can create opportunities for huge scores on part of dealers, so why not price things to the Moon?

stickguy

yup. you can do a crazy purple spiked hairdo to make a statement, and easily make it go away. Same with shocking clothing choices. Tats, hard to make them go away. Especially in visible areas you can't hide.

dino001

snakeweasel said:

You save 1/3rd of the price with a used one, but the best half of it's life has been sucked out of it.

I wouldn't say the best half of its life has been sucked out, it likely has several good years or normal driving left in it it it hasn't been really abused. I would say that half of the nest part of its life has been used.

I agree - it's an exaggeration to say "better half" is gone. Many modern vehicles can easily go 10 years with minor service and repairs. What does change is a risk profile of such machine.

I think many here (myself included) sometimes speak from a position of choice - I can get 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 thousand dollar vehicle (or more for some) and if I choose to get 20 thousand, I don't see 2, 3 or even 5 thousand dollars as a large difference. Moreover, that money actually buys something of value (warranty, lower risk, convenience of not having car in the shop), so we will spend it. However, for people who simply cannot spend 20 thousand, but somehow can scrounge 15 (including a high APR loan), even a thousand dollars will make a difference. They may not get same value as we can (or at least in our eyes), but that's the best they could do. They probably should have gone lower in the market (older and cheaper vehicle), but they chose not to go there.
Our starting point is new car and we look what we lose for those few grand. Their starting point is 5-6-year-old car and they focus what they buy for those extra few grand when they get a 3-year-old.

imidazol97

Nancy Wilson, 81. I listened to her albums while studying in college, along with other singers, on 33's I bought to play on the stereo record player my sister had loaned me.




That was the era when songs had lyrics and told a story, a human story in cases.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj05EY2aP7I

And interview of
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Heu6QQ3KFYo

henryn

Used versus new is always a debatable point, sometimes leading to vigorous debate.

oldfarmer50 said:

I looked at the Enterprise site and I can get a 2017 with low 30s mileage for about $14k. I get another $1000 off as an employee. I don’t see it as a big enough bargain for my particular tastes when I can get a brand new 19’ for a few thousand more.

I agree on this one. If buying a Soul, it would be new. When I bought the T&C minivan, I got a much bigger discount by buying used. New would have cost me about $28.5 (plus TT&L), best deal I could find. Used, 11 months of service at Enterprise, 34k miles, for about $17.2k (plus TT&L). For that kind of deal, I will go used every time, especially when there are a lot to choose from and careful shopping will get you a very clean example.

I keep buying new trucks because the used ones ( a year or two old ) are only $5 or $6 thousand less than brand new. That’s at best. At worst, the dealers ask MORE for the used one.

graphicguy

imidazol97 said:

Nancy Wilson, 81. I listened to her albums while studying in college, along with other singers, on 33's I bought to play on the stereo record player my sister had loaned me.




That was the era when songs had lyrics and told a story, a human story in cases.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj05EY2aP7I

And interview of
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Heu6QQ3KFYo

My late Mother adored Nancy Wilson. I remember the album this song came from (just can’t remember the name) as it’s the one my Mother played all the time.

Tremendous jazz talent.

graphicguy

Regarding TATS....I guess I don’t care enough for it to matter to me. I will say, ask someone about their tattoos and each one of them has an interesting story attached.

ab348

snakeweasel said:

The problem about using tattoos to make a personal statement is that tattoos are far more permanent than personal statements. A lot of people have tattoos that they regret (or is it regert?)

That depends on whether the person doing the tat was drunk/high when they were trying to spell "regret" for perpetuity on your body.

qbrozen

I have just one, and it is on my upper arm. It was a college drunk dare, and the work was done at a kitchen table in a house on Long Island. Not fond of it now, but I very rarely even notice it. I will say the artist did a helluva job because it looks exactly the same now as it did 25 years ago.

pensfan83

I couldn't care less about tattoos. Two of my best investigators have tattoos, extensive ones, and the only reason I know this is because I ran into both of them at outside events in the summer. And even though my LOB is not customer facing they conceal them enough that you would never know they were there.

tjc78

My wife has a few.  Tasteful and she can cover them all up if needed.  I don’t have any and probably never will ... but to each his own. 

oldfarmer50

dino001 said:

driver100 said:

I looked at the Enterprise site and I can get a 2017 with low 30s mileage for about $14k. I get another $1000 off as an employee. I don’t see it as a big enough bargain for my particular tastes when I can get a brand new 19’ for a few thousand more.

I agree. Those are crazy prices for used vs. new.

I think a lot of used car asking prices are derived from MSRP's, not actual transaction prices. Also, except of course places like Enterprise, Carmax, or Avis car sales, most used car prices can be negotiated down, sometimes much more significantly than new vehicles, as original spreads are higher. However, I also discovered long ago that used car pricing can be all over the place, sometimes completely irrational, sometimes taking advantage of a particularly ill-informed customer base. I remember once taking a trip to several Talahassee area dealers (when I was in the grad school) just before the new semester was about to start (Tally is basically government and universities) and I recall chuckling at some of the posted priced. They were absolutely insane, but I can see how this scam worked - a 19-year-old kid comes to town with some money from his/her parents, knows nothing about nothing, thinks of course he/she knows everything, doesn't even ask anyone for help and gets into this 5-year-old Mustang, or whatever at 15% APR and sky high price. Or worse - trades a boring family car from dad/mom for another set of "exciting" wheels. This can create opportunities for huge scores on part of dealers, so why not price things to the Moon?

Based on my limited experience I think 30% is the average used car mark up.

oldfarmer50

henryn said:

Used versus new is always a debatable point, sometimes leading to vigorous debate.

oldfarmer50 said:

I looked at the Enterprise site and I can get a 2017 with low 30s mileage for about $14k. I get another $1000 off as an employee. I don’t see it as a big enough bargain for my particular tastes when I can get a brand new 19’ for a few thousand more.

I agree on this one. If buying a Soul, it would be new. When I bought the T&C minivan, I got a much bigger discount by buying used. New would have cost me about $28.5 (plus TT&L), best deal I could find. Used, 11 months of service at Enterprise, 34k miles, for about $17.2k (plus TT&L). For that kind of deal, I will go used every time, especially when there are a lot to choose from and careful shopping will get you a very clean example.

I keep buying new trucks because the used ones ( a year or two old ) are only $5 or $6 thousand less than brand new. That’s at best. At worst, the dealers ask MORE for the used one.

Used trucks go for crazy prices even on Craigslist. People wouldn’t pay for a rusted sedan with 200k+ miles but they’ll do it on a truck.

dino001

Things are going down in my local friendly BMW dealership. My car is due for service and I just learned no loaners for routine maintenance. So much for a luxury brand. I'm not even angry, more like "you've got to be kidding me". I guess lofty sales increases (except last year of course) finally caught up with them and it just became too expensive.

driver100

In BMWs case, I think they do surveys and they find things like "having a free loaner car" are not good enough incentives for most people. The dealer where I bought my last BMW 2011 until 2014 offered free loaners, but, never seemed to have one available when I needed it. I would tell them I needed a shuttle bus but it was always caught somewhere unexpected so it took a long time for it to show up. Work always took longer than the time given too.
None of them care about customer service any more....they know you don't have a choice, and if they are all lousy customer service becomes a moot point. They just care about the bottom line for that quarter.

abacomike

dino001 said:

Things are going down in my local friendly BMW dealership. My car is due for service and I just learned no loaners for routine maintenance. So much for a luxury brand. I'm not even angry, more like "you've got to be kidding me". I guess lofty sales increases (except last year of course) finally caught up with them and it just became too expensive.

When I took my S450 to the local Mercedes dealership for my “A” (1-year) service appointment, I was offered an E300 as a loaner.  I declined since the service is just 2 hours and I had nothing pressing that I needed to take care of that day.

But it is obvious Mercedes does provide loaners for routine services.

imidazol97

abacomike said:

Things are going down in my local friendly BMW dealership. My car is due for service and I just learned no loaners for routine maintenance. So much for a luxury brand. I'm not even angry, more like "you've got to be kidding me". I guess lofty sales increases (except last year of course) finally
When I took my S450 to the local Mercedes dealership for my “A” (1-year) service appointment, I was offered an E300 as a loaner.  I declined since the service is just 2 hours and I had nothing pressing that I needed to take care of that day.

But it is obvious Mercedes does provide loaners for routine services.

They didn't have an "S" model available for loaner service?

28firefighter

I'm actually surprised there wasn't an S available for loaner duty. I know my local BMW dealer has 7 series loaners dedicated for 7 series customers.

driver100

When my 2012 535 was left at the dealers they ran out of loaners, let me rent a Nissan Versa from Enterprise for a nominal fee....$15 or something. Made me glad I didn't own a Nissan Versa.

roadburner

When I worked at BMW we had dozens of loaners- and they still do; I received a new X5 with a pretty comprehensive option set when I left the X1 to be detailed.

sb55

dino001 said:

Things are going down in my local friendly BMW dealership. My car is due for service and I just learned no loaners for routine maintenance. So much for a luxury brand. I'm not even angry, more like "you've got to be kidding me". I guess lofty sales increases (except last year of course) finally caught up with them and it just became too expensive.

Maybe that's a regional thing or just the dealer you use? I get loaners whenever I ask, and I didn't buy my CPO car from the dealer I use. Just last week my car service minder stated that I needed a brake fluid flush. I was willing to wait, but they said that car needed to be cold, so they gave me a loaner.

abacomike

imidazol97 said:

Things are going down in my local friendly BMW dealership. My car is due for service and I just learned no loaners for routine maintenance. So much for a luxury brand. I'm not even angry, more like "you've got to be kidding me". I guess lofty sales increases (except last year of course) finally When I took my S450 to the local Mercedes dealership for my “A” (1-year) service appointment, I was offered an E300 as a loaner.  I declined since the service is just 2 hours and I had nothing pressing that I needed to take care of that day.

But it is obvious Mercedes does provide loaners for routine services.

They didn't have an "S" model available for loaner service?

I was offered an E300 or a GLC300 because I had an S450.  Other customers get C300’s as service loaners if they have models other than S Class.

abacomike

28firefighter said:

I'm actually surprised there wasn't an S available for loaner duty. I know my local BMW dealer has 7 series loaners dedicated for 7 series customers.

When I had my 740i at BMW for service, all I got was an X5 - they had no 7 series loaners.

Mr_Shiftright

oldfarmer50 said:

henryn said:

Used versus new is always a debatable point, sometimes leading to vigorous debate.

oldfarmer50 said:

I looked at the Enterprise site and I can get a 2017 with low 30s mileage for about $14k. I get another $1000 off as an employee. I don’t see it as a big enough bargain for my particular tastes when I can get a brand new 19’ for a few thousand more.

I agree on this one. If buying a Soul, it would be new. When I bought the T&C minivan, I got a much bigger discount by buying used. New would have cost me about $28.5 (plus TT&L), best deal I could find. Used, 11 months of service at Enterprise, 34k miles, for about $17.2k (plus TT&L). For that kind of deal, I will go used every time, especially when there are a lot to choose from and careful shopping will get you a very clean example.

I keep buying new trucks because the used ones ( a year or two old ) are only $5 or $6 thousand less than brand new. That’s at best. At worst, the dealers ask MORE for the used one.

Used trucks go for crazy prices even on Craigslist. People wouldn’t pay for a rusted sedan with 200k+ miles but they’ll do it on a truck.

Well trucks have an obvious utility, especially if you need one for short-haul dirty work. And an old truck can be a source of income, too. You can't drive a rust bucket car with Uber.

oldfarmer50

Mr_Shiftright said:

oldfarmer50 said:

henryn said:

Used versus new is always a debatable point, sometimes leading to vigorous debate.

oldfarmer50 said:

I looked at the Enterprise site and I can get a 2017 with low 30s mileage for about $14k. I get another $1000 off as an employee. I don’t see it as a big enough bargain for my particular tastes when I can get a brand new 19’ for a few thousand more.

I agree on this one. If buying a Soul, it would be new. When I bought the T&C minivan, I got a much bigger discount by buying used. New would have cost me about $28.5 (plus TT&L), best deal I could find. Used, 11 months of service at Enterprise, 34k miles, for about $17.2k (plus TT&L). For that kind of deal, I will go used every time, especially when there are a lot to choose from and careful shopping will get you a very clean example.

I keep buying new trucks because the used ones ( a year or two old ) are only $5 or $6 thousand less than brand new. That’s at best. At worst, the dealers ask MORE for the used one.

Used trucks go for crazy prices even on Craigslist. People wouldn’t pay for a rusted sedan with 200k+ miles but they’ll do it on a truck.

Well trucks have an obvious utility, especially if you need one for short-haul dirty work. And an old truck can be a source of income, too. You can't drive a rust bucket car with Uber.

That’s true. I made a lot of money off my old F-150. The tomatoes didn’t care if it was falling apart.

jwm40517

I saw today that Tesla was the first manufacturer to reach 200,000 sales of electrics and the $7500 tax credit will be phased out in 2019. $7500 until 12-31-18, $3750 for Jan-June 2019, $1875 for July- Dec 2019 and zero starting in 2020.

cdnpinhead

My goal in life is to not have my vehicle in for service, ever. Part of it has to do with the initial vehicle selection, much of it has to do with the quality of the vehicle, and part of it has to do with pure luck. People who discuss the quality of the "service experience" are in a different world to the one I prefer to live in. My car almost never needs to endure a "service experience." I change my own oil and filters. Imagine.

Apologies to those who know their service people on a first-name basis.

dino001

Oh, I didn’t even get a BMW loaner before, it was always an Enterprise rental vehicle, usually a full size or a small SUV. So whatever, at least something was provided. Now they decided it was no longer worth it. It really is downhill for BMW, as I see it. First they drop full maintenance, replacing it with shorter basic package (prices went up anyway), now this. Not so ultimate, more like minimum we can get away with. I read somewhere BMW had a large writeoff last quarter, billion Euros ir so, perhaps cost cutting is now reaching the dealers, their allowances are lower, so customers get less at the same price, too.

stickguy

can't complain about Acura for that. once a year (maybe sooner if you drive more) based on the MM, and just routine oil changes. Dealer has express service for routine stuff, no appointment needed, always out in under an hour (well, almost always). So, not worth the time and effort to get a loaner.

I did get one for a warranty issue (Takata airbags) and one other thing that was going to take a little longer.

ronsteve

dino001 said:

Oh, I didn’t even get a BMW loaner before, it was always an Enterprise rental vehicle, usually a full size or a small SUV. So whatever, at least something was provided. Now they decided it was no longer worth it.

I bought my V70 new from a Volvo dealer in NC, and they didn't offer loaners for routine maintenance, or really anything short of a multi-day warranty job. When I moved up to Louisville, the first few visits (I think 2-3 routine plus one not-so-routine) were at the local Volvo dealer, and if I just had to get my drop done before their shuttle ran, they would give me a loaner. I took them up on that twice... first time was a very new S60, and the second was a FJ Cruiser out of their pre-owned inventory... so very much the luck of the draw.

Now I get to see how it all works with the Acura dealer here, hopefully not before it asks me for its first routine service in about another 5000 miles.

fintail

I think that's how my dealer works, too. I've never seen anything higher than an E in their loaner fleet.

abacomike said:

I was offered an E300 or a GLC300 because I had an S450.  Other customers get C300’s as service loaners if they have models other than S Class.

oldfarmer50

Just got a scam email offering to pay me $400 to be a mystery shopper at Target. Sounded like a scam and it was.

https://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2018/09/target_mystery_shopper_email_o.html

roadburner

We had a couple of 7 Series loaners reserved for 7 Series owners.

venture

cdnpinhead said:

My goal in life is to not have my vehicle in for service, ever. Part of it has to do with the initial vehicle selection, much of it has to do with the quality of the vehicle, and part of it has to do with pure luck. People who discuss the quality of the "service experience" are in a different world to the one I prefer to live in. My car almost never needs to endure a "service experience." I change my own oil and filters. Imagine.

Apologies to those who know their service people on a first-name basis.

...but what about the free latte, doughnuts, and plastic container of fruit cocktail you are missing out on?

oldfarmer50

Has anyone seen these creepy tv commercials for ‘Sling’ tv service?



I suppose it does it’s job of getting attention but it’s so weird I’m not sure I remember what company they are promoting.

abacomike

venture said:

My goal in life is to not have my vehicle in for service, ever. Part of it has to do with the initial vehicle selection, much of it has to do with the quality of the vehicle, and part of it has to do with pure luck. People who discuss the quality of the "service experience" are in a different world to the one I prefer to live in. My car almost never needs to endure a "service experience." I change my own oil and filters. Imagine. Apologies to those who know their service people on a first-name basis.

...but what about the free latte, doughnuts, and plastic container of fruit cocktail you are missing out on?

And danish and bagels w/cream cheese, not to mention a variety of flavored coffees and soft drinks?  And yes, I do know my service writer, service manager and the mechanics in the group by their first names.  Better yet, they know me by my first name. 

P.S. The dealership posted a photograph of me in their employee washrooms with the following caption:

”...If you see this man, alert management immediately - he’s always a buyer!” 

carnaught

LOL, is the chainsaw, in that position, on that Sling commercial coincidental or planned?

snakeweasel

cdnpinhead said:

My goal in life is to not have my vehicle in for service, ever. Part of it has to do with the initial vehicle selection, much of it has to do with the quality of the vehicle, and part of it has to do with pure luck. People who discuss the quality of the "service experience" are in a different world to the one I prefer to live in. My car almost never needs to endure a "service experience." I change my own oil and filters. Imagine.

Apologies to those who know their service people on a first-name basis.

I have to agree, the best cars are the ones that go back to the dealers service bays the least.

snakeweasel

oldfarmer50 said:

Has anyone seen these creepy tv commercials for ‘Sling’ tv service?



I suppose it does it’s job of getting attention but it’s so weird I’m not sure I remember what company they are promoting.

Can't say I have seen that one, the Sling commercials I have seen were basic information about getting their service and a TV antenna.

tjc78

True statement @snakeweasel!

I am hoping for zero visits other than oil changes on both of mine.

The Hyundai has owned up,  the 2017 Enclave has warped rotors at 14k miles.   I’m at 30% on the OLM so I’m thinking in Feb it will get a service and the rotors cut.  Not quite half way through the lease but hopefully close enough they don’t warp again.  The 2015 Enclave’s rotors warped as well but it wasn’t bad until 20k. 

snakeweasel

oldfarmer50 said:

Just got a scam email offering to pay me $400 to be a mystery shopper at Target. Sounded like a scam and it was.

https://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2018/09/target_mystery_shopper_email_o.html

Mystery shopping won't make you rich but it might make you able to buy that used Yugo you have your eye on.

Speaking of scam emails I got an email at work last week from another employee using a private email account. Though this is unusual it is not unheard of as some don't have work emails or might be doing things from home and cannot access their work accounts This email told me she had closed her bank account and needed to change her direct deposit information asap. So I called her to confirm that it was her that sent the email and it was not.

graphicguy

Acura dealer usually does “like for like” with their loaners. Ordinarily, that means if you bring in a TLX for service, you get a TLX as a loaner (albeit a base model). Oil changes and tire rotations usually take no more than 45 minutes. So, I just wait for those services and drink their fancy coffee and eat their cookies and doughnuts in their lounge.

I can work just as easily from their lounge as I can from my home office.

roadburner

snakeweasel said:

I have to agree, the best cars are the ones that go back to the dealers service bays the least.

Over the past couple of years the only cars that have needed repair(as opposed to maintenance) have been the Club Sport(pinion seal) and the Wrangler(brake lines). Oh yeah, I did need to put a new battery in the Mini as well- but that was DIY.
I still change like to change the oil in the ti and Jeep myself, but since my dealer boasts a CCA discount, first rate techs, and free BMW loaners I tend more and more to leave maintenance the Mother Ship.
The only downside is my SA always gives me really nice loaners- a nefarious plot to encourage me to buy a new(er) BMW.

henryn

I would definitely agree with the majority on this one, the fewer visits to the service department, the better I like it.

I have been pretty lucky in recent years, but my latest purchase is breaking my string of good luck. My new F150 has a recall for the seat belt tensioner, and the built in NAV is living in some alternate universe. I would take it in for that second problem, as the built in NAV is handy, but I'm afraid the odds of them actually fixing the problem are somewhere between zero and nil, and then I would just mad and frustrated. Probably best to leave it alone and use Google Maps.

roadburner

I think that's pretty much the case for virtually all the Ford dealers I have dealt with. The only thing the techs seem to be able to write on diagnostic work orders is, "Unable to Duplicate." I'd be furious if an option I paid for was malfunctioning and the dealer was unable to fix it. When I was looking at Mustang GTs back in 2015 the thought of having to take it to one of my local Ford dealers gave me more than a little pause.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

venture said:

My goal in life is to not have my vehicle in for service, ever. Part of it has to do with the initial vehicle selection, much of it has to do with the quality of the vehicle, and part of it has to do with pure luck. People who discuss the quality of the "service experience" are in a different world to the one I prefer to live in. My car almost never needs to endure a "service experience." I change my own oil and filters. Imagine.

Apologies to those who know their service people on a first-name basis.

...but what about the free latte, doughnuts, and plastic container of fruit cocktail you are missing out on?

And danish and bagels w/cream cheese, not to mention a variety of flavored coffees and soft drinks?  And yes, I do know my service writer, service manager and the mechanics in the group by their first names.  Better yet, they know me by my first name. 

P.S. The dealership posted a photograph of me in their employee washrooms with the following caption:

”...If you see this man, alert management immediately - he’s always a buyer!” 

I’ve heard of people getting their phone numbers posted in the men’s room but not their pictures.

oldfarmer50

snakeweasel said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Just got a scam email offering to pay me $400 to be a mystery shopper at Target. Sounded like a scam and it was.

https://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2018/09/target_mystery_shopper_email_o.html

Mystery shopping won't make you rich but it might make you able to buy that used Yugo you have your eye on.

Speaking of scam emails I got an email at work last week from another employee using a private email account. Though this is unusual it is not unheard of as some don't have work emails or might be doing things from home and cannot access their work accounts This email told me she had closed her bank account and needed to change her direct deposit information asap. So I called her to confirm that it was her that sent the email and it was not.

I’m assuming you’re the guy writing the checks?

BTW, my paycheck is late, could you please send me a replacement to my Swiss account?

oldfarmer50

henryn said:

I would definitely agree with the majority on this one, the fewer visits to the service department, the better I like it.

I have been pretty lucky in recent years, but my latest purchase is breaking my string of good luck. My new F150 has a recall for the seat belt tensioner, and the built in NAV is living in some alternate universe. I would take it in for that second problem, as the built in NAV is handy, but I'm afraid the odds of them actually fixing the problem are somewhere between zero and nil, and then I would just mad and frustrated. Probably best to leave it alone and use Google Maps.

But you paid for tha NAV system (probably a premium price too). Why would you not demand they make it function correctly.

oldfarmer50

roadburner said:

I think that's pretty much the case for virtually all the Ford dealers I have dealt with. The only thing the techs seem to be able to write on diagnostic work orders is, "Unable to Duplicate." I'd be furious if an option I paid for was malfunctioning and the dealer was unable to fix it. When I was looking at Mustang GTs back in 2015 the thought of having to take it to one of my local Ford dealers gave me more than a little pause.

I’ve been fairly satisfied with the Ford dealer where I purchased the Mustang. With minor warranty work or equipment ad on they’ve been good, but expensive.