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Mazda6 Sedan

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  • My buddy, whos family has nothing but Hondas, swears that you can get an Accord V6 coupe with a manual. In fact, he plans to buy one early next year. I guess hes in for a surprise when he talks to his salesman...
  • maltbmaltb Posts: 3,572
    why would Type-R go on anything but an Acura? Sounds like that be plain stupid marketing on their part.

    Honda will need to trash that designation if the proliferation in the aftermarket gets any worse.
  • lngtonge18lngtonge18 Posts: 2,228
    There has been a mention of a 6 speed manual available for the CL Type S in both magazines and in the forums, BUT I find no mention of this tranny on Acura's website nor Edmund's. What gives? Is this tranny really available or hasn't come out yet? More then likely the 03 Accord will get a version of the 225 horse 3.2 V-6 from the TL, not the 240 horse 3.5 from the MDX and Odyssey. There is a chance the 6 will actually beat the Accord horsepower wise for once.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    The CL is finally getting a manual, but the Accord V6 doesn't have one yet.

    Also, Acura is now using the "Type S" label, so that leaves "Type R" for Honda to use if it pleases.

    -juice
  • dsm6dsm6 Posts: 813
    Accord power: I don't see the accord v6 getting more than the standard 225 hp from the 3.2. Yes, the tl and cl type s boost the 3.2 to 240 hp, but Honda wouldn't want the accord to step on the toes of the upscale auras.

    type r: word is the RSX will come out in a type r version. A type r Honda civic and honda accord already exist in other parts of the globe - check out honda's british web site. The british type r is powered by a pumped up inline four and features some suspension and brake upgrades.

    If the 6 is anything close to what mazda says it is (this has yet to be seen, but I have hope that it will at least come close - PR folks always make every model sound better than actually turn out to be) it should easily be able to compete for my money with the others in its class.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    260hp for the Type S, actually. You may be thinking Altima, which has 240.

    The Euro Accord is different than ours. In fact, the Civic Si we're getting in based on the Euro Civic.

    -juice
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    The Civic Si for 2002 is coming from Britain, not Japan or Ohio. I wonder how well built these are compared to these other sites.

    Back to topic: I hope that the 6 comes in the fall and not an "indefinite date".
  • dsm6dsm6 Posts: 813
    Someone asked about a sports package for the 6. According to the info on mazda's us web site (www.mazdausa.com), the 6 will come with optional 17 inch wheels shod with 215/50 tires. Check out some of the specs on mazda's NAIAS pages.
  • diploiddiploid Posts: 2,286
    The RSX is already available in Type-R format...but only in Japan.

    OK, back to the topic...
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    For my wife, I'd pick 16" wheels. 215/50 is too low a profile for a tolerable ride (in her eyes). I think a 215/55R16 would be more than adequate.

    -juice
  • dsm6dsm6 Posts: 813
    The standard wheel, tire combo whill be 205/60R16s.

    Mazda doesn't list vehicle weight on the page where I got these wheel/tire figures. Has anybody seen any info on curb weights for the various 6 models/configurations?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    205/60 is still OK, plus you could do a Plus Zero.

    -juice
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    The latest release info from Mazda on the Mazda 6....

    Late Nov 2002.

    Rich
  • venus537venus537 Posts: 1,443
    "No matter how dated the 6 gets, it's bore factor couldn't approach the Accord"

    somebody has it backwards. despite being in its last year, the accord is still highly competitive (i'm not talking in terms of sales either). The accord's interior as it is right now is better than the current camry and altima. i'm actually hoping that mazda hits a homerun with the new 6. i was disappointed with the new camry and altima. i plan on getting a new car later this year and my choices right now is another jetta or 2003 accord. i know what i'll get with the jetta, but i'm waiting to see what the new models from honda and mazda bring. my concern with the new mazda is its affilation with ford. will the neccesary resources for the new mazda be forthcoming from ford? yes, this car is critical for mazda. this is the car that needs to bring home the bacon for maxda, not the smaller economy car protege. the new 6 has lots of room for improvement and it looks like it will be much improved.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Accord did win the sales race.

    But they're guilty of some cost cutting (so is Mazda for the last 626). It'll be interesting to see the content level on the new 6 vs. the new Accord.

    I'm talking mouse-fur headliners, thin carpets, sun visors, gooseneck hinges for the trunk, prop-rods for the hood, stuff like that. Note that the Korean competition has started to address these issues.

    -juice
  • venus537venus537 Posts: 1,443
    i can't speak for the 626, but the last accord had a vinyl headliner and always had a prop rod for the hood for 4 cylinder models. it did lose the gooseneck hinges however. overall, the accord made a big leap from the previous model. Honda know accord owners won't put up with any cost cutting. for example, the 98 accord didn't have break away mirrors. after a big uproar, honda put the break away mirrors back onto the accord the following year. something the new altima or camry don't have.
  • maxamillion1maxamillion1 Posts: 1,467
    Honda knows they better get it right to stay in the game. I remember back in late 1997 when the 1998 Accord debuted, it had some very cheap looking cloth(as cheap as the new Altimas), and it had a pattern like the cloth found in the Pontiac Grand Prix. Actually back in 1998 all trims with cloth seats shared the same pattern and design. I think that is cheap. The higher the trimline, the better the cloth or leather should get IMO. Nissan does the same thing now with the new Altima. As mentioned earlier, it didn't have breakaway mirrors. By 1999, all these things had been changed. Only the new Accord DX has the cheap looking cloth. The LX models have upgraded cloth, while the EX models get "suede" like material. That's they way it should be IMO. Now people wonder just how I can tell the difference between the 1998 and 1999 Accords. My aunt drives a 1998, and she honestly couldn't tell the difference between the 1998 and the 1999 when she brought her Accord earlier this year. And she is a salesperson at the dealership. I also think that Honda will learn from the new Cr-V, which has some seriously hard plastics. Their best bet is to just leave the interior alone, and let it stay the way it is, or use some seriously good plastics. I mean, this is some serious money that people spend on cars, I will not be driving a new car with a cheap interior. Not with my hard earned money! No sir!

    BTW,from the video I saw on the new Mazda 6 at the mazdausa.com website, it looks like the new 6 will have some nice interior materials, they look better than the ones found in the new Altima. The only thing I can say that I don't like is the center console with all the metallic trim. I really like the seats though, plus the rear outboard passenger seats have adjustable headrests! Something I wish the new Altima had. How much does it really cost to have adjustable rear headrest? They can't cost much, can they?!?!?
  • ickesickes Posts: 82
    The cost cutting on the previous generation Camry and current Accord was due to high Yen to Dollar exchange rates. Note that Toyota has re-contented the Camry for 2002, and we can probably expect the same for the '03 Accord. The new "6" looks rich on content, while it will likely command a lower price than Accord/Camry.
  • carguy62carguy62 Posts: 545
    You said the new Accord will approach $30K. Honda usually raises prices 1 or 2% with a new model intro. That would bring the MSRP to a little over $26K. To be close to $30K the price would have to go up by over 16%----never will happen. And don't forget the top of the line Accord has no options (or very few) unlike the Camry, which is why that vehicle approaches $30K. Don't scare people away from a vehicle that isn't even out by overinflating the price. Now if it were Subaru....j/k.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    I wonder how big the Camry and Accord will eventually get, since each "redesign" they brag how much "bigger" they are. Soon, they will be as big as a 76 Olds 88!

    At least the Mazda 6 is not turning into a boat.
  • ickesickes Posts: 82
    I wouldn't think an Accord would be priced much over 26K or 27K. Otherwise, it bumps into the almost fully loaded Acura TL at 28K.

    I hope they keep the "6" around 25K nearly fully loaded. The 5-door really has my interest if I can get one with a V-6, 5-spd., and cloth seats.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    Supposedly, the 03 Accord is to be "dramatically" styled anb bigger. How much bigger an it get before it's called a "full size car", the kiss of death for Baby Boomers!
  • I have to assume that the folks at Mazda understand that there are still driving enthusiasts in the USA, and will allow us to spec out a V6 with a manual tranny and cloth seats, instead of assuming we want leather and an automatic to go with the V6.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    I think they are going to have a MTX/V6 available. I just want to see the car, but I have to wait for the Chicago Auto Show!
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    check out the Accord board for some mag-x artist renderings... yes, they are only renderings, but these folks from across the Pacific were dead on with their drawings of the 02 Camry. and if those pictures are true, I would hardly call the new Accord "dramatically styled". I think that the Altima, joined by the "6" (dumbest vehicle name EVER!) will be the most exciting cars in the class, offering more for the enthusiast than the Camry/Accord vanilla duo. That said, the Camry and Accord will remain the quintesential top performing overall family cars, IMHO.
    ~alpha
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    The drawings look blah, except for the front. It has the new Civic's boring rear doors too.

    But, I am sure it will sell since they will say how much bigger it is.

    However, I think the 6 will do real well too! '626' was so "80's" sounding, :\
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    The reason for the name mazda 6 is for brand image...Actually they will eventually call every car line with just one number. mazda 4, mazda 5 etc...

    according to the marketing guru's at mazda it forces the person to say the name "Mazda" when mentioning the car.
    Nobody will say "I drive a 6" They will say "I drive a Mazda 6". BTW: the RX-8 will be called the Mazda 8.

    Rich
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    John: if they add the 225hp engine, side curtain air bags, and stability control, plus factor inflation...

    I guess the question is how far will they go? If the EX-V6 does not offer all three of these, prices will be lower.

    Rich: interesting story on the names.

    I think the catch is people will think all Mazda 6s have a V6 engine, and the 8 will have a V8, and so on.

    -juice
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    Yes, I agree about the names for Mazdas. The Miata is known as just that, not "Mazda Miata".

    It depends though, some cars are remembered for their make, such as Honda Civic and Ford Mustang.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    In Miata circles I hear "MX-5" and "Eunos roadster" more often than I hear Mazda, so maybe they do have a point.

    -juice
  • Type in "Mazda 6" into any search engine and see what you get back.
  • meesrmeesr Posts: 20
    The show cars do not have the annoying Altezza taillights for North America. Thank god.

    anyone, does anyone have pics of the show cars at 2002 Detroit show???
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    The web search won't yeild anything until after the car comes out, though.

    -juice
  • Sorry if any of this is repeated but I've skipped to the end. I loved the Mazda 6 and will wait to make the purchase (unless the 2003 Accord blows me away). This is what I was told by the rep. at the show:

    1. sedan due out march 2003
    2. hatchback/wagon due out june 2003
    3. priced $20-28K (leather, V6, etc.)
    4. auto/manual (6 speed!) avail. in all models.
    5. Millenium will eventually be phased out.

    I too think the 6 will be out sooner than 2003. Perhaps they want to be on the safe side for a release date vs. not making the given date. Sell all the 626s first too?! The blue sedan w/ leather interior at the show was sweet. I loved the feel of the tight 6 speed tranny too!

    I did take lots-o-photos and will try to post them soon! Stay tuned.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    The MPV was promised early and got delayed, so maybe they are playing it safe. I'm not sure if I can wait until March 2003, but we'll see.

    Were you able to get in the car?

    -juice
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    We were told at the National Dealers meeting a week ago the Mazda6 will be out in late Nov 2002.
    Like any new car intro, delays are always possible.

    I ordered 2002 MPV on Monday. Current schedule for northeast. Brochures and national advertsing start on 2/11 and vehicles arrive for late Feb.
  • dsm6dsm6 Posts: 813
    Interesting that the rep at the show said 6 speed manual. The Mazda lit. that I've read says 5 speed manual, though it does say both 4 and 6 cylinder engines will get manuals with the 6 actually getting a different 5 speed than the 4. Also, the lit. I've read says the automatic will be 4 speed for the 4, and 5 speed for the 6, cylinder that is, on the 6, car that is. Too many numbers now. Gets confusing. Maybe either the rep or the folks who wrote the lit. are confused as well.
  • Yes, two of the four 6s you were able to get into! Both had leather, 1 auto, 1 manual (w/ removed shift knob). The locked 6 was the red w/ tinted windows hatch back with right side steering. The other was silver, on a rotating display and was cut in half length wise.

    I ended up asking two different reps the same questions to make sure they were accurate, which they were. Hoping for this fall too.
  • maltbmaltb Posts: 3,572
    the mazda press release verifies your post. No mention of any 6 speed.
  • dsm6dsm6 Posts: 813
    It would bring a nice symmetry to the name, though, eh? Much better than 5 speed 6 cylinder 6 for dsm6. How about it, Mazda? Oh, well. I may just get the 4 cylinder 5 speed 6 anyway.

    3-5-6-8 whom do we appreciate? Mazda! Mazda! Yeah!!!!

    Mazda's right: that sounds much better than "Protege-Miata-626-Rx8 ..." ;-)

    edit: I just thought of a good reason they shouldn't offer a 6-speed. Then it would be 6 6 6 , vehicle of the beast.
  • OUCH, that was funny. LOL

    We're gonna get our 6 no matter when it's released to the public. More likely the hatchback or wagon (if it's coming) with 5 speed auto (tiptronic I hope) 6 cylinder 6, so that's 5 6 6 :-)
  • otoluvaotoluva Posts: 195
    It will definitely be an interesting mach up,what do you think?
  • maltbmaltb Posts: 3,572
    that the mazda 6 will be more vehicle at a higher price.
  • newcar31newcar31 Posts: 3,711
    Here is picture of them. It's from a distance, but you get the idea: http://www.detnow.com/naias2002/gallerytuesday1/p0004187.html

    Looks much better. Looks like a winner.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    The V6 Altima is priced from around $23-30k, but they are being discounted already. That'll likely put the prices at the same level, and the Nissan has the edge in displacement.

    But it also has too-light steering, and some serious torque steer. We'll see how Mazda tunes theirs, but hopefully the steering will have more feedback, and the torque steer can't possibly be as bad.

    The Altima is pretty sporty, too, with 17" wheels and V-rated tires standard on the 5 speed, so Mazda has its work cut out for it.

    -juice
  • My guess is that Mazda and Nissan are going to be seriously scrapping it out for sales in the next decade. Toyota and Honda have done such a good job of appealing to the broad middle of the market that nobody is in a position to knock them off. Even if a competitor made a better car today, it would take years to win the sort of reputation for reliability and low depreciation that Accord and Camry enjoy now.

    How can competitors find a decent slice of the family sedan market? Hard to win market share by outcompeting Toyota and Honda on cost; that market is being taken over by the Koreans. That leaves both Nissan and Mazda looking for customers by focussing on the sporty, zoom-zoom side of the family sedan market. If the 6 lives up to expectations, Nissan will have to refine the Altima to keep it competitive and attractive to buyers who actually enjoy driving.

    If Mazda and Nissan go at each other that way, and if the yen stays weak against the dollar, it's gonna be fun trying to pick a car.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Bingo, you nailed it. Honda competes with Toyota, so Mazda will battle with Nissan for the sporty fringe of the mainstream.

    Koreans have taken over the value end. Subaru has the wagon/AWD niche. Mitsubishi may be in some sort of identity crisis, because IMO they share too much with Chrylser.

    -juice
  • dsm6dsm6 Posts: 813
    I too think you hit the nail right on the head, storyteller. That having been said, I've driven the new Altima (in 5 speed v6 form), and it was impressive, but it leaves room for Mazda to push into the "driver's" family car market - the Altima has some shortcomings (IMO). Like a lack of road feel - a bit out of touch with the road, and too much torque-steer, as noted above. I also didn't care much for the feel of the shifter. The car handled competently, but didn't seem particularly nimble. Maybe that's the lack of road feel combined with the car's size (I'm used to smaller cars I guess). I think Mazda could do better on many of these points. The Altima has power, though - nice and smooth. Should be fun to compare!
  • Was also told by the rep in Detroit that the Mazda 6 will appear at the Chicago and NY auto shows. Chicago is in February, NY ????
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