Subaru Legacy/Outback Wagons Maintenance & Repair

seayakker

The tach jumps after about one second, then it downshifts & tach jumps again after 2 seconds. I've never before had an automatic wait THAT long to respond!

Maybe I just need to always keep my cool if any emergency situation arises (uh huh) & push the gas pedal slowly - I get more speed that way. :-(

paisan

I'm swinging by my dealer tonight I'll see if they have an H6 there and I'll test it out. I always nail my gas on my cars

-mike

seayakker

Note: If I floor it from a stop or barely rolling (which, of course, I NEVER do) it moves out...the hesitation is only when I'm already moving along at near freeway speed.

Jillian

paisan

Let's say I'm doing 30-40mph and nail the gas it should hesitate?

-mike

seayakker

that's exactly it mike.

ateixeira

Drive hard until the tranny "learns" your driving style, and it should adjust and shift more quickly. The ECU is probably trying to decide what gear to be in.

Paul: 14 lbs already. As for the heat shield, it's not something I've had to do, so I can't say how hard/easy it is.

mama: recalls having been complete are a good sign. It means the owner was registered, heard about it, and took care of it.

-juice

seayakker

juice ~ I first became aware of this issue a few months ago, so I've been flooring it occasionally in the hopes that it would adjust its attitude, but I've seen no changes yet.

Bottom line for me is that it seems like a safety issue. This isn't my usual driving style, (hey, I'm getting older & more conservative...umm, in driving anyway) but I want the power when I need it!

Jillian

sierra15

Can anyone tell me if the steering wheel lock on the 02 Outback is supposed to engage with the wheels turned to the passenger side? This makes it hard to work parking uphill and curbing the wheels the other way. (My GL locked with the wheels in the neutral position) Basically I got blown off by the dealer service dept.

ateixeira

Hmm, our H4s respond pretty quick to the throttle, so I can't say why yours doesn't. Maybe they tuned the H6 to be smooth vs. abrupt, and it just responds better to smoother inputs? Beats me.

The wheel should lock in either direction, once you remove the key and turn it a little.

-juice

jfl

Steering wheel lock - don't you just park, curb the wheels, then remove the key?

At this point, the steering wheel may turn a certain amount (i'm thinking less than 45 degrees on the steering wheel) and then lock. Always thought of it as a pin going into the next notch preventing further movement.

Jim

mawittman

My '99 OB (102K) has a "rattle" in the front/middle when I turn in or out of driveways, etc. When I hit bumps or anything driving straight, I never hear it. I have looked, and looked for anything loose...nothin' Am I just gonna have to face facts and drop a grand on struts/bearing plates or does anyone know of anything else it could be? The strangest part of it, the rattle/clunk seems to be eminating from the middle/front, not so much left or right "wheel area"

Matt "I Get It" from Ohio http://www.jamawittman.org/the_suby.htm

ateixeira

Sounds right Jim.

To save the tires, try turning the wheel gradually, while the car is still moving.

Matt: the real question is...HOW did you drive 102k miles so soon! Yowsah! :-)

OK, let's try to trace this. It only happens when the car is turning and in motion, so I'd look at the suspension and the steering, maybe the front differntial too.

suspension: try hosing out the spring base to clean it. Inspect the CV boots and the axle boots for leaks. Those have to be greased up to stay quiet. Then check the sway bars - I guarantee they are dry so spray some lithium grease on those. Even if that's not it, it'll help your car handle more smoothly.

steering: check the PS fluid. See if the noise happens when you are in neutral and turn the wheel all the way left, then right.

diffy: have the gear oil level checked. If you have a manual tranny, the front differential will share its oil. At 102k, if you have not done this already, heck you're close to the mileage to have it done the second time, so go for it. 75w90 gear oil.

If it's auto, flush the ATF.

My last thought is the wheel bearings are beginning to go. If that's the case they'll get louder and start to whine at high speeds. Our 626 got to the point where it was grinding all the time.

-juice

snowbelter

I have an 02 VDC. Was on and off the hwy several times today and floored it at 30, 35, and 45 mph. Each time the car downshifted right away and the tach jumped up to 4K once each time. That's "normal" for my car. When my car was low mileage I once floored it from a stop to enter traffic and car just crawled into the intersection, but it seems to have "learned" and accelerates better from a "stop". I would like to have a dollar for every time I've taken my car in to fix a problem, only to be told "its normal" when you know its not.

paisan

I tried it in my 3.3 H6 last night. Didn't notice anything out of the ordinary as far as a hesitation. I did notice a gulp before it downshifted, but nothing out of the ordinary. Also on the 3.3L I think it actually turns off one bank of cylinders during upshifts to make them smoother. Not sure if the 3.0 does this.

-mike

ateixeira

If this makes you feel any better, Edmunds wrote this about their brand spankin' new Lexus ES300:

"when exercising the car or driving aggressively, the slushbox responded with harsh upshifts and soggy, delayed downshifts, behaving as though it were utterly confused about what the driver wanted it to do"

The full review is here:

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/roadtest/73568/article.html

I'd have the ATF flushed once you hit 30k miles, or at the next major service. It's cheap insurance for the tranny, either way.

-juice

reblack_jr

Any feelings on this? My dealer was "pushing" this $100 service once a year or every 15,000 miles. It is advertised to "Reduce engine contaminants with an engine oil flush". From what I have been reading it is not needed if regular (3K-7Kmiles) changes are done. I put it off at least till the next oil change.

ateixeira

The only way to remove sludge is to use a solvent. My concern would be what tiny bit gets left behind could do serious harm to your engine.

Also, any solvent might actually start an oil leak, since it attacks your seals.

I wouldn't touch that, even for free.

-juice

taddison

I would concur with what Juice said.

An oil change place talked me into doing an oil flush few years ago (back when I didn't do my own oil changes), and my front and rear crankshaft seals both started leaking shortly afterwards. This could have been coincidence, but I suspect not.

Unless you have actual evidence of a sludge problem I think it's best to put nothing but oil in there...

otis123

My '01 Bean never opened the front moonroof cover automatically. How could it? - there's no motor/mechanism to slide it. The rear cover DOES open as the rear moonroof opens (a nice feature when your daughter is too young to reach the cover!). It catches the cover and slides it along...

There is a slight hesitation when you floor the Bean on the highway, but when it kicks in it flies like a rocket. I had to escape from two 18 wheelers last night on the Whitestone expressway near Shea Stadium in Queens NYC. I crossed three lanes and left the trucks in the dust. As I grinned from ear to ear, it reminded me of why I went for the H6 - for that reserve power when you need it.... I could hear the truck drivers say, "that's an Outback?"....

ateixeira

If you want to stop sludge, switch to synthetic oil. That $100 will pay for a few changes right there. Mobil 1's oil is supposedly compatible with dino, so it doesn't strip the stuff off.

But leave whatever little sludge there may be behind, to keep the seals in good shape.

-juice

hammersley

Mamamarmot: the '97 Alternator recall was a simple fix... if the alternator needed replacing, it happened. Mine had already been done when I bought it. Don't let that scare you off.

Cheers!
Paul

wmiller4

I have an '02 Bean and my front moonroof's sun shade has never opened with the switch. I have always had to open it manually then move the rocker switch to the rear to open the moonroof.

seayakker

:::sigh::: so far it's looking like my car is the only one in the world whose lower front moonroof opened w/ the switch! I'm not going to try to convince everyone that I don't live in a fantasy world, and unfortunately I'm the only one short of the sales & service staff who's ever driven my car.

But it DID open w/ the switch, and there has to be a reason why! One of these days I'll take it apart & see if I can figure it out, if for no other reason than to convince y'all I'm not nuts! (wellll.....let's not go there...) It WAS a very nice feature.

Thanks for the feedback everyone - believe me I will let you know if I ever figure it out!

Jillian

paisan

If it's the cover, I doubt it opens with the switch, I thought all along we were talking about the glass tilting via switch. Most covers only retract with the glass when it retracts.

-mike

ateixeira

Jillian: maybe the rodent that got into WDB's engine bay and tinkered with his throttle managed to find his way into your moonroof! ;-)

-juice

idahodoug

I get a brake pulse at speeds of 75 and up. It's not severe - just annoying and it's more like a pulse than a warped chatter and drops off below 65 or so - gone. Doesn't do it at any speed otherwise. New Michelins, but it did this faintly on the old tires as well. There's nothing more disconcerting when braking from 85 or so and feeling a brake issue. I pulled the rotors this afternoon and they're not warped, and the pads are in good shape. Wheel bearings are tight, though the right front has a touch of slack I'd tighten if the crappy Haynes manual showed me how they come off (grr). Also, I don't feel it in the steering wheel and swapped rims front to rear one side at a time and was not able to discern a difference.

While the rotors were off, I scoured them with garnet paper as they looked slightly glazed. Now, I haven't run out to the freeway to see if this is gone, but anyone have any other ideas to investigate while I'm dirty? I am Mr. Picky so I've gotta fix this - simply cannot let it go.

IdahoDoug

idahodoug

Guess I should ask this one also. When I remove the hubcaps, I can see what looks like a wheel bearing nut retainer in the wheel's hub hole - gold colored sheetmetal collar whose inboard surface is clearly shaped like a nut. I'm expecting if I unbend the little punched section that keeps it in place and remove this, I'll find the usual wheel bearing nut and a retainer nut, yes? I just want to give it a tweak to remove a bit of slack, but cannot find anything to confirm this before opening it up. Thanks.

IdahoDoug

hammersley

Doug: where you goin' 85? I wanna come play!

Cheers!
Paul

seayakker

There's a subaru rodent wreaking havoc on our minds & motors? That's it!

"the rodent in the moonroof...gonna get that rodent...dadblasted rodents...."

she wanders off muttering.....

idahodoug

Paul,

I frequently go to LA and the Midwest for business and drive 'cause I like it and can bring my bike for off hour relaxation. Most of the way to LA is on the 15 and I just set the cruise at 84 mph all the way there. One of the reasons I'm a fanatic about maintenance is that I do run at a pretty good clip and like knowing everything in my vehicle's in top form.

To test around here, I just head east from CDA and run that speed for few minutes. Still miss the good ol' days of unlimited speed limits in Montana. I used to run my '97 A6 Quattro Wagon at 94 mph on the cruise all the way across the state (700 miles) and save serious time.

Still haven't checked if the brake pulse is gone. Later today. I'm gonna be really bummed if it's not...

IdahoDoug

idahodoug

Nope. Still there with no change. Grrr. Borrowed a dial caliper to check the rotor thickness all around - I think it's a rear. Anyone know of a good source for online Subaru parts? The dealer wants $70 apiece for the rotors, and I think that's kinda steep for such a small part. The huge LandCruiser rotors were something like $82 and they'll give you a hernia.

IdahoDoug

paisan

My isuzu rears were $200 from the cheapest online dealer around IIRC. I got rotors for $30 each @ Pep-boys/Autozone/Strauss for the Trooper when I needed them.

-mike

idahodoug

I've always been nervous about buying non stock parts - especially brakes. But if YOU'RE not warping rotors they must be good enough. Interestingly, the OEM rotors (I'm assuming they're original at 23k) were stamped Made in Canada while the rears were Made in Japan.

I'll look into it. Thanks.

IdahoDoug

paisan

I know I'll probably have to replace the non-oem one quicker than normal but at that price I can live with that. I was very leary about it myself.

-mike

sten2

I have been trying to find alignment information that was posted on one of the Subaru boards sometime ago. It was about some national repair/tire chain that offered a lifetime alignment on a special machine. What was the chain and what is the name of the machine?

I have been having a slight pulling to the right ever since the dealer installed new struts in my 2000 Legacy L. I have been back for several alignments since and am still having the trouble. It gets better after the alignment and as the tires wear, but after I rotate the tires the problem keeps coming back.

subearu

It could be one of the tires causing the alignment issue. This would be especially true if they were the OEM's.

It took me 2 alignments to get our Outback 'perfect'. But, it was 2 different dealers. The 2nd alignment was at a dealer who had Hunter equipment. I have alignment specs at home and can post 'em here if you want.

Does it pull right even on the left side of a crowned road?

-Brian

taddison

Did you happen to have your tires rotated at the same time as the struts were changed?

I once had a bad tire but didn't notice it was bad until it was rotated from the back to the front, after which the car started pulling badly to one side.

To diagnose the problem the tire place switched the two front wheels and found that the car then pulled to the opposite side, which told us that a tire was bad and ruled out a suspension or alignment problem. They couldn't actually tell which of the tires was bad so they replaced them both under warranty.

sten2

The tires were not rotated when the struts were replaced. The car does pull to the right even on a road that slopes to the left. (Had to take the mechanic for a drive to prove this to them).

It is possible that after the front struts were replaced the tires wore more on one side, so now they are causing the pulling instead of the alignment. But I can't see any abnormal wear.

I guess I will have to try swapping tires left and right.

Anyway- does anybody know what place offers a 'lifetime' alignment deal?
Thanks

idahodoug

You say the problem comes back after you rotate the tires. What happens if you simply rotated the tires back where they were immediately? And are these OEM tires/rims?

I think you have a tire with improper conicity. When you have the alignment adjusted to the pulling tire on the front, everything's fine. When you put the bad tire on the rear, the alignment no longer has the tire's affect and the vehicle pulls again. The alignment fixes this by an adjustment to the bad tire on the rear and you're fine again until you rotate and start all over again.

There's no way to measure this bad tire outside a lab, so your cure will likely mean new tires. If you have the original tires on it, and can show that it pulls with the tires rotated, but not with the tires in the 'OK' position, then they'll have no choice but to conclude the tires are the issue. So, knowing that if you "re-rotate" immediately and the problem goes away would be important.

Also, why were the struts replaced, and which ones?

IdahoDoug

sten2

These are OEM tires and wheels, 15” steel and 205/60/15 RE92’s. I figured that the problem was getting better in between rotations as they tires wore into their new position. I have not tried immediately rotating the tires back to the previous position.

From my understanding of how the alignment is checked, the tire is not involved at all. Aren’t the measurements taken on the rim of the wheels? So I don’t see how the alignment could be adjusted to the ‘pulling tire’, unless the mechanic fudges the numbers to make it drive the way it should.

I will be getting new wheels and tires, but I will not have them for 2 more months.

The dealer replaced the front two struts because they thought they were the cause of a noise that occurred when the front wheels went over a bump while the car was turning. The noise was sort of a rattling thunk. The noise did get better, but not totally. That dealer had its Subaru franchise pulled, but their main Subaru mechanic moved to the new dealer in town. The new dealer says they can’t work on it because it is related to a problem the other dealer was involved in.

mamamarmot

Hi all-
First, thanks to everyone putting up w/ my eternal questions, I finally went and bought my car. It's a '97 Outback w/ 62k on it. the guy I bought it from is a Subaru freak, and replaces the transmission fluid, etc with synthetic aviation grade stuff, so I 'm thinking that is a good thing...
Anyhow, the question I have is-- has anyone had the now-standard tether latch put into their wagon retroactively? Is it a big deal to have done,and about what did it cost?
Thanks!

revka

You may also want to post (copy/paste) your question about tether latches in our main Subaru Legacy/Outback discussion. Good luck.

Revka

Host

Hatchbacks & Wagons Boards

idahodoug

I have not tried immediately rotating the tires back to the previous position.

>Give this a try as a key data point.

From my understanding of how the alignment is checked, the tire is not involved at all. Aren’t the measurements taken on the rim of the wheels? So I don’t see how the alignment could be adjusted to the ‘pulling tire’, unless the mechanic fudges the numbers to make it drive the way it should.

>That's exactly what I think is going on. A test drive, a tweak and there you are, sir. Then you rotate the tires and the pulling tire's now opposite when it was aligned and its force is doubled (tires pull plus alignment now pulls WITH the tire instead of against it).

I will be getting new wheels and tires, but I will not have them for 2 more months.

>That will be very revealing. I suspect you'll need another alignment - this time to the "straight ahead, no pulling tires" position.

The dealer replaced the front two struts because they thought they were the cause of a noise that occurred when the front wheels went over a bump while the car was turning. The noise was sort of a rattling thunk. The noise did get better, but not totally. That dealer had its Subaru franchise pulled, but their main Subaru mechanic moved to the new dealer in town. The new dealer says they can’t work on it because it is related to a problem the other dealer was involved in.

>I think the pull started after the new struts because they were not aligned properly. On a strut suspension, the struts themselves align the tires. This could have worn the tires into a uniform bevel (now acquires conicity force) and it has been a constant battle each time you rotate out of the alignment that "cures" it. Too bad about the new dealer - that means he or his service manager (most likely) is a bit edgey and prefer beating the system to taking care of customers. As a new dealer, his service satisfaction numbers are watched closely and he knows you're a likely low score so he doesn't want you in the system. So, he's gonna cheat things a bit. I was both a District Sales Manager, and a Dealer Evaluation Manager so I know what I speak of here.

Frankly, if I were in your position I'd simply put the new tires/rims on now and be rid of an annoying situation. Your old tires may never track straight again. When you get the tires put on, proceed directly with as few miles as is humanly possible to the best alignment shop in town. The best will have a top of the line Hunter and they will advertise that they're an alignment shop.

Let us know. Also, what are you doing with your old wheels?

IdahoDoug

sten2

Yes, if I had the new tires and wheels now it would be easier to just put them on and see if it still pulled. Unfortunately, I won't have them until my brother brings them for Thanksgiving.
I plan to keep the 15" wheels for snow tires for now.

oclvframe

My self-dimming mirror is starting fail. When a car gets behind me(w/headlights on, during non-daylight hours), the mirror dims as designed, but sections of it don't...as time goes on, the portion that is not dimming is getting larger. I have already worked with my dealer to get a new one (and from what I understand it has already arrived). Now all I need to do is swing by there to pick it up.

Anyone else experience this?

-r

paisan

The fluid was leaking, replaced under warranty.

-mike

bat1161

I just had my mirror replaced, as Mike mentioned. Over a period of a few days the fluid seemed to leak out. The dealer replaced it with no problems, under warranty.

Mark

ornt

The ATF Temp light on my 97 automatic OB frequently flashes upon startup. It stops after 10 seconds. The computer reveals a code 24 - transfer clutch solenoid circuit. I notice some vibration during tight turns and binding when turning while in reverse. The problem is sporadic - when the ATF light doesn't flash at startup the binding doesn't occur, when the light flashes the binding is quite noticeable. I understand that trouble with the AWD clutch pack is a common problem, however, there've been no recalls. Comments or suggestions?

idahodoug

If it were my car, I'd find the wiring harness that goes to the transmission computer and clutch solenoid circuits. Then I'd pull them off one at a time and spray them liberally with Contact Cleaner (electronic supply shop), dab a little dielectric grease (any auto parts chain) on the connections and reconnect them. Spending a half hour doing this would be time well spent.

From what I know about the clutch solenoid circuit, it uses very small variations in voltage as signals for the amount of lockup. After 5 years, there may be some corrosion in there that's deteriorating this delicate signal level wiring - especially if you live in the rustbelt.

The binding seems to indicate full lockup of the clutch when it's not called for.

The alternative is a wildly expensive transmission and days of down time. Try the half hour $15 solution first.

IdahoDoug

paisan

I'll try to lookup where the connections are in the SVX shop manuals tonight. It isn't a "common" problem though.

-mike