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Subaru Crew Cafe

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  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I thought about Tundra, too, but that's gotta be relatively expensive to produce. And Toyota enjoys some exclusivity right now, which Nissan wouldn't.

    I just thought about their current lineup. The Pathfinder uses the VQ engine, but the more trucky Frontier and XTerra use a different engine from their truck family. Strong sales + cheap to produce = profit.

    So I guess it's sort of my educated guess - they'll use a non-car engine for the F/S pickup.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    the Nissan truck V8 will be a variation of the existing Q45 V8, just as the Tundra is a variation of the Lexus V8.

    BTW, according to those in the know, the '03 4Runner V8 gets the 5-speed auto that the Lexus GX470 gets. That being the case, I would not be at all surprised if all '03 Toyota V8s also get the 5-speed automatic, including the Tundra.

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The Tundra doesn't vary that much, though. I predict the Nissan's will be far more distinct.

    It's just that their approach to trucks has never been high tech, and Carlos "le cost cutter" Ghosn isn't going to throw a Q45 engine in a class where prices start in the teens.

    -juice
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    The Tundra isn't selling as well as Toyota had hoped I thought? Cause it's not quite large enough?

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    is VERY happy with Tundra sales. They're selling them as fast as they can make them.

    Tundra V8s don't sell in the teens. High $20K is more like it for V8 models.

    Bob
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I guess I was mistaken I heard that they were nowhere selling as well as the big 3

    -mike
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    OK, I stand corrected. I read a review of the Sequoia yesterday, and it turns out that Toyota uses an iron block and less aggressive tuning for their truck version of that V8, so that it can run on regular (the Lexus engine requires premium).

    It's still DOHC, though. I think Nissan will do something similar, and maybe go further in making it SOHC.

    I also checked and V8 models start at about $22 grand for 2WD, and go up from there (try finding one for $22k though).

    But my general feeling about them having to cheapen the engine was accurate - the iron block, for instance.

    The Big Three's trucks sell in higher volume, but Toyota's supply chain isn't nearly as big, so it can be viewed as successful even with fewer sales.

    -juice
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    For me $22K for a 2wd base pickup is just way way too much $. If I were to buy a pickup I'd get something in the $15-$20K range. Something you can beat up. I mean if I had say a $30K 4wd Tundra extended cab, I doubt I'd want to load up the back with cement blocks and concrete. Maybe it's just me.

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Doesn't have anywhere near the production capability to produce Tundras like the big three—yet. They need more factories, which will be coming, I'm sure. A new 3/4 ton Tundra is in the works, which is about a year or so away.

    The Tundra has met and/or exceeded any and all production goals set by Toyota. Most people would call that a success.

    Bob
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Most personal-use pickups sticker above $30K, including domestics.

    Bob
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    yep. the funny thing is that an F150 or Silverado 1500 will run you $27k-31k and the same money buys you a REAL truck, a 2500/3500 Silverado or SD F250/350.

    of course that sort of logic is why some folks daily drive a medium-duty truck and that's nutty IMO.

    -Colin
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    With a bed liner, it shouldn't get too bad. Plus you should tie down any loads like that, else hit a speed bump and have debris flying out and nailing the guy behing you in his Miata (like me).

    I can't see owning a pickup. I'd just get a trailer.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    a 3/4 ton or 1 ton pickup will ride much harsher without a load than a 1/2 ton. 1/2 tons are far more often used as personal use trucks. *Most* of the people who buy the HD pickups usually also use them them for work, however.

    Bob
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    I've owned a couple of full-size trucks. For people who have never owned one, it's hard to understand their attraction. Both times I've sold my trucks, I've regretted it. I do agree, as a daily driver, they don't make a whole lot of sense.

    Bob
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I'd buy a 2500/3500 series for towing and hauling. Couldn't drive one on a daily basis.

    I've driven my uncle's F250 (circa 97ish) with the V6 in 2wd that he bought for $16K. It's absolutely huge! But for hauling it can't be beat.

    I can't see spending $30K on a non-daily driver :(

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    owning a 3/4 ton, but not a 1-ton dually.

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I can see the use in a Crew Cab, or the new Dodge Quad Cab, I guess. I'm just not a truck person. You couldn't give me one.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Unless you never owned one before, it's hard to appreciate a full-size pickup.

    If I had enough money for two new vehicles (of my own), one would be a 5-speed silver WRX wagon, and the other probably a new 4x4 Dodge Ram 1500 Quad Cab short bed.

    The Dodge Ram would be (for me) the ideal vacation vehicle for the Outer Banks. Put a hard lockable bed cover on it and you have an absolutely huge trunk. I could tow the WRX to the vacation spot, so that it I have a nimble run-about for errands, and the RAM I could drive out on to the beach. Sounds about perfect...

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Well, my room mate owned one, and I lived with him for half a dozen years before I got married.

    It was great for moves, but I can see a trailer being just as useful, if not better. He had a big tool box that ate up half the space on his 6" bed.

    But many more times, we were cramped in the 3 seater cab, and stranded a 4th person.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    without at least an extended cab.

    Bob
  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    I've never owned one but my father has had a succession of Ford, then Chevy, half-tons for almost my entire life. I learned to drive stick on a '68 F-100 Ranger (Ranger was a trim line, not a separate model, in those days). In fact, when I started shopping for the Forester I actually began by looking at '00 Chevy Silverado 4x4 half-tons, short bed, regular cab. Part of my twisted logic Silverado -> Frontier -> Xterra -> A4 Avant -> Legacy GT -> Forester selection process. Sometimes I still want one.

    Ed
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Yep that is what I do in the summer essentially I tow up the XT6(soon to be SVX) and leave the Troopa upstate for towing the boats, doing off-roading etc. Then I use the Subaru to travel up and down, and for sprited drives on the mountain roads.


    Updated pics are up by the way http://isuzu-suvs.com/events and http://isuzu-suvs.com/autox


    -mike

  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    This seems like a good topic for discussion—sort of a pre-X-Mas list, if you will: :)

    If you had the opportunity to purchase two new vehicles for yourself, what would they be?

    My choice, given what's on sale now, would be the WRX wagon and Ram 4x4 Quad Cab SLT (w/hard lockable bed cover).

    My daily driver would be the WRX. Between the two vehicles, the WRX would see about 80% of my seat time, with Ram getting about 20% of my seat time. The WRX would satisfy my sporting jollies, whereas the Ram, equipped as I've described would be the ideal family, vacation and utility vehicle, IMO.

    What's your choices?

    Bob
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Gotta love when bob does this.

    Audi S8
    MB G-wagen

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    must have gotten a (big) raise! :)

    While I didn't put any price limits here, I'd hope the choices had an (outside) chance of occurring—meaning vehicles that "could" be on your short list, should such a situation actually present itself.

    Bob
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I didn't say I could afford it :)

    If I had shorted a bunch of stock the past 2 weeks I could have afforded it!

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    both Mike and I have picked one vehicle with extreme sporting pretensions, and one with extreme utility pretensions. I'm curious if others will follow this pattern too?

    Bob
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    where Mike and I differ is that I prefer "small and nimble" for sporting, and "large and in-your-face" for utility.

    Mike's sporting ride is rather large, and his utility—while extremely rugged, is rather small, at least compared to my choice.

    If anyone is wondering about my wisdom in picking a Dodge (reliability, etc.), recent quality results have shown Chrysler products to have made a large positive jump recently (resulting in better warranties, BTW), so I'll take take my chances...

    Bob
  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    WRX wagon (unless I didn't have to pay for maintenance, then Audi S4 Avant)

    A refurbished Toyota FJ62 from Cool Cruisers

    Ed
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    following the same pattern: sporting and utility!

    Bob
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I'm not a fan of the looks of the new 1500 series Dodges. I rather take a 2500HD Ford or 2500HD Chevy over the looks of the dodge.

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    looks have nothing to do with it. The Ram Quad Cab's "cab" is the best in the business—bar none! It's not quite a crew cab, but is bigger than an extended cab, and has the best combination of interior comfort, flexibility and utility of any full-size pickup on the market.

    Plus the truck has enough "work" capability for my needs. I don't want/need the rough ride associated with a solid front axle, found on the 3/4 ton models. I wouldn't mind having a diesel though; unfortunately none are available on any domestic 1/2 ton pickup (yet!).

    Bob
  • goldencouple1goldencouple1 Member Posts: 209
    and for a time I loved it. I will not get into why I stopped loving it. But I will comment on driving a little truck:

    We like the volume of the bed for carrying stuff: it was a champ when camping, vacationing, etc. Bikes inside and all the other junk -- great! It was reasonably comfortable. It was 4wd, so it was go anywhere, for us -- rock-crawling was out, but who cares! It was an Extended Cab (two jump-seats) with was good for packing stuff inside the cab -- virtually useless for passengers.

    The downside on the truck was truck-like handling. I put a few hundred pounds of dirt (arroyo dirt: rocks and sand) in bags and put the bags in the back of the truck -- handling improved" fewer spin-outs, and the back end stopped hopping around on bumps (though it seemed to intrigue the Border Patrol every time we went through a check-point: they wondered what I was hauling, and were mildly skeptical when I told them "dirt".) The truck still steered like a truck -- couldn't do anything about that. Smaller tires would have helped, I guess. The four liter engine was all low end torque and very thin upper end torque. The truck sucked on hills unless you were going 75 miles per hour and has lots of momentum built up -- but then there was the truck-like steering.

    The ideal setup would be a pickup that handles like a car and has room for passengers in a back seat -- big volume for cargo and a pure car drive. I was pretty excited about the Baja (or its prototype, really). But that took too long to come out.

    We have our Forester now, and it is great -- though we still pine a bit for the truck's hauling capacity -- bikes inside will all our stuff.
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    ...my 1986 4Runner back. =8..^(

    Should never parted with it, but Kirsten wasn't ready to give up her Explorer.
  • subearusubearu Member Posts: 3,613
    Even my wife liked driving my Chevy Z71 extended cab. But, as mentioned, it wasn't financially feasable to have as a daily driver. But, for towing our ski boat (before we sold it), it was excellent. And for moving into our house - well, we packed up the short bed AND a small trailer with our junk.

    I too like the Dodge Ram. Sure the new Silverado's are better than my Z71 was, but I guess I'm just not interested in the General anymore.

    We've already got our mini-van (MPV ES), so I doubt we'd wish for something else. And you know what other vehicle I want - a Legacy Blitzen/B4 sedan. Is this wish list limited to current U.S. models? If so, then I'd say a Outback VDC sedan or Legacy 2.5GT sedan.

    -Brian
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    the RAM would only see about 20% (at most) of my driving time, so I wouldn't feel too guilty about driving something so fuel-thirsty. When you want a truck, nothing but a full-size will do, IMO.

    Bob
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    I saw Juice's post about Lucky's first service and while I haven't (and probably won't) name my M3 I have had it in for service twice.

    The dealer is awesome, in a word, but I've found they do make some assumptions being that they service BMW only.

    I brought it in for an oil change, because there is a reminder light on bimmers that cannot be reset except by a dealer's scan tool. I decided I like the light, since it accounts for how hard you drive, oil temp and mileage; so even though I never brought my Impreza in for a change I let the bimmer guys do one. $53 for a filter, 5 quarts of BMW formula Mobil1 10w30 and labor-- not cheap, but not overly high either.

    I also asked them to look at a chirp at cold start and investigate the weak A/C. I supposed they might be related, like a slipping AC belt.

    From those drop-off instructions they pressure tested and recharged the AC ($160 P&L-- unquestionably fixed the problem though) and diagnosed a failing alternator pulley bearing and ordered that too. They were apologetic about not having the bearing in stock and completed the work in 4 hours, but I couldn't return before the end of the day.

    The part arrived in 2 days but due to my schedule I went in Monday. Again they were done in 4 hours, and again the problem seems fixed-- no more chirping. I am fine with this type of service but I can understand that some people would prefer to know about any and all new charges before actions are taken. I decided to evaluate what they've done and as long as I find it reasonable, to let them do their job as best they can.

    Both visits I received a loaner service vehicle at no charge-- remember, I have a used 1995 M3, not exactly a spankin' new car. First one was a black 2002 325 with the premium and sport packages ($35k, the kitchen sink trim level) and Monday I got a white 2001 330 sport. Both automatics, natch. The 330 had some punch. Not quite like my M3, but I'd be curious to try that comparison again with a manual 330...

    Anyway, both times I got my car back it was clean enough to eat off the exterior or interior. They did move my seat, but I think the service manager is too short to drive without moving the seat. They also are very fast when I check-in and -out.

    My Subaru dealer unfortunately was the polar opposite of this.

    -Colin
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Porsche Boxster S and an Audi RS6.

    Oh, wait, I have to pay for it? :-)

    Used '99 Miata and WRX wagon. I'd sell my '93 Miata but keep 4 vehicles in the fleet. Utility would come from a little trailer I'm trying to talk a friend of mine into share-purchasing with me (since he offered to keep it in his garage).

    If I'm allowed to wait a year, I'd get a 2004 Forester Turbo and trade my current Forester.

    So I broke that trend, and chose sporty/sporty. You can always rent a truck from UHaul, given how often I'd need it, I really don't want to own one.

    I thought about a minivan, maybe that would make more sense if we got a 4th vehicle in the fleet. But nah.

    -juice
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Interesting, Colin, they definitely cater to a different audience (affluent & impatient?).

    That service would have peeved me, though, honestly, because I feel that people should never assume they can spend my money freely.

    -juice
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    I wouldn't consider myself affluent Juice, but clearly they did make the jump between me asking for a diagnosis and them doing that and then undertaking repairs without prior approval.

    I definitely did not say "fix my AC and this chirping" when I came in... but they did it all so well and I *did* want it fixed after being sure the price was fair.

    -Colin
  • subearusubearu Member Posts: 3,613
    there's a U-Haul just 2 blocks from my house, so if I did need a truck (or trailer for that matter), I could get one just by walking over there.

    colin-maybe they figure you would rather just have it fixed rather than getting an 'estimate'. I'd love to have that kind of service though.

    -Brian
  • storytellerstoryteller Member Posts: 476
    Give me a cherry red Honda S2000 for fun on good highways and a wintergreen VDC for outdoor adventures (and for something to drive when I'd accumulated too many tickets with the Honda).

    Steve
  • jfljfl Member Posts: 1,396
    Audi TT Quattro Roadster and I'll keep my Legacy until a more powerful version comes out.

    Yes, I know the TT is all looks when compared to the Boxster and S2000, and it will be dusted by a WRX. 8~)

    Jim
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    Well the more I think about it a WRX wagon would be perfect for me, plus around 2K worth of mods. I mean, what a great roadtrip vehicle, plus fine for around town sales calls AND the occasional 10 case wine delivery. So there's #1 unless the STi shows up as a wagon.

    #2 Ford Econoline E-250 with the triton v-8, Chateau I guess but maybe panel too. Haul it all in secure, tempurature controlled comfort. Plus go camping in it. Hmmmmmmm...mirror ball?
  • grahampetersgrahampeters Member Posts: 1,786
    G'day

    Okay, I'll overlook the fact that Paisan wants US Spec models only, pleading that there's a whole five billion people out there who are not Stateside.

    I'm pondering about something practical and something fun. The practical would probably be another Subaru although I am tossing up between the Outback and a new Forester (a choice I'm currently making in real life).

    For the fun one,I'll take a different tack. I'm in my mid 40's so am allowed a little mid-life crisis and can probably run to something convertible or completely stupid. Am I allowed a really extravagant beast like a Ferrari Dino or a Lamborghini. Perhaps not - the dog hairs would clash with the black leather interior and she might have problems looking out of the windows!

    Maybe the cute little Peugeot 206cc which I saw, top-down this morning would do. Mind you the guy driving it in 2 degree chill (okay 36F for you folk) looked as if "Pride does feel the cold" after all, despite looking immensely cool with the roof down.

    I also fancy the Mercedes Smart which is cute, tiny and zippy, despite a 660cc motor.

    I'll ponder some more. This is a fun idea

    Cheers

    Graham
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    It was actually bob who restricted it to US models. I guess we could say anything available in your "home" market to make it fairer. Although that restricts us :( We always get screwd on car choices.

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    << It was actually bob who restricted it to US models. >>

    Actually I didn't put any restrictions on it, other than vehicles currently in production, and for sale. I was assuming "for sale" would mean wherever you live. So for Graham, it would mean whatever is currently available on the Aussie market.

    The only other "request" would be choosing vehicles in which there would be at least an outside chance of one purchasing&#151;for yourself, not for your family (does not include spouse, significant other, or children's vehicles), given your current situation. Yeah, I would love to have a Ferrari, but I know I will never own one, so I didn't list it.

    Bob
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    In that case. I shall revise mine.

    1992 SVX
    2000 Trooper

    Which is pretty much what I should have by Christmas.

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    I would think you might want a brand new Trooper...

    Bob
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