I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

fintail

The late 50s through the 90s to some extent was the peak of visibility. Maybe some hiccups here and there with thick B/C-pillars only barely helped by opera windows, but beltlines were generally somewhat low, and design made it easy to see the corners. I think safety regs and maybe some sycophant copycat designers who think high beltlines and gunslit windows look "sporty" or "dynamic" have doomed the idea. Especially bad these days is the cliched upkick at the rear beltline which appears to exist to add insult to injury (or an arrogant stylist will claim it is "character".

Visibility, easy to park:



I recall a relative had an HHR, and the A-pillar is what drove them nuts, apparently right in the line of sight, ergonomic fail

I'll also agree about Adam's new format. Someone needs to tell him he's a cool guy and all, but we are there to see the cars

roadburner

My '02 had the best outward visibility of any car I've ever driven:


Second best was my Bavaria:

stickguy

the Volvo 144 was like that. square with large glass area.

fintail

Is the Bavaria on later wheels or some kind of Euro spec wheelcovers? I could see those on an E28.

Pic is apparently old enough that the cars in the background are now interesting, my eyes go to an 84-85 Tempo, and I see a Mk II Scirocco and a Festiva in the background.

roadburner said:

My '02 had the best outward visibility of any car I've ever driven:


Second best was my Bavaria:

kyfdx

@fintail

Those look like early-mid '80s wheels covers.

I had a set from an E30 318i on my '67 2000 CS

tjc78

One of the worst cars I’ve ever owned for visibility was the 2012 LaCrosse. High belt line and huge A pillars. It was a handful in tight quarters.

roadburner

They were E28 covers. I mounted the steel wheels from a parts car I had because the E23 alloys I had needed refinishing. The picture was taken at Oktoberfest '88.

uplanderguy

Our '11 Malibu LT was bad for visibility, rearward. That said, to this day I think it was the nicest-looking car we've owned. Metallic black, and good wheels. The only thing I didn't like was the Mitsubishi-looking taillights.

Speaking of bad A-pillar blind spots, when I've driven my B-I-L's '06 Dodge Ram pickup, when I turn left I am almost blinded by the left A-pillar.

sda

I’ve had several convertibles with poor rearward visibility. The 2008 HHR had the worst overall outward visibility. What bothered me most was the huge blind spot at the B pillar. The passenger seat and B pillar blocked my view.

andre1969

I think the best car I had for outward visibility was my '68 Dart (and by default, my '69). The C-pillars were pretty thick, but because they were slanted, they weren't as bad as you might think. That car was also very squared off, and I could see the corners, so it was very easy to judge in tight spaces.

My DeSoto is also pretty good. The peaked front fenders and tail fins are good for judging. Also, the hood and the trunk really aren't that high, but the seating position is somewhat high, so there's a good view over them. Now, the seat is still low to the floor, but because it's a ladder-frame car and not a perimeter frame, that still seems to raise the seating position up a bit. The down side, is that the ceiling is really close to my head, and the view to the side is cut a bit, at the top. I guess that's not all that important, since it's beside you, and the road, that you really need to be watching. There is a little distortion though, in the wraparound windshield, and the rear window, that can be a bit distracting. And driver's side tailfin shows up in the rear view mirror, so at a quick glance it makes me think something's cruising to my left, and just behind me.

As for the Colonade cars, my LeMans isn't too bad, although looking out the back window, you really can't see the rear of the car because of the way it slopes away. And while I definitely prefer the large triangular windows, the opera windows, in my opinion, don't hurt visibility as much as you might think.

uplanderguy

My '17 Cruze and the wife's '19 Equinox both have backup cameras, of course. The wife's vehicle beeps if something is coming down the street as we sit in the driveway. My Cruze doesn't have that.

But, I'll say, I think the backup camera is the most practical thing in cars in a long time for me. I rely on it. But then, I'm older and have some trouble moving my neck back and forth, LOL.

Now...if someone could invent a tire and wheel combination that will not perpetually result in loss of air in cold weather. I go to Sheetz, wait my turn, and see every make of car, domestic, Asian, and European brand names, old, new, low-cost and high-end, waiting to air their tires up.

imidazol97

Here's what you need. Set the pressure desired, and it pumps it up to
1/2 pound over that pressure. When you've removed the snap on connector,
the pressure drops due to the slight amount of air lost, and the tire
ends up at the pressure you want.

Only downside is it requires being plugged into the outlet on the
car. I'd like to find a battery powered model that's in the quality category.



https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MKSP49L/ref=redir_mobile_desktop?_encoding=UTF8&aaxitk=5e5e100348890d08724a735ab71d70fb&hsa_cr_id=2811948350701&pd_rd_plhdr=t&pd_rd_r=af57cd74-e38f-42db-97a7-f52c9d91f57f&pd_rd_w=pnG4H&pd_rd_wg=HVEvw&ref_=sbx_be_s_sparkle_td_asin_0_title

uplanderguy

Thanks for the tip. Years back I had an air compressor for the Stude, but I ended up burning it out somehow. Never replaced it.

stickguy

I have a fairly basic black and decker air station. works off 12v if needed, but also has a normal 110 plug. I just keep it in the garage. When I need to air up, I just plug it in and take care of them right in the garage. No need to ever go to some place that has air (and very few around here now don't charge for it).

xwesx

One of the tricks to tire air, especially when it comes to TPMS, is to always set your pressure to 35 psi for on-road use. Many vehicles call for pressures somewhat lower than that (between 28-32), and then as soon as the ambient temperatures go below freezing, the lights trip as though you're losing air. At 35, the tires wear better, you get a little better economy, and you don't need to deal with temperature-related false-positives on the TPMS.

tjc78

Agree. I always set mine to 35 or even a touch higher if I know there is a colder weather coming

stickguy

I use a 10%ish rule of thumb. I generally put an extra 3PSI in. Seems like a good compromise to me. A little firmer for handling, but not going to lead to funny wear. Been working for 30 years or more, so just going to keep running with it.

roadburner

xwesx said:

One of the tricks to tire air, especially when it comes to TPMS, is to always set your pressure to 35 psi for on-road use. Many vehicles call for pressures somewhat lower than that (between 28-32), and then as soon as the ambient temperatures go below freezing, the lights trip as though you're losing air. At 35, the tires wear better, you get a little better economy, and you don't need to deal with temperature-related false-positives on the TPMS.

BMW often recommends different pressures for the front and rear tires. I generally follow those recommendations but bump them up 3-4 psi before the cold weather hits.

uplanderguy

As far as I can remember, every Chevy I've owned has called for 35 cold at all four wheels.

When it's cold I tend to air up a pound or two, but I'm liking the "10%" rule mentioned above going forward.

sda

Forgive me for another picture of my 76 Sunbird that I drove while I was in college. It had the best outward visibility of all cars that I've owned. The short trunk decklid and a hoodline that didn't fade from view made parking a breeze. More importantly, parallel parking was easy, which was a must when trying to find parking on campus. I liked front end styling of the Sunbird...it looked like a...Pontiac.

uplanderguy

That's a nice-looking car. I liked those wheel covers. Chevy called them "tromphe l'oeil"--'fool the eye'.

Pleasant surprise in the mail today, about something we were talking about here recently.

I got two checks, each for $97.43, for the GM ignition-switch class-action lawsuit.

After we no longer owned both Cobalts, I remember getting a little postcard in the mail about it, instructing me to go to the website, enter the VIN's, and the name of the principal owner of the car. I keep service receipts so it was easy--my wife's name was on one, as apparently first on the title, and mine on the other.

I bet it's been a good couple years, maybe more, since I entered the info online.

sda

The wheels on the Sunbird were steel rims with polycast molded inserts. The decorative part was actually flexible by hand and only the center cap was removable. Years later after I repainted the Sunbird, I replaced the wheels as they got dingy looking and the wheels did not balance well. I found some nice Vega GT wheels which Pontiac also used and bought Pontiac center caps. They looked good but I admit to liking the original wheels better.

uplanderguy

I thought they were these wheel covers:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/302018035072?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=302018035072&targetid=1264870805664&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=9015383&poi=&campaignid=14859008593&mkgroupid=130497710760&rlsatarget=pla-1264870805664&abcId=9300678&merchantid=6579974&gclid=Cj0KCQiAkZKNBhDiARIsAPsk0WgGEiWTP1X3kLVbymIbm1vUY1w3BkiL45ZcxZvC8PiGMaEi7-nced0aAjDoEALw_wcB

sda

The look is very similar.

Michaell

uplanderguy said:

That's a nice-looking car. I liked those wheel covers. Chevy called them "tromphe l'oeil"--'fool the eye'.

Pleasant surprise in the mail today, about something we were talking about here recently.

I got two checks, each for $97.43, for the GM ignition-switch class-action lawsuit.

After we no longer owned both Cobalts, I remember getting a little postcard in the mail about it, instructing me to go to the website, enter the VIN's, and the name of the principal owner of the car. I keep service receipts so it was easy--my wife's name was on one, as apparently first on the title, and mine on the other.

I bet it's been a good couple years, maybe more, since I entered the info online.

Hmm, I can't remember if I ever filled out that information for our ION. Guess I'll know if I don't see any checks in the mail soon.

uplanderguy

My hunch is that most people got that postcard and blew it off. Although, I did have to provide VIN's--they were not on the card; I do remember that. But I bet I didn't have ten minutes invested in it all.

My son-in-law's Dad paid Firestone for a repair on my daughter's '15 Equinox, wipers, that Chevy was fixing free for ten years or 120K miles. I told her husband, and her, I wished they'd have called me first. I filled out 90% of the reimbursement paperwork for my son-in-law, for his Dad to get reimbursed...VIN, etc. A month or so later I asked the S-I-L if he'd ever sent it in. "Nah". Yeesh. And it was $300-odd.

roadburner

uplanderguy said:

I thought they were these wheel covers:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/302018035072?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=302018035072&targetid=1264870805664&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=9015383&poi=&campaignid=14859008593&mkgroupid=130497710760&rlsatarget=pla-1264870805664&abcId=9300678&merchantid=6579974&gclid=Cj0KCQiAkZKNBhDiARIsAPsk0WgGEiWTP1X3kLVbymIbm1vUY1w3BkiL45ZcxZvC8PiGMaEi7-nced0aAjDoEALw_wcB

I remember Road & Track tested a '76 or '77 Skylark(IIRC) with those wheel covers. During the R&T brake fade test a couple of the wheel covers melted.

uplanderguy

I recall that review too. It was a Skyhawk.

uplanderguy

I was thinking that was a '75, so googled it. It came right up in a 'Curbside Classic' article. Funny, the very next thing that came up in Google was a post somewhere about someone's 'all stock' '90 Civic SI that did that too.

I had two friends whose parents bought the new '75 Monza 2+2 V8's, both with those wheel covers. They fell off easily. My one friend's Dad was a Chevy/Buick Service Manager and the guy was always up on parts changes/TSB's and always said the '76 wheelcover was improved, as were the brakes. I loved the cars, and actually despite what people's comments are saying about their 'fit and finish', I remember the Ste. Therese, Quebec-built cars, which was 100% of the '75's, striking me as rather good and the Popular Mechanics Owner's Survey of '75 Monza 2+2's, I recall saying the same thing--the magazine was surprised by how high customers rated the car in that respect.

The '76 cars (across B, O, and P too) got the Towne Coupe instrument panel, squared corner pieces on the rear bumpers, and lowered center hump as the original cars were built with a Wankel engine in mind. I preferred the '75 styling in and out, although the '76's were improved and Chevy started offering the 305 in the '76.

Both my friends' cars had very loud brakes when hot.

The CC article, below, mentions comparison to a current Toyota, but in my mind I can't think of a Toyota then that would be marketed against these cars, and where I lived, anyway, 1975 was a lot closer in the memories of buyers to 1945 than it is now.

I distinctly remember being very anxious to see the cars, but it was a late/lousy launch. Our dealer did not get a Monza 2+2 until February '75 and they were supposedly introduced the previous September or October. Also, the fact that the brochure was entirely mechanical drawings (zero photographs of the car) told me even then that something was up, LOL.

I'll say this, I know I'm not typical in this respect, but I'd rather buy a car I liked and was interested in, than buy something I'm not based almost solely on its reliability, real or perceived. That said, it certainly appears that GM rushed these cars into existence to have something to sell against the now-maligned but good-selling Mustang II. This, the original Mustang, and the Taurus were big examples where Ford scooped GM on the introduction of a new market niche.

https://www.curbsideclassic.com/vintage-reviews/vintage-review-1975-buick-skyhawk-it-isnt-a-finished-car/

sda

Thanks for including that article, I remember reading it as well. My Sunbird had the standard suspension and would understeer if a curve was approached too quickly. I can't say I had any issues with the brakes, nor did I do any panic stops from 80. The speed limit then was 55 and only when I was being 'bad' would I exceed 65. I did peg the speedo once, it took a long stretch of road to do that. I did find the Sunbird better riding and quieter than my friend's Toyotas and Datsuns but looking at the stats, 75db at 70, that isn't particularly quiet. Where the Toyotas and Datsuns you heard engine noise at highway speeds, the loafing V6 in the Sunbird was not heard, only road and some wind noise. I did prefer the original Vega GT based instrument panel. I thought it had somewhat of a sporty and european look. The revised dash complete with a big slab of fake wood tried to look more luxurious and included an 80mph speedometer instead of the 130 in the original version. Of note there was not a hard stop preventing the speedometer needle from exceeding 80, it would continue to wrap around the scale to 0 if you felt daring.

uplanderguy

The revised dash, you and I are in total agreement on. At some later point the Monza optional interior had a gloss black panel above the glovebox, sort-of like the Caprice Classic and I always liked that as a break from just more woodgrain there.

roadburner

My 1984 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe was good for one hard stop from 80 mph. I found that out I had sold my M6 and hadn't landed on another BMW yet. I wanted to attend an HPDE and the T Bird was the only possible candidate. The new four-lane bypass that ran past my driveway wasn't open to the public yet so I took the car up to 80 and hammered the brakes to the threshold of lockup, then turned around and tried it again. The second time the pedal went to the floor. The Fox body Mustangs were equally bad. As I heard a European automotive engineer say:
"European drivers don't care if the brakes squeal- just as long as they stop the car.
"American drivers don't care if the brakes stop the car- just as long as they don't squeal."

explorerx4

330+ car auction in Raleigh.
https://www.raleighclassic.com/

andre1969

explorerx4 said:

330+ car auction in Raleigh.
https://www.raleighclassic.com/

Interesting variety there. This one started making me feel a bit nostalgic...

https://www.raleighclassic.com/vehicles/1088/2001-buick-park-avenue-ultra

stickguy

This is a classic? Wow. I feel old too.

https://www.raleighclassic.com/vehicles/900/1984-plymouth-reliant

stickguy

This I love.

https://www.raleighclassic.com/vehicles/1160/1995-nissan-hard-body-4x4-pickup

jpp75

That's definitely quite a collection. Thanks for posting @explorerx4 I wonder if @breld would let me rent some space in his new garage.....

fintail

Quite a variety in Raleigh indeed.

This might do well

This youngtimer should fare better than a normal used car

tjc78

That 86 is beautiful. What a car.

ab348

Interesting piece here about its ancestor, the 1969 300 SEL 6.3. Never knew the injector pump dated back to the 1930s.

https://youtu.be/vMxXmkpKWY4

texases

ab348 said:

Interesting piece here about its ancestor, the 1969 300 SEL 6.3. Never knew the injector pump dated back to the 1930s.

https://youtu.be/vMxXmkpKWY4

What's more, the 1930s MB V12 had direct injection, just like the latest car systems. It gave them a big advantage over the Spitfire's Merlin. DI was also used on the MB 300SL of the 50s, I haven't been able to find out if it was used on the 6.3, but it look like it was. They switched to Bosch CIS for the 6.9.

sda

https://www.raleighclassic.com/vehicles/907/1970-cadillac-coupe-deville

This is a sharp 70 Coupe DeVille. The red leather interior is the same as what I had in my 70 DeVille convertible. @graphicguy , I think you'll like this one.

andre1969

I find myself kinda digging this handsome beast...

https://www.raleighclassic.com/vehicles/1054/1977-mercury-grand-marquis

In the past I've sworn I'd never buy another car in that general color range...not that I think there's anything wrong with it, but I've just had too many cars in the past that were similar to that, and want something different. But, I like the way the burgundy contrasts with the creme on this one.

I heard that on facebook, someone in a Lincoln forum ruffled some panties by saying he'd actually prefer a loaded-up Grand Marquis over a more basic Continental. And I can definitely see the attraction.

sda

andre1969 said:

I find myself kinda digging this handsome beast...

https://www.raleighclassic.com/vehicles/1054/1977-mercury-grand-marquis

In the past I've sworn I'd never buy another car in that general color range...not that I think there's anything wrong with it, but I've just had too many cars in the past that were similar to that, and want something different. But, I like the way the burgundy contrasts with the creme on this one.

I heard that on facebook, someone in a Lincoln forum ruffled some panties by saying he'd actually prefer a loaded-up Grand Marquis over a more basic Continental. And I can definitely see the attraction.

I was drawn to the GM as well. The interior is the best of both worlds, leather and cloth, very attractive. It is identical to the 77 GM dad had. 460 V8, deep dish wheels.

fintail

I could be wrong but I don't think the 6.3 had direct injection, I suspect a standard MFI setup maybe not unlike the fintail. Same engine as in the big 600 cars, btw.

texases said:

ab348 said:

Interesting piece here about its ancestor, the 1969 300 SEL 6.3. Never knew the injector pump dated back to the 1930s.

https://youtu.be/vMxXmkpKWY4

What's more, the 1930s MB V12 had direct injection, just like the latest car systems. It gave them a big advantage over the Spitfire's Merlin. DI was also used on the MB 300SL of the 50s, I haven't been able to find out if it was used on the 6.3, but it look like it was. They switched to Bosch CIS for the 6.9.

ab348

Over on the FB "All Original Cars" page, this unicorn '65 LTD popped up today. Just amazing to look at how well this was preserved. 390, 4-speed, just lovely. I prefer the '66 to the '65 usually, but this is just great.

sda

Wow! A factory 4sp LTD. Great color combo. Super sharp car.

fintail

Whoa, 4 speed in an LTD. I wonder if someone knew someone to get a build like that. That's a beauty.

explorerx4

Nice looking LTD. Looks like it has some added custom gauges.

texases

explorerx4 said:

Nice looking LTD. Looks like it has some added custom gauges.

That is a very unusual set of gauges, but the installation looks a lot better than any aftermarket ones I've seen, and the gauge faces look factory.