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reg : Exterior is stunning in my eye. Just a beautiful car. Interior looks mostly good (aside from the wheel) but yes, they could done a little better with the design. Quality is suposidly good though.
-juice
My current wallpaper: http://www.visi.com/~m16/images/
The wheel looks a little better with leather wrapped around it: http://199.239.248.45//images/full/2004/81/pn2005g6812674.jpg
> The tend to have the worst build quality.
I found that out the hard way. I bought an early VIN '03 Accord, thinking "it's a Honda, what could go wrong?" So far I've been back to the dealer six times, and there are still some things that aren't right. I spent months wishing that I could get my old GP back.
I will never again buy a major redesign without giving them 3 or 4 months to get the production issues worked out. I plan to trade my Accord in for a G6 before the warranty goes out.
I still don't like the steering wheel, though that is an improvement.
-juice
Parts bin sharing is a nice idea but cmon guys. The radio and HVAC modules look like dimestore bits. Perhaps the easiest change for Pontiac would to redesign the face plates, control buttons, and illuminated displays for these parts and get them in there ASAP. Those pieces are not requisite to a mid to upper twenties selling automobile.
There's no excuse for that sort of outright cheapness.
This car has a horrible front end that looks photoshopped from GP IMO. The interrior is nice looking, obviously worse than the Mercedes SL500 insipred interrior of the concept.
Gm is eally trying, but with such a hit on their hands with the concept G6, why did they fork over such a production model???
The '04 GP is an awsome designed car IMO, too bad its sibling was beat with an ugly stick.
bottom line: stats and specs on G6 are good, style kinda sucks.
Well, styling is subjective as they say. I really like the front end, except for the overhang, which is unavoidable on a FWD car with a transverse engine.
I especially like the metal mesh grill: http://community.webshots.com/photo/110077705/110080782RRFEtS
It's a great start GM, but you know the competition is going to catch up. Altima gets a new interior and exterior revisions and pretty soon the Camcorders are going to get restyling too. I wish GM had still gone all the way ahead of the others with a nicer interior. But for a REAL first effort, its very good!
does it send the competition scurrying to the board room to adjust their own production numbers.
UMMMMM NO, SCOTT. If anything, the exec's from other mfr's just scheduled a bunch of 2 week golf resort trips.
i don't think people will be lining up outside dealers to buy this car and i would fill my pants if i had heard someone actually preordered this thing.
Better not hang around Pontiac stores then cause I'll bet there will be many pre-orders. Man would I love to see that, LOL!
-juice
stranger things have happened. I saw on the Kia Amanti board someone paid like 28 grand for a new Kia.
Press has liked the G6. I agree with them, it and the Cobalt are the two best cars i have seen from the General since the Intrigue.
Of course we do know that it will new not be w/o its shortcomings; but what car isn't?
Think about it: a better interior, unique features (e.g. the sunroof), 2 V6's (GT 200 hp & GTP 240ish hp) and a convertible to boot? Someone please tell me what car offers all of this in this price range? (Sebring "enthusiasts" need not apply).
No it won't be a class leader when released; but even Honda had to start somewhere.
> it does not match the style of the gauges
I think it would look bad no matter what they did with the gauges. ;-)
It's not the best, but it doesn't ruin the car for me. Even the new Vette has this new GM steering wheel theme, so someone in high places at GM must really like it.
Ya.. but it took a 10 year break
Granted, I think Honda is absolutely great...an I have a Civic to prove it (I also own an Oldsmobile Intrigue).
But when I see progress from any carmaker, I call it how I see it. GM is making an effort to regain those customers it lost during the "Dark Ages". So as a fan of its rich history,I figure I can at least entertain the notion of a quality GM vehicle...right???
More like a 20+ year break to me. LOL :P
Back to the G6 which will be awesome!!!!
if you hate GM cars so much why don't you just buy and discuss Hondas? I just don't understand what is productive about you spending so much time trying to convince everyone that the G6 is going to flop.
Another thing, people keep talking about GM and OHVs, but the 3900 will have VVT which still isn't available on Ford or Chrysler DOHC engines, nor is it available on the DOHC engines used by the Koreans. The 3500 and 3900 easily trounce the Duratec and Chryslers 2.7L V6 and they are probably better than the Korean V6's and the Camry's V6. The 3900 will also get Cylinder deactivation which wont be available on anything else in the class except the Accord V6.
You are right, the car will be very competitive.
a-don't want a honda
b-g6 won't flop, it will just be an effort that is far below what the worlds biggest automaker should be capable of
c-when does a v6 and manual become available.......I doubt we'll see the 3900 anytime this calendar year and it will likely be frozen in hell before Gm actually ships any built v6/5sp combos to dealers.
isn't vvt in OHV kind of against the whole cheap and siple thing GM goes for with pushrods>? Why not just pull the 3.6 off the shelf and make more of those and be done with it? Why they waste the effort on it (3.9) when a world class perfectly good motor is ready to go is beyond me.
You say these things, but the evidence, specs and everything I have read point 180 degrees the other way. It's just your hate of all things, nothing else.
> current GA and am hoping that this one is much
> quieter (less wind and tire noise).
The best way (today) to find out how the G6 will drive is to test drive an '04 Malibu. The G6 will have a longer wheelbase and better tires, but they are otherwise similar.
> year and it will likely be frozen in hell before
> Gm actually ships
speculation, based on?
> any built v6/5sp combos to dealers.
It's a 6-speed actually. Manufactured by Saab AFAIK.
> isn't vvt in OHV kind of against the whole cheap
> and siple thing GM goes for with pushrods>? Why
> not just pull the 3.6 off the shelf and make
> more of those and be done with it? Why they
> waste the effort on it (3.9) when a world class
> perfectly good motor is ready to go is beyond
> me.
The 3.6 DOHC costs considerably more to produce than the 3900 OHV. The whole idea behind the 3900 is to offer performance approaching the 3.6 SOHC at a lower cost.
The 9-3 has a 4 banger, which is going to handle better than the G6 with a V6 hanging over the front wheels. The acceleration will also be different, with the G6 having more low-end grunt, and the 9-3's turbo probably better at highway speeds.
By the way, I currently drive a 2002 Grand am GT1 which looks far more exciting and sportier than the G6. The G6 is a step backwards in styling. Disappointing.
> which looks far more exciting and sportier than
> the G6. The G6 is a step backwards in styling.
> Disappointing.
If you like the GA's "Gotham City" look, then it's not suprising that you don't care for the clean design of the G6. They are worlds apart for sure.
I'll agree with dindak here and say that some folks here and in other GM topics are repeatedly disappointed because they expected more. Over and over and over again, like a broken record. The Grand Prix, then the Malibu, then the Malibu Maxx, then the GM vans, then the G6, then whatever is next. I'm sure I left out 20 other disappointments.
How long before you accept GM for what it is, and move on to discuss other things?
Also, we have to accept that some makes will compete on price, not by being the top of the class. They have other virtues like number of dealers, cheap replacement parts, cheap service, etc.
I remember the Honda/Toyota camp used to argue fuel efficiency was so important before those models had V6s, now that the Malibu V6 is more efficient than even their 4 bangers fuel efficiency is suddenly no longer important?
We easily forgive Toyota for the sludge debacle, and people aren't even aware of all the Honda/Acura transmissions issues that forced an extension of their warranty.
None of us have even driven a G6 and many people have written it off already. Fine, then why are you still here?
-juice
I don't like the '99 - '02 Grand am SE styling. But I love the GT's styling. Truely sporty and it looks very good.
The G6 is simply a sporier malibu. I also have to question reliabilty. My current car is not reliable at all. Hyundais are more reliable than my GA is. I would be stupid to buy the G6 knowing this, plus the ugly looks. I don't mind the clean styling, but Pontiac could have done a better job. I prefer the Acura TSX styling. That looks good.
There are a lot of pessimists here that focus only on the negatives.
-juice
Mazda6 launches with two engines and both offer manuals and autos - G6, only a 6 with an auto.
I'll reserve judgment on the Lacrosse until I see the interior. This car has a pretty important role for Buick, maybe they are even expecting to much from it. Supposed to replace the Century and Regal. I consider those cars to have quite different demographics (maybe I am wrong).
make that LOLx2
"How long before you accept GM for what it is, and move on to discuss other things?"
We can accept GM for what it is and watch it get taken over for the number one spot by Toyota. Considering how some folks love to be complacent and like things to always stay the same (and honestly don't recognize GM is a falling giant), I'll just say, its only a matter of time. There is an article in automotive news today about this but since I don't pay them oney I can't read it.
"Also, we have to accept that some makes will compete on price, not by being the top of the class. They have other virtues like number of dealers, cheap replacement parts, cheap service, etc."
if GM wants to compete on price, they should stop the ame incentive game and just adjust the stickers. This G6 will sticker in the upper twenties for sure. Some versions may hit close to 30k eventually. Why then doesn't GM admit their cars are second tier and not try to marekt them all as being competitive with the top tier? If you guys really want the second tier products but love multiple dealers and 'cheap parts' and 'chaep service' that's fine. But I doubt GM parts are much cheaper these days with model proliferation and GM serivce is just as pricey as any other. And then the question is, why do you have to fix or replace anything in the first place? Nothing on your vehicle should ever go out for the first 50-75k miles.
GM can't have it both ways....they can't play the low price maker and claim to be with the top dogs. Unless they try to evolve any of their brand sot make more sophisticated cars (which the market clearly wants) GM will alwys have the current stigma it does. That being, never the best.
The Maxx actually beat the Mazda6 hatch to market, despite Mazda having a big head start. Advantage Chevy.
I happen to agree about the incentive game they are playing. Sticker is $28k, but we all know $2000 rebates are around the corner, plus factor invoice pricing and you're talking $24k real-world.
They should use Saturn's sales model and just price them at $24k right now, loaded, from the start. Non-negotiable.
I guess they'll get a few first-on-the-block customers and make dealers happy for a little while.
But...they can't lead every segment, some times I think the critics expect them to.
-juice