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Comments
At the same time, buying used is actually less risky than buying new from a purely financial perspective. If you go with the 4Runner & then decide 2 years from now that it's just too big for your needs, you won't lose as much money as you would if you bought a new CR-V today & then traded out of it in 2011. The nice thing about buying used is that the original owner takes much of the depreciation hit so that you don't feel as much pain. And unless the 1st owner of the 4Runner abused it, you probably won't have any significant problems with it. A lightly used Toyota truck has to be one of the lowest-risk buys out there.
As far as comfort, no one rates the CRV high in comfort on the Edmunds or MSN Autos owners reviews. I personally think that larger, heavier vehicles are always more comfortable. I know the $Runner is atruck, and might be a little bouncier than the CRV on rough roads, but I think it's a better vehicle for road trips (as long as gas stays down).
The CRV is a nice, fairly small, efficient vehicle. It's well made and the cabin is nice in te EX L, but there is definately no "King of the Road" feeling in it. Driving it is effortless and you could be in any generic 4 cylinder sedan. I am also convinced that the size of the armrests and the ergonomics off the vehicle are geared towards women. I am not huge, 6 ft. at most and around 220, but I feel much more comfortable in a truck.
The problem with 4Runners, at least used ones. Is that they depreciate very slowly. I mean from the buyers perspective it's a problem. The reliability, driveability and off road ability cannot be matched. The Cherokee, Pathfinder and the Fords and GMs all suffer from sub par reliability, besides not having the same combination of being off road/snow/beach capable and also driving well on the road.I have two dealers looking for a low mileage 4Runner Limited for me. Both told me they were hard to find. Toyota made very few 4Runners in '07-'09, and very, very few of them are Limiteds.
I am going with the used 4Runner. it's just too dangerous out there, and my 16 yr. old son will presumably have his license in a few months and borrow the car from tme to time.
I know it's kind of sick to say, and no one wants to think about it, but if he was broadsided in the CRV by someone who was travelling at a hgh rate of speed, or someone even at a more moderate speed in a big SUV, and he was seriously hurt, I would have to wonder what would have happened if he was sitting up a foot or two higher in a vehicle with a full frame, not unibody construction.
I know gas might go back to $4 or so, but you really can't put a price on safety.
I think what profit they made was in that Doc Fee. But I agree its pretty close to dealer cost.
They get commission on the loan, no idea how much.
The only thing more comfortable for me is the Accord EX, but just practical anymore.
For the cost of a Pilot, you could get two nice used cars. Accord for trips and a truck for dump runs...
Just my feelings. Good luck with the CRV.
We go up to ME. every summer and volunteer at a camp by Lake Sebago. It's a great state!
Dealer says Invoice is $28470.51 MSRP is $30455.00
This is the best offer I have so far.
$28971. ($500 over invoice) plus $150 for Docs and $188 for licencing and $134 for splashguards = $29,443.
I really do not want wait until Feb to see if the prices drop. I have a pre clunker and it is in need of a timing belt.
Your feedback? Thanks in advance
2010 4WD EXL w/Nav
MSRP Price: $29,745 + 710 dest = $30,455
Invoice Price: $27,661 + 710 dest = $28,371
Do you have pricing on a 2010 EX L without Navi?
I am not sure what you nmean by your response, "Except you'd other options"...can you elaborate please? thanks much.
I was just doing the math based on bigdadis dealers cost. It seems if you take his dealers cost, and add the destination, the price they quoted you is $600 above dealer cost.
If they told you it was $500 over their cost, it seems they "misspoke".
For a 2010 Honda, it sounds to me like a very good deal. Watch them as they will probably try to make significantly more profit off alarms, extended warranties and financing rates. You should probably enter any deal with financing you fot yourself. You'll get a better rate.
PS If I wanted an Ext Warranty later if I decide I am going to keep this car, can I purchase it later? If so....Who should I purchase it from privately or should I solicit a quote for the Hondacare from another dealer ?
From what I understand, these "advertising costs" are a legitimate charge. You can read all about them on another website. I think it's called TrueCar.
Still, it is usually regional, so I don't se why one dealer would charge it and one wouldn't. Maybe the other dealers just haven't mentioned it yet? In any case, you can always ask them to take it off the bill and see what they say.
I am not an expert on extended warranties, but I can tell you that Consumer Reports recommends NOT purchasing them. Very few people get their moneys worth out of them. Very, very few people that buy a Honda or Toyota ever use them. Maybe if you were buying a Chrysler, Volkswagen, Land Rover or something with well below average reliability, and planning on keeping it for several years, it would be a good investment. The whole idea of buying a Honda or Toyota is that the vehicles rarely need any repairs. You are paying more for the car initially, especially compared to a Jeep Patriot or something like that, but the Honda should need much fewer repairs and, because of that, hold it's value much better.
I understand from some Honda owners websites that there are companies that sell warranties for about half the cost the dealer charges. The cost does go up a little though if you buy it when the car is a few years old, as opposed to new. But any of these warranties are only as good as he company that stands behind them. You'd have to do some research to see which are the bigger, more established warranty companies.
I am just curious what part of the country you are in? No 2010 CRVs by me. My local dealer said she didn't expect them until November. Another local dealer told me they would sell for MSRP when they first came in, and someone else on this forum said all Hondas go for $1200-1500 over dealers cost when new, but he was shopping an Odyssey, so maybe he's wrong.
Let me know what area you're in please. Do they have a lot of 2010s? Have you seen the new green? I think it's called Sage Willow?
I am in the Portland Metro area in the Pacific NW. Where are you located? No advertising costs added to invoice here in OR that I have seen but many dealers are trying to palm off add ons with purchase when pressed for comprehensive totals and written offers. The dealership with the advertising costs added to invoice is in Washington State.
I saw the new Opal Sage Metallic. It is a grayish-green color. Not for me. Actually the Green tea is a better color by far. The other new color is a dark grayish color....called Polished Metal or something like that....similar to one of the Acura colors. These new colors will be Accord Crosstour options as well. That should be out by Nov I hear.
The 2002 thru 2006 have had some major issues with the CR-V air conditioner and some wish they had the extended warranty. Read up on this issue in this forum
Brand new full make over ( Not Mild mid year changes ) honda or any other vehicle, the dealerships charge MSRP if not more depending on the model. Mid year cars normally do not and you can dicker with the manager. Start with Invoice, then go up from there bit by bit ( Few hundered only ) until both you and the dealership agree. Too much, walk out.
We here in Florida have to pay a $599 dealer fee, also state law. Other states have fee's as well but are less then Florida.
My dealer has gotten the word that two LX models are now in the build stage, so late Oct 2009 the CR-V's should be arriving.
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so donot pay more than extra 150-200 on top on that.......
https://www.myhondawarranty.com/pricing.php........to see actual cost select this dealer as your dealer.....will get actual cost ...if u select diff state...it will go 150 higher.....
when i brought my 2009 honda crv....they asked me 1850......for 7yrs/100k......got for 1000......i hope this will help
thanks
hp
I am on the complete opposite side of the country, Long Island, NY.
They must be pushing the new CRV across the country if we're not getting tem until six weeks after you.
I am still going back and forth between a new CRV and a used 4Runner or Pilot. Size and safety vs. the new car warranty. Thankfully, I am in no rush.
Someone was posting to this forum a week or two ago, right around the time C4C ended. He was from the Portland area and could not find any, or very few, CRVs. Maybe they sent the 2010s there first because inventory was depleted.
We still have some '09s left here, but the amount is dropping quickly. I spoke to my dealer a week ago or so and she was still expecting another 6-8 '09s to come in. I'm sure they were comng, as she knew colors and everything.
Opal-Sage sounds depressing!
$1000 or less seems to be right. People that complain on dealerrater and Edmunds that they were ripped off usually paid $1500-2000, and sometimes then wrapped that into the financing, so in reality they were paying interest on that amount too. Some Honda owner websites mention warranty costs in the "scondary market" as around $900 being a fair price.
http://www.myhometownnews.net/index.php?id=32248
"Florida law currently has some regulation on dealer fees.
The amount of the fee must be printed on the buyer's order, next to the real fees, such as sales tax and licenses. Next to the dealer fee must be printed, "these charges represent costs and profit to dealer."
This statement is misleading because it says costs and profits.
Obviously, when the dealer charges you money to cover some of his expenses, you are increasing his profits. The statement should be, "these charges represent profit for the dealer," period."
When we balked at the $349 documentation fee, he first said it was a rquirement and the dealership wouldn't budge on it.
He then took it upon himself to go talk to the boss and he was able to reduce the van by another $349, which offset the doc. fee.
It was a class act by a class guy. Too bad I can't find that guy now when I'm in the market again.
http://automobiles.honda.com/cr-v/
looking for LX 4wd
Some info - looking for an 09 or used 07, 08
would like the EX trim awd, no leather needed.
So - I was looking at this used '08 with a retail value of 23,995 - http://ps.getauto.com/group/details/91/6495/JHLRE48528C001115/
So i compared that pirce on kbb and they have a retail of 25,700 - http://www.kbb.com/KBB/UsedCars/PricingReport.aspx?YearId=2008&VehicleClass=Used- - Car&ManufacturerId=18&Condition=Excellent&ModelId=126&PriceType=Retail&VehicleId- - =197276&Mileage=25000&SelectionHistory=197276|31416|14224|0|0|
Edmunda has a retail of 21,102 - http://www.edmunds.com/used/2008/honda/crv/100933618/options.html?tmvaction=vdpr- - esult
how is kbb and edmunds so different? and why would the dealer be selling at 23,995 when truecar says a good deal can be had on a NEW 09 for 24,000 - http://truecar.com/Honda/CR-V/2009/best-price-report-3FA694E8.html?colorInfo=Roy- - al%20Blue%20Pearl,Black,25405,0,2009%20Honda,CR-V,4WD%205dr%20EX,2009_Honda_CR-V- - _Royal_Blue_Pearl.jpg&trimId=308102&modelId=18842&zipcode=14224 ?
Thanks for reading and helping out!
Based on the zipcode in your link, you are looking at East Aurora. If you are like many of NYC expatriats in the Buffalo area, you want to live in the Northtowns. You will have a lesser chance of being snowed in the winter. Northtowns get half as much snow as the Southtowns.
Amherst, Clarence, Williamsville, East Amherst, Snyder, and maybe Lockport are where majority of NYC expatriats live, includng us.
There are 4 Honda dealerships in the immediate vicinity, Don Davis (my favorite), Lia Honda, West Herr Honda and Ray Laks. Plus there are at least 5 more Honda dealers within 1 hour's drive. 1 hour's drive is not 5 miles, like in NYC, but rather 60-80 miles.
I believe Don Davis will sell at Edmunds' TMV with just a mild mentioning of the TMV.
Ray Laks is good too, they sell parts online at a deep discount www.hondaacuraworld.com and not only for cars, but bikes, and power equipment.
Good luck with the move.
Don Davis had six Glacier Blues in stock and they wanted $22,800 plus for that color. Lia's lowest quote over the phone was $22,850 plus and the Internet Manager at Dick Ide of Rochester wanted $22,990 plus.
Hope this helps. I really love the car and am happy with the deal I got. Best of luck to you!
Anyways, if we decide to go with the crv, could i ask for an OTD price of 24k? Would that seem unreasonable?
Take the price of the car your are comfortable paying inclusive of destination charge, add sales tax, and if you are getting new plates, the cost of the plates, registration... ect, and you should have a number.
For example, if you negotiate $22,800 for the car inclusive of destination charge, then your sales tax will be $1995 (8.75% in Erie County). Registration is probably another $60, I believe new prices went into effect Sept. 1st.... You are already at $24,855....
Make sure you have full coverage (if you are financing) insurance in place before picking up the car.
The guides on here are very useful, it may be a good idea to read them.
Don Davis came down to $22,800 plus for the Glacier Blue only after I showed the printed e-mail from Lia. When I said I wanted the Red (not in stock), the guy offered to get it for me, demanded $23,000 plus and did not budge.
At West Herr, the sales person started by pulling up Edmunds.com's TMV price on the computer and asked me to make a reasonable offer on the car price, not OTD. $22,600 plus was flatly refused. Wanting to save time, I asked him to beat Don Davis' $22,800 plus. West Herr quickly matched that figure. So I pushed again for $22,600 plus to no avail. Then I said $22,700 plus. The guy made the trip to the manager's desk and returned with the keys.
In retrospect, I think could have asked for some extras - perhaps all-season mats, wheel locks, splash guards, or a cargo net. As I said, though, I was happy with the way I was treated and the numbers. I have no regrets.
Since 2010's are about to hit the lot, my guess is $24,500 OTD could be a good start or target. $24K seems to be on the low side, but the worst they can do is say no and ask you to try again, right?
So here is the last question -
It seems like I can get a 2009 for 22,800 or so.
The 2008 we drove last night has a dealer retail TMV of 21,100
It has 25k miles, and is in pretty good condition.
Is it worth the extra 1,700 or so to get a new car with no miles? I know there is no objective answer to this, but would love your feedback.
Thanks!
Dave
Plus, there is no way of telling why this year old car is up for resale already.
Plus, you will get the full warranty on the new model.
For the used, your insurance premium could be lower. If it's certified used, you will probably get extra powertrain warranty and maybe some non-powertrain warranty. Powertrain failures are so rare these days that I tend not to value that too much, especially for a Honda or a Toyota. Surely dealers don't offer those warranties for free, so it could become a factor in your negotiation.
Needless to say, some haggling on your part is in order with Ray Laks over the 2008 you test drove. Dealers won't usually put Edmund's TMV price on the windshield. They might make the decision easy for you by either going way way below TMV or insisting on their sticker price.
Best,
Kim
How should I go about negotiating new car price?
Should I just negotiate new car price and then hope that dealer will give decent tradein value?
I would try to sell the car privately first, if there is nothing major wrong with it. If you can't sell it privately, then you have no choice but to trade it in. But negotiate the price of the new car seperately.
Do I have to pay 1) ERT Fee, 2)License and Title.
I guess I will have to pay documentation fee which looks like 151 in chicago.
I went to Honda dealer for selling my subaru
I plan to keep the decision to tradein separate than purchase but in back on my mind I know I have to get rid of the car. I am willing to take 500 less but not 1000 less than bluebook kbb value
I would expect them to offer you about $1500-2000 less than the Edmunds or kbb private party value. They can't give you any more than they can get for it at auction, and they have the latest auction prices. I would be prepared for a shock if I was you, unless the car is a clean, late model, low mileage car.
That's why,if the car is in good shape, and you sell it yourself, you should come out AT LEAST $500-1000 ahead. You are really paying them for the convenience of getting rid of your car w/o having to list it and show it yourself.
kbb blue book value shows 5500 for tradein not private party.
edmunds gives $4,806 $5,900 (tradein, private party)
My guess is that they offer you $4000-4500, believing that if they take it to auction they can get at least $4500 for it. It will probably end up on some dealers lot with an asking price of $6995!
That is why, if you can take 3-4 weeks, and invest $150 or so in newspaper ads, and ads on cars.com or autotrader.com, you should be able to ask $5700-5800, come down to $5000-5200, and be ahead at least $700-800, maybe a thousand.
But then in a month there wil probably be no more 2009 CRVs left, and an 2010 will probably be a grand more. Or they might be a few 2009 CRVs left, and they might be even cheaper.
It's your call. If time is not important, and you have service records, the car has been maintained, the body and tires are good, etc. you could come out a grand ahead. But you'll have to be available to show it to buyers and it may take three-four weeks to complete the deal. If you don't get an response from newspaper ads in two weeks, I would give up on that idea. At least by me the ads are expensive, but the on line ads are cheaper. Of course you need to take pictures of the car for on line ads. I would think a nine year old Subaru with 90K on it would be pretty easy to sell. There must be people looking for a car to commute in, or for their kids. It's kind of unique because it has AWD and is good on gas.
If you did all that, and came out a grand ahead, the 2010 CRV should be arriving on dealers lots. It has some big improvements over the 2009, a compass, a bigger center armrest, 18 more H.P., I think it's bluetooth compatible too. Not to mention a redesigned grill/front end. You would also then be ahead on the Honda as far as resale value, as you'd have a 2010 instead of a 2009.
I know I have to get following things done to sell myself --
1)tires which will cost $400
2)small dent in front near front wheel ?
3)engine light
All other things work in the car. Did I tell you how much I hate Subaru.
I just got it serviced at dealer for oxygen sensor less than month ago but the engine light has always given me issues. Dealer says he will charge me for diagnostic to determine if it is their work which would be under warranty.
Read the code from Carmax but it says oxy sensor, catlystic converter, etc. Not very specific.
The question is how much checking does the dealer do before taking in tradein car.
It's gonna cost at least a grand to do the tires, sensor (if it's not the converter), and fix the dent. The dent alone may be $500-1000 depending on the size.
Personally, if they gave me even $3500, I would take it and move on. You've come this far in searching for a new car, do you really want to put money into the old one in the hope of selling it and maybe getting that money back?
Good deal or not?
I've learned that I rarely come even close to a kbb or edmunds trade-in value on the cars I've traded in.
I also noticed that used CR-V's are horribly overpriced. Espcially in the condition of some I've test driven. Lots of interior wear, tranny shifting fairly rough. Clearly abused vehicles but still "certified used".
you are right -- SUVs age faster than cars for the normal city driving