Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

qbrozen

Mr_Shiftright said:

Thanks for the suggestions guys. The Honda Fit is a hatch and they aren't interested in that body style (for whatever reason). Like you say, go with what THEY want, not what I want.

Hadn't thought about the Cruze. I think I'll suggest they take that for a spin.

Yes, we know the Accord is not a compact but they were sniffing around a Camry, so I threw that into their mix.

And I agree, they might not appreciate the Mazda3 for what it is.

So nobody's hot on Hyundai in the compact class, eh?

Stickguy is! haha.
But, yes, the Elantra is pretty nice.

I can't get my head around NOT choosing a hatch if one is available.

Mr_Shiftright

I might have them drive one anyway. I think the nearest dealers of any sort are about 30 miles away, so not too bad.

xwesx

Mr_Shiftright said:

Thanks for the suggestions guys. The Honda Fit is a hatch and they aren't interested in that body style (for whatever reason). Like you say, go with what THEY want, not what I want.

Hadn't thought about the Cruze. I think I'll suggest they take that for a spin.

Yes, we know the Accord is not a compact but they were sniffing around a Camry, so I threw that into their mix.

And I agree, they might not appreciate the Mazda3 for what it is.

So nobody's hot on Hyundai in the compact class, eh?

I was going to suggest Cruze diesel given the driving distances and long ownership timeline.

Mr_Shiftright

Hmmm...I wonder if they are "diesel-intolerant" or not. I never asked them about that.

andres3

28firefighter said:

Like @fintail mentioned, lots of Volvos around here, particularly in the neighborhood I live in.

I'd say Volvos are very rare in Southern CA. Never seen an "R-line" in the wild either. S60-R was pretty good for the time.

CR has been hard on Volvo; at least since Ford took them over.

andres3

roadburner said:

My only regret about buying my out-of-warranty E24 M6 was selling it...

Do you know how that E24 M6 is doing after your ownership period? Might ease the regret if it blew a clutch 10 days after you sold it

stickguy

au1994 said:

Umm yeah, I’d expect 5k or better on and outgoing model that’s a stick no less. With those two factors and end of month and end of quarter, I might be looking for an 8k discount!

Well, at 8k I would have called in sick to drive up and sign papers. MSRP IS ~$26,670. My dream price (hoping to get back, would jump on) was 20, but I expected them to e-price back maybe $21,700, so some haggle to get to $21k, everyone wins! Having them give special online price of $26,115, if they are serious about that, I can wait until NY eve to drop in since car will still be there. Probably all 3 will be.

andres3

Mr_Shiftright said:

roadburner said:

My only regret about buying my out-of-warranty E24 M6 was selling it...

Perhaps that's the best time to sell, when all is well.

I think used car managers do maybe value a car just within warranty 10% more than one just out of warranty. Reason mostly being perception. Under warranty, there's no motivation for you to keep a problem undisclosed. After warranty, you might just forget to mention that slipping transmission....., or occasional electrical glitch.

stickguy

Andre, Volvo is actually doing much better now since unshackled from Ford. They aren't for everybody, but if you appreciate them, they have a lot to offer

andres3

Mr_Shiftright said:

So, what would you guys recommend as the "flavor of the month" in compact family sedans for some friends of mine who a)keep a car forever b) just need to get from place to place and c) live in a rural area so reliablity is an issue?

I told them if they could boost their budget somewhat to wait for the mid-size 2018 Accord (October 18th I believe). They were thinking Corolla but I sort of nixed that. I don't see it as a good value.

I was thinking Mazda 3 as a possibility.

If reliability is of utmost concern then Toyota or Honda. What's is a secondary concern? Handling? Power? Comfort? You don't really mention a second concern.

stickguy

Wish I saw this today when I was driving here!

https://www.bmwofturnersville.com/detail-2008-bmw-3_series-328xi-used-16841424.html

kyfdx

stickguy said:

Wish I saw this today when I was driving here!

https://www.bmwofturnersville.com/detail-2008-bmw-3_series-328xi-used-16841424.html

You don't want that engine, if at all possible. Uninspiring.

andres3

stickguy said:

Sat in Elantra GT and a TLX again today. Both have great seats. TLX is odd to me. From outside, seems smaller than it is, but inside, seems bigger.

The GT is just a perfect size. Just pricey. If the Elantra sport sedan had the seats from the GT, that would have been a screaming deal. I just hate to cut corners on seats! Have to go try them again and see how it hey seem.

I found the GT Sport seats to be very narrow and tight, even for a "sport." I liked the general looks of the car, I think they did a good job taking a Mazda 3 hatch and making it look better exterior wise, and modeling/copying an Audi A3 for the interior, and doing a pretty good 8/10th impression.

Car felt light. I wonder what it weighs. 7-speed transmission felt like a improved quicker faster dual-clutch for sure. The 1.6T felt improved (and sounded it too). Didn't really get to wring it out all-out though.

I have a feeling it wouldn't quite keep pace with a GTI.

tjc78

@Mr_Shiftright

Since I have obviously I’d vote for the Elantra.  Solid little car with a lot of features for the money.   Definitely worth a look. 

roadburner

Mr_Shiftright said:

Thanks for the suggestions guys. The Honda Fit is a hatch and they aren't interested in that body style (for whatever reason). Like you say, go with what THEY want, not what I want.

Hadn't thought about the Cruze. I think I'll suggest they take that for a spin.

Yes, we know the Accord is not a compact but they were sniffing around a Camry, so I threw that into their mix.

And I agree, they might not appreciate the Mazda3 for what it is.

So nobody's hot on Hyundai in the compact class, eh?

I forgot about the Cruze; I do think it's a good car to consider.

roadburner

andres3 said:

roadburner said:

My only regret about buying my out-of-warranty E24 M6 was selling it...

Do you know how that E24 M6 is doing after your ownership period? Might ease the regret if it blew a clutch 10 days after you sold it

No,it's gone through two owners; the current ones put the cat back on and swapped the Dinan chip for stock. I heard that they even put the beyond awful TRX tire/wheel set back on in a quest for originality.
Ugh.

andres3

Also went to VW to eat some tacos at the Tiguan launch party. VW is making a good move. No more 1.8T. Instead, using the 2.0T de-tuned, and they told me this was going to happen for all the models.

Nice Tiguan, much bigger than the older one. Still, I can't help but think it's just a slightly bigger taller Alltrack without DSG I think..... SEL Premium topping out at $37K MSRP.

I guess that's why I've recognized I'm more of a wagon man than a SUV man.

stickguy

Saw a 2003 BMW M3 on the used lot today at BMW dealer. Odd thing to see there.

stickguy

Andre, if decided seats are the most individual item on a car. I found the GTI seats to be narrow, but the Elantra. GT just fine. But I am scrawny now. My wife isn't, and found the Si seats too tight, but was fine with hyundai. And WRX sport seats oddly.

andres3

stickguy said:

Andre, if decided seats are the most individual item on a car. I found the GTI seats to be narrow, but the Elantra. GT just fine. But I am scrawny now. My wife isn't, and found the Si seats too tight, but was fine with hyundai. And WRX sport seats oddly.

Definitely a subjective thing with seats..... I will say, I think first impressions color the impressions of the seats. For example, seat comfort isn't high on my list (as it is with you), so if I like a car, I'll learn to just like the seats, unless they are really bad for some reason.

I think I could live with the Elantra GT seats, but it is definitely less roomy than the Optima which seems cavernous in comparison.

Mr_Shiftright

roadburner said:

andres3 said:

roadburner said:

My only regret about buying my out-of-warranty E24 M6 was selling it...

Do you know how that E24 M6 is doing after your ownership period? Might ease the regret if it blew a clutch 10 days after you sold it

No,it's gone through two owners; the current ones put the cat back on and swapped the Dinan chip for stock. I heard that they even put the beyond awful TRX tire/wheel set back on in a quest for originality.
Ugh.

That's utterly pointless to do IMO. Those metric tires are very pricey.

stickguy

Well, it's almost 2 feet shorter than an optima. Or my sonata. A huge plus in my book. I want something smaller

benjaminh

stickguy said:

Found a dealer with 3 2017 accord EX manuals. Interesting option with a big enough discount. Ptretty well loaded, drive nice, not as rough as an Si. But would have to be a killer price.

As you know, the current Accord has LaneWatch rather than blis....I thought that was a deal-breaker? But, the current Accord also has best-in-class visibility. No blind spots. An additional positive for me of this generation of Accord is that it doesn't have to have Sensing. On the 2018 Accord I think the Sensing can be turned off, but you have to do it each time you drive iirc. So, the 2017 Accord is a more "pure drive-it-yourself" experience.

stickguy

Not a deal breaker, but I would like to have it. Can compromise on that, since like you said, has lane watch at least, and good visibility.

Hard to be picky when shopping stick shifts!

benjaminh

stickguy said:

Not a deal breaker, but I would like to have it. Can compromise on that, since like you said, has lane watch at least, and good visibility.

Hard to be picky when shopping stick shifts!

You'll be able to get a 2017 EX probably for less than the price of a 2018 LX. And next generation, as you know, no manual any more on the EX. Only the Sport gets the manual for 2018.

stickguy

that is why I was poking around at the EX. if I get a stick, I still want the goodies on it. Not that interested in a 2017 EX CVT though.

benjaminh

stickguy said:

that is why I was poking around at the EX. if I get a stick, I still want the goodies on it. Not that interested in a 2017 EX CVT though.

Since you're considering the 2017 Accord, here's some info you might find interesting that Honda put out on the mid-cycle updates they did on the car starting with 2016....

http://www.hondanews.com/releases/2016-honda-accord-press-kit-overview

" All models, Coupe and Sedan, feature the expanded use of LED lighting – LED taillights for all models, LED headlights for the new Touring Coupe, and LED daytime running lights (DRLs) for Sport and above trims....Accord's body rigidity is increased for all models and is complimented by new high performance dampers, and a retuned electric power steering system that delivers even more linear and precise response. The Accord Sedan also gets a new aluminum hood, replacing the previous steel hood, benefitting both fuel efficiency and dynamic performance. The Accord audio and digital experience is also significantly upgraded with the application of a new 7-inch touchscreen Display Audio interface (EX and above trims) featuring Apple CarPlay® and Android Auto...."

Of course, as you know, this model has the dreaded lack of volume knob. It was silly of them to take it out (my wife's 2013 Accord has one), but it's not a big deal imho. The steering wheel control works fine.

stickguy

thanks. was not aware they changed that much. I came close to getting a 2015 EX before I landed the Sonata, but I think we were $20 off on the payment, and I got stubborn and refused to budge!

benjaminh

Yeah, and that handling stuff did make a bit of a difference. My 2016 Accord has slightly better handling than my wife's 2013. But the prices on the new 2018 Accord might surprise you. Lower than I was guessing.

Mr_Shiftright

The prices seem to start around $24K?

benjaminh

VW has just doubled the length of its warranty, to 6 years/72k miles, bumper to bumper. Wow. A major reason for avoiding VW, that fear of the time after the warranty, just vanished....

http://www.vw.com/warranty/

"Introducing The People First Warranty. Power to the volks.
Volks, then wagen. People, then car. That’s our philosophy, and that means being there for our customers long after they drive off the lot. That’s why we offer America’s Best Car and SUV Bumper-to-Bumper Transferable Warranty on almost all of our 2018 models.3 The Volkswagen 6 years/72,000 Miles New Vehicle Limited Warranty. It’s perfect for America’s best customers.

Not just desirable, transferable.If you sell your Volkswagen within the warranty period, your New Vehicle Limited Warranty goes with it. The remainder of the vehicle’s warranty coverage transfers to the new owner at no cost to you."

benjaminh

Mr_Shiftright said:

The prices seem to start around $24K?

Yeah, the 2018 Accord LX CVT with Sensing is $23,570, which is a price cut of $685 from the 2017 LX CVT Sensing.

And the 2017 LX got so-so 16" tires that were a bit narrow, while the 2018 LX gets good 17" tires that are wider. Plus the car now gets the 1.5 turbo that's supposed to be slightly better than the one in the Si—because it has vtec, and can also run on regular gas.


Mpg numbers for the 1.5T are 30 in the city, 38 on the highway, combined 33. That's an increase of 3 in the city from the current Accord, 2 on the highway, and +3 overall. Beats the Camry LE by 1 mpg. But, essentially the same.


2018 Accord EXL is 29,970, only a $50 increase
The new 2018 Accord 1.5T Touring is $33,800. If you don't need the power of the 2.0, you can get all the fancy features of the Touring for about 2k less.

ab348

benjaminh said:

VW has just doubled the length of it warranty, to 6 years/72k miles, bumper to bumper. Wow. A major reason for avoiding VW, that fear of the time after the warranty, just vanished....

http://www.vw.com/warranty/

"Introducing The People First Warranty. Power to the volks.
Volks, then wagen. People, then car. That’s our philosophy, and that means being there for our customers long after they drive off the lot. That’s why we offer America’s Best Car and SUV Bumper-to-Bumper Transferable Warranty on almost all of our 2018 models.3 The Volkswagen 6 years/72,000 Miles New Vehicle Limited Warranty. It’s perfect for America’s best customers.

Not just desirable, transferable.If you sell your Volkswagen within the warranty period, your New Vehicle Limited Warranty goes with it. The remainder of the vehicle’s warranty coverage transfers to the new owner at no cost to you."

That would have helped a little bit in my case when considering my options. To buy that 3 years worth of coverage as an extended warranty is probably $2000 or so I'd guess.

xwesx

benjaminh said:

VW has just doubled the length of it warranty, to 6 years/72k miles, bumper to bumper. Wow. A major reason for avoiding VW, that fear of the time after the warranty, just vanished....

http://www.vw.com/warranty/

That's impressive! Certainly could sway some folks in their buying decisions. Too bad they don't have any diesels in their lineup! Or, too bad the warranty isn't on all new vehicle sales going forward. I know there are still a fair number of 2015 Q7 TDIs out there for sale as new vehicles....

Michaell

"Almost all"?  What models are excluded?

Lemme guess - GTI, GLI and Golf R

benjaminh

Michaell said:

"Almost all"?  What models are excluded?

Lemme guess - GTI, GLI and Golf R

They are included!

They only thing excluded, I think, is the electric Golf.

Maybe you can trade in your Jetta when the warranty expires on a new VW....

stickguy

that just changed the dynamics for picking a car for my daughter in the spring. Instead of leasing something, get a cheap deal on a Jetta to buy, and if financing rate is low, just finance out for 6 years.

stickguy

and glad I did not pick up a 2017 this week!

stickguy

actually, if I have not done anything before then, might make a Golf or new model Jetta an option for me at the end of the year.

rny421

Back in April, VW only was going to supply the 6yr/72k warranty on SUVS. I didn't realize they expanded it to their entire lineup. That's a big deal. http://blog.caranddriver.com/best-in-the-biz-volkswagens-2018-atlas-and-tiguan-suvs-to-come-with-6-year-72000-mile-transferable-warranty/

My mom jumped ship from her 2005 XC90 to her 2010 XC90 when Volvo offered the 5yr/60k "Safe and Sound Warranty" for a limited time which included maintenance and wear and tear items (wipers, brakes).

A warranty like this would be good for someone like my mom who tends to blow through warranties in miles rather than years. Heck, it would even sway me depending on what I was in the market for.

stickguy

it is great for someone like me who does not tend to go over 10K/year on a car. 6 years BtoB is nice.

rny421

Off topic, and late: I forgot to thank everyone that helped with my NYC trip transportation questions. We took the Metro from the Cortlandt station - It was super easy, inexpensive to park, and a very pretty ride into the City!

Sandman6472

A bit sad that they changed the Golf TSI lineup a bit, no more "S", "SE" or "SEL" offered. So even if I were interested in another Golf, which I'm not, it would have to be a GTI. Just saw the local BMW place has a beautiful beige over beige 2015 328i with 22,460 miles on it. Asking $28K for it, a bit of money there but a gorgeous vehicle just the same. Do these usually come with Sirius/XM radio or is that more $ to get it? Really like my XM even though my iPhone has all my music on it, around 800 songs give or take. Still have a couple older iPods from the kids which I use every so often.
The more 328's I see, the more I'm wanting one for my next vehicle. Think one would fit on my side of the garage, anything smaller than 185" should just make it. The more I think about what I really really want next time, this is the one I always come back to, either in brown over brown or a light blue over beige combo. And a CPO unit would fit my budget. Honestly, if the other half wouldn't give me any flack about it, I'd probably get one much sooner than later. Just think an X1 is more vehicle than I really need since we're empty nesters now.

The Sandman

stickguy

XM is always in there. might have to pay to get it turned on.

Not sure what VW is doing to the models for 2018, but I loved in 2017 when they added the Wolfsburg. Added all the key stuff I wanted, and the price was good. A manual is about 22.5 MSRP, and includes moonroof,BLIS, XM, car play, and a few other things I am forgetting. Not worth spending 5K more for an SEL, unless you can't live with the seats being not fully powered.

benjaminh

Torque News tells us the the next generation 2018 Accord Hybrid—(which from other sources we know is faster than the 2018 Accord Sport 1.5)—is going to have a big drop in price compared to the current model. Right now the 2017 Accord Hybrid starts at $29,605. Apparently the new one, with even better battery technology, might get a price cut of even a couple of thousand dollars, making it about the same price as the Accord Sport—but you'd probably save about $500 a year on gas....

https://www.torquenews.com/1574/2-key-features-normalize-2018-honda-accord-hybrid

stickguy

if the hybrid is price competitive to get into, and is equipped well (the EX level is about right), I would be interested in one for sure, vs. the standard engine car.

benjaminh

But the 2018 Accord Hybrid won't go on sale until c. Feb. 1 for some reason....

stickguy

I saw that. sometimes that happens, one configuration comes later. Not sure I can stretch until Q2 though, unless I just do 6 months of extending my current lease, which I don't want to do.

benjaminh

stickguy said:

if the hybrid is price competitive to get into, and is equipped well (the EX level is about right), I would be interested in one for sure, vs. the standard engine car.

Right now the base hybrid is close to the EX, but with some things like the LX. The hybrid has good tires, a power seat, pushbutton start, Sensing standard, etc., but no moonroof, no carplay, 4-speaker stereo, etc. I'm guessing that carplay might be standard on the new hybrid, but blis is the question. There are going to be 4 trims of the hybrid, which seems a bit much, but....Base, EX, EXL, and Touring.

stickguy

they have those 4 trims of the regular car so why not?