Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

nyccarguy

marcogallo1986 said:

 Got the Thunderbird inspected this morning, good to go. And we drove it around afterwards for over an hour on a couple of highways going 7580 miles an hour, no issues car runs cool, and good. That’s what I needed for the longest time of sitting. 

Were you trying to beat the Millenium Falcon's Kessel Run record at 7,580 mph in your Thunderbird?

tjc78

Happy Birthday @nyccarguy

Mr_Shiftright

rayainsw said:

$31,210

So, a bit more than a fully maxed out Mazda3. Hmmmmm......

henryn

henryn

henryn

Three of them available locally, 2 Anniversary Edition and 1 Autobahn. All 3 black over black. Ugh.

Mr_Shiftright

The Autobahn is the highest trim level, right?

henryn

Dang, I forgot to look at the other dealer. He has two Autobahn, one red, one white.

henryn

Here you go: an Autobahn with 6 speed manual, in Tornado Red

ab348

The ones with black wheels do do it for me at all, but the Autobahn versions look good and seem like good value.

au1994

If you could just go ahead and wrap that white one up for me, that’d be great...

Michaell

I've compared the new Mazda 3 against the GLI

AWD available on the 3, but no stick shift unless you want the hatch (and, I don't). Fewer HP than the VW, but maybe a more mature look and feel, both inside and out.

I'd probably give the nod regarding long term reliability to the Mazda.

ab348

If the Mazda and the VW were the only choices I had, I'd take the VW.

Michaell

ab348 said:

If the Mazda and the VW were the only choices I had, I'd take the VW.

Guess I'll have to test drive both - I'm sure they will both appeal to different parts of me

breld

ab348 said:

jeffb0101 said:

@tjc78 I actually appreciate the posts of 99% of you. Sandman just does nothing but complain about his car, Edmunds, his family, etc. 

Whoa there, big fella.

Sandy is Sandy, he likes to come here and tell us what he is thinking. Does he repeat hinself sometimes? Sure. But that is just him. I think we act as therapy for him sometimes, and that's OK. Walk a mile in his shoes before you and your 50-odd post history start putting him down. We are all like a big family here, sometimes dysfunctional, sometimes annoying, but always supportive and tolerant of each other - except for a couple of black sheep about which the less said the better. Don't be one of those.

Well said.

xwesx

Michaell said:

I'd probably give the nod regarding long term reliability to the Mazda.

Long term reliability.... in this thread?! Please....

breld

@rayainsw - thanks for the review of the GLI; I always enjoy your reviews.

I wonder if any of the materials, other than the seats which are obvious, are upgraded on the GLI versus the "regular" Jetta. I was driving my daughter's new Jetta a bit the other day, and to me, it's pretty apparent where VW cut some costs on the material compared to the GTI. Nothing wrong with that, 'cause they're delivering a lot of value in all the Jetta models, and I think that's the intent. But I was a bit surprised at your comment regarding the high level of interior quality.

Michaell

xwesx said:

Michaell said:

I'd probably give the nod regarding long term reliability to the Mazda.

Long term reliability.... in this thread?! Please....

Hey, I kept two different Saturns for 7 years each, without losing my membership.

Still noodling on the idea of buying something and keeping it long term. But, new or pre-loved?

28firefighter

au1994 said:

If you could just go ahead and wrap that white one up for me, that’d be great...

Seconded.

28firefighter

This is at one of my local dealers. Taking a lot of self control not to go and take a look-see.

https://www.cartervw.com/vehicle-details/new-2019-volkswagen-jetta-gli-gli-autobahn-w-6-speed-manual-transmission-seattle-wa-id-29359377

breld

Haven't driven the GLI, but having had seat time in a 2019 Jetta SEL and a 2019 Mazda3, here's my $.02.

I think the Mazda3 will prove to have a higher-end interior and an overall more refined experience. Soon enough the car mags will do a big comparison of compacts, and I predict the Mazda will win each and every one of them. It's a really impressive car, especially with the newly added option of AWD.

But if you want a more exhilarating driving dynamic - closer to a true sports sedan - I would think the GLI takes the cake. As nice as the Mazda3 is, it isn't a Mazdaspeed3, nor is Mazda trying to make it so.

roadburner

If I ever buy a hot hatch again it will have to be something borderline crazy like the Mazdaspeed 3 or the Type R. I honestly like the GTI but it’s too well-mannered- if that makes any sense. 

venture

roadburner said:

If I ever buy a hot hatch again it will have to be something borderline crazy like the Mazdaspeed 3 or the Type R. I honestly like the GTI but it’s too well-mannered- if that makes any sense. 

They have a R at my local dealer. I don't remember what color it is - it still had it's pajamas on. It was an automatic! I told the sales dude his manager should be taken out in front of the dealership and tarred and feathered.

carnaught

tjc78 said:

Happy Birthday @nyccarguy

Ditto.

omarman

Ha! I was thinking "Clap For The Wolfman" by The Guess Who.

SEVENTY-FIVE OR EIGHTY MILES AN HOUR SHE HOLLERED “SLOW, SLOW, SLOW…”
BABY, I CAN STOP RIGHT ON A DIME

nyccarguy

Michaell said:

I'd probably give the nod regarding long term reliability to the Mazda.

Long term reliability.... in this thread?! Please....

Hey, I kept two different Saturns for 7 years each, without losing my membership. Still noodling on the idea of buying something and keeping it long term. But, new or pre-loved?

Lease new.  Rinse.  Repeat!

corvette

venture said:

roadburner said:

If I ever buy a hot hatch again it will have to be something borderline crazy like the Mazdaspeed 3 or the Type R. I honestly like the GTI but it’s too well-mannered- if that makes any sense. 

They have a R at my local dealer. I don't remember what color it is - it still had it's pajamas on. It was an automatic! I told the sales dude his manager should be taken out in front of the dealership and tarred and feathered.

Civic Type R? Surely you jest--they don't come in automatic.

Mr_Shiftright

Michaell said:

ab348 said:

If the Mazda and the VW were the only choices I had, I'd take the VW.

Guess I'll have to test drive both - I'm sure they will both appeal to different parts of me

I have heard the Mazda3 drives a lot nicer than one might think. At least we could say that both these choices would be "fun" cars to drive.

stickguy

Michaell said:

xwesx said:

Michaell said:

I'd probably give the nod regarding long term reliability to the Mazda.

Long term reliability.... in this thread?! Please....

Hey, I kept two different Saturns for 7 years each, without losing my membership.

Still noodling on the idea of buying something and keeping it long term. But, new or pre-loved?

buy cheaper used and flip when you get bored! That might be my next solution. After the TLX goes back and the wife gets a new CUV to be the use together car, the spare car will be whatever strikes my fancy, but no need at all to be new or fancy, since will just get light local use with just me.

andres3

graphicguy said:

I could go for another red car. Matter of fact, I kind of like the fact that in a sea of grey, black and white, red cars are scarce these days. I like red interiors even more.

Saw a grey Stinger GT with red interior at a stop light yesterday. Very tasty!

I find my main problem with looking at used cars, despite my worry I"m buying someone else's problems and headaches, is that they are all white, gray, or black.

nyccarguy

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

Michaell

stickguy said:

Michaell said:

xwesx said:

Michaell said:

I'd probably give the nod regarding long term reliability to the Mazda.

Long term reliability.... in this thread?! Please....

Hey, I kept two different Saturns for 7 years each, without losing my membership.

Still noodling on the idea of buying something and keeping it long term. But, new or pre-loved?

buy cheaper used and flip when you get bored! That might be my next solution. After the TLX goes back and the wife gets a new CUV to be the use together car, the spare car will be whatever strikes my fancy, but no need at all to be new or fancy, since will just get light local use with just me.

I've thought about that approach, as well. Driving only 6000 miles a year certainly helps.

My problem is that I've had poor luck picking used cars, but now that I have the Denver crew ( @breld and @jpp75 ) available, I can lean on them to help evaluate.

stickguy

if I continue to work at home, and we get a new car for the wife that we will use to road trip with, and take when we go out together, my car will probably barely do 2K, maybe 3K, a year. and probably never get far from the house. So it pretty much could be anything.

But, I have the same issue now. Finding a car worth buying! Hence ending up with a cheap cheap lease on a new one!

andres3

I like owning because I might do something crazy like trade in all 3 of our families cars for an RS6 Avant, though I'd rather have an RS4 Avant.

However, only 2 of our cars are worth a damn, because one is leased. The Kia provides zero equity towards doing something "outside the box" like the above.

stickguy

nyccarguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

I think that if you are pretty positive you are not keeping it more than 3 years, leasing is probably the best idea. Tax calculations can muddy the waters of course. As do residual accuracy, so if trade in value matches the lease residual, and you get a sales tax credit, then you can do better buying and trading in.

actually it seems the primary reason the leases win is when they dump tons of lease cash in. Without that, and realistic residuals, might as well buy.

Michaell

stickguy said:

nyccarguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

I think that if you are pretty positive you are not keeping it more than 3 years, leasing is probably the best idea. Tax calculations can muddy the waters of course. As do residual accuracy, so if trade in value matches the lease residual, and you get a sales tax credit, then you can do better buying and trading in.

actually it seems the primary reason the leases win is when they dump tons of lease cash in. Without that, and realistic residuals, might as well buy.

Learned something interesting today. Average APR for new car loans is now north of 6%.

qbrozen

nyccarguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

You sure are playing fast and loose with the phrase “worth it.” You can lease a well-optioned 5-series for less than that. 

Michaell

qbrozen said:

nyccarguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

You sure are playing fast and loose with the phrase “worth it.” You can lease a well-optioned 5-series for less than that. 

Really? How does that work?

nyccarguy

qbrozen said:

nyccarguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

You sure are playing fast and loose with the phrase “worth it.” You can lease a well-optioned 5-series for less than that. 

I understand there are much better programs for much more expensive cars out there.  I’m just saying if you are focused on a particular car, even if the program stinks you are better off leasing.

nyccarguy

stickguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

I think that if you are pretty positive you are not keeping it more than 3 years, leasing is probably the best idea. Tax calculations can muddy the waters of course. As do residual accuracy, so if trade in value matches the lease residual, and you get a sales tax credit, then you can do better buying and trading in. actually it seems the primary reason the leases win is when they dump tons of lease cash in. Without that, and realistic residuals, might as well buy.

Think of it this way.  Assume the car will be worth less than the stated residual.

28firefighter

Meh. I’m buying it when I get it. Mostly because knowing what I know, I’d feel dirty all over paying that kinda money on a lease for a Jetta. 

qbrozen

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

You sure are playing fast and loose with the phrase “worth it.” You can lease a well-optioned 5-series for less than that. 

Really? How does that work?

Here is one (a loaner of course) a broker posted for sale:

2018 BMW 530xi
Loaner w under 5000 miles
Premium Package
Heated Seats
Heated Wheel
MSRP $60xxx
$377/Month plus Tax
MSDs plus first DAS (approx $3200 Total)
Loyalty included

28firefighter

And even without loyalty you’d still be in the 400s. 

Michaell

Thanks for the examples.

xwesx

nyccarguy said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

If you are going to turn over your vehicles on a regular basis (e.g., you'll "always" have a car payment), it makes sense to go with a lease in nearly every case. You only come out ahead on a buy when you can amortize the cost of the purchase over a period of time when you *don't* have a car payment any longer. The longer the period of time, the better it works out.

xwesx

stickguy said:

if I continue to work at home, and we get a new car for the wife that we will use to road trip with, and take when we go out together, my car will probably barely do 2K, maybe 3K, a year. and probably never get far from the house. So it pretty much could be anything.

But, I have the same issue now. Finding a car worth buying! Hence ending up with a cheap cheap lease on a new one!

sounds like you should just get a used Leaf. Cheap to buy and cheap to own... no need for range anxiety... What's not to like?

xwesx

Michaell said:

Learned something interesting today. Average APR for new car loans is now north of 6%.

Man; it's been a long time since that was the case!

Michaell

xwesx said:

Michaell said:

Learned something interesting today. Average APR for new car loans is now north of 6%.

Man; it's been a long time since that was the case!

Accord APR went from 2.9% last month to 4.9% this month.

qbrozen

xwesx said:

Some quick math.  I think even with a crummy lease program like the GLI has right now, it’s still worth it to lease.  Using the 36/15K numbers provided in the “lease questions” thread by our smart, funny, & extremely talented hosts (.00214 & 53%), I came up with a mock lease payment (assuming a $2,000 discount from sticker) of $472.82 (including 6.35% sales tax) with 1st month, bank fee & DMV due at signing.  

Using that same $2,000 discount, before I even add interest.  The payment on a 60 month loan would be about $512/month.  

In 3 years, you turn the GLI in & get a new one at a cheaper payment because the program is better, you get more of a discount off of sticker.

thoughts?

If you are going to turn over your vehicles on a regular basis (e.g., you'll "always" have a car payment), it makes sense to go with a lease in nearly every case. You only come out ahead on a buy when you can amortize the cost of the purchase over a period of time when you *don't* have a car payment any longer. The longer the period of time, the better it works out.

“Nearly” is probably accurate. I would advise purchase over lease just on certain subarus, hondas, toyotas, and porsches. Anything with a realistic RV, high MF, and low trunk money. 

kyfdx

xwesx said:

Michaell said:

Learned something interesting today. Average APR for new car loans is now north of 6%.

Man; it's been a long time since that was the case!

That is an average of actual loans written.

Not the average new car rate for a buyer with excellent credit.