Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

breld

@tifighter - you have the performance model for both your 3 and X, right?

I assume you drove the non-performance model too? If so, how much of a noticeable difference was there? The base models appear to be so quick as is, just curious what drove you to make the upgrade.

stickguy

oldfarmer50 said:

Michaell said:

mjfloyd1 said:

xwesx said:

28firefighter said:

Do they really need extra battery capacity, though?

To me the trick is not increasing battery capacity, but rather improving charging technology so that it (1) doesn't harm the batteries as much to do Level 3 charging regularly, and (2) can charge from < 5% to 100% in 15-20 minutes. Will it be as fast as putting gas in your car, no, but it would be sufficient for a road trip.

Even 45-60 minutes, on a road trip, is not problematic... as long as the charger isn't in the middle of concreteville (e.g., there's something available within walking distance to occupy time). For example, the Tesla Supercharger in Twin Falls, Idaho, is collocated with a long boardwalk along the rim of the Snake River canyon. One could walk for hours along that scenic rim and completely forget the true purpose was to charge the car.... Walking for an hour for another 400 miles of range? Yeah, that's a good trade-off and a much-needed stretching of the legs.

However, distribution matters... and the charging network still needs two things:

1. Regularly spaced availability across much, or even all, of the road network if not in North America, then at least the US and Canada.
2. Common interface. Imagine how annoying it would be if you could only stop to gas up at "compatible" stations? There's a tiny bit of that with fossil fuels, but, basically, if one wants to fuel up with gasoline or diesel, they just stop at the nearest station and do so. For electric, such commonality has yet to exist (and probably won't with elitist pricks as major players in the "war").

Forty five to sixty minutes would not work for me if I was driving 1000+ miles (like when we go to FL). Adding 3 hours to a long drive. Ugh

Or when I drive to California (1100 miles). It's 17 hours already; not sure how I'd feel having to recharge for an hour rather than spending 5 minutes to refill the gas tank in Grand Junction (264 miles from home), Richfield, UT (225 miles from GJ, overnight stop), Mesquite, NV (203 miles from Richfield) and Barstow, CA (236 miles from Mesquite).

I totally see using an EV as an errand runner around town, but until they can cut the recharge time down, I'm not sure I see it for any sort of long distance travel.

You’d have to plan side trips on your way down and go sightseeing while the battery recharged. Now there’s an idea, put charging stations at all tourist stops along the way so travelers kill a couple of hours at your amusement. The trip itself could be a vacation.

problem is, when you travel at off times through areas with nothing to do. When we drive up past you, often leaving after dinner, we are driving from say 7-12 PM for almost 300 miles, through a whole lotta nothing. And I really have no desire to get off the thruway at 10:30 at nigh in Catskill to look for a place to spend an hour charging.

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

NJ MVC is the BEST!

Decided to finally bite the bullet and go wait in line to register the ML63. Jump through all the hoops, wait in all the lines, get to the desk, hand over the paper work and ..... she stared at it for a while .... talked to a supervisor .... looked it over again .... asked for any other paperwork I had .... and rejected the title.

So, here's the story. Way back in Feb, the title transferred hands from an Autonation Honda dealer to some private dealer THROUGH the Autonation Auto Auction in Orlando. The MVC has an issue with this because "we don't know if Autonation Auction had the right to sell a car titled to Autonation Honda. We need an affidavit stating they are one in the same company." IT IS AUTONATION! Are you freakin kidding me?!

I think I have it handled, but, man, that is is BS right there. I called the titling department at the auction, sent them a pic of the title, pointed out the issue. Just like me, the woman said "IT IS AUTONATION!" Yup, yup, I know. So she is sending me the letter/affidavit.

One stroke of positivity is that the MVC lady gave me a pass to bypass the lines next time. The agency is 30 mins from my house, though, so still eats up a lot of my time. Ugh.

Sometime ask me to tell you the story of trying to buy a Buick from the widow of a man who didn’t want to go through probate to transfer ownership into her name. NYS DMV must have money invested in various law firms.

stickguy

when my sister died I was the executor. It was taking a while to get all the legal stuff done. While that was going on, her daughter (my niece) had her car (an Altima) and had a guy that wanted to buy it. But, I did not have the official paperwork stuff needed. Finally got that, and touched base with her, to find out that they got tired of waiting, so she just signed the title and took the money, deal done. Worked for me!

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

here is an interesting one, for you PNW people. Love these. Only thing better (other than not being black over black) is if it was a V instead. Love the wagons.

https://carsandbids.com/auctions/KZBDo1QA/2010-volvo-s40-t5-awd-r-design

I drove a S60 T5 Wagon today. I was impressed with the ride, handling and acceleration. I’ve driven larger Volvos that had nicer interiors but seemed slow by comparison. If I were to buy a Volvo the S60 would be a good compromise of size and performance.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

If I did for some reason get something like this WRX (or comparable Si or GTI) it would only be if it was close as possible to stock, especially mechanically. A few nice upgrades is fine, but major work like that, hard pass.

What kind of hooptie are you looking for as your occasional driver, Sporty, Luxury? What exactly.

stickguy

probably more sporty. stick shift if possible (which likely eliminates luxury!). beyond that, whatever strikes my fancy and doesn't cost too much.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Michaell said:

mjfloyd1 said:

xwesx said:

28firefighter said:

Do they really need extra battery capacity, though?

To me the trick is not increasing battery capacity, but rather improving charging technology so that it (1) doesn't harm the batteries as much to do Level 3 charging regularly, and (2) can charge from < 5% to 100% in 15-20 minutes. Will it be as fast as putting gas in your car, no, but it would be sufficient for a road trip.

Even 45-60 minutes, on a road trip, is not problematic... as long as the charger isn't in the middle of concreteville (e.g., there's something available within walking distance to occupy time). For example, the Tesla Supercharger in Twin Falls, Idaho, is collocated with a long boardwalk along the rim of the Snake River canyon. One could walk for hours along that scenic rim and completely forget the true purpose was to charge the car.... Walking for an hour for another 400 miles of range? Yeah, that's a good trade-off and a much-needed stretching of the legs.

However, distribution matters... and the charging network still needs two things:

1. Regularly spaced availability across much, or even all, of the road network if not in North America, then at least the US and Canada.
2. Common interface. Imagine how annoying it would be if you could only stop to gas up at "compatible" stations? There's a tiny bit of that with fossil fuels, but, basically, if one wants to fuel up with gasoline or diesel, they just stop at the nearest station and do so. For electric, such commonality has yet to exist (and probably won't with elitist pricks as major players in the "war").

Forty five to sixty minutes would not work for me if I was driving 1000+ miles (like when we go to FL). Adding 3 hours to a long drive. Ugh

Or when I drive to California (1100 miles). It's 17 hours already; not sure how I'd feel having to recharge for an hour rather than spending 5 minutes to refill the gas tank in Grand Junction (264 miles from home), Richfield, UT (225 miles from GJ, overnight stop), Mesquite, NV (203 miles from Richfield) and Barstow, CA (236 miles from Mesquite).

I totally see using an EV as an errand runner around town, but until they can cut the recharge time down, I'm not sure I see it for any sort of long distance travel.

You’d have to plan side trips on your way down and go sightseeing while the battery recharged. Now there’s an idea, put charging stations at all tourist stops along the way so travelers kill a couple of hours at your amusement. The trip itself could be a vacation.

problem is, when you travel at off times through areas with nothing to do. When we drive up past you, often leaving after dinner, we are driving from say 7-12 PM for almost 300 miles, through a whole lotta nothing. And I really have no desire to get off the thruway at 10:30 at nigh in Catskill to look for a place to spend an hour charging.

You could look at the prison there. Maybe plug your car into the electrified fence to get a charge. You could watch a break out for entertainment.

stickguy

but pretty much anything.

stickguy

oldfarmer50 said:

stickguy said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Michaell said:

mjfloyd1 said:

xwesx said:

28firefighter said:

Do they really need extra battery capacity, though?

To me the trick is not increasing battery capacity, but rather improving charging technology so that it (1) doesn't harm the batteries as much to do Level 3 charging regularly, and (2) can charge from < 5% to 100% in 15-20 minutes. Will it be as fast as putting gas in your car, no, but it would be sufficient for a road trip.

Even 45-60 minutes, on a road trip, is not problematic... as long as the charger isn't in the middle of concreteville (e.g., there's something available within walking distance to occupy time). For example, the Tesla Supercharger in Twin Falls, Idaho, is collocated with a long boardwalk along the rim of the Snake River canyon. One could walk for hours along that scenic rim and completely forget the true purpose was to charge the car.... Walking for an hour for another 400 miles of range? Yeah, that's a good trade-off and a much-needed stretching of the legs.

However, distribution matters... and the charging network still needs two things:

1. Regularly spaced availability across much, or even all, of the road network if not in North America, then at least the US and Canada.
2. Common interface. Imagine how annoying it would be if you could only stop to gas up at "compatible" stations? There's a tiny bit of that with fossil fuels, but, basically, if one wants to fuel up with gasoline or diesel, they just stop at the nearest station and do so. For electric, such commonality has yet to exist (and probably won't with elitist pricks as major players in the "war").

Forty five to sixty minutes would not work for me if I was driving 1000+ miles (like when we go to FL). Adding 3 hours to a long drive. Ugh

Or when I drive to California (1100 miles). It's 17 hours already; not sure how I'd feel having to recharge for an hour rather than spending 5 minutes to refill the gas tank in Grand Junction (264 miles from home), Richfield, UT (225 miles from GJ, overnight stop), Mesquite, NV (203 miles from Richfield) and Barstow, CA (236 miles from Mesquite).

I totally see using an EV as an errand runner around town, but until they can cut the recharge time down, I'm not sure I see it for any sort of long distance travel.

You’d have to plan side trips on your way down and go sightseeing while the battery recharged. Now there’s an idea, put charging stations at all tourist stops along the way so travelers kill a couple of hours at your amusement. The trip itself could be a vacation.

problem is, when you travel at off times through areas with nothing to do. When we drive up past you, often leaving after dinner, we are driving from say 7-12 PM for almost 300 miles, through a whole lotta nothing. And I really have no desire to get off the thruway at 10:30 at nigh in Catskill to look for a place to spend an hour charging.

You could look at the prison there. Maybe plug your car into the electrified fence to get a charge. You could watch a break out for entertainment.

I'm thinking, getting gas in NJ before I leave then just driving through without stopping, is preferable to that.

tifighter

breld said:

@tifighter - you have the performance model for both your 3 and X, right?

I assume you drove the non-performance model too? If so, how much of a noticeable difference was there? The base models appear to be so quick as is, just curious what drove you to make the upgrade.

Yes, we have two performance models.

For the 3, I originally ordered a Dual Motor. This was over two years ago, back in the wait list days. When they became available for test drives, they had the RWD model, and the Performance. We all know how that turned out. But the Dual Motor is a 0-60 4.4 sec car, so I can't imagine anyone being very disappointed with the power.

As for the X, I test drove a standard LR car. It drove great. The only reason I ended up with a Performance is because an astounding deal became available on a showroom car in SF. Mid 2019 they made some changes to the suspension and powertrain, so the earlier cars got blown out for the end of the quarter. A Performance 5 seater with the Ludicrous upgrade demo ended up less than a new LR, so I went for it. They shipped it up to me for free. If I were buying a new one today, I'd get the standard one. The X isn't really the type of car you feel the need to push hard, so I think it's basically unnecessary most of the time. (These guys basically say the same thing). Plus the standard car has a little more range, so that's an added bonus.

So to conclude, I'm glad I have them, but I think the standard cars are plenty good.

suydam

Michaell said:

mjfloyd1 said:

xwesx said:

28firefighter said:

Do they really need extra battery capacity, though?

To me the trick is not increasing battery capacity, but rather improving charging technology so that it (1) doesn't harm the batteries as much to do Level 3 charging regularly, and (2) can charge from < 5% to 100% in 15-20 minutes. Will it be as fast as putting gas in your car, no, but it would be sufficient for a road trip.

Even 45-60 minutes, on a road trip, is not problematic... as long as the charger isn't in the middle of concreteville (e.g., there's something available within walking distance to occupy time). For example, the Tesla Supercharger in Twin Falls, Idaho, is collocated with a long boardwalk along the rim of the Snake River canyon. One could walk for hours along that scenic rim and completely forget the true purpose was to charge the car.... Walking for an hour for another 400 miles of range? Yeah, that's a good trade-off and a much-needed stretching of the legs.

However, distribution matters... and the charging network still needs two things:

1. Regularly spaced availability across much, or even all, of the road network if not in North America, then at least the US and Canada.
2. Common interface. Imagine how annoying it would be if you could only stop to gas up at "compatible" stations? There's a tiny bit of that with fossil fuels, but, basically, if one wants to fuel up with gasoline or diesel, they just stop at the nearest station and do so. For electric, such commonality has yet to exist (and probably won't with elitist pricks as major players in the "war").

Forty five to sixty minutes would not work for me if I was driving 1000+ miles (like when we go to FL). Adding 3 hours to a long drive. Ugh

Or when I drive to California (1100 miles). It's 17 hours already; not sure how I'd feel having to recharge for an hour rather than spending 5 minutes to refill the gas tank in Grand Junction (264 miles from home), Richfield, UT (225 miles from GJ, overnight stop), Mesquite, NV (203 miles from Richfield) and Barstow, CA (236 miles from Mesquite).

I totally see using an EV as an errand runner around town, but until they can cut the recharge time down, I'm not sure I see it for any sort of long distance travel.

After my experience with the Volt I’m definitely ready for a longer range all EV. I’ve really come to appreciate the way an EV drives. If I had a 1000 mile trip I would be more than ready for an hour restaurant stop, or even an overnight at a nice hotel!

laurasdada

".**Sales prices are plus applicable sales tax, reg fees, $199.00 vin etch, $499.00 dealer conveyance fee. " Porsche Audi of Wallingford, CT. Matters not what part of the country, ya gotta read the fine print! Etching fee, a classic.

laurasdada

oldfarmer50 said:

tjc78 said:

I honestly have zero interest in electric cars.

We drive much less than we used to and even big SUVs aren’t that bad on gas today. The cars also run cleaner than ever.

I’ll stick with gas until I have no other choice or gas becomes so expensive it doesn’t make sense any longer.

I had zero interest too until I drove that Tesla. Really got me interested but only for a model that had super performance and that alas, is beyond my meager finances. I went by the Karma dealer a few times today. I know nothing about them but they are sharp looking.

My local Jag dealer also took on the original Fisker Karma. They did not shed a tear when Fisker went under, it wasn't an easy sale. While a lovely car to look at, the trunk and back seat were quite small, the back seat quite uncomfortable. From reviews, minimal electric range and the GM motor was not a smooth operator; nor was performance exceptional.

I believe Karma motors has addressed some of the many shortcomings, but not sure what kind of financial shape they are in. If you've got $130+k burning a hole in your pocket, likely better ways to spend it. But, it is pretty, and maybe ok for two people.

kyfdx

Reverse punch, pending: I think the FIT is sold.

stickguy

darn. I was hoping you would eventually get desperate...

but congrats.

kyfdx

stickguy said:

darn. I was hoping you would eventually get desperate...

but congrats.

Thanks... sort of out of the blue. My landscaper was over to discuss how to solve a low spot/drainage problem, and he said he was interested. Boom!

graphicguy

kyfdx said:

stickguy said:

darn. I was hoping you would eventually get desperate...

but congrats.

Thanks... sort of out of the blue. My landscaper was over to discuss how to solve a low spot/drainage problem, and he said he was interested. Boom!

Congrats. BTW...when I logged in today (sometimes Edmunds makes me log in, again, for some unknown reason) I was taken to one of your posts asking “anyone have a car buying story?” It was from 2014. Things don’t seem to change much around here. LOL!

kyfdx

graphicguy said:

kyfdx said:

stickguy said:

darn. I was hoping you would eventually get desperate...

but congrats.

Thanks... sort of out of the blue. My landscaper was over to discuss how to solve a low spot/drainage problem, and he said he was interested. Boom!

Congrats. BTW...when I logged in today (sometimes Edmunds makes me log in, again, for some unknown reason) I was taken to one of your posts asking “anyone have a car buying story?” It was from 2014. Things don’t seem to change much around here. LOL!

It never ends...

corvette

stickguy said:

300 miles? Drive out and drive it back. If the wife doesn't want to drive you, just rent a car 1 way and drop it off.

The price of a one way rental was super reasonable when I was in Utah a couple years back.

qbrozen

I had written off getting the wife a vert, but man... check out the miles. I confirmed they are accurate. Seller says everything works.
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/share/283239656

stickguy

looks new. I would be worried it had too little use though. I guess you aren't afraid of needing to do a full refresh though (belts/hoses/fluids, etc,) to take care of anything that goes bad from sitting. Black though, not an attractive color for one of those but at least the interior isn't also dark.

corvette

Parked the Tundra in my non-weathertight garage for a few days. When I got inside, it smelled like there was a dead mouse. I'm trying to air it out and ran the HVAC fan for an hour or two until the battery got low (it's on the Battery Tender now). I'm hopeful the smell goes away soon.

qbrozen

stickguy said:

looks new. I would be worried it had too little use though. I guess you aren't afraid of needing to do a full refresh though (belts/hoses/fluids, etc,) to take care of anything that goes bad from sitting. Black though, not an attractive color for one of those but at least the interior isn't also dark.

Agree about maintenance. I asked questions but the answer was “it has had oil changes.” Lol

corvette

Wizard reviews a 1980s Firebird and a 1999 Prelude - thought you Prelude guys might enjoy:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qONzRy9eUQU

au1994

qbrozen said:

I had written off getting the wife a vert, but man... check out the miles. I confirmed they are accurate. Seller says everything works.
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/share/283239656

I’m close if you want eyes on it. Or it could come home with me.

Out of town for the weekend but Monday maybe late tomorrow afternoon would work,

corvette

qbrozen said:

stickguy said:

looks new. I would be worried it had too little use though. I guess you aren't afraid of needing to do a full refresh though (belts/hoses/fluids, etc,) to take care of anything that goes bad from sitting. Black though, not an attractive color for one of those but at least the interior isn't also dark.

Agree about maintenance. I asked questions but the answer was “it has had oil changes.” Lol

Belts, hoses, and fluids may be a lost cause, but if they had it detailed, maybe the detailer put a decent product on the weatherstripping.

qbrozen

Yikes. And tires are 9 yrs old.
I can’t do it. That’s another couple of weekends of my time and probably $1500 in parts to get it up to snuff.

qbrozen

Told her that my offer would be too low to make sense to her right now and I’m sure she’ll have no trouble finding a sucker, I mean buyer.

explorerx4

@corvette,
Last fall, I started getting a nasty smell in my truck when running the hvac.
Bought this for about $5. Followed directions and applied a couple of times.
Fixed the problem and it didn't come back.
Most of it is still in the can.

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

I had written off getting the wife a vert, but man... check out the miles. I confirmed they are accurate. Seller says everything works.
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/share/283239656

I’d check that out right away, if it’s any good it will sell quick. Heck, I might swoop in there and drive it home myself.

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

Yikes. And tires are 9 yrs old.
I can’t do it. That’s another couple of weekends of my time and probably $1500 in parts to get it up to snuff.

Do Volvo’s of that era have any unusual fail points? Seems like a few belts and tires shouldn’t scare you off.

stickguy

the FWD T5, not really. Possibly the tranny I think in certain years but not sure what that car has.

qbrozen

oldfarmer50 said:

qbrozen said:

Yikes. And tires are 9 yrs old.
I can’t do it. That’s another couple of weekends of my time and probably $1500 in parts to get it up to snuff.

Do Volvo’s of that era have any unusual fail points? Seems like a few belts and tires shouldn’t scare you off.

Nope. They are good, as stick said, in FWD form. 6-spd auto had been out since ‘06 and proved better than the 5-spd it replaced. Nothing beyond typical maintenance.

28firefighter

That C70 just doesn’t do it for me. And given the age, only oil changes just doesn’t inspire confidence.

oldfarmer50

28firefighter said:

That C70 just doesn’t do it for me. And given the age, only oil changes just doesn’t inspire confidence.

I’d hold off judgement until I got more info. From the way the photos are upside down in the ad I’m going to guess the seller is older and not too technically proficient. They could have just taken it to the dealer for an oil change once a year and had them do whatever was recommended. Some people don’t even know what the dealer does while the car was there beyond that it was “serviced”.

I’d ask where they got those oil changes and if there were any records there.

roadburner

au1994 said:

tjc78 said:

OMG I just heard someone get quoted $366 for a battery. Wow

Similar deal with BMW’s. Seems the car won’t ‘recognize’ the battery if not programmed?? Knock on wood, I have not had to deal with that and would likely have little patience for a $350+ battery.

RE: Loaner...Can’t believe they wouldn’t put you in an Enterprise rental since there is nothing available. BMW did that for me once as there was some type of recall going on and all the loaners were spoken for.

It’s not that the battery won’t be “recognized,” it’s that the charging system won’t charge the battery at the correct rate/level. I use my Carly app or Foxwell scanner to register the batteries in my three cars that need it.

qbrozen

@oldfarmer50 I gave more info above. No t-belt service and out-of-date tires. For someone paying for service, that car probably has $3k of work needed, easily.

graphicguy

Got an email from both the Honda and Toyota dealerships yesterday asking about my availability next week. Talked to a friend who is retired, too. Between the two of us, we should be good to go.

Wondering why next week, then I realized end of month AND end of quarter.

I told the dealerships all systems are go. Should be a busy week.

stickguy

another OldFarmer mobile popping up.

https://www.royaleasing.com/details-1996-buick-regal-custom-used-2g4wb52kxt1512059.html

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

@oldfarmer50 I gave more info above. No t-belt service and out-of-date tires. For someone paying for service, that car probably has $3k of work needed, easily.

Yeah, sounds like it was neglected.

stickguy

not necessarily neglected, but with so little use, things just did not wear out or break. Only the fluids really matter though along the way. Belts, hoses, various rubber bits, if they still function not likely to have been touched. they just become an issue for the new owner, if you want to actually put the car back on the road and use it much!

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

another OldFarmer mobile popping up.

https://www.royaleasing.com/details-1996-buick-regal-custom-used-2g4wb52kxt1512059.html

That’s my kind of hooptie alright but if I was to get a Regal of that vintage I’d prefer the coupe.

qbrozen

stickguy said:

not necessarily neglected, but with so little use, things just did not wear out or break. Only the fluids really matter though along the way. Belts, hoses, various rubber bits, if they still function not likely to have been touched. they just become an issue for the new owner, if you want to actually put the car back on the road and use it much!

Correct. She said it sat in her garage.

corvette

Big Al from YouTube would scoop that Regal in a heartbeat.

stickguy

watching football, and there was just an ad for the BMW M8. Wife said something along the lines of "that looks nice, maybe you should get one of those". I mentioned the MSRP on one, and she has not pushed the idea since.

kyfdx

stickguy said:

watching football, and there was just an ad for the BMW M8. Wife said something along the lines of "that looks nice, maybe you should get one of those". I mentioned the MSRP on one, and she has not pushed the idea since.

617 HP, AWD. I think you need it!

That's what we drove on KY Speedway, a few weeks back.

au1994

stickguy said:

watching football, and there was just an ad for the BMW M8. Wife said something along the lines of "that looks nice, maybe you should get one of those". I mentioned the MSRP on one, and she has not pushed the idea since.

Yeah, I asked mine to start looking at BMW verts. That’s the one she came back with.

28firefighter

There is a 68k Mystic Blue ZHP vert on BaT. Would recommend. Should be less than an M8.

stickguy

oh. will have to go look!