Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

graphicguy

NYC...missed it somehow, but even a decade isn't enough time to wipe away missing someone close to you.

laurasdada

@Stever@Edmunds said:

Haven't had a car payment in years either but the rates are so low, it's tempting to keep the cash in the savings account. But the rates are so low....

1.84%/60 months. No prepayment penalty...

nyccarguy

Thanks again guys! Everyone's words and comments were very comforting to me.

rayainsw

nyccarguy - very sorry to hear about your friend.....

0.0 APR on the GTI last Summer.

• Ray

Hard to pass up 'free money'.

abacomike

@laurasdada said:
1.84%/60 months. No prepayment penalty...

I could have gotten a 60 month loan through Mercedes Benz Financial Services for 1.9%, but the way I looked at it, I am earning less than 1% on my CD's - so to take out a loan, my net cost is about 1.1% per year. However this way, by paying cash, I received the title from Tallahassee, have no car payments each month, and feel a bit more independent because of that.

I am not too healthy, for many reasons, which I have alluded to on this forum. So I never know when my next visit to the hospital will be, nor it that will be my last visit. I certainly do not want to have a $50,000 loan outstanding on a car that my children will have to deal with in the event of my death. I'd rather them have the title to the car so they can do with it as they see fit.

qbrozen

stick - I'm pretty indifferent to CVT. Would i have it on MY car? No. But wife is a slushbox gal, so I see no difference in that case. Its only a detriment if, as in the case of the Versa, the engine sounds horrible and you have to listen to it drone on at steady rpms.

stickguy

The corolla I drove was ok in terms of cvt action. It never bothered me at all test driving subarus (outback or legacy)

Sandman6472

Trust me, that drone noise isn't noticeable after awhile. When ever I drive the kid's Versa SL, I notice that it is a cvt by the way it creeps up the power band but with the stereo on, I do not hear the sound one bit. With just about 50k on the clock, it has also been pretty flawless and besides oil changes/tire rotations and alignments, I haven't done much to it at all. I did get her Firestone Affinity tires, same as on the wife's Mazda3, and they are wearing very nicely...did get her a 3 year alignment policy and use it at least 3 times/year. I'd have no problem driving this as my daily driver and did almost get one in a weak moment but decided that I wanted to get a cuv this time out.

The Sandman

suydam

Maybe so. It did bother me on the Altima. I felt like it got more annoying rather than less so. That's why I prefer the Accord CVT -- no drone. That said, I know plenty of people who love their Altimas and don't notice it at all.

Sandman6472

Drove a couple of Altimas at work yesterday and today and heard nothing, nothing at all and was impressed with the smooth ride and nicely done interior. A good friend just got a used '13 model with 14k on the clock and absolutely loves it...she came from a '10 Rogue which she didn't like at all. She helped me decide not to get the Rogue SV model I was looking at because of her dislikes...found them to be true on my couple of test drives so I took it off my short list. It finally came down to the Outlander SE with the cvt tranny or the Tuscon SE with the 5 speed and the 2.4 engine...a bit more thirsty but it has plenty of power as it moves up the power band and I've yet to feel a lack of power in any maneuver I've had to make actually.

The Sandman

stickguy

My son makes me laugh. He is still obsessing over looking at his car options. After the car show, he short list stayed the same, with the Mazda still being the apple of his eye. Well, tonight for some reason he starts talking about the 2013 Jetta GLI that we drove, and wondering how cheap he could get that? If low enough (and that would have to be a buy, not a lease), he would rather have that (even without the moonroof and a few techie options) than a 3.

I will have to remind him that the 2.0t needs premium, and a lot more of it, compared to the Mazda. I suspect insurance will be a bit higher too.

so, tomorrow I get to call the salesdude and rib him a bit about the lack of customers and overflow of cars and snow. And tell him to dig deep, and throw out a # we can't resist, and see what happens!

speaking of snow (and we are getting another 6-12 Thursday), the VW dealer has a big banner up on their website saying OMG! Too many cars, too much snow, and no room for more of either! Basically begging you to show up, their shorts are already down around their ankles.

so who knows, I will make the call. MSRP on the GLI is 26.7k. If they want to roll in all the rebates, offers, etc. and blow it out for 20K, son would probably just take it. On the side, will see what he can do on a Jetta SE... I just really prefer hustling leases at the VW place. More up front about it, and more desperate. At mazda, the killer deals just aren't there yet.

nyccarguy

More on (almost) free money. According to our very own @kyfdx, Subaru's January lease program has a money factor of .00023 for a 15K per year/36 month lease. That's 0.552%. Very close to 0. With a realistic 52% residual value at the end of the lease, It'd be a good deal to buy out at the end for about $13K & change.

qbrozen

so someone mentioned buying a vehicle.. and its not something I want to do for a newer car. However, it did occur to me that $250/mo on, say, a 3-yr lease, adds up. Looking at my CU rates, they are offering 2.35% for 3-yrs on used cars. That would be about $8k+. I'd say there are a fair number of decent cars out there for $8k, including a few Prii, Altima Hybrids, and even an Escape Hybrid I found in my 10 mins of searching. So it is something to consider. It would, of course, have to wait another 10 mos until the Leaf is due back to Nissan.

But THEN I start thinking... hell, the wife seems to like the volvo so much, I should just let her have it and spend $8k on something for myself. hmmmm....

stickguy

Sell the mercedes, and add that to the 8K, and you can get something even nicer for yourself.

The wife can have the Volvo and Minivan. You got the Mustang. Get a Jeep for foul weather and top off fun duty. And just screw MPG all around. Put the payment savings into the gas tank.

qbrozen

oh, the mercedes is already figured into it all. haha. seriously, though, vacation planned for august requires funding.

stever

Edmunds has assembled an alphabetical list of all-new cars, along with their projected on-sale dates, price ranges and likely competitors, so naturally I thought of y'all.

All the New Cars You'll See at Dealers This Year

nyccarguy

@qbrozen

You are right about leases costing a lot of money. After 30 months, my BMW payments (including tax) total $17,160

breld

Getting a new car off the lot, whether buying or leasing, is expensive. You're really paying the same thing either way, right? Back in '06 I bought my first BMW - 530xi. Paid like $54k for it and sold it a few years later for $30k. So along the way, a purchase or lease has a different payment structure, but either way you still end up paying for the depreciation one way or the other. Okay - I won't go into my "leave vs. purchase" diatribe again.

As always, the best approach is buying used, and buying smart.

Not to say I always follow that advice. But I don't think I'll ever purchase a luxury car new again.

qbrozen

so, just to get the wheels turning, I searched and found many many possibilities in that pricerange of a 2- to 3-yr lease.

Vibe

AWD

Swedish

Bigger Swede

At least its got leather?

Mileage king

German

Big hybrid

Mr_Shiftright

My problem with cars over 80,000 is that, statistically speaking anyway, 80K is just about when you'd expect normal wear and tear failures on things like struts, brake rotors, alternator, suspension bushings, etc. So it's the beginning of the 'fatigue range" IMO, and this requires me to push such a car right into a PPI, regardless of the pressure to snatch up a "good deal" without mechanical inspection. Quiz: What's a $6000 car that needs brake rotors, CV boots and tires? it's an $8000 car.

qbrozen

No idea why the beginning of that last message is bold.

Anyway, also came across these that would default to me.

Low miles and likely reliable

Mini

Mini Mini

Possibly the pick of the litter

stever

Some stray bit of "code" - looks like it was the dash. Beats me why it bolded.

I like the Soul.

qbrozen

Shifty - that definitely crossed my mind. ANY repairs, maintenance is going to make it more expensive than the equivalent lease. HOWEVER, then I came to the realization that I'd actually own the car at the end of 2 or 3 years and the value of it at that point would probably pay for the money put into it in maintenance/repair (hopefully more than cover it).

Mr_Shiftright

Yes that strategy would work for SOME used cars you might buy, but selling say a 10 year old Saab for any kind of decent money is going to be very difficult. Fact is, some used cars do depreciate a lot faster than others---at least until you hit what I called "the basement concrete pad" where no decent, good running used car can sink below. So in theory, "orphan" brands, or old, expensive luxury cars, can sink to the $3000 range, even if you paid $9K a few years prior.

qbrozen

true. We aren't exactly talking beaters here. So it is something to keep in mind, too. Resale will be important.

nyccarguy

@qbrozen

First of all, how do you just post "Low miles and likely reliable?" I used to do that in the old format and didn't think it could be done anymore.

I know you are extremely mechanically inclined, but even so, I'd eliminate those Saabs from contention immediately.

You could easily drive that 2008 Prius for another 100,000 miles with no issues. I think as long as the water pump has been changed, you are good.

No thanks to the 95K miled up 5 cyl Jetta.

The Scion xD should give you no problems at all, neither should that 43K mile Soul.

The 2 Minis are interesting. 62K miles on an '07 looks decent, but that is the 1st year of that body style. German engineered 1st year teething problems could get pricey. That 2010 Clubman with a stick would work too, but the 84K plus miles would scare me away.

stever

You can change the "title" by editing the text between the initial brackets.

edmunds.com

This is a link to Edmunds

hm, you'll have to click on the graphic to read it - haven't figured out how to manipulate the sizes.

qbrozen

damn, that was quick. Was about to say I like the suzuki quite a bit, if only for the fact that its a compact AWD wagon for cheap... but the ad is gone.

My wife would like the Saabs very much, which is the biggest reason they are on there. Like me, she has developed a liking for the swedes. I did find a few volvos, but I'm extremely wary of years that fall into this search criteria for their faulty transmissions.

The Vue is kind of an interesting option. 30mpg SUV? that's got some appeal to it. Same with an Escape hybrid. Too bad they didn't make an equivalent Tribute.

corvette

Eight of my namesakes swallowed by a sinkhole.

It appears that the building was empty at the time and nobody was hurt.

Mr_Shiftright

Prrobably caused by a new pathway for an old underground stream? Time to call the fiberglass specialist in the area.

kyfdx

That's pretty close to the Mammoth Cave area, so the topography/geology is conducive to that, I would think.

Michaell

Greetings from Glenwood Springs! About 200 miles from home in the mountains west of Vail. Wife has a leadership class here so we took the CX-7 on a short road trip over the Continental Divide and Vail pass. Roads were dry for the most part.

Very sad about the cars at the Corvette museum. Hope they are able to get them repaired.

And, safe travels (better yet, stay home) for all those affected by bad weather down South and back East. Temps in the 40's for us the next couple of days, and 60's predicted for Denver this weekend.

js06gv

Unexpected punch. My daughter recently got her license and started driving our Santa Fe that I kept when my wife got her Mustang in Dec 2010. I was bored one day (that's how it all starts) and was researching values. I bought the Santa Fe new in mid 2007 for $21,500 (list was $27,800) and ran it up to 72K miles. Nothing but routine maintenance. The examples I saw when researching were fetching very good money, such that I thought I could get pretty close to my payoff on the Mustang and then turn around and lease something less expensive for my daughter and pocket a few hundred bucks a month (I know, in the long run I'm spending more but this is CCBA after all......). Put up a CL ad a couple weeks ago at $12,950 and not one bite. Lowered to $12,500 this past weekend, got one call, they showed up an hour later and bought it for $12,000 which was my rock bottom or I would've kept it and aborted my plan. I never even told my daughter until after I sold it as I didn't want to get her hopes up.

So as of yesterday, car is gone and the Mustang is paid off. Car shopping began Monday night. She decided she wanted something different than an SUV so we started off looking at sedans. Surprisingly she liked the mid sizers better than the compacts. I did get her to drive an Escape but I liked it much better than she did. My most recent new purchases have been Fords, which is relatively new territory for me but I've been impressed and pleased with them. So we got pretty serious about a loaded Fusion SE 2.0 turbo that was decked out very close to a Titanium but listed for 3K less, with nice rebates and good lease terms. Then tonight I test drove a Kia Optima SX turbo. Cars were very similar in price, lease terms, options and driving characteristics but the Kia had more features, a sportier feel and slightly lower lease. As for the SX turbo model, I definitely could have gone for a lower trim level, which was more in line with the original plan but as usual I got sucked in by all the "stuff" and figured what the hell. If I was buying instead of leasing it would've been a different story. This was also my first lease in 23 years of buying cars.

So tomorrow we pick up our new red over black Optima after the windows get tinted. Will see where we are in 3 years, but the Santa Fe sale has boosted my confidence in resale values of Korean cars. This is something that definitely could not have been said as recently as 10 years ago.

nyccarguy

@js06gv

Mazel Tov & Congrats on the new Optima! I believe that's our 1st punch in February. Post some pics for us after you pick it up! Enjoy! "I was bored one day..." LOVE IT!

@corvette

What's the 2014 punch count so far?

graphicguy

Q....if you feel so inclined, the most recent issue of Car and Driver has a comparo of electric cars. They weren't unkind to the Leaf. But, it also didn't win the comparo.

Interesting read for those who have, or are considering an all electric vehicle.

Generally speaking, they all had a real world range of about 60-65 miles before a re-charge would be needed.

qbrozen

I read that. Nothing they tested had a good range, but of course they always get horrible mileage in the cars they test, too, so they obviously don't drive efficiently. haha.

Michaell

Would like to know the feeling of the folks here on the Range Rover Evoque. Just stopped at the RR/LR dealer here in Glenwood Springs to take a quick look.

Lord, is it stylish. Certainly not meant to be a family vehicle (get an LR2 if that's what you want), more of a lifestyle statement. OK room in rear seat, bigger than it looks for luggage.

Panoramic roof doesn't open, but the motorized interior shade is pretty cool - opens up the whole car.

Decent room up front, with gobs of technology. 9-speed transmission, multiple AWD modes, requisite touch screen for most all major controls. The 2014 models actually allow 2WD mode, so MPG ratings go from 20/28 to 21/30, which I don't find too bad for a 2.0L turbo engine and available AWD.

Price? If you have to ask, you can't afford it. The one I looked at was loaded up with over $10K in options, which took the sticker price to over $52K. For something smaller than an Escape, it seems other-worldly expensive.

stickguy

I don't get it really.

stever

I'd still be leery of reliability but Tata seems to have turned Jaguar around so maybe Land Rover is just a step behind in going up in the JD Power rankings.

qbrozen

Oh, I think its gorgeous.

But, yeah, in reality, it is just a REALLY expensive hatchback. For $50-large on a Brit, the XF makes infinitely more sense.

nyccarguy

@Michaell

I second what @qbrozen said. The Evoque is gorgeous. It really stands out and looks in front & rear. One of the guys on Top Gear (british version) took it on quite an adventure. I never priced one out. Supposedly a very capable off roader as well (not that it matters). I think those who buy them do so as a fashion statement. Maybe if TATA made it a quality vehicle it might make a good off lease used buy one of these days.

graphicguy

isellhondas has me so scared of Land Rover reliability (or lackthreof) I don't know if I could ever remotely consider one, regardless of how good they look.

Rtegarding SUVs, it's hard to make a case for any brand outside of American ones, given we really do know how to design and make trucks and SUVs than anyone on the planet.

Michaell

@graphicguy said:
Regarding SUVs, it's hard to make a case for any brand outside of American ones, given we really do know how to design and make trucks and SUVs than anyone on the planet.

When you say "SUV" do you also include crossovers and 'cute utes' in that category?

I started to spec and price an Evoque on the website, but decided that was a waste of my time, since we're so not in the market to replace the wife's CX-7.

I am, however, encouraged by the improvement in MPG in cars that we would consider as a replacement - whenever that is. I remember that our Expedition was rated at 13/17 .. but gas was around a buck a gallon at the time.

However, stay tuned. Daughter turned in a resume/cover letter with the non-profit where the wife works. If she gets the job, she might get a 30-50% increase in pay. And, she would be doing a lot more driving and hauling stuff around. She could afford the Countryman she has her eyes on.

Sandman6472

Congrats on the Optima, have driven a bunch at work and love 'em...a bit sportier than the Sonata. The Koreans have come a long way since their early years, heck, we have two Hyundai's in the fleet now and am very pleased with them both. Looks like we will be adding a third within the year as the wife is leaning toward an Accent of her own even though she loves her Mazda3...she really wants to downsize her vehicle but I have insisted that she get the GLS with the alloy wheels and the cruise control. Not that I drive her vehicle much, i just love alloys and need a vehicle with cruise control if we ever take it on a trip. And if she does get one, her mpg's will be better than mine in the Tuscon so we'd be taking her vehicle on any trips.

The Sandman

corvette

@nyccarguy said:
What's the 2014 punch count so far?

4, so far. We're falling behind! Congrats, js06gv!

stickguy

my son wants to go out Saturday to try and buy the GLI of his dreams. Still not sure why, but his money. I think we end up with something else more practical though.

graphicguy

@Michaell@Edmunds said:
When you say "SUV" do you also include crossovers and 'cute utes' in that category?

Michaell....not prejudiced against "cute UTEs".

If you're going to get an SUV, get an SUV that does everything and more that you'll ever need. Subrubans, Tahoes, Expeditions, Explorers, Jeep GCs, Durangos...those are the vehicles that qualify as an SUV in my book. All the rest are pretenders.

Sandman6472

That's all well and good but some of us just wanted a smaller vehicle with the ability to sit up a bit higher in driving...something we can slide over into. I think my small crossover is the perfect vehicle for my stage in life right now...my Honda Civic was just too low for my spinal condition and ingress/egress was just getting too difficult. The sub's you mentioned were all too large for me and my limited side of our garage...I needed a smaller ute to fit in and also not kill me in mileage. The Escape was a bit too large even though it just fit on my side with the Outlander Sport, Encore and the Tuscon I eventually bought fitting with plenty of room to spare.
All I know is that at my particular life stage, the Tuscon crossover fit the bill perfectly and the price I paid was very very fair. No regrets here so far...and even the wife is starting to dig it more and more!

The Sandman

oldfarmer50

@qbrozen said:
true. We aren't exactly talking beaters here. So it is something to keep

in mind, too. Resale will be important.

My thinking on used cars is obviously way different than most of you folks. I would find it difficult to spend $10k on an older or miled up car for fear that it would be a lemon. I could stand to throw away $1-3k on a bad choice but not much more. If I was going higher than $10k I would rather buy new. But that's just me.

As to resale, I would hope to keep any used car until the only buyer would be the scrap yard.

qbrozen

yes, farmer, very different. ha.
I wouldn't spend more than $10k on a miled up one, either. But, then again, maybe our definitions of "miled up" differ. 7x,xxx doesn't scare me much, unless its a known troublemaker.