Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

oldbearcat

isellhondas said:

oldbearcat said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

If you could extract some trouble codes from the car we could give you more advice on how to handle the repairs. I'm sure the dealer is stacking it up on her. This is the type of car you want to bail out on under 100K miles anyway, so I wouldn't put too much into it. I think the car is a money pit. And yes, get a second opinion. You don't have to go to a fancy-pants Jaguar shop to have this car worked on -- but of course you need something better than a chain store. It's certainly worth putting up to $1K in it to sell it, if the body and interior are really nice. If it's a rat, then yeah, let it go.

breld said:

I have to double check, but I believe it's the 3.0. She has the list from the dealer, so I'm gonna look at that, and maybe get the opinion from our mechanic. Like you said, it's more Ford than Jaguar, right?

I owned two X-Types a few years back, and , there's very little Ford in the drivetrains. These cars are expensive to fix, and, depreciated like mad. Check the current book value of the car before putting any more money in it. Good indy shops would be the cheapest place to affect repairs, but it may not be worth it.

Regards:
Oldbearcat

Jaguars are on the short list of cars that the store where I worked would wholesale rather than try to resell them when they were traded in. Painful experiences caused this.

I remember the warranty companies would sell aftermarket warranties on certain Jags but they really limited the miles and time. The warranties were VERY VERY expensive to buy and for good reason. They would NOT sell a warranty on any Land Rovers nor would our stopre resell them.

</blockquote
My third Jag was the one that finally cooked me on the brand. I bought a CPO 2006 S-Type with a nice long factory warranty. The car's heating and A/C system went haywire to the tune of about $5000 in parts - all covered under warranty of course. Problem was my dealer couldn't get the parts to fix it. It sat in their shop for 7 weeks waiting on a fancy circuit board to show up. I traded the Jag for one of the other brands they carried while it was still sitting in their service department. Wife and I figured if parts availability was that bad, we could no longer rely on the Jag as our long trip car. About a month after we traded it, I saw the car in one of the dealer's ads - so eventually the parts showed up to fix it.

Regards:
Oldengineer

oldbearcat

Mr_Shiftright said:

I appraised an X Type recently for an estate, along with a bunch of other cars owned by an elderly gent who is now incapacitated (you know, like me...). The Jaguar had cosmetic and mechanical issues and I pretty much advised the estate to junk it. The old guy could use the money elsewhere IMO.

I'm with you. Just joined the ranks of the incapacitated. Got diagnosed with stage 3 colon cancer a few weeks back. I'm now wearing a chemo pump and get radiation treatment at the hospital every day. Between that stuff and the pain killers they've got me on, I'm pretty much out of action. Doctors are going to fix me up with a new tailpipe early next year. Hopefully life will get back to normal after I recover.

Regards:
Oldengineer

stickguy

sorry to hear engineer. Will pray for the best. Thankfully the medical toolkit keeps getting better and better. They can do things now that even 5-10 years ago were impossible.

stever

Ugh, hate to hear that. Did a "scope" catch it?

At this rate, this will be the Mustang we all finally wind up with. ("Convertible" Miata in my case).

stickguy

Steve, I want one of those. Do they come in queen?

fintail

Wow, that sucks. I am sure you can beat it, just stay positive and look forward to the next car in the pipeline.

oldbearcat said:

I'm with you. Just joined the ranks of the incapacitated. Got diagnosed with stage 3 colon cancer a few weeks back. I'm now wearing a chemo pump and get radiation treatment at the hospital every day. Between that stuff and the pain killers they've got me on, I'm pretty much out of action. Doctors are going to fix me up with a new tailpipe early next year. Hopefully life will get back to normal after I recover.

Regards:
Oldengineer

Michaell

I might have just saved $15K on the wife's next car!

Out running errands yesterday, and the daughter spots a Fiat 500L. "Mom, you should get a 4 door Fiat". I explain that the 500L only comes with FWD.

But, it got me to thinking, and I jumped on-line this morning to confirm.

Yep, debuted this past week at the LA Auto Show - Fiat 500X. 2.4L TigerShark engine with 180HP, available AWD, lots of tech and toys.

Wifey likes.

No official release date, but expected 1H 2015 as a 2016 model.

stickguy

hopefully the seats are better. The 500X I sat in at the autoshow IIRC the rear seat was like a park bench.

jayrider

Michaell said:

I might have just saved $15K on the wife's next car!

Out running errands yesterday, and the daughter spots a Fiat 500L. "Mom, you should get a 4 door Fiat". I explain that the 500L only comes with FWD.

But, it got me to thinking, and I jumped on-line this morning to confirm.

Yep, debuted this past week at the LA Auto Show - Fiat 500X. 2.4L TigerShark engine with 180HP, available AWD, lots of tech and toys.

Wifey likes.

No official release date, but expected 1H 2015 as a 2016 model.

Make sure the customer lounge at the dealership is comfy.

Michaell

jayrider said:

Michaell said:

I might have just saved $15K on the wife's next car!

Out running errands yesterday, and the daughter spots a Fiat 500L. "Mom, you should get a 4 door Fiat". I explain that the 500L only comes with FWD.

But, it got me to thinking, and I jumped on-line this morning to confirm.

Yep, debuted this past week at the LA Auto Show - Fiat 500X. 2.4L TigerShark engine with 180HP, available AWD, lots of tech and toys.

Wifey likes.

No official release date, but expected 1H 2015 as a 2016 model.

Make sure the customer lounge at the dealership is comfy.

If the loaners are Abarth's, I might not mind.

corvette

oldbearcat, sorry to hear. Hope they have you back to normal soon!

Michaell, I ordered pizza last week and my pizza delivery professional was driving a Kia Soul. Kind of reminded me of you! Jack Baruth of The Truth About Cars did a rental review of a 500L and it repeatedly stalled on him in the Texas heat. He concluded that it was a crummy vehicle until you compared the price to something like a FWD CR-V. I'm sure they're even less expensive used, but if you're looking at the upcoming AWD model, that won't be an option.

roadburner

Hang in there obc- our prayers are with you!

graphicguy

roadburner said:

Hang in there obc- our prayers are with you!

Bearcat....I'll reiterate what RB said.

rayainsw

Bearcat... - Me too.
We are not a huge group - but
I think each of us does care
- about every 'member' here.
Hang in - and good luck
= Ray

jwilliams2

Bearcat...praying for a full recovery....

nyccarguy

@oldbearcat‌

Quick recovery! Get better! Thank-you for checking in.

Mr_Shiftright

Be sure to get the extended warranty, AAA Premium membership, a flare kit and emergency rations.

Michaell said:

I might have just saved $15K on the wife's next car!

Out running errands yesterday, and the daughter spots a Fiat 500L. "Mom, you should get a 4 door Fiat". I explain that the 500L only comes with FWD.

But, it got me to thinking, and I jumped on-line this morning to confirm.

Yep, debuted this past week at the LA Auto Show - Fiat 500X. 2.4L TigerShark engine with 180HP, available AWD, lots of tech and toys.

Wifey likes.

No official release date, but expected 1H 2015 as a 2016 model.

nyccarguy

@stickguy‌

I saw my 1st 2015 Sonata in the wild today. It was a base model, but none the less a handsome looking car. The grill is very similar to my legacy. I really like the headlight cluster & really dig the wraparound LED tail lights.

stickguy

NYC, I am not 100% sure if I have seen another one. probably just did not register. But, they must be out there. It is a nice looking design, and I agree that it reminds me a lot of the Legacy.

oldbearcat

stever said:

Ugh, hate to hear that. Did a "scope" catch it?

At this rate, this will be the Mustang we all finally wind up with. ("Convertible" Miata in my case).

Thanks to everybody for your words of encouragement. Stever - Yes, a scope caught it. My wife saved my life - she insisted that our family doctor set me up for a scope. He had been treating me for a year for lower back pain and other symptoms that just kept getting worse because I took a bad fall last Summer and broke my tailbone. I kept telling him that problems were getting worse, but, he ignored me until wife got insistent with him. So far, tests are indicating that it hasn't spread anywhere else. Again - Thanks everybody - I'll enjoy reading your posts while I go through treatment.

Regards:
Oldberarcat

stever

Wives will do that (mine cost me my thyroid, lol). Been scoped (waited a decade since insurance wouldn't pay for it before the health laws changed). Now I get to bug her about getting hers done. It's payback time....

Don't know if I'd been checking out Mustangs or anything else low to the ground with a busted tailbone!

henryn

OldBearCat, best wishes for a full and speedy recovery.

Looks like everyone here thinks very poorly of the reliability of Fiats. (smile)

qbrozen

oldbearcat said:

I owned two X-Types a few years back, and , there's very little Ford in the drivetrains. These cars are expensive to fix, and, depreciated like mad. Check the current book value of the car before putting any more money in it. Good indy shops would be the cheapest place to affect repairs, but it may not be worth it.

Regards:
Oldbearcat

I always thought they were ford engines/transmissions, but looks like you are correct, they were specific to the x-type.

Michaell

henryn said:

Looks like everyone here thinks very poorly of the reliability of Fiats. (smile)

So, if I had come on here and said the wife wanted the new Jeep Renegade, I wouldn't have encountered such harsh feedback?

They are the same car underneath, after all.

Mr_Shiftright

From a survey of 1.1 million cars recently done by CR, as reported by NBC news:

"The four lowest-scoring brands were all from Fiat Chrysler Automobiles' Chrysler Group, as were five of the bottom seven. Fiat scored the lowest of the 28 brands and the Fiat 500L was named the least reliable among 265 models included in the survey. The survey is seen as a key factor in influencing American car shoppers."

Other than THAT, I see no reason to be concerned

henryn said:

OldBearCat, best wishes for a full and speedy recovery.

Looks like everyone here thinks very poorly of the reliability of Fiats. (smile)

qbrozen

Michaell said:

So, if I had come on here and said the wife wanted the new Jeep Renegade, I wouldn't have encountered such harsh feedback?

They are the same car underneath, after all.

I want one!

Well, it LOOKS cool, anyway. I actually emailed the salesperson we bought the wife's T&C from (also a jeep dealer) a couple of weeks before deciding on the Fit to ask when they might be seeing Renegades on the lot. He never responded, so I just dropped the notion. Oh well.

carnaught

A few comments: thank goodness for family, who are great patient advocates. Get well soon OBC!

I had an X-Type in '02, and it was a surpringly satisfying and reliable vehicle. That said, I did not have it long enough to truly test it.

I'm seeing a lot of '15 Sonatas locally, nice understated quality. It is truly amazing what Hyundai has done in such a short time, reliability, quality and a lot of bang for the buck. Why couldn't we do that here?

Next, I've had legitimate health-related procedures denied, SINCE the ACA healthcare law! "You can keep your health plan, doctor....period"...."no pre-existing conditions".......righto....

Finally: Happy Thanksgiving to all!

roadburner

I occasionally check in on one of the US Abarth forums and those cars don't seem to be plagued with chronic problems- most of the issues have been cosmetic and/or minor mechanical issues. Like most any newer car, it is clear that the competency of the dealer service department has a much greater effect on customer satisfaction than the issue with the car itself...

Mr_Shiftright

Those two vehicles are aiming for the old Geo Tracker/Suzuki Samurai market. Not a bad move, if they can deliver something better than an old Geo Tracker or Suzuki Samurai.

stever

There should be tons of them showing up around here then. I see old Trackers and Samurais tooling around all the time.

Mr_Shiftright

A 4X4 golf cart, at best. The idea of an inexpensive 4X4 is appealing, no doubt, but you know, off-road and reliability do sort of have to go together. But considering that most people wouldn't take a Tracker if you gave it to them, it makes sense that if you need a 4X4 and don't have a lot of cash to spend, then these old vehicles do fill a need. You can buy 'em really cheap.

CR beat the crap out of the old Suzuki, and it seems they are going to do the same to the Fiat.

breld

@oldbearcat - sending best wishes and prayers.

I've seen plenty of 2015 Sonatas here in the Denver area, as well as new Legacys (not surprising on the Subaru for our region). I actually had to look at the badge for awhile to distinguish the two, which is to say they're both good looking cars with similar styling.

henryn

Mr_Shiftright said:

Those two vehicles are aiming for the old Geo Tracker/Suzuki Samurai market. Not a bad move, if they can deliver something better than an old Geo Tracker or Suzuki Samurai.

....

A 4X4 golf cart, at best. The idea of an inexpensive 4X4 is appealing, no doubt, but you know, off-road and reliability do sort of have to go together. But considering that most people wouldn't take a Tracker if you gave it to them, it makes sense that if you need a 4X4 and don't have a lot of cash to spend, then these old vehicles do fill a need. You can buy 'em really cheap.

A friend of mine owned a Tracker, going back about 15 years. He rather liked it, but then he didn't really use it much at all. Just a toy, really. As I recall, he bought it really cheap (under $1k), and nearly doubled his money when he sold it two years later.

stickguy

my car is almost official. The license plates showed up via Fed Ex today. One issue with buying in PA (I live in NJ). They don't put on a NY inspection sticker (it does have a PA one though). So I have to go to the inspection station myself to get one. All a formality (pretty sure it will pass!) but still the hassle of going, waiting on line, etc. I do need to find out if I can just go to the exit end and have them throw a sticker on. Seems silly to have to go through the line!

I also have to do surgery on it. I forgot to have them put the front plate bracket on (they left it in the trunk because PA doesn't have a front plate, so they don't automatically do it). Making the wife a little nervous pulling out the power drill! Not that hard (it has a slot to line it up, and 3 self tapping screws that go right through the front bumper cover). Just nerve racking. Have to make sure not to go to far and crack the cover.

nyccarguy

@stickguy‌

I think they do the same thing in NY if you buy out of state. Here in CT, there are no state inspections. After 5 years, your car has to pass an emissions test. No stickers on the front windshield either. My Prelude has to get emissions tested every 2 years because of its age. Once it hits 20 years old, I can apply for historical plates and get an emissions inspection.

Funny, we have to have front plates on the cars here in CT too. They don't break your chops about it like in NY.

stickguy

the sticker on a new car is for 5 years anyway. Just a formality that I have to go get it. They don't actually test anything. I just don't feel like waiting on line at the inspection station. At least I don't have to pay for it again (included in the registration as long as you go to a state run center).

not sure how picky they are in Jersey about the front plate, but I have no desire to find out the hard way!

I don't mind about that. Just annoyed that I did not think of the bracket for the front plate until I was already home. I could stop at a local dealer and they would probably throw it on, but that just feels cheesy! So I will risk it all and do it myself. Plus the other dealer is out of the way.

fintail

20 years for "historic" plates? That might be the shortest period I've seen. That means such classic rides like an early Altima or a Neon could now run those plates. Crazy.

I think it is 25 or 30 years here, I saw a Citation with vintage plates a year or two ago, made me smile.

nyccarguy said:

@stickguy‌

I think they do the same thing in NY if you buy out of state. Here in CT, there are no state inspections. After 5 years, your car has to pass an emissions test. No stickers on the front windshield either. My Prelude has to get emissions tested every 2 years because of its age. Once it hits 20 years old, I can apply for historical plates and get an emissions inspection.

Funny, we have to have front plates on the cars here in CT too. They don't break your chops about it like in NY.

stickguy

Jersey is 25 years, but they seem to be pretty restrictive. I am sure plenty of people violate this strict definition.

"To be considered a historic vehicle, the vehicle must be at least 25 years old and only used for exhibition and educational purposes by the owner."

nyccarguy

@fintail‌

It varies by state. In NY it is 25 years. Here in CT it is 20 years. In NY you get a cool plate that says HISTORICAL on the bottom.

Here in CT, they give you a plate with a picture of a Model T looking car and it says "Early American." Looks cool on an older domestic car, looks dumb on a vintage Mercedes...

xwesx

Alaska is very similar, stick. I pretty much had to deliver a long-winded soliloquy about how all my plans fit the letter of the law to a 'T' before the DMV would issue me a set for my Econoline. I mean, I rarely drive the silly thing, so it fits the definition in spirit. Besides, regardless of what I'm doing when I have it out, it's an exhibition! LOL

fintail

Here, the main old car plates are "collector vehicle" and "horseless carriage". I just looked it up - cut off is 30 years, which makes sense, as the gentle climate means cars survive longer. We also have "year of manufacture" plates, which means if someone finds a vintage plate from the same year as their car, they can re-register it on the old car. I have a set on my fintail, they look cool - great yard sale 25 cent purchase back in 1996.

The authorities claim the specialty plates are only for vehicles used for shows and recreational purposes, but I doubt it is enforced.

nyccarguy said:

@fintail‌

It varies by state. In NY it is 25 years. Here in CT it is 20 years. In NY you get a cool plate that says HISTORICAL on the bottom.

Here in CT, they give you a plate with a picture of a Model T looking car and it says "Early American." Looks cool on an older domestic car, looks dumb on a vintage Mercedes...

kyfdx

25 years in KY. We had them on the '87 BMW.

Also.. for show or parade use, only, but my son used it as his daily driver, and was never questioned.
The insurance company doesn't care how it's plated, so that isn't an issue.

Also, in KY, once you get historic plates, you don't have to update the registration every year ($25 savings), and instead of ACV for property taxes, the car is listed at $100 value, so most of your tax bill goes away, as well.

28firefighter

I hate the front plate situation in WA. Not having a front is one of the few niceties from PA that I miss. 

qbrozen

you can get classic designation here in NJ after 20 years, but you have to jump through a lot of hoops. I did it with my Alfa back when it turned 20 because I couldn't get it to pass emissions no matter what I did. The requirement was proving it is somehow special. I wound up reaching out to the president of the Alfa club, who happens to live in NJ, who then hit up his contact in Italy who researched my car and sent me a letter stating it was 1 of xxx that was sent to the US (of course, narrowing the number by only counting triple black Veloce models).

Anyhoo - stick, you can just go and get a sticker without waiting in line per the paperwork I got with my Honda. However, you have to go within, I think it was, 2 weeks of registering. My dealer delayed sending to me, then it was delayed in the mail, so I got it the day the grace period expired. Oh well. I still haven't taken it to the inspection station and continue to drive around with the PA sticker on it. I do worry when passing cops, but not enough that I've rushed over to the station, obviously.

graphicguy

kyfdx said:

25 years in KY. We had them on the '87 BMW.

Also.. for show or parade use, only, but my son used it as his daily driver, and was never questioned.
The insurance company doesn't care how it's plated, so that isn't an issue.

Also, in KY, once you get historic plates, you don't have to update the registration every year ($25 savings), and instead of ACV for property taxes, the car is listed at $100 value, so most of your tax bill goes away, as well.

I need to keep my cars a whole lot longer than I do......

roadburner

kyfdx said:

25 years in KY. We had them on the '87 BMW.

Also.. for show or parade use, only, but my son used it as his daily driver, and was never questioned.
The insurance company doesn't care how it's plated, so that isn't an issue.

Also, in KY, once you get historic plates, you don't have to update the registration every year ($25 savings), and instead of ACV for property taxes, the car is listed at $100 value, so most of your tax bill goes away, as well.

I actually had an officer cite a guy for running historic tags and driving it daily. I think the LEO was running radar at a school zone and saw the guy several days in a row. I still told the officer I thought he must have way too much free time...

xwesx

graphicguy said:

I need to keep my cars a whole lot longer than I do......

That does bring up the irony of this conversation in, well, this conversation.

nyccarguy

Paging @roadburner‌

https://autos.yahoo.com/news/5-best-looking-collectible-cars-under--15-000-015630896.html

laurasdada

In defense of Jag (well, current models!): Just made service appointment for first (and only) free service. I've had my XF for just about 11 months/11k miles now, no incidents to report. First trip to dealer since I bought it. Ok, there have been a couple of Lucas moments with the "advanced for 2005" infotainment system, but solved with a reboot and (so far) non-recurring. Small sample size, but still a wonderful all around ride.

Jag's got a nicel lineup, the F-Type certainly seems to be inducing lustful thoughts throughout the auto mag/site industry! Looking forward to XE reviews, wondering if there will be an XK (GT Coupe) replacement?

nyccarguy

@laurasdada‌

I just saw a recent-ish model XK Coupe. That car is stunning and very sexy. It wasn't even an "R."