Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

jayrider

Sandman, you can buy a brand new Verano with leather for less than 25K.

suydam

I thought you said back then the Ct200h was rather low getting in and out.

carnaught

SM, wifey has the CT200h and loves it and the close to 50 mpg., even with today's lower gas prices. It has surprisingly sporty handling/steering, yet is no rocket. FWIW, Consumer's rated it the number one hybrid in reliability.

That said, the car is very low to the ground making entrance and egress challenging, and a tight cabin for some. I think your Tucson better suits your needs and purposes.

Sandman6472

Funny, the one I drove today wasn't that tight at all, maybe it's because I lost about 10 pounds since last year and ingress/egress wasn't an issue. That kind of mileage is what is drawing me here but yes, the Tucson is a better fit for me. But the Lexus is calling me right now and if I could get into one for around $10k and my car, I think I'd be very tempted to be honest, very tempted! Mentioned it to the wife again and she's not saying a word, not a no or a yes but nothing. So either she thinks this will just blow over or since she spent a lot on hers on Sunday, she's just letting nature take it's course. Logically, makes no sense but logic goes out the window when one falls in love with an object, or lust in this case.
Figure I'll go over to Lexus in the morning and test a couple of the units I found online and go from there. Figuring they'll be there until the new year since most aren't buying such large presents right now. But if I could get that magic $10k price difference, it would be very tempting!!!

The Sandman

carnaught

SM, tried talking you out of it, but I'm right with ya buddy.

Living vicariously with car-buyers in times when I'm not buying myself makes me a member of Chronic Car Buyers Annonymous.

stickguy

I kind of like that Lexus. I recall sitting in one at the car show. I just can't remember if I fit! Something like that for my next car is a possibility. I always did like hatches!

Not seeing any 14s at my dealer in the 20s. They did have a really nice bronze/gray Navi model CPO. 2012 with 36K on it. Listed at 25.9K. Their 2014 was more like 34K asking.

jayrider

But if I could get that magic $10k price difference, it would be very tempting!!!

Based on Edmunds, you are looking at 13K difference plus tax and fees. As far as mpg === you will never realize any savings close to 13K. If you are real unhappy with the Tuscon, then go for it but like most car swaps, a big money loser. My cars have depreciated so much and still drive so nicely, I can't even fathom a transaction. I've easily lost 30k in the last 6 years in depreciation. Been there and done that many , many times.

corvette

slorenzen said:

If mine fails again, I will replace myself. It didn't look that difficult.

I think there was a design flaw with the original chip which has supposedly been corrected. If true, it's unlikely to fail again.

If it does, I'm not sure. Mine is now approaching 10 years and I'm not a heavy TV user. I think I might leave it by the curb and wait for a really good sale to get a replacement.

It's funny, our legal assistant at my old firm was famously frugal, but when their old tube TV died, she and her husband wanted a 60" flatscreen with Netflix. The flatscreen died in short order after the warranty was up, but the manufacturer repaired it as goodwill. I'm not so convinced reliability is improving!

Sandman6472

Jay, not that I'm unhappy...I really really had wanted the Mitsu Outlander Sportto be honest with ya, just think it looks a whole lot better. But after I got the convertible as a 2nd d d for myself, I zoned in on the 200CTh as the perfect vehicle and great mileage. But it felt cramped to me back then but today, no such issue and I doubt that losing 10 lbs. would make that much of a difference. I had put the power seat all the way up and manipulated the back and lower cushion, so ingress/egress was pretty easy and not painful in the least. I think driving another one or two will help me with the decision process. Funny you mentioned $13k, because that was the supposed difference at the Hyundai store. Hoping the cpo units at Lexus will be around that magic 10 number. One has to remember that I'm looking at a vehicle that stickers in the mid $30's for the most part and the only way I'd ever get into one is going the used route as I just do not the funds the other half does.
I've never done something like this before in my life, keeping a vehicle was a long term commitment except with the problematic '03 Sentra and that was a nightmare for me. I just feel that this is the time to do something as illogical as this is, when I'm still working and could afford it...once I retire for good, a new vehicle will just not be feasable and we'll probably go down to one vehicle at a certain point. But right now, the time is right if I am going to make a change. Best part is I can walk away like I did today and she honestly thought I was going to buy it to, the sales lady that is. Before I bought the Tucson, I figured it would be my last vehicle but now, I know there could very well be another two down the line. The devil on my left shoulder is pushing me to do it while the angel on the other side is telling me not to! Such a problem!!!

The Sandman

stickguy

wait. You never got the convertible did you? That was just something you were considering, but never pulled the trigger on, right?

anyway, look at the big picture. You have said all along that the Tuscan wasn't a long term keeper. so if you are planning to trade in a few years anyway, really does not matter if you do it now and keep the Lexus longer to make up for it. Just make sure whatever you get, you really want to have for 10 years, and be done with it.

Life is short. If it isn't going to hurt your financial future, not that big a deal.

besides, in some ways, you will save money. Trust me (channeling my inner Driver here). The Hyundai is worth 16K now. In 2 years, it will be worth what, 10K? so you have 6K less to play with. But, you will still want a 2 YO or so CPO Lexus, so that will cost about the same 28K or whatever it is today.

doing the math, trading today would cost 12K. Doing it in 2 years will cost 18K.

Yes, I know that the Lexus in 2 years will be worth less. But that does not matter, since in either case, you are keeping it until it is 10 years old. So you don't actually recoup any savings until that time when you sell the Lexus.

Make sense? Basically the AbecoMike process. Trade your newer car while it is still worth quite a bit!

anyway, what the heck, hit the lexus dealer. maybe they do 10K+ trade. if so, and you are in love, do it. Just make sure that this time, it really is "the one"

stickguy

I actually did something like this once. I bought a 2005 scion tC in August 2004 or so (I think it was the first one delivered in the area). after a bit over a year, it just wasn't working for me, so I got an Accord instead (left over 2005 bought in December 2005). Yes, I pulled a Mike and went from 1 2005 to another.

traded in the Scion. I think it had 10K on it maybe? 7.5? Not much in any case. And trade in for only 2K less than I paid for it. And considering the killer deal I got on the leftover Accord, if I had just bought that to begin with, I would have spent just as much in the end. At least I tell myself that.

nyccarguy

@sandman_6472‌

Mazel-Tov & Congrats on the A3. White on Black is a sweet looking color combination for sure. Enjoy it.

"Not sure how the wife would take it" - her car, her money. Your car, your money.

"Just 369 days ago" - I know that you know what board this is.

"Someone please talk me out of this." - You are on your own with that last comment bud.

Ok Sandy, all joking aside the good thing is that your Tuscon is paid for so you don't have to worry about being upside down on your loan. Make sure you take thorough test drives of the CT200h. Don't just take the gas mileage numbers and use them as your main reason for switching.

Also take into account that you might not get as much fo your trade at the Lexus dealer as at the Hyundai dealer. There are plenty of these coming off short term leases or that got bought out via "pull ahead" programs so you should have the pick of the litter.

The CT is an interesting car. I'd actually consider a used or CPO unit once my wife's Pilot is paid off & I make some extra payments on my Legacy. She drives the truck out of necessity, but she much prefers a car.

houdini1

Sandy, demand for the CT is way down right now because gas prices are so low. Use this to your advantage when negotiating because they are really wanting to move these things. I like them a lot also. Just take your time, shop around, and I think you can get a great deal. If you are talking to a Lexus dealer remember that it makes no sense to certify a '14 model with low miles. The CT comes with a 4 year 50,000 mile warranty, so why certify. Sometimes they will de-certify and save you some bucks.

You might also consider a private sale on your Tucson. A free ad on C/L and you might find the perfect buyer at a price that will get you where you need to be.

kyfdx

Leasing is the way to go on the CT, I think...

Mr_Shiftright

I need spiritual counseling.

As you know, I've been searching pretty vigorously for a Porsche 996 cabriolet.

Finding the right combination of color, equipment, service history and price has not been easy, because what IS easy on a car like this is making a $20,000 mistake.

The biggest barrier that I can't seem to get over is compromising on a Tiptronic transmission. Like with the Corvette, there are more automatic Porsches out there than one might imagine.

There are many sound arguments for "settling" for the automatic, such as heavy traffic conditions in the SF Bay Area, the precision of paddle shifting and the durability of the unit. AND I might add, generally a better price. (I was going to add the creakiness of maturity, but really, I'm still in pretty good shape and don't mind shifting).

An added incentive is that I can drive a TIP Boxster S as well, but cannot find leg room in a Boxster or Cayman for my left knee when I shift. And let's let out the dirty secret. In your rear view mirror, a Boxster and a 996 look identical.

But I dunno, I drive a TIP and it just feels "wrong". Remember, this is not a sequential box like a Ferrari.

It's like those cartoons with the guy in the bar and he has a little angel on his right shoulder whispering in his ear and a little devil on his left.

And really, at $350 a pop for PPI inspections, one doesn't want to be waffling here.

qbrozen

no way, no how, shifty. The tip, as you say, is a true slush box unit. It is not even as sharp as the ZF automatics.

Mr_Shiftright

I had a horrible experience with one last week---as it revved up, the electronic "brain" shifted for me and I suddenly had the visceral recollection of the shifting characteristics of my old Mercedes 300D sedan.

It was akin to the first time the checker at the supermarket looks you over after packing your grocery bags and says "You want help out with that"?

roadburner

qbrozen said:

no way, no how, shifty. The tip, as you say, is a true slush box unit. It is not even as sharp as the ZF automatics.

I agree 100% Do not "settle"

laurasdada

Sandy, back in '11 I was like you. Intrigued by the CT200H, but then the earthquake/tsunami hit and they became short in supply. So, instead, I bought its identical cousin: Jaguar XK Coupe. I recommend you take a look at the Jag

I liked the CT, but it is small inside and one thing I remembering it sharing with the XK, not great all around visibility. And, not very quick. Made up for by mpg, however!

laurasdada

Oh, yeah. Speaking of Jag: Brought the XF in for its first scheduled service. Not quite a year and 11k miles. Pull into the Jag/LR dealer lot, first car I see is the (new) identical XK to my '09 in silver. Next to it was a black F-Type. Man, these are just such beautiful pieces of aluminum! Ian Callum, well done. Teared up a bit over the XK, too short a mid-life crisis.

Anyway, all is well with the XF. Other than one flake out of the infotainment screen, solved by rebooting the car, no issues. Hadn't been back to the dealer since I bought it. And, took advantage of their free pastries, donuts, apples and ice cream! Ok, so I didn't have an apple. Just got the latest CR, Jag did very well in overall customer satisfaction. On my second Jag, count me amongst those masses! I spoke to a gentleman who was having them put snow shoes on his '07 XJ VDP, he too said he loved his with not a complaint.

Next door is the Bentley/Lambo/Maserati dealer and just down the road is BMW. Nice little Autoquartermile!

kyfdx

@Mr_Shiftright

I wouldn't settle, either... but if you do decide to go TIP, and you are stuck on a convertible, I would definitely save my money and get a Boxster..

The only 911 I would spend my money on is RWD, coupe and stick..

nyccarguy

Mr_Shiftright said:

I need spiritual counseling.

As you know, I've been searching pretty vigorously for a Porsche 996 cabriolet.

Finding the right combination of color, equipment, service history and price has not been easy, because what IS easy on a car like this is making a $20,000 mistake.

The biggest barrier that I can't seem to get over is compromising on a Tiptronic transmission. Like with the Corvette, there are more automatic Porsches out there than one might imagine.

There are many sound arguments for "settling" for the automatic, such as heavy traffic conditions in the SF Bay Area, the precision of paddle shifting and the durability of the unit. AND I might add, generally a better price. (I was going to add the creakiness of maturity, but really, I'm still in pretty good shape and don't mind shifting).

An added incentive is that I can drive a TIP Boxster S as well, but cannot find leg room in a Boxster or Cayman for my left knee when I shift. And let's let out the dirty secret. In your rear view mirror, a Boxster and a 996 look identical.

But I dunno, I drive a TIP and it just feels "wrong". Remember, this is not a sequential box like a Ferrari.

It's like those cartoons with the guy in the bar and he has a little angel on his right shoulder whispering in his ear and a little devil on his left.

And really, at $350 a pop for PPI inspections, one doesn't want to be waffling here.

Don't settle. Not on a car like a 996 911 anyway. You want to settle on another aspect, settle on color. Don't get an automatic.

Mr_Shiftright

Ah Boxsters.....well they're okay but I like a MAN'S car, you know what I mean? Back seat for stowage. 300+ HP and some actual resale value. Boxsters are like fruit flies where I live. Great handling cars, though, and the "S" is a credible performer. The regular Boxster I can already equal in performance with my Mini S, so no "gain" doing the switch. Two of my friends have Boxsters, and I can run right up their backsides (to be fair, I am a better driver, too).

I have been considering a 996 coupe with sunroof, or a cabriolet with detachable hardtop. Miles have to be under 100K because this will be a primary car for me, and I rack up miles pretty fast.

So if I bought a 996 with 125K, in two years that'd be 150K and that makes a 996 practically worthless. I'm not blowin' $10K on two years' depreciation! If I buy at 75K and sell at 99K I haven't lost a thing.

Sandman6472

Saw the selection at the Lexus store, '12's and '13's with miles from 7.5k plus on the '12 and between 11k and 13.5k on the '13's. The red metallic ;12 was really stunning in the afternoon sunlight and had a bit over 7.5k on the clock, had the lighter interior. The '13's were a pearlized saffire and a gray, both over black. they all drove nice and once I found the "sport" setting, downright fun but just don't know. I don't have an issue with the seating since the power seats are highly adjustable, visibility isn't that bad either and they all ahve the back up camera but it's in the rear view mirror which gets washed out in the sun. Just not sure I really "love it" right now if that makes any sense. These are cpo units which does add some extra value, 3 years and 100k miles, from fate of purchase. Seems like both stores are pretty close on price to be honest so just don't know.
Get back in my Tucson and I have more room and no cvt lag, I hit the gas and it goes. It does nothing wrong to be honest, I just don't love it. the wife has not said one word and doubt she will since she really got exactly what she wanted so I know she gets that part. But, and this maybe not be logical in here, but the smart thing to do right now is nothing...save my funds and keep on driving the Tucson. Think if I absolutely loved the CT, I'd just say the hell with the extra cash and just trade out but, since I'm just in lust, makes no sense at this juncture. Looking like I'll need to spend close to $14 to $15k plus mine and that's not something I want to do right now just to get better gas mileage.
Hyundai store called and left a message but not doing a thing right now. And to be honest, the new Honda small cuv coming out soon looks like something I would like down the line. Might be best to keep what I've got a few more years and then revisit this again come 2016 or 2017. Heck, now that we got the Audi, we've got our lux vehicle that eventually I will get to drive. And who knows, next year things might change but for now, staying the course is the logical thing to do here!

The Sandman

brian125

I like the Ford C-max I think its a all around better buy for the money. Your lexus 200ct has poor visibility and tight interior room. Granted your gas mileage may be better. C-max gas mileage is impressive along with its ride and handling. Another plus is in the C-max : you sit a lot higher inside where the Lexus you feel lower to the ground.

jayrider

Sandman --------- Why not set your sights on the 2016 Audi A3 ? You sounded pretty happy --- maybe the right choice is sitting in your garage. You can name them Jack and Jill.

nyccarguy

@Mr_Shiftright‌

Have you considered expanding your search for different cars? I know there's nothing on earth like a 911, but if your ideal car (anally maintained C2 coupe or cab w/ 6-Speed with average-ish miles for a modest price) doesn't exist, have you considered a used C6 Corvette? A late model Grand Sport Coupe lets you pop the roof off. Or even a Z06 of some sort?

Sandman6472

Funny but I mentioned to the wife that we should get the black and white one, or the gray one which I like so much better. But yes, already mentioned that. The C-Max is something I've mentioned before for me as you do sit a bit higher and it isn't that bad to drive but with a Ford, I'd definitely want new and not pre-owned...trust a pre-owned Lexus but not a Ford. But a new C-Max is a definite possibility. The lack of height in the CT was something that I wasn't too happy with and it is a bit snug inside, not a deal breaker but an issue. And I don't have that gotta have it now feeling with the CT, not that "way cool" feeling I got when I saw the wife's A3. It didn't do anything to my heart so for now, it ain't gonna happen and the Tucson will stay on my side of the garage. Also, I'm intrigued with the new Honda coming out in 2015, the CV-R I think? More of what I'm looking for in a vehicle. It would be really hard to go back to a regular sedan which I found out today.

The Sandman

jayrider

sandman_6472 said:

Funny but I mentioned to the wife that we should get the black and white one, or the gray one which I like so much better. But yes, already mentioned that. The C-Max is something I've mentioned before for me as you do sit a bit higher and it isn't that bad to drive but with a Ford, I'd definitely want new and not pre-owned...trust a pre-owned Lexus but not a Ford. But a new C-Max is a definite possibility. The lack of height in the CT was something that I wasn't too happy with and it is a bit snug inside, not a deal breaker but an issue. And I don't have that gotta have it now feeling with the CT, not that "way cool" feeling I got when I saw the wife's A3. It didn't do anything to my heart so for now, it ain't gonna happen and the Tucson will stay on my side of the garage. Also, I'm intrigued with the new Honda coming out in 2015, the CV-R I think? More of what I'm looking for in a vehicle. It would be really hard to go back to a regular sedan which I found out today.

Audi Q3 should ring your chimes.

breld

Well Sandy, doesn't hurt to wait. Yes, your Tuscon will depreciate, but so will all those used CT200's out there too. I'm seeing CPO models here in my area for low-mid $20's - the $10k difference doesn't seem all that out of line.

I wouldn't mind one of those to spin around town in. I remember enjoying the drive, finding it sporty for what it is. As small as it is, at least it has rear seats, unlike the CR-Z, being the only other hybrid with a hint of sportiness.

Good luck - whether now or later, I'm excited for you to get into something you're passionate about.

breld

Could use some advice.

I'm taking my MIL car shopping on Saturday. She still needs to do something with her X-type - probably make the minimum required repairs and offload it. But she would like to get into something else even before everything is settled on her Ford...er...Jag.

So, she'd like something efficient, and comfortable enough for road trips. She has the Mitsi Endeavor, and while it's not the greatest SUV out there, it's paid off and has pretty low miles, so I think she should just keep it for the hauling and snow duties. So best bet is probably some mid-size sedan.

She'd like to get some lease deal for little down and around $200/month. WIth her wanting leather, I told her it'd probably be closer to $250-$300.

So...

I'm thinking a Kia/Hyundai may offer the most value (as Stick found), but maybe this time of year we could find a deal on a Camry/Accord?

Also threw out to her the idea of looking at Buicks, and she and my father-in-law really liked the idea of that. Verano may be a little small, but maybe a Regal? Those are pretty heavily incentivised, right?

She'd be open to a good used car buy too, if it wasn't too old (1-3 years).

Sandman6472

Yep, that's it...I'm not passionate about the Tucson though it is very good at what it does. There's no excitement like the A3 going on and I want that, want what the wife has now, to love my ride! So I will just wait, plenty of things coming down the pike for me to "love"!!!

The Sandman

Michaell

breld said:

Could use some advice.

I'm taking my MIL car shopping on Saturday. She still needs to do something with her X-type - probably make the minimum required repairs and offload it. But she would like to get into something else even before everything is settled on her Ford...er...Jag.

So, she'd like something efficient, and comfortable enough for road trips. She has the Mitsi Endeavor, and while it's not the greatest SUV out there, it's paid off and has pretty low miles, so I think she should just keep it for the hauling and snow duties. So best bet is probably some mid-size sedan.

She'd like to get some lease deal for little down and around $200/month. WIth her wanting leather, I told her it'd probably be closer to $250-$300.

So...

I'm thinking a Kia/Hyundai may offer the most value (as Stick found), but maybe this time of year we could find a deal on a Camry/Accord?

Also threw out to her the idea of looking at Buicks, and she and my father-in-law really liked the idea of that. Verano may be a little small, but maybe a Regal? Those are pretty heavily incentivised, right?

She'd be open to a good used car buy too, if it wasn't too old (1-3 years).

2014 Accords have good MF's (.00011, IIRC). Camry lease numbers are very regional and Toyota doesn't residualize all their options, so it can be a bit of a crapshoot.

Altima has a .00003 MF, while the Sonata and Optima are just OK by comparison.

Ideally, you want to find something that gives you a good discount from sticker and a low MF.

If you post your questions in the relevant lease question discussions for each make/model you're interested in, ky or I can pull those numbers for you.

stickguy

Lots of incentives on the sonata. 2014 accords are real rare now, might get lucky and find an Exl.

Leather is going to kill you. All the good leases are cloth. Leather in a sonata, Altima Camry or accord will sticker up around 30k.

Look for a 2014 Jetta. Cheap leases still. And vinyl just like leather!

carnaught

brian125 said:

I like the Ford C-max I think its a all around better buy for the money. Your lexus 200ct has poor visibility and tight interior room. Granted your gas mileage may be better. C-max gas mileage is impressive along with its ride and handling. Another plus is in the C-max : you sit a lot higher inside where the Lexus you feel lower to the ground.

I don't disagree with what you've said but the C-Max makes the Prius look handsome.

Mr_Shiftright

I have given some consideration to a Corvette C6 as a matter of fact. The 2005s/6s could sneak under my budget limit and the car is an awesome performer, but I really struggle with the styling. The front end is fine with the exposed headlights, but the rear end---ugh! Something about that just screams bad taste to me---my problem, I know. But I'll nose around--maybe a black one would tone things down a bit. At least it would be cheaper to repair and I wouldn't have to go to Rocket School in Germany to DIY some things.

nyccarguy said:

@Mr_Shiftright‌

Have you considered expanding your search for different cars? I know there's nothing on earth like a 911, but if your ideal car (anally maintained C2 coupe or cab w/ 6-Speed with average-ish miles for a modest price) doesn't exist, have you considered a used C6 Corvette? A late model Grand Sport Coupe lets you pop the roof off. Or even a Z06 of some sort?

nyccarguy

@Mr_Shiftright‌

Another thing with a C6 is the good old pushrod V8. Very durable. Very old school, low tech. Chevy "stuff" is a lot less expensive than Porsche "stuff." Another thing is that so many guys buy a Corvette as a "mid-life crisis car" and barely drive them. They are kept in perfect shape and eventually people just don't want to bother getting in and out or they just get rid of it because they never drive them.

A guy near where I work has a C5 with over 100K miles.

I happen to love the look of the C6. Front, back, side. With that monster V8 up front, it is a great starting point:)

houdini1

sandman_6472 said:

Yep, that's it...I'm not passionate about the Tucson though it is very good at what it does. There's no excitement like the A3 going on and I want that, want what the wife has now, to love my ride! So I will just wait, plenty of things coming down the pike for me to "love"!!!

The Sandman

That new Honda is called the HR-V. It is 9 inches shorter than the CR-V and about 700 pounds lighter. Based on the Honda Fit platform. It sounds like something you would really like and is supposed to be available around the 1st of the year.

Edmund's have some info on it in their review section.

stever

I think Honda is calling it that because it's going to be their Home Run Vehicle.

rayainsw

As a previous C6 driver [ over 30,000 miles in 2 years on a 2007 w/6-speed automatic ] I do think it is worth a serious look. Bang - for - the - buck, it is hard to beat, IMHO.
My friend with a 2006 has about 3,000 miles on his...
= Ray
Had my mid-life 'Vette - moved on...

breld

Sandman - sounds to me the perfect vehicle for you would be the new Lexus NX200h (small hybrid SUV). Though likely a bit more than you want to spend at this point.

suydam

Leather in an Accord does not come anywhere close to 30k. The Ex-L has an invoice of just over $26k and can be bought for around that number. But you are correct that the lease deals are almost always on lower end cloth models.

brian125

Agreed about the Accords. Most buyers are getting 2k below dealers invoice price on what's left of the 14's. A 2014, exl Accord model will sell for 24k or lower.

In some area's 2015 Accords are selling 1k below invoice. Others at Invoice price. In Boston and CA buyers are claiming close to 2k below on the 2015 model. . How true that is I don't know? Honda may be trying to outsell Toyota and its rival the....... Camry for the year.

jayrider

brian125 said:

Agreed about the Accords. Most buyers are getting 2k below dealers invoice price on what's left of the 14's. A 2014, exl Accord model will sell for 24k or lower In some area's 2015 Accords are selling 1k below invoice. Others at Invoice price. In Boston and CA buyers are claiming close to 2k below on the 2015 model. . How true that is I don't know? Honda may be trying to outsell Toyota and its rival the....... Camry for the year.

Today's invoice was yesterday's MSRP. The car companies aren't stupid when it comes to pricing.

brian125

Correct..... Jan,1 2015 your I month old vehicle bought in 2014 is now a 1 year old model and has depreciated accordingly. Dealerships get more incentive money from there Corps. to push vehicles at a lower price this time of the year. .

henryn

stickguy said:

Lots of incentives on the sonata. 2014 accords are real rare now, might get lucky and find an Exl.

Leather is going to kill you. All the good leases are cloth. Leather in a sonata, Altima Camry or accord will sticker up around 30k.

Look for a 2014 Jetta. Cheap leases still. And vinyl just like leather!

I agree, the Volkswagen leatherette is actually my favorite seating material. I would much rather have that than cloth seats, and I'm not about to pay the premium for leather in a new car.

suydam

My point is that you can get leather in a new Accord for way less than $30k.

henryn

suydam said:

My point is that you can get leather in a new Accord for way less than $30k.

No argument from me on that. If you're at all serious, you should start by looking at the Accord Prices Paid forum here on Edmunds, it is quite active and you will learn quite a bit.

graphicguy

jayrider said:

brian125 said:

Agreed about the Accords. Most buyers are getting 2k below dealers invoice price on what's left of the 14's. A 2014, exl Accord model will sell for 24k or lower In some area's 2015 Accords are selling 1k below invoice. Others at Invoice price. In Boston and CA buyers are claiming close to 2k below on the 2015 model. . How true that is I don't know? Honda may be trying to outsell Toyota and its rival the....... Camry for the year.

Today's invoice was yesterday's MSRP. The car companies aren't stupid when it comes to pricing.

Yep....I've noted that the last few years. Wife's Accord (with leather, nav, the whole shebang) came in well under invoice.....I figured trunk money.

My CTS came in way under invoice....I mean thousands under, and that was before I even got to the "publicized" manufacturer's money back to me. So, yes there is some trunk money being thrown around pretty liberally these days.

stevedebi

sandman_6472 said:

Funny but I mentioned to the wife that we should get the black and white one, or the gray one which I like so much better. But yes, already mentioned that. The C-Max is something I've mentioned before for me as you do sit a bit higher and it isn't that bad to drive but with a Ford, I'd definitely want new and not pre-owned...trust a pre-owned Lexus but not a Ford. But a new C-Max is a definite possibility. The lack of height in the CT was something that I wasn't too happy with and it is a bit snug inside, not a deal breaker but an issue. And I don't have that gotta have it now feeling with the CT, not that "way cool" feeling I got when I saw the wife's A3. It didn't do anything to my heart so for now, it ain't gonna happen and the Tucson will stay on my side of the garage. Also, I'm intrigued with the new Honda coming out in 2015, the CV-R I think? More of what I'm looking for in a vehicle. It would be really hard to go back to a regular sedan which I found out today.

The Sandman

I recommend the C-Max. I have the Energi version, which loses some cargo to accomodate the big battery in the rear. But in town it will go around 20 miles on electric only (depends on outside temp and driving habits). Be aware that on the road you will get around 40 MPG at 70 MPH, maybe a bit less. I'd plan on 38. But it drives really well, has a high quality feel to it, and the seating is good with great visibility. The tech is very impressive (I still have a few issues with the way they use Sync, but it is worth it to me).

For the "normal C-Max hybrid in town, it all depends on the driving - it takes adjusting your habits to maximize.

With the tax credits available in most states (and federal), I found it worked out cheaper to buy the Energi over the normal C-Max.

Let me know if you have any questions about the car.