Toyota Prius v. ??? (fill in the comparison)
The Prius is being compared to non-hybrid vehicles - the Elantra, Corolla and more. Here's the place to discussion the Prius V. other vehicles.
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Also you won't find a new Corolla for $12k. You might find a basic one for $14k, but for that you won't get ABS/traction, power everything, remote locking, auto climate control, automatic transmission or many of the other nice standard features of the Prius. But if a strippo Corolla meets your needs, save the bucks and buy one.
Actually, I have taken your advice! That is why I bought a TDI diesel over a 2003 Prius! Too bad the Toyota Corolla doesn't come in the USA with a diesel! Killer combo! But then I can be forced to commute in my Toyota Landcruiser!
I saw one at the dealer today for $19,595.
It was the Corolla SRX without an automatic transmission.
JOHN
and the SUVs for whatever purpose you need or want.
>I saw one at the dealer today for $19,595.
>It was the Corolla SRX without an automatic transmission.
>JOHN
You can find new basic model 2004 and 2005 Corollas for around 12-13K, a few 2004 CEs are less than $12K
The Corolla SRX that you mention is incorrect. You actually meant a 2005 Corolla XRS which is the performance version with the 170 horsepower engine, the same as in the Matrix XRS and the Celica GTS. It is for driving enthusiasts and comes only in a 6-speed manual, the same as the Matrix XRS. However, in the Celica version you can get and automatic.
YMMV,
MidCow
>You might find a basic one for $14k
WRONG!
Everyday in the Houston Chronicle:
You can find new basic model 2004 and 2005 Corollas for around 12-13K, a few 2004 CEs are less than $12K
The basic model does not have ABS, but is does include:
DRL (daytime running Lights) - Prius doesn't have this!
32/40 mpg (manual transmission 0-60 mpg in 8.5 seconds)
external temperature display
tachometer -Prius doesn't have this
power mirrors
tilt-adjustable steering wheel
air conditioning
Cruise control, ABS brakes, sunroof and power remote locks are options.
The Corolla makes a very nice economy car with good acceleration and good miles per gallon at a price less than half the Prius.
YMMV,
MidCow
You can order a basic model (which is rather well loaded) of Prius too.
So why are some people insisting that comparing the lowest cost Corolla to a every-tech-item-possible Prius is appropriate? They are opposite extremes.
JOHN
>I saw one at the dealer today for $19,595.
>It was the Corolla SRX without an automatic transmission.
>JOHN
You can find new basic model 2004 and 2005 Corollas for around 12-13K, a few 2004 CEs are less than $12K
The Corolla SRX that you mention is incorrect. You actually meant a 2005 Corolla XRS which is the performance version with the 170 horsepower engine, the same as in the Matrix XRS and the Celica GTS. It is for driving enthusiasts and comes only in a 6-speed manual, the same as the Matrix XRS. However, in the Celica version you can get and automatic.
YMMV,
MidCow
To lowest Prius $20,810
The Corolla is $9,010 less.
Anyway you slice it if you are looking for a reliable (i.e. Toyota) car and you are concerned about miles per gallon and Total Cost of Ownership, then the only obvious answer is the Corolla. $9,000 buys a whole lot of gas!
Both are economy cars: the Prius is on steriods with tech options and is classified as a midsize only barely and only because of its hatch back design.
And the Prius only comes with an automatic. If you want or need a manual transmission, you can get one in the Corolla!
YMMV,
MidCow
@ 1.59 for #2 diesel and 1.95 unleaded gas:
this converts to 4,615 gals and at 38 mpg that is 175,384 miles!
MY WIFE BOUGHT ME
THIS BORING BUT
ECONOMICAL CAR
Oh.. one more thing.. why would you want a TACH in a Prius with a CVT? It serves NO purpose at all. I can't remember the last time I looked at a TACH in a car with automatic.
>a TACH in a Prius with a CVT? It serves
>NO purpose at all. I can't remember the
>last time I looked at a TACH in a car with automatic.
How much real information does the cartoon on the Prius multi-display console provide when it shows the schematic of the ICE, MG1, MG2, Battery and wheels, when it shows sources and users of power.
Are you advocating that tachometers be eliminated from all automatics. What about tiptronic shifting? Oh Yeah! I forgot, they won't let you exceed red-line; electronic protection.
Where can I get the T-Shirt ?
YMMV,
MidCow
P.S.- That is probably why the boss hasn't given me approval to buy a car
>MY WIFE BOUGHT ME
>THIS BORING BUT
>ECONOMICAL CAR
What makes the Prius not-boring?
It isn't accleration
It isn't handling
It isn't the throaty exhaust
It isn't the smell of leather on the seats and the sun shining through the sun roof.
It isn't the medoicre JBL stereo
Please don't tell me it is the multi-display console screen.
So if the Corolla is boring what makes the Prius non-boring ( or you might go as far as to say exciting)????
YMMV,
MidCow
I agree the Prius is an "economy" car if you look only at fuel economy and TCO. But in other aspects it is far above economy cars: features, interior quality, ride quality, interior room, and NVH for example.
@ 1.59 for #2 diesel and 1.95 unleaded gas:
this converts to 4,615 gals and at 38 mpg that is 175,384 miles!
Do all those interested in diesel live in the US? If so, is there some secret market for reduced sulfur diesel about which I am unaware? My understanding is that this won't be available until at least 2006 (and the way thing work in this arena, I wouldn't bet the farm on that one). If so, in figuring the "cost" of fuel, diesel drivers should factor in the tremendously detrimental health effects yielded by the emmisions from their tailpipes.
Short story... had a Mercedes E320 loaner 2 months ago while my friend's car was being serviced (he was away on business). I had to go to work and had a choice of a brand new E320 (actually it was an '03) or my '04 Prius. Needless to say, I chose the Prius. No, it's not a Mercedes but own one and you'll understand.
If you are trying to make the point that some cars cost a lot less than the Prius, that is pretty obvious. If someone is really worried about lowest cash outlay, they can buy something like a slightly used Elantra for $7-10k. With the average price of new cars these days over $27,000 (more than what a loaded Prius costs), it's clear that lowest possible cash outlay is not the main criterion for many car buyers.
Another way to look at it is total cost of ownership. It's interesting I think that Edmunds.com estimates the TCO for the Prius ($.38 per mile) is actually less than that of an Elantra GT ($.39 per mile). Purchase price is just one factor in "economy."
Someone mentioned this class being miniature. LOL.. The Mini is miniature. The Prius is considered mid size. SUVs are super sized and pure excess and WASTE.
Calling a Prius a midsize is like calling a Camry or Accord fullsize. It's a lie. A Crown Victoria is full size. The Mini-Cooper is very small. I would buy a Mini-Cooper over a Prius in a heartbeat. That car will not lose money over the long haul, if it is cared for. If you consider driving comfort and pleasure a WASTE. Then my Suburban and LS 400 are a WASTE. If you would take your family in a little car like the Prius on a long trip. That is horrible. The only reason I can see for them is daily commutes for 2 or less and going to the gracery store. I have an old Mazda 626 that I use for little errands. And it is more of a car than that Prius and I have driven both.
Actually, in Europe and the rest of the world the Prius is classed as a Large Family Car, and it fits their needs, family and all, quite well for trips of all lengths.
Only in America, home of the super-size Fries, Butts and Egos do we think for some odd reason that we need more interior space than the Prius (and similar US Mid-Size Cars) provide. Kind of odd.
But, as far as transporting more than two people in comfort, let's see.
Rear Leg Room
Crown Vic 39.6
Prius 38.6
Camry 37.8
Accord 36.8
Mazda 6 36.5
For a Cross Country Trip with 4 people, explain to me again how the rear seat passengers are going to be more comfortable in the "Mid Size" Cam/Cord/6?
Luggage Capacity
Crown Vic 20.6
Camry 16.7
Prius 16.1
Mazda 6 15.2
Accord 14
Oooh, those Mid Size Accord buyers are all set to load up those suitcases.
Bottom line is, the Prius is Mid-Size inside and Compact Size outside. It's fully and directly comparable to the Cam/Cords in interior size and function, and it's a lot more fun to drive
I took my '04 Prius (#9/Drift) to Cental Oregon from the San Francisco Bay Area last month which is 510 miles each way. I took a leisurely 9 hrs or so to get there so I spent a long time "in the saddle". I stopped occasionally for safety stretching and only one stop for gas. No one should be making marathon driving stretches without breaks. It's good for the body AND the mind. Anyway, I found no discomfort when I got to my destination. I travelled solo with my ever-present golf clubs and even with other golf buddies/gear the ride is very smooth. Until you've taken on such a journey either solo or with passengers, don't keep saying the car isn't comfortable, it is!!
Thanks,
Rich
Welcome to the debate. I think a long trip in Europe would be a bit shorter than a trip from San Diego to the Oregon border. My wife has spent a lot of time in Europe and agrees. The cars in general are smaller and you never see a PU truck like here. That is part of the problem. When you are in a sea of SUV's and 1 ton crew cab PU trucks with anything smaller it can be cause for claustrophobia. In the Suburban I can spot trouble 30 cars ahead in our Mazda barely one car ahead. The freeways and Interstate highways are a jungle and I don't want to be the mouse that gets squashed by the elephant. If I was in Europe I am sure I could handle being in a smaller car.
Unfortunately, full service stations are few and far between. Thank goodness today's automobiles last a long time because if people don't check their air, water, oil level, etc., they'd be hurting. If California did something like this it would definitely give people jobs and I'm all for that. The only problem would be if dealers raised their prices to pay for labor.
The previous reviewer noted driving a Prius on Maui. Oh, just the thought of that.... When I was in Central Oregon (city of Bend), my trips between golf courses yielded me over 50 mpg!! The terrain is high desert and basically flat or else Oregon adds a little something special in its fuel.
Thanks,
Rich
I do know what you mean, if they start slopping it down the side of your car. I would freak out. It just seems a good way to provide an alternative entry job to working at Burger King. I feel for young people trying to make it today. It is tough here in CA where the median house just hit $500,000.
I think having a Prius rental on Maui would be great. We were there in 1997 and rented a Mustang convertible...ooh la la!! The sights and especially the smells are wonderful. The roads that the rental companies don't want you to drive on are listed on the rental agreements and they even have road signs designating a road unsuitable for rental vehicles due to remote access, rough roads, etc. I did take the Mustang on a one-lane road that connected two cities and other than a few harrowing cliffs nearby, we got through and was able to see a lot of small villages (hamlets?) and gorgeous scenery.
Can you imagine the questions and problems "outsiders" may experience trying to negotiate a Prius? I know it's not difficult to drive a Prius, but you have to admit, it takes a few months to fully appreciate and utilize all that the Prius has to offer.
Thanks,
Rich
HCH - 91 Points: "It's a Honda... Driving is always fun in Hondas" etc.
Prius - 90: "This is a spaceship, a purposeful thrust into Futureland where saving fuel is Job One. ... The Prius is as much a promise as it is a car."
Jetta TDi - 78: "Bland is bad in cars. Diesels don't know how to be bland. ... A few of us really get off on them. It's not explainable."
ECHO - 3: "This is Metamucil for the road--you'll go, and you'll be glad when it's over."
Rear Leg Room
Crown Vic 39.6
Prius 38.6
Camry 37.8
Accord 36.8
Mazda 6 36.5
For a Cross Country Trip with 4 people, explain to me again how the rear seat passengers are going to be more comfortable in the "Mid Size" Cam/Cord/6?
Luggage Capacity
Crown Vic 20.6
Camry 16.7
Prius 16.1
Mazda 6 15.2
Accord 14
Oooh, those Mid Size Accord buyers are all set to load up those suitcases."
How about a CR-V
Rear leg room = 39 inches
Cargo = 33 Cu Ft.
If desired, the rear seats can be slid foward to create a 36" rear leg room and about 40 Cu Ft of storage. Oh, and the rear seats also recline (don't know if the Prius has this option).
Also, what you fail to mention is that the Prius uses more vertical storage than other vehicles, which means it has less floor space (square footage).
Of course, the CR-V is one of those hated "SUVs"... though it probably gets about the same MPG as a Crown Vic (I get 27 MPG highway).
The rear seats of the Prius do not recline. But you don't really want to compare the options list of the CR-V vs. the Prius, do you? ;-)
Are you seriously suggesting that the Ride Quality of a CR-V is comparable to a Crown Vic? Or even any of the other Sedans compared? The comparison was about Comfort as well as Space.
If you have that many extra kidneys to spare, I'm sure there are some folks out there that would be happy to hear from you.
If you want space your CR-V can't hold a candle to a Scion XB or Element, but I wouldn't want to go cross country in either of them, even though they get decent mileage.
And, for the record, the Prius also has some serious length, as well as height. The Front Passenger Seat folds down flush, so you can carry a stack of 8' 2x4s with the hatch closed. I can't be 100% sure, but I have a strong suspicion the CR-V would fail that test.
I take it you have never gone cross country in a CR-V. It is quite comfortable. It is not a Crown Vic, and isn't supposed to be, but it is very good on a long haul. I have driven it for 11 hours straight (except for pit stops, that is).
"If you want space your CR-V can't hold a candle to a Scion XB or Element, but I wouldn't want to go cross country in either of them, even though they get decent mileage."
Can't speak to the Scion XB, but the CR-V has more capacity than the Element. I cross shopped them.
"And, for the record, the Prius also has some serious length, as well as height. The Front Passenger Seat folds down flush, so you can carry a stack of 8' 2x4s with the hatch closed. I can't be 100% sure, but I have a strong suspicion the CR-V would fail that test."
Never tried it myself, but I suspect CR-V could handle that... or open the hatch glass, which is separate from the rear door. But we were referring to 4 passengers and luggage...
Actually, you can carry 10' 2x4s. I have photos to prove it!
(Hint: you gain that extra length by laying them on the dashboard.)
JOHN