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Comments
But to me it not nearly as bad as PAX. If it breaks anybody should be able to fix it. Even if it gets stuck at 3 cyl and ANS fails you can still drive it as long as you have to (unlike PAX).
So in short I would rather not have VCM, but it would not stop me from buying if it is there.
If 8 passenger in leather is not an absolute requirement go for the Sienna (stupid that Toyota advertises 8 passengers when in fact it's not available in 95% of the vehicle it sells). If you really want a Honda wait until February (05) and I bet $1000 discounts (or more) will the norm at least up north.
The new Odyssey is essentially the old Odyssey with Sienna extras and a new skin. The 04 floor mats fit perfectly in the 05! The driver and passenger space of the Sienna is better. The stereo in the Odyssey is crap. Odyssey mileage is good for a minivan (low 20's).
I plan on ordering a Touring next week (I have an '02 EX-L), and although I looked at the Sienna, I never actually drove one. Some of your comment make me wanting to find more:
- In what ways would you consider the driver and passenger space on the Sienna better?
- Stereo: the '02 was pretty weak. I listened to '05 EX-L Stereo and was not that impressed. I noticed even in the Touring you get 6 speakers + sub, while the Sienna can get 10... Did you have an Ody before? Are you happy with the improvement in your '05?
Thanks.
While neither one is perfect, both vans are great. IMHO, they are the top two minivans in the market. B/w the two the top pick depends on a number of factors such as (i) trim level (ii) timing of purchase, and (iii) your flexibility wrt availability/features/color, etc.
For the two lower trims I think Sienna offers more bang for the buck whereas for higher trims (XLE/EX-L and higher)Odyssey would be my choice.
Regarding the timing, it is widely accepted that '05 Odyssey is hotter than '04 Sienna. In fact, you have a great leverage in that '05 Siennas are already out and I would think dealers would be more willing to deal on '04s.
If you can settle for something that is already on the lot both vehicles can offer additonal advantage over the ones the dealer would have to order or search for.
Does the slate green have greenish hue in direct sunlight as the granite green did?
did not go together. The Sage Brush was more like a dark grey. Beautiful by itself. It may go better with an ivory interior. But certainly not green, again IMHO. We went ready to order the Sage with Olive combo, but now want to see the Slate also to make sure that it looks like the dark silver like they show in the Ody brochure or if it more green. Otherwise it is silver with black for us :-)
Contrary to message 1335, the new Odyssey is not essentially the old Odyssey with a new skin. As MotorWeek points out, it is a brand new design using a new platform.
I caught two mistakes on the MotorWeek program. One, it showed the ECO light when talking about VCM. As a person previously pointed out and the owner's DVD says, the ECO light comes on to show economical operation of the engine whether or not VCM is operational. Two, the person demonstrating the operation of the third seat used the release latch to pull the seat into the well, which the owner's manual says not to do because the latch is not designed to do this and could break. I wonder how many broken latches Honda will be asked to repair under warranty?
Think you need to take it easy and read the article again as you failed to understand the issue of the posting...it has to do about VALUE.
Thank you Honda for keeping things simple. When all you have to do is pick the color of a 2005 Honda Odyssey EX costing $28,510, while on the Toyota Sienna XLE costing $29,025, here what you have to consider:
13 different option packages which are expensive (one of them actually costing $8,555) and brings the Sienna to a total grand price of $38,145.
Just look on this site at the comparison of the two vehicles and the demand is accurately reflected in the TMV (What Others Are Paying). The Honda Odyssey is selling at MSRP, but the Toyota Sienna is well below MSRP.
If you need further consideration of value, simply refer to Intellichoice or ConsumerGuide to note who get the best value rating...once again, the benchmark of minivans...the 2005 Honda Odyssey.
The Honda Odyssey receives the highest ranking, while Toyota Sienna receives "recommended" rating as it is on par, but may lack refinement, have a high price, or appeal to limited audiences.
The new Odyssey is not just a makeover. It's a giant new effort that takes the humble minivan to a whole new level. A new level of ''sophistication, refinement and innovation,'' that is. Just like they promised, the 2005 Honda Odyssey delivers on all counts!
http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/new/reviews/full/index.cfm/id/- 38134
The article states that the Odyssey's navigation system has "real time traffic alerts" when in fact it doesn't. The Acura RL has it, but not the Honda Odyssey.
http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/new/reviews/full/index.cfm/id/- 38134
It's not the number of speakers that the problem. The speakers are crap! I took one of the rear ones out while installing the rear sun shade and it has a magnet the size of a silver dollar and the frame is plastic. Got replacement speaker on the way. Hopefully the head unit is half decent since changing it out is probably too complicated (it's integrated with the DVD). Never had a minivan before (Passat wagon and Accord), but I did test drive the 04 Odyssey and Sienna. The harshness and noise in the 05 is more than I expected on rough pavement (otherwise it's quiet).
My suggestion is drive the Sienna and see what kind of discount you can get.
Overall I'm happy with the vehicle.
For the record Honda and Toyota are marketing much like BMW and Mercedes...no not Luxo barges or GT cars. Rather each caters to a slightly different customer base. The reason that they differ is because the wants and needs of their target customers are slightly different. 05 Ody is not "killing Sienna" because the market niche they are selling into is dominated by Chrysler. Rather than taking absolute sales from each other the net loser is Chrysler. Both companies are likely to sell out all they had planned for this year. Interestingly in some locations both Honda and Toyota are on the same block and are successful.
Let's get back to the 05 Ody and its issues like PAX and voice navi...etc..
Actually, I read in a trade journal that the T&C and Caravan "stow n go" seats are so popular that Chrysler is having to convert a factory that was not producing models with the seats to keep up with demand. They are actually selling more vans than they projected. My guess is that vans in general are taking a bite out of SUV sales. Can you say $2 per gallon? Oh, and there is the Ford minivan that's doing terribly.
Sorry if some of them are too dark
hope you all like them
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Ill try yo take more later on....
If you have no button to push: What is if you're just talking to your wife/friend? Does the NAV respond to questions you never asked??
I hate all those voice recognition systems by phone. For example, I have a Bank of America credit card, and whenever I call for any info I have to 'talk' to the machine. Whenever I am in a noisy environment (people talking, cars blowing the horns, etc...) I get a message "I'm sorry, I didn't get your answer, please select again"... blah blah blah...
I hope the NAV in the Ody don't respond this way.
If you DO have to push any buttons: is it before each command? Or how often?
Somebody please explain, I never dealt with a 'voice recognition' NAV - just with portable (aftermarkets).
Thank you all.
I drove both a Touring model and the EX-L RES that I ended up buying. I didn't notice anything "better" about the "ride/comfort" of the Touring over the EX-L, so you can factor that into how you feel about the comparison with your '02. To me the '05 ride is significantly better than my friend's '03 model, which I presume is just like your '02.
I didn't notice any significant torque steer problem, but I'm also used to driving FWD vehicles, which could account for that?
For my money, the Touring isn't worth the extra $$, unless $$ is no issue. Lastly, the lack of a telescoping steering wheel is somewhat annoying to me, but my wife didn't care.
Good luck.
I agree 100%!
I think that was absolutely stupid of Honda!
They should have included a POWERED telescopic steering wheel, not a powered pedal! Stupid!
I also think the deletion of the PlusOne seating or at least the seatbelt for it was stupid.
Why not EASILY give consumers an option to BUY the PlusOne seat if they didn't care for the console? Was that TOO DIFFICULT? Stupid!
The adjustable does little for them.
Very interesting. So the EX-L gets the same exact NAV+RES, but also gets a more comfortable ride and the PlusOne seating and saves $4K!!!!!
Yeah, I think I would go with the EX-L w/NAV+RES now.
Okay, well, I take back what I said then:-)
Are there are quality issues or marketing reasons?
I can't believe that Honda would artificially limit production in this market climate, thereby costing them money. remember, Honda makes the same on every van sold. Only the dealer makes extra if they can inflate the sales price.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
"Mainstream minivan buyers might be turned off by Odyssey's firm ride, budget-minded interior materials, and daunting array of buttons and switches." They talk about Ody in general here, not just Touring.
I personally like the interior and many buttons, but I was always concerned about (long) ride quality. I hope some publication would be able to compare ride quality between Sienna and Ody. I do not care which corners best, but which leaves you less tired after a long drive?
Maybe my information is incorrect. I just heard it from few dealers...
There are 2 truths in life:
A dealer will always say don't believe everything you read on the internet.
The internet will always say don't believe everything a dealer tells you.
Hey! Has ANYONE paid $500 for a PAX tire???
Anyone?, Anyone?.. Bufford?, Bufford?...
There's enough vans out there now to validate this myth...
If you are using a temp tire there is no wheel sensor, thus no input to the control unit. So the computer won't say "you drove too much with zero pressure". You just won't read tire pressure for that wheel on the MID.
That concludes our lesson plan for the day
Steve, Host
Did you think at all before you posted about the spare? Makes no sense. Sensor is almost definetly analog. Probably a resistor of some sort. Once you put a spare, nothing will be between contacts so you'll get a infinite resistance and computer will read that pressure is "below required". In any case from safety point of view the only reasonably design is to indicate a low/no pressure if electric circuit is broken, which is exactly what would happen if you put a regular spare.
I wonder if Ody can tow this and few spare tires :-) Then there would be no problem with PAX.
Previously tested the Touring with no DVD/NAV.
Todays tester was the model we want (except color). The seats are all comfortable. The navigation will be great to have. With this amazing tool you can control just about everything with voice activation: climate (front, rear), radio stations, it really is impressive. Like another poster here, I feel strange giving voice commands, but I could get used to this. You can also use the touch screen instead.
There are a few things I am not crazy about:
Stereo/speakers are poor
Why no TPMS? 05 Pilots have it!
BUT, it's not enough to make me not purchase. Overall, it's very nice!!
Most people see it as an Acura system. Go to Acura web site click on RL and then on "Comfort and Convenience". Among it's many futures: "It also introduces North America's first real-time traffic feature that brings you traffic, accident and construction updates, weather issues and any other information that's pertinent to your journey in select metropolitan areas."
From what I heard this technology is still very young and NAV for instance does not try to navigate around jams.
Ody does not have this.
Now it's time for a new van. It appears that Honda has addressed the interior issue, maybe the stereo (if you buy the touring w/subwoofer?) and perhaps the noise issue although there are reports of excessive wind noise. I guess I can live without the load leveling, however I ocassionally tow a small trailer so a tow package might ne nice if one is available on the honda. (?)
Anyone had a chance to compare the two?
WVK
If the wheel sensor is missing you will get a TPMS light on the MID indicating there is no sensor.. But your argument sounds intelligent.
aka: yea, I thought about it before I posted...
I would imagine that as soon as you get that light, van system will assume that tire pressure is too low? Usually safety systems are designed to assume that situation is unsafe (in this case means pressure is too low) unless proven otherwise. Since there is no sensor, system can't prove that pressure is ok, thus it must assume that the pressure is too low. If that's so then you only get 120 miles to find a nearest Honda dealer or more likely a place where you van can be towed to the Honda.
Another way to look at this problem is like this. I've read in number of places that Honda explicitly states that you can not put regular wheels/tires on US Ody Touring. Why would they do it? Is suspension going to be damaged? Whatever the reason this is probably the same reason why you can not use regular spare.
Is it true that there is not any dealership willing to negotiate the price of this van? Anyway to get the dealer to negotiate? Any advice? I think I should also look at a Sienna. What do you think? Thank you.
I found a dealer outside Dallas that offered me $1050.00 off MSRP.Will keep you guys updated