'65 Imperial price is market correct for an undinged car, so we'd have to see that "ding"...if chrome is damaged badly that could be tough to find.
'76 Olds --I'd say your use of the word "priced too high" is very kind...more like 2.5 Xs real value is more like it. He'll be buying that car a birthday cake very year at that selling price.
but I like that '76 Olds 98. When it comes to these big mastodons I think the '75-76 Electra is still my favorite, but this still has a clean, handsome look to it. Now was the 98 Regency the top model, or did they have something higher, like a Regency Brougham or something? I know Oldsmobile liked to tack on long names back then. So about $2500 or so would be the going price for one of these, even in really nice condition?
Well as I've probably mentioned before, the value of a car has nothing to do with its "merit" or looks or anything else. It's a supply and demand equation. There are more of them for sale than people that want them, so the price goes down until people start "biting".
Think of pricing like a pyramid. At the very top or point is the highest price and you can see that there's very little room up there in the pyramid penthouse (few buyers can fit into it).
As you lower the price, there is more room for more buyers to jump in.
For this '76 Olds, the seller has set the price right at the tippy top of the pyramid and he's not going to get many people in there.
For a more popular old car, like a Hemi Cuda', even they have pyramids, but the tip of the price point is wayyyyy higher of course.
Look at it another way...1976 is when most collectors have already lost interest in the cars of this time period...the Dark Ages are from about 1974--1980 something.
You have to price cars in this time period realistically because supply currently outstrips demand.
This is true for a Pontiac a Porsche or a Ferrari.
I was thinking like $3500 for that Olds, if it really is pristine, with fairly steep deductions for any defects
"The value of a car has nothing to do with its "merit" or looks or anything else"
Aint that the truth. But hey, an imperfect market keeps many interesting and cool cars affordable (fintails for example), so maybe it's not a bad thing. You can have fun on a budget.
with $3500 for that Olds, presuming it really is nice. Oh yeah, I dug out my Consumer Guide old car book, and it looks like the Regency was the top line 98. The lower-line model was just "Ninety-Eight". If I ever do get a big boat from the 70's though, I think the one I really want is a '75 LeSabre convertible.
Even with most of the old cars I've had, I've actually missed most of the excesses of the '70's. I've had a '69 Bonneville on one end, and two '79 full-sized Chryslers on the other, but the only vehicle I've had from the era of peak excess is my '76 LeMans, and it's a mere dinghy compared to some of those loveboats from the era! The Bonneville could actually carry itself well, and the two Chryslers were beefed up, and so was the LeMans, so I've never really had the pleasure of experiencing one of those truly big boats in all of their wallowing glory.
....who, if I'm not mistaken, already has two of those babies. Anyway, looks pretty nice for $4000, though I wouldn't want to have to park or buy gas for it here in Chicago.
Interesting that is has a console and bucket seats, I'd almost call it sporty if it weren't for the column shift, and, oh yeah, the dimensions.
but I'm not as fanatical over them as my buddy is. Now that I think back on it, I drove one of his Mark V's a couple years ago, when he first brought it home. I never thought I'd hear myself say this, but it's just too damn big! :P My '79 NYer feels downright puny in comparison. It definitely has some kick to it, though. Not really that fast from, say, 0-60, but passing power or, say, if you're coming onto a highway on-ramp at around 50-60 and then punch it to merge...well it's actually kind of frightening to have something that big, heavy, and weighted down actually throw you back in your seat as it hurtles forward, with about as much of a sense of control and precision as those old WW2 German V-2 rockets!
They're actually pretty comfy inside, too. The seats are low to the floor, and there's not an abundance of headroom, but there's plenty of room to stretch my legs out. Basically, it's a car that you drive in a reclined position, something like piloting your livingroom around while relaxing in one of those old 70's overstuffed Lay-Z-Boy recliners. After riding in the back seat a couple times though, I learned first-hand how people used to get car-sick in those old boats.
....I like just about all '60s Pontiacs, and the '61s are about the cleanest. This is a good restoration candidate, though it's not 'loaded', or ' special' (no four-speed or tri-power) and the color is kinda so-so for a convertible. How much are these worth restored? Is this a fair price for a car that needs basically 'everything'?
I don't think anybody remembers this cartoon, but there was a show called "Goof Troop" with Goofy and his son. Goofy's neighbor Pete drove one of those Continental Mark IVs.
IIRC, on "Beavis and Butthead Do America", the bad guy was driving a Mark IV. Or, considering the detail of the artwork, a semi-reasonable facsimile of one!
let's see, not a very loved style to start with, right? And I assume it isn't some ultra rare HO 421 race car from the factory. So, body needs work and "bad frame"? Run screaming.
How many cars with a bad frame (actually, so bad that they would note it in the ad, vs. the usualy ignore it and figure the buyer won't notice) are worth taking on as a project? I just don't see any upside on that one.
What a shame! I'd be desperately afraid of a convertible with a bad frame. The only solution I could think of outside of getting a convertible in better condition is finding a junked hardtop or a convertible in worse shape but a good frame, detaching the body, and slinging the good frame underneath.
1961 is probably my favorite year for Pontiacs of the '60's. However, the part about the "bad frame" bothers me. And there's just too much rust in general. I guess you might be able to salvage some of the interior, glass, maybe some mechanical/suspension parts?
That actually is a pretty valuable car. NADA lists a "high retail" of around $47,000 (I spec'd it with a/c and the 303 hp 389 V-8). In comparison, they list a "high retail" of my '67 at around $17,000. I'm sure that both of those prices are a bit optimistic though, and if someone offered me $17K for mine it'd be sold in a heartbeat!
Still, I'm sure that this particular '61 is strictly a parts car.
That 50K Pontiac would have to be a literal #1 car, a 98+ point show car that is not driven. Either that or an exceptional #2+ car with provocative history. A lot of people with "perfect" cars have #2 cars.
Shame that one is rusty, those aren't bad looking cars, and a 61 convert has to be rare, I can't recall the last one I saw.
...doesn't seem like too much a bargain at $3500 considering the rusty frame; it's a shame, it would be a great restoration candidate otherwise, IMO. I don't think even a minty fresh example would fetch $47k, though, unless it had some special options or the aforementioned four-speed or tri-power. I could be way off, though. How difficult is it to repair a rusty frame on one of these, anyway?
Fin, that wagon is cool; were any sold in the U.S.?
They were sold in the US by specialty importers I believe....but literally by the handful, maybe a few dozen made it over. It's the holy grail of fintails, save for the rumored late W112 300SE 5 speeds that people talk about but can't find.
Shifty will puke at the price...but I believe it is legit. There is a very small and very obsessive Universal cult out there, mainly based in the Netherlands.
Nah, I never puke at prices for stand-up cars that are within conceivable limits, such as this wagon. It's the beaters posing as stand up cars or "slap-dash" restorations that are asking "stand up" prices. This car seems near flawless---in those cases you can throw the price guides out. But it's not the rarity that is driving this price, it is the condition of the car 90% the rarity 10% IMO. Rare + Rust = junkyard, same as always with a 60s Benz.
You can ask an exceptional price on any car, but only for an exceptional (as in once in a blue moon) price.
You watch, next week you'll see five beater MB wagons with 10,000 dollars reserve on eBay if this one sells.
Yeech. I can see that being a sharp car if restored, but I personally would not touch that one. It has been literally rotting for far too long. It would be a good parts car though. The interior looks to have some nice "treasures." It would have to be worth a whole heck of a lot once restored to be worth the effort. It was probably far easier to build the prototype of this car than it would be to rebuild this one.
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
Yeah, and the green Universal is a solid honest car - I've seen it in person many times. His reserve is at least 15K...I don't know how serious he is about selling it, rather than just wanting to test the market.
The Universal cult is pretty crazy, so I could see a real rusty beater bring a few grand at least.
A person is just flushing money down the toilet buying a rusty old Benz, except to snag a few parts off it. At best, he ends up buried up to twice the value and at worst he patches it up and foist it off on someone who doesn't know better. I just looked at a BMW 2002 like that for someone and saved them a lot of grief I think. Bondo, pop riveted sheet metal and lots of goopy undercoating.
If you could buy it for maybe $2000 or so, you might be able to come out ok. But I bet he has neglected the service. Maybe it needs a timing belt and a clutch; then you are in over your head.
...what would something unusual like an early-mid 1960s Mercedes ambulance fetch if the Universal is so revered? I remember Matchbox had a really cool replica of a M-B ambulance back in the day.
You are a brave man, swimming in this pool of interesting old Porsches.
The red 944 sounds like it might be OK if you get it at a good price. Of course, why is it in NC with Maryland plates?
The white one could go either way. You really need a very sharp 944 expert to look at it carefully. I bet the owner knows more about the extent of the problems then they are letting on.
The 911 looks real nice. WOnder why it was salvaged? That vintage is about my favorite 911 (I think it is what SHifty recommends too). But, for a car with a bad title and no records, it would have to be an awful cheap price (say, I'll give him 5K if it drive OK).
I would always be leery of jerky sellers like with that 944. There's something up, there.
That E320 is pretty beat considering most of those late series ones were pampered. I wouldn't pay a premium for it.
A fintail ambulance wouldn't be worth as much as Universal or even a Binz (the company that made most ambulances) wagon. Commercial vehicles are usually worth less. There were also fintail hearses...there's some freakshow value.
That dude must've smoked big boulders of crack! Why spend $30K on a Golf? I would've simply bought a better car in the first place! Heck, he could've got a nice W-8 Passat for that money!
I can't see a quarter (coincidentally, the starting bid) of the $30k in that GTI; OK, lots of mechanical parts, I guess, but nada in the body and certainly almost nothing in the interior (the duct tape on the door panels and stereo wires coming out the dash are nice touches, though). The real question is 'why'? Probably the worst case I've seen of someone thinking their modifications' parts and labor have equivalent resale value.
I think the description he gave WAS for his crack pipe. Carbon fiber,Polished heads and chrome tip. He may be better off selling piece by piece on Ebay, but who is gonna buy that wreck outright for 30k
kinda reminds me of the '53 DeSoto Firedome my Granddad had when I was a kid, which he sold right around my 16th birthday. I had my heart set on that car, but his rationale for getting rid of it was that he didn't want me driving around in some old car that I'd bring back to him to fix every time something broke. So, I ended up with my Mom's '80 Malibu which, you guessed it...I brought to him every time something broke! :P
I doubt a '54 Windsor would go for much, especially being a 4-door and having the flathead 6. If I were to take a wild guess, I'd say maybe $6-7,000 in like-new condition? And then there are only so many people lusting after something like that.
not to mentionthe fact that it is ugly with a capital U. 5500 is a nice price for a used Focus though. Sans modifications it would make a great commuter car or a car for a college bound person.
instead of doing all that crap to the basic little 2.0 engine, wouldn't they have been better off putting in the bigger, stronger 2.3 and working from there?
This seems like a good deal on an ML320. I know they had all kinds of issues when new, but I wonder how they do long term. Most of the ones on ebay have like new interiors regardless of mileage.
Yeah that Chrysler might be worth 7K in exceptional condition, and it will take more than 7K to bring it there, unless you can source cheap parts, do all the work yourself, and also do paint and interior work. The guy doesn't even say it runs...although I do like the idea of aquamarine tinted glass. There was light green tinted glass offered on fintails, although I have never seen it.
That ML is a gamble. It's a very early model, boy do they somehow seem spartan inside, and the bumpers are not flattering. They were indeed bug-filled, but I think they got sorted out over time. One sees a lot of them out there, so they must be at least OK.
'52 Chrysler plain jane 4-door Windsor really has no collector car value at all...it's just an old car, so you value it based on what is a 50 year hunk of iron worth? Price of $750 seems plenty as it sits. I'd guess a very clean survivor maybe $2,500 tops. Nobody wants these is the problem.
Now if it were the '52 Windsor Wagon, you could get some serious money for it, like fintail is talking about, but for this old 4-door....not likely IMO. I've seen too many of this era/type fail to bring a single bid at auction.
The description says "tires and wheels are scratched." Tires.... what tires?! There is a lot of wheel there, though! Yeech. The paint is pretty, but I could do without pretty much all the other "improvements."
The person seems realistic with way too big of a pocketbook. $5500 seems reasonable for this car if he finds someone who wants it with all those changes.
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
I'm guessing the reason that it's not driveable is that something got pushed just far enough to interfere with the suspension travel? Or maybe the exhaust got crimped to the point that it makes too much backpressure?
It really doesn't look like much damage, but on these tiny cars with no rear overhang, even the slightest bump can disable them.
Comments
'76 Olds --I'd say your use of the word "priced too high" is very kind...more like 2.5 Xs real value is more like it. He'll be buying that car a birthday cake very year at that selling price.
Think of pricing like a pyramid. At the very top or point is the highest price and you can see that there's very little room up there in the pyramid penthouse (few buyers can fit into it).
As you lower the price, there is more room for more buyers to jump in.
For this '76 Olds, the seller has set the price right at the tippy top of the pyramid and he's not going to get many people in there.
For a more popular old car, like a Hemi Cuda', even they have pyramids, but the tip of the price point is wayyyyy higher of course.
Look at it another way...1976 is when most collectors have already lost interest in the cars of this time period...the Dark Ages are from about 1974--1980 something.
You have to price cars in this time period realistically because supply currently outstrips demand.
This is true for a Pontiac a Porsche or a Ferrari.
"The value of a car has nothing to do with its "merit" or looks or anything else"
Aint that the truth. But hey, an imperfect market keeps many interesting and cool cars affordable (fintails for example), so maybe it's not a bad thing. You can have fun on a budget.
Even with most of the old cars I've had, I've actually missed most of the excesses of the '70's. I've had a '69 Bonneville on one end, and two '79 full-sized Chryslers on the other, but the only vehicle I've had from the era of peak excess is my '76 LeMans, and it's a mere dinghy compared to some of those loveboats from the era! The Bonneville could actually carry itself well, and the two Chryslers were beefed up, and so was the LeMans, so I've never really had the pleasure of experiencing one of those truly big boats in all of their wallowing glory.
Interesting that is has a console and bucket seats, I'd almost call it sporty if it weren't for the column shift, and, oh yeah, the dimensions.
They're actually pretty comfy inside, too. The seats are low to the floor, and there's not an abundance of headroom, but there's plenty of room to stretch my legs out. Basically, it's a car that you drive in a reclined position, something like piloting your livingroom around while relaxing in one of those old 70's overstuffed Lay-Z-Boy recliners. After riding in the back seat a couple times though, I learned first-hand how people used to get car-sick in those old boats.
http://chicago.craigslist.org/car/109412703.html
How many cars with a bad frame (actually, so bad that they would note it in the ad, vs. the usualy ignore it and figure the buyer won't notice) are worth taking on as a project? I just don't see any upside on that one.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
That actually is a pretty valuable car. NADA lists a "high retail" of around $47,000 (I spec'd it with a/c and the 303 hp 389 V-8). In comparison, they list a "high retail" of my '67 at around $17,000. I'm sure that both of those prices are a bit optimistic though, and if someone offered me $17K for mine it'd be sold in a heartbeat!
Still, I'm sure that this particular '61 is strictly a parts car.
then again, I can't understand why some people pay 100K+ for a '57 Chebbie, so what do I know?
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Shame that one is rusty, those aren't bad looking cars, and a 61 convert has to be rare, I can't recall the last one I saw.
My old MB specialist is testing the waters with his Universal once again. I was pretty sure the car is actually a 65 model
Fin, that wagon is cool; were any sold in the U.S.?
Shifty will puke at the price...but I believe it is legit. There is a very small and very obsessive Universal cult out there, mainly based in the Netherlands.
You can ask an exceptional price on any car, but only for an exceptional (as in once in a blue moon) price.
You watch, next week you'll see five beater MB wagons with 10,000 dollars reserve on eBay if this one sells.
The Universal cult is pretty crazy, so I could see a real rusty beater bring a few grand at least.
You can buy a REALLY nice one for $6,500. Just turn the key and go and look good, too.
0 bids? Why am I not surprised. My faith in common sense is renewed.
A Universal parts car still might bring out the nuts
If you could buy it for maybe $2000 or so, you might be able to come out ok. But I bet he has neglected the service. Maybe it needs a timing belt and a clutch; then you are in over your head.
This 944 is "turnkey" but it leaks oil, has a little body damage, needs some interior work, etc. I mainly included this one so you can all read the creepy comment and reply at the bottom. People typically post questions and answers so that other prospective buyers might get some useful information. Not this person.
$15K for a salvage SC with needs. No.
The red 944 sounds like it might be OK if you get it at a good price. Of course, why is it in NC with Maryland plates?
The white one could go either way. You really need a very sharp 944 expert to look at it carefully. I bet the owner knows more about the extent of the problems then they are letting on.
The 911 looks real nice. WOnder why it was salvaged? That vintage is about my favorite 911 (I think it is what SHifty recommends too). But, for a car with a bad title and no records, it would have to be an awful cheap price (say, I'll give him 5K if it drive OK).
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
That E320 is pretty beat considering most of those late series ones were pampered. I wouldn't pay a premium for it.
A fintail ambulance wouldn't be worth as much as Universal or even a Binz (the company that made most ambulances) wagon. Commercial vehicles are usually worth less. There were also fintail hearses...there's some freakshow value.
Where in the heck did the $30,000 go? Is it partly cash in the glovebox?
If you were a boy racer, would you rather have a 20 year old Golf or a 3 or 4 year old Vette for the same money? It's a tough call.
Carbon fiber,Polished heads and chrome tip. He may be better off selling piece by piece on Ebay, but who is gonna buy that wreck outright for 30k
I doubt a '54 Windsor would go for much, especially being a 4-door and having the flathead 6. If I were to take a wild guess, I'd say maybe $6-7,000 in like-new condition? And then there are only so many people lusting after something like that.
Clean one owner 280ZX. I kinda like this one.
Decent looking '63 Impala.
That ML is a gamble. It's a very early model, boy do they somehow seem spartan inside, and the bumpers are not flattering. They were indeed bug-filled, but I think they got sorted out over time. One sees a lot of them out there, so they must be at least OK.
Now if it were the '52 Windsor Wagon, you could get some serious money for it, like fintail is talking about, but for this old 4-door....not likely IMO. I've seen too many of this era/type fail to bring a single bid at auction.
Apparently he wants you to pay 10K or more for a 20-yr-old "modified" tin can. That's just too good of a deal to pass up!!!! :P
The person seems realistic with way too big of a pocketbook. $5500 seems reasonable for this car if he finds someone who wants it with all those changes.
It really doesn't look like much damage, but on these tiny cars with no rear overhang, even the slightest bump can disable them.