Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

xwesx

"As we move to our new facility we take one last look behind us and mourn these courageous Porsches who have sacrificed their parts and their lives for the good of the Porsche community."

LOL. I am not sure that this photo belonged there, but I thought it was great: a big pile of rusted, gutted Porsches..... :surprise:

michaellno

Well, at least the price seems reasonable

Craigslist seems to be an odd place to find one of these

Looks nice, but is it worth the money?

Overpriced in my opinion

lemmer

The Saab is about $1 too much. I've found what is clearly a better deal.

The Solstice dealer doesn't want to shell it for an Autotrader or eBay ad, but he isn't too shy about asking for the big bucks. There sure is a lot of these for sale considering they are reported to be sold out for the year with a waiting list for next year. I say hold for a year until you can buy one at invoice.

I like the Mustang - no idea on the value.

I agree with you about the Nova being overpriced. Is it really so hard to add one phrase about the engine? Is that 12-bolt rear end hooked up to a 454 with a blower, a V4 from a wrecked Saab Sonnet or what?

michaellno

Actually, I'm waiting for the Saturn SKY to roll out next spring and see what kind of prices they command. I've heard a starting MSRP of $25K or so, but I'm also guessing that they will come with standard equipment that is optional on the Solstice.

Mr_Shiftright

Those Jags are no deal IMHO...two money pits for the price of one, with the resale value of a used fire extinguisher.

Geez, just go out and buy the world's nicest 15 year old Jaguar for $3,500. People can't give these cars away.

gsemike

Wasn't there supposed to be a prohibition on dealers marking those cars up over MSRP? Just another example of the General shooting themselves in the foot AGAIN!!!

When you're rushing in to pay a 10K premium, glance over at the dozen left over 05 GTOs and remember that some schlubs paid 10k over sticker for them once as well.

Have a nice Thanksgiving everyone. Thanks for making some slow days at work go faster.

fintail

These seem to quickly be vanishing from the roads (I won't say whether or not that's a good thing)...not a project yet, but it's a survivor, which is odd to say about cars this age...it looks nice

bumpy

I see those FWD DeVilles around all the time. The coupes are fairly rare, but the sedans are thick on the ground.

andre1969

I don't see too many of the '85-88 models anymore, especially not in good condition. The '89-93's are still an occasional sight, though. My grandmother's cousin has an '89 Coupe DeVille that, at a quick glance, still looks almost new. Shiny paint, no rust, nothing falling off, etc. The inside hasn't aged so well, though. Headliner did the usual dropping thing, the armrests in the door panels cracked, carpet worn, etc...just the usual aging stuff. And it'll squeak and rattle a bit when you drive it, and doesn't exactly sound showroom new when she starts it up. Sounds better than her son's '00 or so Ranger, though. I hear that thing in the mornings when he starts it up, and it's enough to wake the dead! :surprise:

fintail

Yeah when I see those Caddys, they are either in very rotten condition, or they are parked out in a field somewhere. The coupes are a lot rarer.

This is unusual...but more of a "Dad car", and a little steep

This needs some better care, these cars aren't rare, but are a timeless design

Mr_Shiftright

I see a lot of these cars, especially in communities that have older retired people. These cars will run until something big breaks and then they'll be junked I'm afraid, as they have no real collector value and aren't likely to. Perhaps when there are so few left they might spike a little, like '54 Chevy sedans or like that....

fintail

Yeah I wasn't posting it as a real hot collectible, just something less frequently seen in decent condition anymore. Perhaps one for 80s nostalgia buffs who like mediocre at best cars.

Kinda neat in its own way, but I'd say the price is a bit optimistic

andre1969

old FWD 88s and LeSabres from the '80's, but the more expensive Electras, Ninety-Eights, and pre-1989 DeVilles seem pretty rare. I think part of the problem is that those more expensive cars peaked right around 1985-87, which was when the transmissions tended to be more troubleprone, while the later 80's models, which were more reliable, saw fewer sales. In addition to the tranny, the Caddy had the added "bonus" of that dreaded 4.1 aluminum V-8. The 4.5 from 1989 and later 4.9 were much more reliable.

I think the LeSabre coupe, which ran from 1986 until around 1989 was good looking. It was almost TOO sporty for a LeSabre, which might explain why it didn't sell too well. It looked really good in T-Type trim. Too bad Buick had to "grow up" in the 90's.

andre1969

a reasonable price to pay for something like this? For some reason I've always liked this roofline...you could tell that they were trying to conform to stricter rollover standards (which never materialized) yet still trying to keep it a true hardtop. first thing I'd do is ditch those wheels and put some conventional Buick mag-style rallys on it. Looks like it's not in bad shape though, except for the one rust spot. I'd hardly call it "professionally restored", though. :confuse:

bumpy

Styling was greatly improved by Grand National inspired black out trim, aluminum wheels and front and rear spoilers. The interior was improved by installing a console with shift lever, and front bucket seats. A Pontiac-style red-orange dash cluster was used to accent the t-type badges and other interior changes. Finally, the handling was greatly improved by installing a huge 1.25-inch sway bar in front and a .75-inch bar in the rear.

That sounds nice, but 8.5:1 compression, a 2.97 axle, and 150hp makes the LeSabre T-type a "wheater" car. Put some 20s on it, but don't make the mistake of taking on some kid with 'Type R' stickers on his Civic.

Mr_Shiftright

1975 LeSabre: -- If it's real "show quality", Pebble Beach, pristine, out of the box, like new, untouched, virgin, spotless----maybe $3,500 is top dollar. After that, you're on your own for ever recouping any money for it.

OH WAIT! It says "This professionally restored body only has one small spot of rust".

Retract former statements, we're down to $2,000 on that car and maybe less. GEESH---how can it be show quality and rusty at the same time? Some people....

OLD DATSUN PICKUP--- you know, if it's really sharp, he might get close to his price. These are extremely rare and are often purchased as "cutsy" trucks for 5 acre second home "ranches" to carry twigs around. More like $5,500 should be all the money, but it is a very rare piece...can't be more than a dozen of them alive in the USA.

ghulet

This is funny:

http://chicago.craigslist.org/car/113471097.html

Whoohoo, a non-functional, no-year-specified, V6 Peugeot 505 with the usual Euro-electrical maladies for only $1250? Where do I sign up? Never mind that sellers have trouble selling decent cars on craigslist for $1000. Yikes.

Mr_Shiftright

Well it has "rear traction" so that accounts for the extra cost :P

All in all, it sounds like about a $350 car to me. The "brake compressor" which I presume is the power brake booster---now that should cost about TWO arms and a leg, if you can even get one, and a cable driven sun roof should be a delight to repair with a quick trip to one of your local Peugeot dealers.

gsemike

If the man says that you can double your money on this, who are we to question?

Old Supra

Combo deal... maybe didn't anticipate where gas prices were going?

2 for 1 ridiculous price

Why would you pay $600 to do the guy the favor of pulling this out of the yard?

Call the junkyard

This looks beat to hell, maybe the "rare grey interior" makes it worth it

Abused special.... CALL NOW!!!

Mr_Shiftright

The idea is to sell your old car BEFORE it breaks down completely and is useless.....

Geez---looks like Long Island is turning into Appalachia.

well pretty soon I think there will be a big business selling 80s American cars as mobile studio apartments..you heard it here first...

fintail

I don't recall ever seeing an 810 coupe before...and it looks to be in reasonable condition

I know the car itself is beyond reasonable redemption, but the 5 speed must be unusual

ghulet

That Cressida is a lot like the one mom had when I was in high school. Good cars, though less room than the Camry we had before, the RWD is no fun in Illinois snow, and they're a bit thirsty. The 5-speed is fairly rare. Looks like it'd be an OK car for about half their asking price, given its so-so condition.

Mr_Shiftright

He also needs to look under the hood again if he thinks it's a V-6.

Risky car at those miles, and the price is silly with all the problems. Yeah, about $850 is fair enough, maybe even generous.

andre1969

from 1986 shows a pic of an 810 hardtop coupe. They gave the 810 a lot of praise, with the exception of cooling system problems in '77-78 and insufficient seat padding in those years. And they gripe about visibility because of the low seats and high beltline (sounds like a modern car, doesn't it!)

fintail

My uncle had an 810 wagon when I was quite young, in the early 80s. He still says it was a decent car, he mentioned it when I saw him at Thanksgiving and told him about my dad's $100 610. The coupes must be pretty rare. I think it says a lot about the cars that there's almost no vintage Japanese car movement, though.

Mr_Shiftright

A lot of it has to do with the fact that there is little heritage and little brand loyalty with Japanese cars. Buyers are "brand-hopping" all the time and really, most Japanese cars back then were pretty humble fare.

fintail

I suppose you could do worse for the money

Same here...I've always thought this 4 door HT was a nice clean design for a big car

Mr_Shiftright

A Corvair that doesn't leak oil? Now THIS I'd like to see....really. Might be okay for the money if it were really sharp and ran really well. I had this very car once and quite liked it until it got T-boned in San Francisco. You'd be wise to fix the rear suspension with a good thick rollbar however or you might end up upside down. Also you'll need to do something about the awful gearshift. But these things are certainly workable. Kinda cute and original paint, too.

66 Chevy-- they are pretty attractive but oh god so big and clumsy. 214 inches long and 3,700 lbs. That's a half foot longer than a Mercedes 560SEL and just shy of 18 ft.! Better if you lived in the New Mexico desert where you can park anywhere. Good cars though, very reliable.

andre1969

compared to some of the cars I've had, that '66 Impala would probably seem lithe and nimble! 214 inches? I didn't realize they had gotten that big by then. I think my '67 Catalina is only around 215" long, and it's on a 2" longer wheelbase (121 versus 119)

I think the longest car I ever had was my '69 Bonneville. 125" wheelbase, and 225" overall. And that was before 5-mph bumpers, so that 225" was all car! I wonder if the actual bodies of the '71-76 Bonneville were smaller, since even with those stick-out bumpers, I think they were only around 224".

lemmer

I can't imagine there is any good reason to buy this 944 unless it has a specific parts on it you need that are worth $500 to you.

Weird kit car.

fintail

Those curved dash replicas were popular during the late 50s IIRC

Mr_Shiftright

944: Hmmmm 4 bids after 4 days, highest bid $500 from somebody with 0 feedback. This auction is not going to end well. I don't know why anyone would want it either except a wrecking yard perhaps that specializes in Porsche parts and can afford to sit on it for a few years while they collect nickels and dimes for parts that are still good. I'd imagine all major components are pretty trashed but maybe not. This is the kind of car you have to see first.

1903 Olds -- might be interesting as it says its not one of those nasty lawn mower engines but a replica of the original one-cylinder. Badly advertised and described, This guy needs eBay lessons.

gsemike

Even for 500 bucks, how about washing it off?

Mr_Shiftright

I think that's as good as it gets :P

lemmer

911 that just needs some carb work to be a great car. Oh, and it has a little rust and a few other minor issues.

jrosasmc

You'd be interested to know that "Sports Car Magazine" has the 1978-83 911 SC as a top car to have between $10k and $20k. They specifically said that its 3.0-liter engine was "much more reliable than its 2.7-liter predecessor." (the one that liked to pull the head studs)

And I recall you saying that the 1974-77 911s are the least desirable of them all.

Mr_Shiftright

The car's junk...I wouldn't even put it on a lift for fear of bending it....really bad news, especially since it's a targa, which makes it structurally weaker to begin with.

I pity the fool who bids on this car. Too bad, a 1971 911T is a nice car---it's the "bottom of the line" with only 120 HP...a rather lazy engine, meant for "touring".

Seller obviously took a close look at what he had bought and freaked out. It's time to play "Pass the Problem" on eBay!

75-77: Yes, the 2.7 is prone to stud-pulling, premature valve guide wear and severe oil leaking, but all is correctable at the time you rebuild the engine (for a mere $10,000 or so). Best thing is to install a 3.0 engine and be done with all the issues on these cars.

fintail

Should this even be on CL?

Cheaper

aggie1995

I passed on the J30 with 180k miles.

He wanted $1500 for it, I offered $1200, he took it to CarMax to get an appraisal and they offered him $1700. He gave me the chance to match but I passed.

Now I'm looking for an LS400 or Q45.

lemmer

I think people who put cars like that on CL are just on fishing expeditions, like running an ad with a super high price proves the car is worth that much or something.

lemmer

My father-in-law had a tip on a '74 911. It was given to his buddy's shop to settle a bill or something.

It was made to look like an S, but it isn't one. The interior is perfect, the exterior looks perfect but apparently has "a little bit of rust in the rockers," runs great, the rest unknown.

I was told I could have it "for less than it is worth." I was just supposed to give a deposit sight unseen. Two other guys (customers of the shop) wanted it on those terms after seeing it. I just don't have the cojones to jump head first into something like that.

lemmer

Hemmings little sports car mag had a special on Japanese cars this month. They had a list of future collectible ones, most of them crazy.

Maxima 89-94 - no way
RX-7 79-84 - maybe, I would like to see it anyway
Subaru XT6 - are you kidding?
Subaru SVX - what does Shifty say about unloved new?
RX-7 93-96 - got something here
Infiniti Q45 - luxury beater
Celica 73-78 - doubt it
Supra 78-81 - I can't remember the last time I saw one

I wish I could remember them all. They had some major marketplace losers and average sedans in there.

lemko

That 1987 Buick LeSabre would make a nice companion to my recently acquired 1988 Park Avenue...NOT! My Park Ave is in exponentially better condition. I'll give him about $100 for it as a parts car. I see a lot of common pieces.

andre1969

those cool little Corolla SR-5 coupes weren't included. I liked the little '79-83 hardtops, and the RWD '84-87 or so models were cool, too, and especially the final ones, which I guess were around 1988-1992?

What about the 260/280/300ZX? Or is it understood that they're already collectible?

I also like the Datusn 200SX, the generation which ran from around 1980-1983. And the Plymouth Saporro/Dodge Challenger, which were around 1979-83. Mazda had a pretty little 626 hardtop from around then, too.

Of course, just because I like 'em, doesn't make 'em collectible! :P

FWIW, the 1989-1994 Maxima was my favorite, and the sportiest IMO. The 1995-1999 was about as exciting as a Buick to me. Well, okay, a Buick that handles and performs well, but stylewise it's the anti-sporty.

lemmer

There were more cars on the list, but I don't think any Corollas were on there.

I think the 240Z made it, but I don't think any later Z cars did. They referred to the 300ZX made during the time period of the 89-94 Maxima as the "bloated fat Elvis" 300ZX. If they are talking about the 90-96 version, I disagree. Heavy compared to an RX-7 TT, but not compared to much else.

The 240SX also made it.

I agree with you on the Maximas, but I doubt any of them will ever be worth significantly more than other used family sedans.

lemmer

SHO - don't see these much

stickguy

Haven't all the non-rusted out ones (all 3 of them) been turned into drift cars by now?

lemmer

Along with all the 240SXs I think.

stickguy

probably an expensive piece to keep alive, and just the problems mentioned will probably cost more to fix than the car is worth.

I thought that the original V6 cars were all sticks, and the AT came about with the V8 version, but I guess I am wrong.

martian

I'd like to learn more about this (unloved) mutt-it was quite an innovative design (fixed windows with cutouts-a good design? It seems to me you really don't need rolldown windows with A/C. The interior was also very nice 9suede leather), and good visibility. I did speak to one owner-he told me what sank the car was the weight 9too heavy for the 6 cylinder engine), and the high price tag. He also told me that the front axles ate wheel bearings on a regular basis. :lemon: