Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

Mr_Shiftright

Very coo, and VERY primitive. You could resurrect an auto mechanic from 1912 and he'd have no problem working on that car. Seriously.

fortee9er

The Avanti was designed by Lowey not Brooks Stevens.

ab348

Neat to look at. I suspect it is miserable to drive.

ab348

ab348 said:

I love this and who knows, it could prove to be a bargain. Likely not huge demand for cars like this.

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1940-la-salle-5027/

High bid was $35,000, did not meet reserve, no sale.

bhill2

Mr_Shiftright said:

Very coo, and VERY primitive. You could resurrect an auto mechanic from 1912 and he'd have no problem working on that car. Seriously.

I'm pretty Jeep-ignorant so I have to inquire; is that asking price realistic or delusional?

Mr_Shiftright

Seems fair enough--it doesn't look like any kind of top notch restoration or anything---just a driver, so it's in the ballpark.

Mr_Shiftright

ab348 said:

ab348 said:

I love this and who knows, it could prove to be a bargain. Likely not huge demand for cars like this.

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1940-la-salle-5027/

High bid was $35,000, did not meet reserve, no sale.

Seller probably wants his restoration costs back---good luck with that. Nice car, though. Bid might have been a little light.

qbrozen

Talk about wanting your cost back:
http://ebay.to/2kIkGfA

Had a $35k reserve and now is relisted with a BIN north of $30k. Previous high bid was $14.8k.

qbrozen

I have to admit I am somewhat intrigued by this:

http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/dealer/studebaker/silver_hawk/1891105.html

And a more original one with great color combo interior. But could you possibly get any further away for the pics??

http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/carsforsale/studebaker/gran_turismo/1907282.html

stickguy

I kinda like those Studes too. Not many domestics from those years I would say that about. The newer one looks better style wise, but it need different wheels at least.

fintail

I swear I have seen that Jeepster around here before.

uplanderguy

That black GT Hawk looks nice. A few authenticity things noticeable at first glance--reupholstered in non-factory colored inserts, aftermarket radio, wheels painted black instead of off-white, chevron installed on doors blue-white-red instead of red-white-blue. All minor stuff except upholstery of course. One thing I can't stand on some GT's, is when they don't have a tach, as this car doesn't. There is nothing at all on the right one-third of the driver's instrument panel!

That is a very low 1963 serial number. Mine was 1,700 cars higher and mine was built on September 28, 1962. I'd say that car was probably built in August or September 1962.

uplanderguy

I like that Silver Hawk; it looks great on those wheels and '58 was a down year for Studebaker so production numbers were down. I wish it still had the original engine. Studebaker V8's were very sturdy engines in general.

qbrozen

uplanderguy said:

I like that Silver Hawk; it looks great on those wheels and '58 was a down year for Studebaker so production numbers were down. I wish it still had the original engine. Studebaker V8's were very sturdy engines in general.

Yeah, but a chevy 350 and th400 combo is certainly no slouch in the reliability department.

uplanderguy

Yeah, I guess I'm a purist.

uplanderguy

fin was talking about the song "Telstar" earlier. I used to love to find oldies AM stations in my Studebakers, and listen to songs from the general time period. There was a PBS special from 1983 called "Studebaker: Less Than They Promised", mostly about the shutdown, and at the end they showed a '63 Lark Daytona convertible driving away while the record "I Can't Stop Loving You" by Ray Charles was playing. Perfect song from that time period and perfect for the TV show.

fintail

I generally listen to period correct music when I am in the fintail - not always, but there is an AM station here that plays older material - much of it not the typical top 10 oldies, and the fintail's radio was advanced enough to be able to accept an aux port at rear, so I can use mp3s. A friend of mine has called the car "Christine" because of the old music.

ab348

I don't mind "Telstar" but I can understand why some people dislike it - it is one of those tunes where a little seems to go a long way. I quite like the guitar break in the middle but the "waa-waa" of the organ or whatever the main electronic instrument is can irritate. Still, it is very evocative of the early to mid-60s.

Mr_Shiftright

qbrozen said:

Talk about wanting your cost back:
http://ebay.to/2kIkGfA

Had a $35k reserve and now is relisted with a BIN north of $30k. Previous high bid was $14.8k.

Resto-mods are a very tough sell. They are so personalized and "built to taste" that you have to find just the right buyer. And with all that power and the zoomie twin turbo setup, you'd really have to take the vehicle on a shake-down cruise to see how well sorted out it is. The thing could end up being basically undriveable.

An odd duck, to be sure.

qbrozen

I think the previous high bid was about right, personally. As you say, he better be prepared to buy it a birthday cake every year.

Mr_Shiftright

With skillful marketing, he might boost it a bit more, but breaking $20K is going to be a long row to hoe.

He would have been much better off building a pro tourer with modern brakes and suspension, IMO, very little exterior changes and a fuel-injected non-turbo 5.0 with a Tremec 5-speed....a nice build for touring, commuting, club outings.

stickguy

I would have been interested in one done that way Shifty. Not this monstrosity.

Mr_Shiftright

The more radical your build, the more narrow your buyer base. An exception to that might be some fantastic SEMA build done by a famous fabricator.

Even then I wonder. I was watching a Jay Leno's Garage episode and he featured a 65 Mustang, radically altered into a fastback with 1000 HP. The builder said he and his crew had 10,000 man hours into it, not including parts and materials. I seriously doubt he'd get back 1/4 of that effort.

stickguy

a 7 figure custom mustang? Good luck with that.

I assume a lot of those builds are really advertising efforts. Out there to generate buzz about what the builder can do. And quite possibly would be kept for display. And they know they will never get all their money back out of it.

Mr_Shiftright

I think you're right about that.

qbrozen

I know these are not much loved, but I dig them, and this seems pretty damned nice for $15k.

stickguy

Not my thing but that looks like a nice one. Couldn't restore a rat for that money.

sda

Its been a long time since I've seen a Sunbird with a V6 and a/c in good condition that hasn't been made into a hot rod with a V8 and big tires.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-Pontiac-Sunbird-Base-Coupe-2-Door-/162371156466?forcerrptr=true&hash=item25ce1339f2:g:wMcAAOSwo4pYeN54&item=162371156466

gsemike

sda said:

Its been a long time since I've seen a Sunbird with a V6 and a/c in good condition that hasn't been made into a hot rod with a V8 and big tires.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-Pontiac-Sunbird-Base-Coupe-2-Door-/162371156466?forcerrptr=true&hash=item25ce1339f2:g:wMcAAOSwo4pYeN54&item=162371156466

Certainly looks like a nicer car than a comparable Monza was. Curious what the real price is

Mr_Shiftright

gsemike said:

sda said:

Its been a long time since I've seen a Sunbird with a V6 and a/c in good condition that hasn't been made into a hot rod with a V8 and big tires.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-Pontiac-Sunbird-Base-Coupe-2-Door-/162371156466?forcerrptr=true&hash=item25ce1339f2:g:wMcAAOSwo4pYeN54&item=162371156466

Certainly looks like a nicer car than a comparable Monza was. Curious what the real price is

It's getting close to top dollar...seller might squeeze out $2100--2300 ?? Not sure why he hasn't dropped his reserve this late in the bidding---that would be a good idea.

Mr_Shiftright

qbrozen said:

I know these are not much loved, but I dig them, and this seems pretty damned nice for $15k.

It should be worth about $20K--$21K if it's as nice as it looks all around.

gsemike

Mr_Shiftright said:

gsemike said:

sda said:

Its been a long time since I've seen a Sunbird with a V6 and a/c in good condition that hasn't been made into a hot rod with a V8 and big tires.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-Pontiac-Sunbird-Base-Coupe-2-Door-/162371156466?forcerrptr=true&hash=item25ce1339f2:g:wMcAAOSwo4pYeN54&item=162371156466

Certainly looks like a nicer car than a comparable Monza was. Curious what the real price is

It's getting close to top dollar...seller might squeeze out $2100--2300 ?? Not sure why he hasn't dropped his reserve this late in the bidding---that would be a good idea.

Sometimes people get this idea in their head that rare/unusual = desirable and get their hopes up

sda

Back in '83 I got (on paper at least) $2500 for my '76 Sunbird V6, 5sp, a/c with 83K when I bought an '80 Mazda 626 coupe. Kind of sad it isn't worth more...I know it is a glorified Vega. There they are side by side. My first real car payment, $106 mo for 24 mos.

qbrozen

Mr_Shiftright said:

qbrozen said:

I know these are not much loved, but I dig them, and this seems pretty damned nice for $15k.

It should be worth about $20K--$21K if it's as nice as it looks all around.

too bad I'm not ready to make a move. Still have a battle with my renter I am waging. Sigh.

ab348

Mr_Shiftright said:

Resto-mods are a very tough sell. They are so personalized and "built to taste" that you have to find just the right buyer.

Or as in this case, "Built to no taste".

fintail

Gobs of style for the money, but those tires are a bit much - they'd be more appropriate on a squarebird.

qbrozen said:

I know these are not much loved, but I dig them, and this seems pretty damned nice for $15k.

explorerx4

@qbrozen,
I only noticed this recently, but the headlights and grille on that gen T'bird look very similar to a Lincoln.
That is a nice looking example of that car.

qbrozen

Sold for $16k. Disappointed I had to miss out, BUT I showed it to the wife last night and she turned her nose up at it. Can't quite figure her design taste on cars.

uplanderguy

Really nice ad, lots of good photos, pretty color, but first thing I'd have to do is lose those '50's style whitewalls and aftermarket wire wheel covers.

Those cars seem to be a good collector car value in today's market, compared to what they were marketed against as new or slightly-used cars.

Sixties Thunderbirds always had beautiful interiors, but I'll never understand why Ford never put a floor shifter in the console.

Mr_Shiftright

I think it would have been awkward for the driver, given the sunken seats and tall console.

berri

Ford has also always seemed to be a very cost conscious company. One transmission and location shaves costs in manufacturing. I think Ford was also the D3 leader in the reduction of color choices and the black steering wheel on all trend we pretty much see today

Mr_Shiftright

I'm impression of the D3 in those times is that GM won out on styling, Chrysler won out on engineering, and Ford won out on price. Of course, exceptions apply.

ab348

Mr_Shiftright said:

I'm impression of the D3 in those times is that GM won out on styling, Chrysler won out on engineering, and Ford won out on price. Of course, exceptions apply.

Ford did "cheap car" better than anyone back then. I guess when you are selling a rebodied 1960 Falcon as a 1970 Maverick it is more understandable how they could price it at $1995. Man, those were real plain-Janes and no fun to drive at all.

uplanderguy

I remember going to look at the Maverick on April 1, 1969 with my dad. I had never seen a car without a glove compartment before, LOL.

berri

Personal opinion - ugly inside and out, while screaming not just cheap price, but cheap-o.

uplanderguy

I know I grew up on Chevys, but I think for looks at a low price, and value for the buck, it was hard to beat Novas of the same period as Mavericks, although I know they were somewhat more expensive.

I'm surprised they offered the four-cylinder in Novas as long as they did (1970). My Dad was a thrifty buyer, but even he walked away from a new Nova when he saw it was a four.

I know it's what you were used to, but I think GM had the best interiors then--door panels, instrument panels, shift quadrants in the dash as opposed to tacked onto the steering column, crank vent windows in the larger cars, etc.

berri

I think the Nova was popular for that reason and for some, because you could soup them up pretty easily as well. IIRC Mopar Dusters and Demons also competed with a Maverick. Sometimes I kind of feel that main purpose of Maverick was to move the buyer up once in the showroom.

sda

Even on the cheap cars, like the Vega and base Novas, GM integrated the AC vents into the top of the dash so it didn't look like an after thought,which made the interior look more upscale. AMC, Chrysler, Ford all had the ductwork and some times the controls attached to the bottom of the dash or as part of the map shelf.

ab348

No question that the cheap cars from all of the domestic makes felt really cheap in terms of interior materials and features, but I think GM's economies of scale back then based on their dominance in the market let them add little touches for next to nothing whereas for some of the other manufacturers those things added to the cost. I know a base Duster was no treat either. GM always was ahead on interiors in those days.

qbrozen

This pretty sharp. Good thing I like orange. Interesting that it has the smaller V8 but optional 4-barrel and 5-speed. What is the true value, though?

http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/dealer/studebaker/champ/1908408.html

Also found another t-bird. Not quite as nice looking as that ebay car. I really do prefer a light interior, too.

http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/dealer/ford/thunderbird/1877910.html