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Stories from the Sales Frontlines
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Hey, driver, remember when we could ride all day in a hard
suspension Jeep and not have to take backache medicine
the next day?
I'm only 38 for a couple of more months, but I can tell you that I could not see myself driving a 2011. It was just not a pleasant experience. The 2012 is much more comfortable to drive on road, while retaining the same awesome off road capability.
I don't plan to ever do ANY off roaring, so a Sahara would be my Jeep of choice. Not practical you say? Anybody else make a 4 door, 4WD, Convertible? Awesome ride! Have tons of fun with it.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
1.) new the top there is a Chicago police car with the wrong color light on top. It should be blue.
2.) About 2/3rds of the way down there is a red NYC police car with the number 54 on the hood. This is likely one of the cars used in the TV show "Car 54 Where Are You". The producers of the show had the cars they were using painted red so they wouldn't be confused with real police cars by the public during shooting, but they would appear like normal police cars on the black and white TV show.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
As many of you know, their fantastic six-in-line naturally aspirated engine is going away
Three days later I get the call "Sorry, no more wagon allotments for this year in entire country". So let's try Euro Delivery (the allotments do not apply). A few days later, another call "Sorry, production is already stopped, no 2011 wagon this year whatsoever". Mind you, my trade is already in their possession for more than a week, and wait for it... YES, they just sent a check to my bank and the bank cashed it yesterday
So now of course I want my old car back, but since the loan was at 0%, there is no way they can find one for me at that rate (16K payoff). But... Let's ask the bank, perhaps they will overturn the transaction. And they said they would. So papers sent and... nothing. Week, two, three, four. Well, it took the bank seven weeks or so to process the application and send money back :sick: . Almost two months!!! So the car is sitting on their lot (wan't release it until the status is cleared) and I'm driving a rental.
Meanwhile, the salesman learns, there will be 2012 wagon after all. Short line, limited colors (they of course cut away my first and second choices), but it will. The news comes of course just couple of days AFTER we sent the papers to the bank (we ain't stopping that now), plus the car will not be available until mid October (it is mid-July at that moment). Well, in that waiting I tell him, I picked up the car rental bill for the month, but I'm bleeding money here so help me. I'm not angry, and I understand it was not their fault the bank was dragging their feet, I'm just just asking to "share the pain". And they gave me a loaner until the money comes back (which would be over two weeks from that time). Nice 328 with most of same options I was about to order.
And finally, I made the order: as said, 328i wagon, manual, sports, convenience, premium, Nav (for 2012 when you get Nav and premium, they discount it extra $600 - which they didn't for 2011), roof rails. Deep Sea Blue on black leather and dark wood. Picking it up this Thursday in Munich. Probably last manual wagon sold in this country.
Price? Well, I can't say I was a supernegotiator. They gave me $1500 discount from the Euro price (took some away with their "dealer fee" - ahh, Florida car dealers). From what I know, Euro deliveries in Tampa Bay are not discounted as much as those purchases from the lot. Got 3.8% loan (no special offers yet, as official model launch is on Monday), not superlow, but OK (as: good enough). The issue is that US delivery will be around January, but the car has to be paid two weeks before the Munich delivery (now), so I was pretty much at dealer's mercy, as you wan't get a loan on your own for a car that has no title yet. I was walking it ready to hear rates of up to 5%.
It's done, flying to Munich on Tuesday. What's left is enjoy the trip, stay safe, then wait for the delivery. BTW, I'm also taking Performance Delivery, i.e. going to Spartanburg for one day of driving lessons. Yes, you can combine Euro and Performance Center deliveries...
BTW, still having my STI. Will put it on sale just before US pickup of the bimmer.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Wow, what a saga. I'm curious about your impressions of the STI. I really liked the wagon, which Suby has apparently dropped in 2012 in favor of the sedan.
I specifically was wondering about ride and noise since the previous model had a reputation for firmness bordering on corporal punishment as well as for the intrusion of lots of road/tire noise. I'm guessing that the BMW wagon will be more civilized, but still offer competitive pep and certainly seems like a more mature driver's car. I was seriously considering a used 08-09 in a year or two, but, at 54, may not appreciate the jostling. I'm also concerned that given its performance emphasis that a three or four year old one may have considerable hard miles.
Gogiboy
Comparing to the loaner 328i with sports pkg., STI is faster, more explosive, handles a tad better (especially on a ramp curve entrance), has a bit stiffer ride. Road noise is without comparison, interior quality and style is still from $20K Impreza with just a few upgrades. Same with conveniences: decent stereo (but not special), OK dashboard, but I had to get used to red gauges - it was bothering my eyes in first couple of weeks. When I bought it, it was one of those "once a lifetime" deals ($29K+taxes for $36K sticker plus 0% APR), but I knew it was a transition car to me. I would probably have stayed with it for another couple of years if that 328 wagon were still there.
The best feature of STI is a center console knob: I (Intelligent), S (Sport), and SS (Sports Sharp). Changes throttle response and engine mapping from a bit laggy (I) to absolutely scary (SS). When you launch on SS, you will likely smell clutch burning. Do not recommend doing it too often.
BTW, if you can wait until December/January, I just have one for you
2018 430i Gran Coupe
That is interesting! Used to love that show when I was a kid, forgot all about it.
You must be one of those people who can really spot things to notice the different colored light on top. I have a friend who does that especially with movies....if there is any inconsitency he will spot it. In one movie he watched a couple were driving south down the California coast and the ocean was on the passengers window....in another scene the couple is still going south but the ocean was on the drivers side.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Sounds beautiful, and you are really fortunate to get a 328 manual and a wagon. I heard the wagon would be phased out at least in North America because most people would go with an X1. It carries more, and actually costs less. North Americans are not big buyers of wagons...in Europe they are very common.
If you pick up a BMW in Germany you get about a 4% discount I think. The dealer can do their own discount separate. The discount covers the cost of the flight. In Canada, you get no extra discount, so we cancelled that idea.
But, what a thrill going through the plant, and driving away in your new car. Then using your new car to travel around Germany.
I wanted to go to Hamburg to see the Wunderland Miniature Railroad.
Wunderland Miniature Railroad
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
My future BIL had a 1967 Plymouth Fury Police Interceptor (39th pic in the series) with a 440cid engine that he bought at the auction. Even as beat as it was it could still do 130mph and smoke the tires until you were riding on the rims.
The things we did in that car still make me shake my head. :shades:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
That has to have the best resale value of any vehicle Chrysler makes. Old ones on Craigslist are going for crazy money even with 200K+ miles, frame rot or blown engines. I was reading an ad for one that seemed reasonably priced until I realized that it was just a frame without a body!
Congrats.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Also, Euro delivery has 7% discount on both invoice and MSRP (in US), but only for base version of each model. The options go for the same price (invoice and retail) as US delivery, e.g. if car is 40K+5K options (retail or invoice), the price is 37.2+5 (retail or invoice). So one can get an additional discount from the dealer, pretty much same way as in US delivery. The dealer may or may not be more willing to extend one - transaction is deferred, there are some other differences in way dealers are invoiced and compensated (bonuses, allotments, training fees, etc.).
Don't know how that would work in Canada.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Not very well, especially if I got it from dealer A, who don't give discounts at all.
BMW Canada offers no extra discount for European delivery. Cheap --------!
Unlike BMW USA, they don't realize the Europlan is a great marketing tool. People who go to the plant become even loyaler (if that is a word) followers of BMW.
You did well. The discount pays for at least your airfare if not more. And, it seems theyare giving you full value for your trade in. I know the dealers here would knock off a few $100 for every month I continued to use my trade-in, and the new car will take 4 to 6 weeks to get here once shipped.
Your plan is perfect!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2018 430i Gran Coupe
BMW had hoped that 5 wagon buyers would migrate to the 5GT. Instead they attracted 7 series owners who realized that they could save $20K and get into a 7 series based large car.
5 series wagon owners went away to the E class.
Its not that hard, Chicago Police only use blue Mars lights, that one had a red Mars light.
I have a friend who does that especially with movies....if there is any inconsitency he will spot it. In one movie he watched a couple were driving south down the California coast and the ocean was on the passengers window....in another scene the couple is still going south but the ocean was on the drivers side.
I can be like that at times. I remember on TV show where a scene was in the kitchen during breakfast. Every time they cut back to one of the characters the level of orange juice in his glass was different, sometime more sometime less.
It does come in handy at times. One time I started at a company and the first day I noticed the "exit" sign had the arrow pointing away from the exit and towards a window. It was like that for something like 5 or 6 years and no one noticed it before.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I know it sounds funny coming from me after doing a special order, but I also wouldn't have the patience/tolerance for uncertainty that dino had.
Dino, congratulations on the ride. Wagons are really cool (we had a Passat Wagon and liked it a lot.)
Get ready for your car to blend in Europe, but to stand out in the US.
The resale value is probably related to the fact that owners are pretty loyal and that they don't change it all that much :-)
I can't wait to get it.
I'm used to have different taste than most in many other aspects. I generally believe in deciding on the product first and then working on the deal, not the other way around. If I'm to spend over half of my annual pay, I want to get everything I want and nothing I don't.
Now, wagons and manuals are going away and there is nothing I can do about it. Sucks, but fact of life. This is probably my first and last special order - once there is no choice even in theory, then everything else is basically not as important.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Oh, how could you! :mad:
Sounds spectacular.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Interesting information. I don't see very many 5 Series wagons, so I really wondered why BMW offered them. Maybe they do better in well to do rural areas?
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
This year my 16 year old son son accompanied me (he played hooky from school). Among the high points:
My son owned the Texas Hold'em table on Casino Night.
Spaten Brewery was a major sponsor, and provided free beer every night. Lots of it.
I didn't kill my HPDE student, and vice versa. He's a friend who has driven with me on a couple of long distance rallies. He brought his turbocharged 1983 633 CSi. Wicked fast.
I trophied in the autocross(3rd.)
I drove an X6 M. VERY fast, VERY big. A real hoot, but not my cup of tea.
The low points:
Did not win a car in the club raffle.
One instructor totaled his 2003 M3 at the track. The SMG box shifted late- at the one spot on the track(Turn Four) where you DO NOT lift, shift or do any thing that upsets the balance of the car. It spit the car tail first into the Armco. The only injury was to the instructor's pride. Here is a video of an extremely similar Turn Four incident
Realized that the only new BMW's that I really like are the 1 Series. the M3 and the 1 Series M Coupe. The new M5 might be fun, but the current 5er is not a particularly appealing platform to build on. Perhaps the ///M engineers will fix the horribly numb steering. Right now the 5er is more Barcalounger than Bimmer...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
That was quite the turn.......at least it seems the car was OK.
Right now the 5er is more Barcalounger than Bimmer..
Just my experience, but that was my first impression, the 5 doesn't have the honest charm of a 3, I feel a little more isolated from the driving experience. However, for a long distance cruiser, and taking into account I am not getting any younger, I found the 5 really grew on me. The 5 feels like a very refined 3....but I would think the 3 is just more nimble on the track. Some reviews say the 5 has lost what a BMW is all about. I thought that at first, but I like that now.....I think someone in BMW marketing knows some of their customers are getting older, and want the essence of a BMW, in a more refined package.
That's just my impression.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
The $29K & 0% financing are a sweet deal.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Looked up STI just to see what it was. Came up with:
STI - Sexually Transmitted Infections - Sexual Health & STI - Public ...
I don't think that was what you had!
Looked under car STI and found it was a Suburu....thank goodness! :surprise:
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
They offered them because MB offered the E wagon and Audi offered the A6 wagon.
Sales were never very high. I typically see 1 or 2 a week here in Boston.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
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What you have to do to compete! I don't think I have ever seen an Audi A6 wagon!
They still do across the pond. They even have M/AMG/S6 estate (wagons) there.
Wagons are way more popular in Europe than they are in the USA. They hold as much as an SUV but are more practical, use less gas, are better handling. (I'll get grilled once again but here goes) In the USA, people love their SUVs, they like bigger cars and to be seated as high up as possible.
Just for the record, that is not criticism, just an observation. And I have read some articles that explain wagons are a hard sell in NA.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Oh the A6 Avant is definitely a unicorn, not a pink and green one, but a unicorn nonetheless.
You might have to throw Fezo out of the car first......................
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I just looked up a 2012 A6 Avant.....looks pretty nice...........
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Made my day!
Meanwhile, have been spending the last two days doing the NJ Lighthouse Challenge which involves trying to hit 16 points around the state (I think 11 are lighthouses, one is a replica of a lighthouse that fell into the ocean in 1927 and the rest are related museums). We didn't manage them all (yesterday it was me, my 10 year olds and their friend - today was me the ten year olds and my wife) but managed to climb (very slowly) half a dozen lighthouses. A couple were just like a crow's nest on top of a house but several were the real thing - including the third tallest in the country. I am feeling muscles I'd forgotten I had.
If I could do this sort of thing predictably I would not have had to retire. But for now I'll savor our share of accomplishment. Next year we'll skip climbing in order to try and hit all 16 sites.
It's pretty easy to give up the relative gains in fuel efficiency and more due to road damage. That's been my experience.
Once we went to Maine and I believe we saw what was the oldest lighthouse in America. I'll have to look that up.
It was right near a restaurant called "The Road kill Cafe". Does any of that sound familiar?
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
There is some truth in that. SUVs seem to survive better because of that ground clearance. They are also a little more protected from people opening their doors into the side of your car too. They are better protected in many ways.
I had SUVs and I didn't think I would get used to a car again, but I actually prefer a car now. I prefer the handling of a car, and now that you can get AWD that takes away one advantage SUVs have. I like the extra few miles per gallon I get in a car. SUVs are bigger and are heavier, and a lot of time you just don't use the extra space or weight.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I was all set to buy a 328xi wagon back in 2007. I looked it over side by side with an '07 X3 at the NY Auto Show & immediately crossed the wagon off my list. As many of you know, I ended up with a stellar lease deal on an '07 X3.
Back in 2009 I was going to use my $3500 Cash 4 Clunkers credit to buy my wife a '10 A4 Avant 2.0T to replace our leased X3 that we were majorly over the miles. I drove it & liked it, but the
cargo space just wasn't that impressive. I ended up buying a sedan (Acura TSX) with a huge trunk.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
I want a wagon, but want the back to be boxy. Like the good Volvo wagons. But now, too many are low in the back, sloped hatch, stuff like that. All of which eats into usable space.
SUVs do the same thing. A CX-7? Certainly swoopy, but no where near as roomy as it could be!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Careful, now! One of the main reasons we got our CX-7 was its looks. Didn't look like every other CUV on the road. Yeah, the rear styling restricts cargo space, but, unless you're hauling furniture like Richard or have a bunch of younger children and all their stuff, it's just fine.
Don't be hatin' on my ride.
They complain but would they actually buy it. I am a big fan of function, but when you start putting a big ugly back on a car, it just looks weird. Same with the Accord. If you need that much room just get an SUV, there are lots to choose from and they look fine.
I like this line from Edmunds:
It's called the "5 Series" GT, but actually uses many of the 7 Series chassis components and offers a cabin about as roomy as the flagship sedan. Unfortunately, the GT offers neither the luxurious ride of the 7 Series nor the 5 Series sedan's sharp handling.
I have read car reviews that say most people are better off getting a wagon, than an SUV, if you want to be practical. They say, the cargo space is about the same, and it is true, it is just SUVs seem bigger because they are higher off the ground.
This shows it.
X3 20 Cu Ft Trunk / 56 Cu FT Seats down
328i Wagon 12 Cu Ft Trunk / 60 Cu FT Seats down
5 GT 60 Cu FT Seats down
The only extra trunk room in a wagon or SUV is that small amount of room between the window line and the roof...not that much. They are handy though for carrying plants, TVs, furniture etc though at times.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Congrats on the car; sounds like a good off-roader.
It’s a good thing Mrs. j ain’t no red head and had views of ownership like your wife or there would have been some changes made in our house. When I got the Genny the only color that interested me was Cabernet Red Pearl. Since I’m spoiled and always get my way, I guess that means she would have had to change her color.
Have a good time with it when you get your hands on it.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Well, I don't think the new 5er is a bad car, it just doesn't give me that "gotta have it" vibe. As I said on another forum, it now looks like my next car will be used- either a Z4 M Coupe, a Cayman S, or a 1 Series M Coupe.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Congrats ‘dino’. It sounds like you put a lot of time into getting what you wanted, I’d never have the patience to do that. Because of the story you told that’s one of the reasons. It was all I could do to gear up to build a house when we moved to SC in ’92. In the end it was the best thing I could have done. The builder was fantastic to work with. Got everything I wanted and none of what I didn’t, just like you said about your car purchase; just had to be willing to do it.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Just for the record, that is not criticism, just an observation.
Man you’re getting paranoid, huh? Why would anyone flame you for that comment?
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I guess that means she would have had to change her color.
I bet it would match the color of her new dining room :P
Uh, because it has happened before! :P
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250