from what i've been told there are diff types of bankruptcies you can file for, and apparently this lady had filed for every single one of them! talk about someone who really didn't like paying her bills.
In these two instances I confronted him about it afterwards and we worked it out. He applogized and we were ok. There were a few other situations that came up and eventually he left the dealership because you just cannot make money as a F&I manager when more then half of the customers pay cash.
"I wouldn't accept the salesperson changing the price of the car after we agreed and I put down a deposit, I don't think the salesperson should accept a change in price from me."
I agree. I would not try to cheat someone else, but I am not surprised when someone tries to cheat me.
How's about stories from the Service Drive or Service Bay?
Interesting. I had been thinking along similar lines. I came up with "Customer Service: The good, the bad and the ugly" for a title but perhaps someone could come up with a more creative one.
I have a funny service drive story from years ago. A man brought in his car with a bad radio. Actually it was a am/fm/8track tape radio, all beaten up. He wanted it fixed under warranty.
After visiting with man, I discovered that it was his teen age sons car, and the 8 track tape got stuck, so dear old dad tried to get the tape out with a big screwdriver, was not having much luck, lost his temper, and screwdrivered the radio to death. After a few minutes, he started laughing, and decided warranty would not pay for radio, and he would buy another.
You should have seen the radio, he really did a number on it.
I think "Customer Service: ...?" as opposed to "Service Department: ...?" would provide a broader range of issues that could/would be discussed. E.g., when that trailer hitch you order from J.C. Whitney cracks and they refuse to give a refund because you had the audacity to actually install it!
But, hey, you folks can decide what focus you want! My comments are only suggestions.
tidester, host
Disclaimer to JCW: That was a hypothetical in no way suggestive of anything less than superb customer service on your part!
So we can get back on topic here I just went ahead and created Customer Service: The good, the bad and the ugly. We'll see how it goes and if we need to tweak the scope a bit we can do so later.
I'm expecting everyone to jump right in - and keep posting here too!
Hey all, how's about a little help. I'm in the market for a new car, what I'm looking for is good performance, reliable and some what fuel efficent. It will be used as a daily driver and I work 40 miles away over a twisting 2 lane highway over a mountain so handling is a must, so lets hear your suggestion's. Thanks
I'm partial to the Ford Focus Sedan as a commuter with safety pkg.
If you can get an 06 at the end of the month for about 5500-6000 off MSRP. (Canvas 10+ dealers by email) The SES or ST may handle well if you test drive it. For around 12k well optioned you can't beat it. Its worth about 10k in a year so at this price depreciation is good also.
A relative got a deal like this last year but with the gas prices they have become more popular. Still its worth a shot. For substantially more I would look at something else (but a comparable Civic is 18k min?-- Thats a lotta gas you can buy for the diff)
So, I've been to some dealers lately, toying with the idea of trading in my gas hog for one of several new under-$20K sedans. I am 25 years old but look younger, caucasian, and dress fairly decent (collared shirt, khaki pants or shorts, nice running shoes); just a normal young guy.
At some dealers, the salesmen disappear when they see me coming. If I get somebody to (reluctantly) talk to me, they ask basic questions about the trade (year/mileage) or what I am looking for and quickly blow me off. At one dealership where I had a referral, I walked in (right past a bunch of salesmen who looked the other way) and told the desk I wanted to speak to such-and-such. The manager said "Are you here just looking for your buddy? Or do you want to try and buy a car?" Why would he say that or even care?
I can only guess that for some reason they pre-qualify me as unable to buy. Maybe they think I am upside-down in my 2004 Explorer (I am not), that I don't have any credit (it is excellent), or that I don't have enough income (I have plenty).
I finally got one guy to treat me with respect when I told him right off the bat what my payoff was and what Carmax had appraised it for, what my equifax score was, and my income level. But is this really necessary? Do I have to put on dress shoes and a tie, and drive the wife's 04 Mustang up there just to look at cars?
What is so wrong to these guys about a young guy driving an SUV who comes in wanting to look closer at an entry-level midsize sedan, where they don't even want to give the time of day?
Thats according to the new BK laws. Previously there was no such limitation so you had a lot of serial filers
That has been in effect for years. That is one of the reasons why many dealerships are more than happy to deal with the bankrupt. They know that the debtors can't BK again for seven years.
well, i may be off here, but I'm GUESSING that dealerships are seeing ALOT of people bringing in their SUVs lately that they are horribly upside-down in, and they are just getting ... disgruntled? disenchanted? worn out?
That's just a guess, though. A theory, if you will. Maybe the salesfolk can chime in and confirm/deny.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Wow, what were the dealers that you went to? Usually if I sense any kind of stereotyping in the dealer I'd walk out right away.
Here's my experience... I am 24 and look much younger (as people told me) was in the market for a new Lexus about 4 months ago. First dealer I went to the salesman was totally unwilling to negotiate and shown no interest in talking to me (maybe he thought I wasn't a serious buyer). He told me the best he can do is 500 bucks off sticker and that's it. He asked me if I want to test drive but I declined, walked out the dealer in less than 15 min.
Went to the second dealer a couple days after, the salesman is really nice, also very professional. Test drove the cars then went straight to price. Without much negotiation we agreed on $1500 off and I put down the deposit. All done in less than 2 hours.
Although it's just my experience this shows that by stereotyping, a salesman might lose a business or two. Same goes with racial profiling as we discussed earlier.
Not defending the first dealership but many dealerships will not think you are a serious buyer unless you do a test drive. Some dealers have a standing policy that they will not even sell you a car without a test drive.
Did you start negotiating without even driving the car first? That always sends a warning flag up for me and although I would never treat a customer poorly because they did that I would use a different approach then normal.
The reason that I didn't test drive at the first dealer is because of the salesman's unfriendly attitude. As you can see I did test drive at the second dealer and negotiation was followed after that.
I am in a very similar demographic as yourself. A few months ago, I bought a Honda. I stopped by on a Tuesday evening to pick up a couple of brochures. I walked all the way in to the builing, past the sales tower, across the showroom to the wall of brochures without being approached. There was a receptionist seated next to the brochures. She did ask if she could help me. I told her I was there to pick up some info, and that she could page a salesperson for me if she would like.
A few seconds after she paged, a salesman came out and walked up to me. I could see the look of doubt in his eye as he spotted me from a few yards away - I am a young guy and was wearing jeans and a sweat shirt. We shook hands, and I said something like, "I am looking for an SUV for my wife and have narrowed it down to 2 different models. I know the Honda is geared differently than the other model we are considering, and would like to see how it performs at highway speeds compared to the other model. If my wife feels more comfortable behind the wheel of the Honda, we would actually prefer to buy the Honda provided we could work out a deal"
It seemed like once he saw that I had done some research, and was serious, he really lowered his guard. The only other question he asked me right then was if I had a trade - which I didn't. I then set up an appointment for my wife and I to come in the following Friday. He never asked me another "qualifying question" (what payment are you looking for, how's your credit, etc...), up until after my wife and I had gone back for our test drive appointment and actually sat down for the negotiations.
It was a very nice buying experience. Negotiations took 15 minutes, and we only discussed out the door pricing - payments were never mentioned. I already had my own financing arranged, but the F&I guy offered to try to beat my rate, and he did. I think we spent 2 hours there total, and that included test driving 2 cars - part of the time in heavy traffic, negotiations, F&I, and waiting while the car was detailed, gassed up, and presented to us.
Not defending the first dealership but many dealerships will not think you are a serious buyer unless you do a test drive
Then you have others complaining about people coming for a joyride and not being buyers (so-called strokes?). I guess there are some people there who would not talk to you even if you just brought a bag of cash and showed it to them, as long as you look different than their "usual customer".
What beats me in the story of Explorer guy is that he was not shopping for a luxury car - it was just a midsize sedan, for crying out loud! Low 20s or even high teens! And he came in a relatively new Explorer! Surely looks like a potential buyer to me - I just don't get it. At age of 20-something people already have jobs, or graduate college, may (or not) have a decent credit. Still not enough to get your rear out and at least shake hand, ask questions (to find out if the Explorer is his or his dadies), offer a test drive and see where it goes from there? :confuse:
...can only guess that for some reason they pre-qualify me as unable to buy. Maybe they think I am upside-down in my 2004 Explorer (I am not), that I don't have any credit (it is excellent), or that I don't have enough income (I have plenty).
These are all the things that make you a VERY GOOD customer and I'm sure you know that. Don't worry about the RESPECT thing, follow the advice of post #3015 and that of the other young buyers that have posted. The other young buyers got what they wanted and so will you.
Not to sound fatherly but this is just another lesson that you are learning as you go through life and this is an easy one.
Good luck,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
On the flipside, some dealerships will think you're just going for a "joy ride" if you cut straight to asking for a test run without talking numbers. And they're probably right to think so. I'm guilty of this more than once.
I like to have a little bit of foreplay, for lack of a better word, before we go out on a test drive.
Short walk around a vehicle in the showroom. Show the people some of the features on the inside of the car talk about the design some and why things are the way they are.
Talk about where various models start in price and what options are avaliable if any. What a typically equiped model has on it and how it is priced. Once all of that is done and I have the proper information from the customer, full name, phone number, address etc.
Then I will ask if they would like to do a test drive if they have not already.
We walk a fine line in the F&I office. The GSM is always pushing us for higher profits at all costs, but then saying not to lose any deals. It is getting increasingly difficult every time the banks raise their rates. 3 years ago I could get approvals at 2.94% with a 740 plus beacon and 90% finance. That rate today is 6.09%. The people I signed out 3 years ago loved me, now I'm an incompetent. I was making more off of people then than I am now.
I am now 35, but people think I am 25.. My wife is 31 but seriously looks 21.. We went into a Toyota dealer to test drive a Sienna XLE with our infant son, and the salesman who helped us was great, but at this particular dealership the sales manager called all the shots. He sized me up (I took a day off of work on a Friday and was wearing jeans and a short sleeve polo) and kept treating me like an idiot (I have purchased 11 cars in my life, I have been through this before) and kept mentioning that they have less expensive vans than the XLE, and did I drive one yet? I finally told him that I was putting 20K down was not interested in the "base model". The funny thing is, that he continued to talk down to me. At that point I grabbed my wife and child and left the dealership. We preceded to buy a Honda Odyssey..
This has happened to me quite a few times over the years.. Too bad for the salesman/dealer I guess... Some of these dealerships should make it mandatory that salesmen read the book "The Millionaire Next Door"...
"Not defending the first dealership but many dealerships will not think you are a serious buyer unless you do a test drive."
I think that is a big assumption by the salesman.. Perhaps the individual already test drove the car at another dealer. Maybe a friend or family member already owns said automobile and the buyer has already driven it. Or maybe they just looked and researched various car sites and decided on a particular vehicle based on its specs, reliability, safety features, or cost..
"Did you start negotiating without even driving the car first? That always sends a warning flag up for me"
Can't tell you how many times I negotiated on a particular vehicle because I had previously test driven it. If the salesman has any doubt he should always inquire whether the buyer has driven one previously or would he like to test drive one now?
British, your post reminded me of a time several years ago when a friend and I were waiting with our then girlfriends to be seated at a busy restaurant. There was a Land Rover dealer right up the road, so my buddy and I walked over to kill some time.
I have to say that was one of the best experiences I've ever had at a dealer, and we weren't even there to seriously look at buying a vehicle. Of course, the man who greeted us knew that (and we told him anyway); but he went out of his way to make us feel welcome, I guess on the off chance that one day we'd be in the market and would come back. He didn't even pick on my friend for driving a Wrangler. He really went out of his way, wasn't pushy at all, no qualification questions... Turns out in the end when he gave us his card he was the manager. He showed us the then-new Freelander, showed a short video about its off-road prowess, told us about the local Rover club, talked with my friend about some big rally over in Africa where they ran the old Discos, and even gave us nice Land Rover hats and T-shirts!
If I was in the market for a Rover, I certainly would go back! Perhaps when the LR2 comes out...
I think the only way to change some of that behavior is to come back in a new vehicle you just bought and wave the purchase order in front of that moron. But who would do that? We are all busy and have better things to do than teach idiots who would probably learn nothing anyway. Meanwhile, for him your walking out only strengthen his opinion of young buyers being "not worth the time", as if you are really serious buyer you would buy from him regardless of all crap he pulls on you. Reminds me a gentleman a few weeks ago who wanted to buy a Caravan and after couple of hours of testing, searching, trying and first round of numbers he hears "if you are a serious buyer, we could...".
These kind of stories show me over and over that the car buying marketplace has still a lot of tolerance to incompetence, rudness and bad manners. One would think time and competition would weed it out, yet it bounces back again and again. Beats me.
Your experiences with car salesmen just gives continuing credibility to the popular opinion that most (not all) new and used car salesmen are just miserable people....whether they were miserable before becoming salesmen or the job made them that way is subject to debate.
Nevertheless, in most popular opinion polls they are rated lower than politians and tobacco managements.
I know I've mentioned this story before, but a number of years ago my wife's step-father (step-father-in-law?) inherited some money from his mother and was looking to buy a new vehicle for himself. Went to the local Jeep dealer in his grubby clothes (he's never been much of a clothes horse) and was lucky to get a green pea who treated him well.
He paid cash for a Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited. A few weeks (months?) later he did the same thing for my MIL and got her a Cadillac Eldorado ... again, all cash.
Do not judge a book by its cover...
So, I wonder if the opposite is true .. if I couldn't finance a stick of gum but showed up at the BMW dealer in a shirt and tie, would I get treated better than the guy who is dressed down but has a 750 beacon score?
Any salesfolks out there who want to share a story where they saw that happen?
I've found that the best way to get courteous treatment at a dealership is to call a day or two before, speak to a salesperson, make an appointment and then show up on time. No doubt someone will now chime in with a story proving me wrong!
I think the only way to change some of that behavior is to come back in a new vehicle you just bought and wave the purchase order in front of that moron. But who would do that?
Not related to the specific topic..But when people try to rub a sale from another dealer in my face I just can't resist not being a sarcastic bum...I always ask if they got the $2000 additional rebate they just announced today. The deer in the headlight look appears and they jump in the car and rush back to the dealer who sold them the car and make a big bruhaha...works everytime. :P
When I was young I always made sure I was dressed well and professionally, as if I just came from work, when I went carshopping. I felt like it gave me more credibility than if I came in jeans or something casual.
Now that I'm older, I dress nicely but not expensively, deliberately leave off any really expensive jewelry except for a good watch. This is trying to strike a balance between appearing to have money, without advertising "money is no object!"
It feels like game-playing a bit, but it's been successful. I've bought cars for myself, for myself and my husband, and with a male friend, and each time I approach it a little bit differently in my own appearance.
This one is not about a better price - it's about lost business opportunity because a salesman/manager classified one as "waste of time". It's not about showing how much one paid, but to show that there was a business to earn here and one passed it on.
I would never come to another sales guy to show him that the guy next door beat his price. Unless he/she asks of course on some other/casual occasion (in lines with "give me an idea what the competition is doing right so I can win your business next time or just make some general corrections to my conduct").
No doubt someone will now chime in with a story proving me wrong!
OK I will do just that. Many a year ago I went through all the stuff looking for a car. I decided on one and called up the sales lady and told her I would buy their car we came on an agreement over the phone and made an appointment. Well I show up but she is nowhere to be found. I get passed off to another sales person telling me that the sales lady was at a sales meeting (who holds those in the evening when customers are coming in) and the new salesman was telling me what the other sales lady really told me (in short they changed some figures around). I demanded to talk to the lady I was dealing with and they told me she was at a sales meeting (I saw her in the back drinking some coffee).
Needless they lost that sale and about a dozen others due to that.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I would never come to another sales guy to show him that the guy next door beat his price. Unless he/she asks of course on some other/casual occasion
I would not give another salesman someone elses price under any circumstances. If you say you can beat the competitions price then give me your lowest price. If you can beat it so be it, if you can't then you can't.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I'm going to take anybody who has $20K for a down payment very seriously. I went through the same thing you did many years ago when I was young. I wanted to buy a new Cadillac Brougham and had $10K to put down and and a 2 year-old paid-off Chevrolet Caprice Classic for a trade. I encountered a lot of sales people who were immediately prejudiced against me because of my age. Eventually, I found a salesperson who took me seriously and earned my business. I still have the Cadillac to this day and have kept it in excellent condition.
I'm for an open marketplace with as much disclosure as possible as a general rule rather than exception, so I have no problem with telling the prices of the other guy and giving a chance to everybody, especially a fellow I might prefer personally, but not having the best offer. I guess it is a matter of priorities. I think it all depends on the circumstances whether or not it is appropriate to show the price of the competition. I guess I always like to help people to get better, especially when they ask.
After I purchased my Subaru three years ago (the internet price gathering was just taking off and I made first contact with both of the dealers by the net), the "loser" asked me what broke the deal. I liked them both, the loser and the winner (I mean their general conduct and manners), so i thought I could help the loser to adjust and also get other fellow owners better price in the future (perhaps against my self-interest, but I'm a nice guy ) I also wanted to service my car in the "loser" location, as it was way more convenient than the other one.
In response I didn't give him exact numbers, but gave them pretty close: trade by $500 and the final price by couple hundreds. He thanked me, admitted that the deal was worth it (his exact words were "I don't blame you for taking it") and invited to his place for the service (he is a co owner) and promised no trouble with a loaner, as long as it was available at the time of the appointment booking.
I'm for an open marketplace with as much disclosure as possible as a general rule rather than exception,
So do I but I don't think its fair to run to dealer 'B' with dealers 'A' offer and say beat this without giving dealer 'A' a chance to counter offer. Blind bidding gives both 'A' and 'B' a chance, also consider it is a common business practice.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
"I think the only way to change some of that behavior is to come back in a new vehicle you just bought and wave the purchase order in front of that moron. But who would do that? We are all busy and have better things to do than teach idiots who would probably learn nothing anyway."
My wife was more upset than me I actually sent an email to the dealership's GM and complained about the sales manager's attitude and sales tactics. I let him know that I purchased a Honda Odyssey EX-L down the street and that he lost a 30K sale. Surprisingly, the GM emailed me back and was very courteous. He admitted that his sales manager was wrong to treat us that way and that he understood my reason for leaving. I noticed the sales manager is still there (according to the dealership's website) but he is now the sales manager for used cars (he was sales manager for new cars when I was shopping in April)..
That said. I have also run across some great dealers who have gone out of their way to win my business. I have now purchased three cars from one of those dealers, and have even bought lunch for the service team on one occasion where they really went out of their way. It is a two-way street. For the record, stay away from Lustine Toyota/Scion/Dodge if you are in Northern VA.
Generally agree, but we all have limited resourses and time on our hands and so do the dealers. Any back and forth needs a cutoff point. With all fairness, we as customers need to look for our interest, as dealers for theirs. So it is perhaps not fair to have a favorite before and lead the price bidding in such a way that that favorite wins at the end with the price we have in mind, but it's a fact of life.
BTW, I actually bought my Subaru from "less prefered" place. When the "loser" put their price, they appeared to be very firm on their offer, especially the trade. Since the "winner" agreed on matching the new car price (actually he slightly beat it) and offer higher trade allowance, there was no sense of taking that offer back to the other guy. Perhaps not exactly fair, but again - fact of life, the loser had his chance and he claimed the offer was firm - so what's the point of taking the offer back?
Comments
That is a new record ... since you are permitted to file for BK once every seven years.
Tidester .. Kristie?
How's about stories from the Service Drive or Service Bay?
Similar to Sales but with a service slant?
I won't start until I get a green light (no pun intended ... actually pun IS intended)
I agree. I would not try to cheat someone else, but I am not surprised when someone tries to cheat me.
Interesting. I had been thinking along similar lines. I came up with "Customer Service: The good, the bad and the ugly" for a title but perhaps someone could come up with a more creative one.
tidester, host
brought in his car with a bad radio. Actually it was
a am/fm/8track tape radio, all beaten up. He wanted it
fixed under warranty.
After visiting with man, I discovered that it was his teen
age sons car, and the 8 track tape got stuck, so dear old
dad tried to get the tape out with a big screwdriver, was
not having much luck, lost his temper, and screwdrivered
the radio to death. After a few minutes, he started
laughing, and decided warranty would not pay for radio,
and he would buy another.
You should have seen the radio, he really did a number
on it.
tidester, host
What brand of cars and how many cars does the store sell per month?
My customers would curse at me too if I hit them with a 399.00 doc fee!
That is NUTS...we charge 35.00 and some people gripe about that!
I think "Customer Service: ...?" as opposed to "Service Department: ...?" would provide a broader range of issues that could/would be discussed. E.g., when that trailer hitch you order from J.C. Whitney cracks and they refuse to give a refund because you had the audacity to actually install it!
But, hey, you folks can decide what focus you want! My comments are only suggestions.
tidester, host
Disclaimer to JCW: That was a hypothetical in no way suggestive of anything less than superb customer service on your part!
tidester, host
Those two links are are supposed to be in the extreme upper right corner of this page but I am not seeing them either. I'll pass this along.
tidester, host
I'm expecting everyone to jump right in - and keep posting here too!
tidester, host
If you can get an 06 at the end of the month for about 5500-6000 off MSRP. (Canvas 10+ dealers by email) The SES or ST may handle well if you test drive it. For around 12k well optioned you can't beat it. Its worth about 10k in a year so at this price depreciation is good also.
A relative got a deal like this last year but with the gas prices they have become more popular. Still its worth a shot. For substantially more I would look at something else (but a comparable Civic is 18k min?-- Thats a lotta gas you can buy for the diff)
--jjf
Thats according to the new BK laws. Previously there was no such limitation so you had a lot of serial filers.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
At some dealers, the salesmen disappear when they see me coming. If I get somebody to (reluctantly) talk to me, they ask basic questions about the trade (year/mileage) or what I am looking for and quickly blow me off. At one dealership where I had a referral, I walked in (right past a bunch of salesmen who looked the other way) and told the desk I wanted to speak to such-and-such. The manager said "Are you here just looking for your buddy? Or do you want to try and buy a car?" Why would he say that or even care?
I can only guess that for some reason they pre-qualify me as unable to buy. Maybe they think I am upside-down in my 2004 Explorer (I am not), that I don't have any credit (it is excellent), or that I don't have enough income (I have plenty).
I finally got one guy to treat me with respect when I told him right off the bat what my payoff was and what Carmax had appraised it for, what my equifax score was, and my income level. But is this really necessary? Do I have to put on dress shoes and a tie, and drive the wife's 04 Mustang up there just to look at cars?
What is so wrong to these guys about a young guy driving an SUV who comes in wanting to look closer at an entry-level midsize sedan, where they don't even want to give the time of day?
That has been in effect for years. That is one of the reasons why many dealerships are more than happy to deal with the bankrupt. They know that the debtors can't BK again for seven years.
That's just a guess, though. A theory, if you will. Maybe the salesfolk can chime in and confirm/deny.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Rule #1 - If someone doesn't treat you the way you should be respected, DON'T shop there.
Unless you live in podunk, there are hundreds of dealerships and salesmen who want your business. Give it to them.
Here's my experience... I am 24 and look much younger (as people told me) was in the market for a new Lexus about 4 months ago. First dealer I went to the salesman was totally unwilling to negotiate and shown no interest in talking to me (maybe he thought I wasn't a serious buyer). He told me the best he can do is 500 bucks off sticker and that's it. He asked me if I want to test drive but I declined, walked out the dealer in less than 15 min.
Went to the second dealer a couple days after, the salesman is really nice, also very professional. Test drove the cars then went straight to price. Without much negotiation we agreed on $1500 off and I put down the deposit. All done in less than 2 hours.
Although it's just my experience this shows that by stereotyping, a salesman might lose a business or two. Same goes with racial profiling as we discussed earlier.
Did you start negotiating without even driving the car first? That always sends a warning flag up for me and although I would never treat a customer poorly because they did that I would use a different approach then normal.
A few seconds after she paged, a salesman came out and walked up to me. I could see the look of doubt in his eye as he spotted me from a few yards away - I am a young guy and was wearing jeans and a sweat shirt. We shook hands, and I said something like, "I am looking for an SUV for my wife and have narrowed it down to 2 different models. I know the Honda is geared differently than the other model we are considering, and would like to see how it performs at highway speeds compared to the other model. If my wife feels more comfortable behind the wheel of the Honda, we would actually prefer to buy the Honda provided we could work out a deal"
It seemed like once he saw that I had done some research, and was serious, he really lowered his guard. The only other question he asked me right then was if I had a trade - which I didn't. I then set up an appointment for my wife and I to come in the following Friday. He never asked me another "qualifying question" (what payment are you looking for, how's your credit, etc...), up until after my wife and I had gone back for our test drive appointment and actually sat down for the negotiations.
It was a very nice buying experience. Negotiations took 15 minutes, and we only discussed out the door pricing - payments were never mentioned. I already had my own financing arranged, but the F&I guy offered to try to beat my rate, and he did. I think we spent 2 hours there total, and that included test driving 2 cars - part of the time in heavy traffic, negotiations, F&I, and waiting while the car was detailed, gassed up, and presented to us.
Then you have others complaining about people coming for a joyride and not being buyers (so-called strokes?). I guess there are some people there who would not talk to you even if you just brought a bag of cash and showed it to them, as long as you look different than their "usual customer".
What beats me in the story of Explorer guy is that he was not shopping for a luxury car - it was just a midsize sedan, for crying out loud! Low 20s or even high teens! And he came in a relatively new Explorer! Surely looks like a potential buyer to me - I just don't get it. At age of 20-something people already have jobs, or graduate college, may (or not) have a decent credit. Still not enough to get your rear out and at least shake hand, ask questions (to find out if the Explorer is his or his dadies), offer a test drive and see where it goes from there? :confuse:
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I have sold cars to people when they never test drove the vehicle. It does not happen all that often but it does happen from time to time.
Most people want to test drive our vehicles as there are not many Land Rover dealers out there so they have never had a chance to drive one.
Maybe the salesman was just lazy. Lots of people are. Or maybe he was having a bad morning. Way too many variables in the equation.
These are all the things that make you a VERY GOOD customer and I'm sure you know that. Don't worry about the RESPECT thing, follow the advice of post #3015 and that of the other young buyers that have posted. The other young buyers got what they wanted and so will you.
Not to sound fatherly but this is just another lesson that you are learning as you go through life and this is an easy one.
Good luck,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I like to have a little bit of foreplay, for lack of a better word, before we go out on a test drive.
Short walk around a vehicle in the showroom. Show the people some of the features on the inside of the car talk about the design some and why things are the way they are.
Talk about where various models start in price and what options are avaliable if any. What a typically equiped model has on it and how it is priced. Once all of that is done and I have the proper information from the customer, full name, phone number, address etc.
Then I will ask if they would like to do a test drive if they have not already.
This has happened to me quite a few times over the years.. Too bad for the salesman/dealer I guess... Some of these dealerships should make it mandatory that salesmen read the book "The Millionaire Next Door"...
I think that is a big assumption by the salesman.. Perhaps the individual already test drove the car at another dealer. Maybe a friend or family member already owns said automobile and the buyer has already driven it. Or maybe they just looked and researched various car sites and decided on a particular vehicle based on its specs, reliability, safety features, or cost..
"Did you start negotiating without even driving the car first? That always sends a warning flag up for me"
Can't tell you how many times I negotiated on a particular vehicle because I had previously test driven it. If the salesman has any doubt he should always inquire whether the buyer has driven one previously or would he like to test drive one now?
I have to say that was one of the best experiences I've ever had at a dealer, and we weren't even there to seriously look at buying a vehicle. Of course, the man who greeted us knew that (and we told him anyway); but he went out of his way to make us feel welcome, I guess on the off chance that one day we'd be in the market and would come back. He didn't even pick on my friend for driving a Wrangler. He really went out of his way, wasn't pushy at all, no qualification questions... Turns out in the end when he gave us his card he was the manager. He showed us the then-new Freelander, showed a short video about its off-road prowess, told us about the local Rover club, talked with my friend about some big rally over in Africa where they ran the old Discos, and even gave us nice Land Rover hats and T-shirts!
If I was in the market for a Rover, I certainly would go back! Perhaps when the LR2 comes out...
These kind of stories show me over and over that the car buying marketplace has still a lot of tolerance to incompetence, rudness and bad manners. One would think time and competition would weed it out, yet it bounces back again and again. Beats me.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Nevertheless, in most popular opinion polls they are rated lower than politians and tobacco managements.
He paid cash for a Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited. A few weeks (months?) later he did the same thing for my MIL and got her a Cadillac Eldorado ... again, all cash.
Do not judge a book by its cover...
So, I wonder if the opposite is true .. if I couldn't finance a stick of gum but showed up at the BMW dealer in a shirt and tie, would I get treated better than the guy who is dressed down but has a 750 beacon score?
Any salesfolks out there who want to share a story where they saw that happen?
Not related to the specific topic..But when people try to rub a sale from another dealer in my face I just can't resist not being a sarcastic bum...I always ask if they got the $2000 additional rebate they just announced today. The deer in the headlight look appears and they jump in the car and rush back to the dealer who sold them the car and make a big bruhaha...works everytime. :P
Now that I'm older, I dress nicely but not expensively, deliberately leave off any really expensive jewelry except for a good watch. This is trying to strike a balance between appearing to have money, without advertising "money is no object!"
It feels like game-playing a bit, but it's been successful. I've bought cars for myself, for myself and my husband, and with a male friend, and each time I approach it a little bit differently in my own appearance.
I would never come to another sales guy to show him that the guy next door beat his price. Unless he/she asks of course on some other/casual occasion (in lines with "give me an idea what the competition is doing right so I can win your business next time or just make some general corrections to my conduct").
2018 430i Gran Coupe
OK I will do just that. Many a year ago I went through all the stuff looking for a car. I decided on one and called up the sales lady and told her I would buy their car we came on an agreement over the phone and made an appointment. Well I show up but she is nowhere to be found. I get passed off to another sales person telling me that the sales lady was at a sales meeting (who holds those in the evening when customers are coming in) and the new salesman was telling me what the other sales lady really told me (in short they changed some figures around). I demanded to talk to the lady I was dealing with and they told me she was at a sales meeting (I saw her in the back drinking some coffee).
Needless they lost that sale and about a dozen others due to that.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I would not give another salesman someone elses price under any circumstances. If you say you can beat the competitions price then give me your lowest price. If you can beat it so be it, if you can't then you can't.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
After I purchased my Subaru three years ago (the internet price gathering was just taking off and I made first contact with both of the dealers by the net), the "loser" asked me what broke the deal. I liked them both, the loser and the winner (I mean their general conduct and manners), so i thought I could help the loser to adjust and also get other fellow owners better price in the future (perhaps against my self-interest, but I'm a nice guy
In response I didn't give him exact numbers, but gave them pretty close: trade by $500 and the final price by couple hundreds. He thanked me, admitted that the deal was worth it (his exact words were "I don't blame you for taking it") and invited to his place for the service (he is a co owner) and promised no trouble with a loaner, as long as it was available at the time of the appointment booking.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
So do I but I don't think its fair to run to dealer 'B' with dealers 'A' offer and say beat this without giving dealer 'A' a chance to counter offer. Blind bidding gives both 'A' and 'B' a chance, also consider it is a common business practice.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
My wife was more upset than me
That said. I have also run across some great dealers who have gone out of their way to win my business. I have now purchased three cars from one of those dealers, and have even bought lunch for the service team on one occasion where they really went out of their way. It is a two-way street. For the record, stay away from Lustine Toyota/Scion/Dodge if you are in Northern VA.
BTW, I actually bought my Subaru from "less prefered" place. When the "loser" put their price, they appeared to be very firm on their offer, especially the trade. Since the "winner" agreed on matching the new car price (actually he slightly beat it) and offer higher trade allowance, there was no sense of taking that offer back to the other guy. Perhaps not exactly fair, but again - fact of life, the loser had his chance and he claimed the offer was firm - so what's the point of taking the offer back?
2018 430i Gran Coupe