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  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,023
    A leak should result in a warning light I think.

    Actually, in the case of the LeSabre and the Dart, the warning light only came on when you hit the brake pedal and it went down to the floor. So it was warning you that your brakes weren't working AS you were pressing down and already finding that out for yourself! As soon as you let off the brake though, the warning light would go away.

    I hope modern cars are a bit more intelligent with the warning lights!
  • bumpybumpy Member Posts: 4,425
    What did they do on the Corvette? Mount it on the dashboard?
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    Well I don't have anything against a hand parking brake. I think the C4 Covette hand brake is a good design and keeps the console area less cluttered.
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,023
    the hand brake on the Dart, and the '67 Newport I once owned, did make it more convenient to drive the car without brakes than Grandma's '85 LeSabre. With the dash-mounted hand-brake, you just had to pull it when you were stopping, and then twist and release it when you wanted to take off again. With the LeSabre, you had to push the brake with your foot, but then use your hand to release it!

    Of course, these things really aren't designed for day-to-day driving once your regular brakes have failed!
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    Looking at the forums on repairs, the brake section has one on failed brakes for a suburban. There was a small leak that resulted in failure finally. So, one should check the brake fluid level along with the oil level, coolant level...... :)
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    My Seville releases the parking brake when in gear, so using it for an emergency is problematic.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    I believe that was American Motors which first introduced the dual brake system, IF I recall correctly. They also had the best doors for latches.

    Loren
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    It was mounted on the left side of the drivers seat, out of the way on the floor. The rachet design allowed for more than one pull to tighten the brake. The brake was then released gradually by pulling the handle tight, pushing a button and lowering the handle. A good design. Most console ones only allow a single pull and then the handle stays up till released.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    That can not be good on the transmission. And she will park on a hill someday and not be able to get it out of park -- oh well, cars are treated like the most humble appliance now-a-days. :sick:

    Loren
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,023
    My Intrepid doesn't release the parking brake when you put it in gear, but it does override it pretty easily...much more so than the older cars I've had. I always liked the way the parking brake on my DeSoto works...clamps down nice and tight on the driveshaft. Although I've heard some people say that system's got problems of its own.
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    Mom is in her ninties now :D
  • bumpybumpy Member Posts: 4,425
    So it was by the door? That could work, if it doesn't stick up high enough to catch your leg when you're getting in or out of the car.

    Every hand brake I've ever seen could be tightened up through successive ratchet points on different pulls (two notches on one pull, then three more on the next, etc.), and loosened through the ratchet points by pushing in the button and moving the handle where you wanted. It's not a simple on-off thing.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    Just curious.....Who bought Suzuki from GM ?

    Rocky


    end quote

    Suzuki is buying back the shares, the way I understand it.
    Recall the old ads, " Solo Suzuki Champ of Grand Prix ! "
    Ah the good ol' days when a car was Corvette, and bike was a Suzuki. Never realized they were making cars. I bet many people still don't know they are, and have never seem one in the Middle Land of the US of A.

    Loren
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    :D

    Rocky
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Member Posts: 6,043
    Who said GM was not in trouble?
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Member Posts: 6,043
    GM still owns about 3%. Alas, Suzuki is now in a bit of trouble. All that money going to GM really cuts out spendable cash for vehicle development. May drive them into bankruptcy. whoops, they are in Japan. No bankruptcy there for auto companies.

    Also GM does not need Suzuki. They are letting GM Daewoo in Korea do that part of the business.

    http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060307/AUTO01/603070401/1148-
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    ...my 1975 Cadillac released the parking brake when shifted into gear - that's how long that features been around. Funny, I must manually release the parking brake on the '88 Park Ave.

    Anybody recall when the master cylinder was below the floorboards? Wasn't Plymouth the first make to adopt hydraulic brakes and didn't Ford hand onto mechanical brakes as late as 1948?
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Member Posts: 6,043
    After you pulled up the lever it would drop back down to the floor and still be engaged.
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    The handle was along the door sill out of the way. Once the brake was set tight enough the handle would drop down to the floor. Then to release, the handle brought up to where is was tight, the button would release and then lowering the handle would release in one move, even if you made two or three strokes to tighten the brake. The handle was fairly long, giving one some leverage.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    Well we now have the lever to adjust the seat height there by the way of ratchet. I like that. Keep the brake where it belongs. OK, they won't do that, but I got something to complain about, I guess. We all should be glad a few cars remain. Between cross-overs and SUVs, the classically beautiful lines of a fine car nearly disappeared. Even Porsche made an SUV - how strange a World is that???

    The current trend of the disappearing window glass is not good. While I can still see out of a Chrysler 300, you wonder how far this can go. Seems that they went too far in the Crossfire and people did not like the idea of sitting in the bathtub to drive. They still buy those Nissan 350Z s though, which is a mystery. Those feel really confining and are but a slit of a window, front, and sides, the peer out of. Sort of like a military armored car - so what's up with that?

    Loren
  • plektoplekto Member Posts: 3,738
    The problem I've had with footbrakes is that in an emergency, they will ALWAYS pop out/disengage/loosten up after a bit, so in a stop, you have to apply a lot of pressure on it for as long as it takes to stop.

    Well, that means you have to either choose between the brakes, weak as they are(they don't ever completely fail outright), or the E-brake, unless you stop with your right foot and E-brake with your left at the same time.

    A handbrake is far better - you can pull on it while pumping the brakes/using them without the power assist feature. Plus, it won't pop out if the spring is weak - at least not unless it's an old VW bug, that is.
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,023
    I think one reason they do it nowadays is for increased side impact protection. Those more open, airy interiors are nice, but tend to not do so well for side impact protection.

    And on the plus side, we're finally starting to see rear windows that roll down all the way again! :) With a smaller window and taller door, there's less window to have to hide and more space to roll it down into. The 300 is probably the first Chrysler car since the 1979-81 New Yorker to have back windows that roll all the way down. And the only reason they roll down on the '79-81 is because the quarter window is disproportionately large, while the roll-down window is smaller than normal. And even on the big '74-78 Chryslers, you had to get a hardtop for rear windows that went all the way down. On the sedans they stopped a few inches short.

    On a similar note, the Buick Lucerne has back windows that roll down all the way. I think they rolled down all the way on the '92-96 Roadmaster and '93-96 Fleetwood, but otherwise you'd have to go back to the full-sized GM hardtops of 1976 to find a GM car with rear windows that went down all the way.

    I know what you mean about the bathtub feel though, Lauren. That was one thing that made me choose an Intrepid over an Impala. While the Intrepid was getting a bit more confining, it still felt much more open and airy than the Impala, which felt like it had much higher door sills.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    ...was commenting on how much better the visibility is on the 1988 Park Avenue compared to her LaCrosse. If you look out the back window, you can actually see the end of the trunk lid, whereas the tail and backwindow are so high on the LaCrosse, you need the side mirrors to back into a spot. You can easily rest your forearm on the driver's door sill when the window is open on the Park Ave, but is awkward on the LaCrosse as the sill seems to be an inch or two too high. However, the rear window glass on the Park Ave hardly goes down 6 inches w3hereas it goes down all the way on the LaCrosse.
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    I think that the 300 is more about style than safety. Current styling fad is a big grill and the higher windows go with that. Side impact protection is more about the B-pillar design and how the doors are reinforced than how short the door window is.
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,023
    I didn't realize that the back windows on the LaCrosse went down all the way too...cool! I don't know why that's such a sticking point with me, but it is. Probably because I remember all the cool hardtops and such from when I was a kid, and it just seemed so much more free and open. Then in the 70's, things just got more confining. Plus, for awhile I took a window that didn't roll down all the way to be a sign of a cheap car. Oddly though, most cheap Japanese sedans in the 70's had roll-down rear windows, while it became increasingly rare on domestics, even the priciest ones.

    I think the absolute worst was GM's downsized 1978 midsizers, where they made the rear windows in sedans and wagons stationary! IIRC they only roll down about 1/3 of the way in the 1991-96 Caprice, and I think the '92-99 Bonneville was just about as bad. They went down about half way in my Grandma's '85 LeSabre.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    What color is your girlfriends LaCrosse ?

    They are very nice styled (Jaguarish) cars, but needs a Northstar or better engine and a sporty interior. Perhaps that could help distinguish the LaCrosse from the Lucerne and add a little spice to the Buick line-up.

    The perfect Lacrosse

    If the LaCrosse had a better interior (sporty) a stick, and a Northstar or 3.6
    "High Feature" V-6 with a few Turbo's and gadgets like DVD-Audio and Voice Recognition I'd buy one without hesitation. I'd also wouldn't mind paying a premium price for it too. ;)

    Rocky
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    The color is Sapphire Blue Metallic with a beige interior. It's a beautiful shade. I like the interior much better than in the cars it replaced - the Century and Regal. Their dashboards were a featureless prairie of barren gray or beige plastic.
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    The LaCrosse does offer a 3.6 high feature V6. However, to make a decent Jaguarish car out of the LaCrosse, a decent RWD platform is needed. Then it might be an alternative to the S-type. At least it would be cheaper.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    The color is Sapphire Blue Metallic with a beige interior. It's a beautiful shade. I like the interior much better than in the cars it replaced - the Century and Regal. Their dashboards were a featureless prairie of barren gray or beige plastic.

    Yeah that's a nice color and ride. I guess I don't remember you having it posted on Car Space ?

    Neways yes I strongly agree the LaCrosse is galaxy's ahead of the Lesabre, Regal, Century, it replaces. I'd like to see the LaCrosse become the Performance Touring Car for Buick, but keep the Jag styling cues. :shades:

    Rocky
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    I have a lot of pictures still on film that I haven't developed. I should get a digital camera, but I'm cheap and old-fashioned. I'll post them when I finally get my butt in gear.

    I see the Jaguar in the LaCrosse, but I always thought of it as a prettier Lexus GS.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    I know that pal, but I want the Twin Turbo 3.6 engine out of the Buick Velite. I agree it could be a nice Jag S-type alternative and still compete with the supercharged version of the "S". ;) I guess that would open up a can of worms for the Lucerne which is suppose to be the Flagship

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    I can agree with you also on the Lexus GS styling. I do see that to.

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    If gas keeps going up I will take the drivers seat out and sit in the back seat to save a buck in a new Honda Fit. :surprise: Hell basketball players do this in BMW 3 series coupes.

    Rocky
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Member Posts: 6,043
    The high rear ends and side window sills are all abbut styling and aero.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    62vetteefp, do you like the LaCrosse ?

    Rocky
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    There is a turbo 2.8 V6, but a turbo 3.6 is not a production engine. A twin turbo 3.6 is a one-off fiction, like the 750 hp V12 in the Cien. If the Cien engine really had a peak torque of 450 lb-ft as GM said, then 750 hp would have required an engine speed of nearly 10,000 RPMs.
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,023
    also helps to boost trunk volume. Cars these days usually don't have much overhang beyond the rear wheels, so more of the trunk are tends to be between the wheel wells instead of behind them. And since cars usually taper more in the front and rear these days, that useable trunk area gets shaved even more. If they didn't start raising the decklids as those horizontal dimensions shrunk, most trunks these days would be truly tiny.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    There is a turbo 2.8 V6, but a turbo 3.6 is not a production engine. A twin turbo 3.6 is a one-off fiction, like the 750 hp V12 in the Cien. If the Cien engine really had a peak torque of 450 lb-ft as GM said, then 750 hp would have required an engine speed of nearly 10,000 RPMs.

    Are you sure your calculations are correct. 450 lbs-ft of torque can easily be made with less horsepower like 600. ;)

    The 3.6 Twin Turbo isn't fiction. I saw them test drive the Buick Velite. ;)

    Rocky
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    Are there any more Steve Miller's out there that need to be watched?

    Yeah Carlos Ghoson in 5-10 years. ;)

    Rocky
  • mirthmirth Member Posts: 1,212
    ...if you're a Southern Californian working at Nissan.
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Member Posts: 6,043
    Yes, for many reasons :blush:

    It has an excellent interior with tight gaps and uplevel materials. (Better fit and finish and materials than the old Camry and current Accord, however styling may be too "woody" for some) I love the way the console blends into the dash instead of just going under it.

    It is the first car of GM that the team really worked on fit/finish/materials and gloss levels. All cars after it have used the same criteria though it varies with price range on the material selection such as soft materials.

    On exterior styling it came out a bit more conservative than what may have been best. But, it is a great looking exterior.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    there are many good things about Suzuki, just not products that are well-suited to the American landscape. Although I still wish they would bring the current Swift here - I would have to give it serious consideration even THOUGH their dealer network is so pathetic. ;-)

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    >people did not like the idea of sitting in the bathtub to drive

    Man, I'm all over THAT statement, I like a low beltline and good visibility in my cars. It's getting hard to find right now as function follows form in many of today's designs......
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    "Local Dealers, Managers tried Alerting Staid Bureaucracy:
    Marketing goes off course."

    It's on Page 1, Column 1 of today's edition. Long article, pretty interesting outlining the Elephant size of this company, their analysis paralysis, to where even the CEO was afraid to authorize the Escalade project when it came out to compete against Lincoln. It only got approved when Lincoln pulled ahead of Cadillac for the first time due to the Navigator's success.

    Very illustrative of what ails GM these days, doesn't blame the UAW for a change, places it pretty much on Managment, or the lack thereof. The segment on how badly GM does in Miami was hysterical - how they introduced the Escalade in Miami in an ad featuring the truck in the snow - and with the "Breakthrough" tag line, for which there is no translation in Spanish. Lots of misfired. I recommend it as a good read.... NV ;)
  • ron_mron_m Member Posts: 186
    >people did not like the idea of sitting in the bathtub to drive

    Man, I'm all over THAT statement, I like a low beltline and good visibility in my cars. It's getting hard to find right now as function follows form in many of today's designs......


    The high beltline is why I think the 350Z doesn't look as good as its predecessor--the 300ZX. When it comes to the profile of these two cars, the 300ZX just looks more sleek and less bloated than the 350Z with its high beltline. I realize that to a large degree this is supposedly for safety improvements(side impact crash test), but how much safer are you if your visibility is limited by this sacrifice in style for alleged safety enhancements? Furthermore, I just don't want to feel like I'm driving a Sherman tank with low profile tires on it. :)

    Ron
  • gogogodzillagogogodzilla Member Posts: 707
    How can you not remember the Suzuki Samurai from the 1980's?

    :P
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    How can you not remember the Suzuki Samurai from the 1980's?

    --end quote--

    What!!! Those weren't golf carts?

    Loren
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    I think being conservative is what's best for Buick. The Lacrosse's design is clean and "Sexay" :shades:

    To me it just doesn't blend into traffic and it get's my attention.(especially in Black w/ chrome) :shades:
    This car definitly needs to keep the GS-ish/Jag styling which has made it a Buick Success. I do see a good future for the LaCrosse if GM is committed to adding more spice under the hood and perhaps giving it AWD/RWD eventually :)

    Rocky

    P.S. Glad you like it myself and obviously like Lemko.
  • rockyleerockylee Member Posts: 14,017
    Your arguements are very true. However in not just GM's defense but for all car company's here in the U.S. I thought English was suppose to be are national language in this country. :confuse: Either learn it or get out in my opinion.

    Rocky
  • harrycheztharrychezt Member Posts: 405
    http://theautochannel.com/news/2006/03/06/212488.html
    GM still has 3% stake in Suzuki.

    Like one story said Suzuki does not really need GM anymore. GM has GM-DAT to build cars,like AVEO, for USA( GM-Daewoo Automotive Technologies). Suzuki can make better cars on their own these days, as they had A Record sales for 05, and have passed Mitsubishi for sales this YTD, in Feb. Gm-Suzuki will still have cars together, etc.
    Suzuki owns 11% of GM_DAT, so? Who knows what will happen.

    I read Suzuki is 12th(?) out of 20+ makers, worldwide, for sales, beating out Mazda and BMW last year(theautochannel.com has all makers stories form up to a year, or more, just click on call out box on right side.... on maker).
    BTW. my mother in law still has her 97 "Chevy" Tracker(Suzuki). No problems.
    Zero. Think it was made at their joint venture in Canada, which they still have!

    Anyhow, Suzuki may have tight finances by Buying the stakes back from GM for 1 year, and GM as the option to buy them back. If not, both sides will decide what to do about it.
    http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000006&sid=aH2Ti9FcTb1A&refer=home

    Said stockholders were upset, (sounded like GM did NOT want to do this ).
    May have been this, or my autochannel story.

    Anyhow, the "demise" of Suzuki is greatly exaggerated, as is the "break-up" of any co-operation between GM/Suzuki/ GM-DAT(I also read Shanghai Motors of China owns 1.4% or so stake in GM-DAT, and Shanghai Motors is the Chinese partner of GM).

    Seems Suzuki also makes mini cars for Nissan overseas, and other companies.
    The sky ain't falling, so-to-speak, but from some reports and comments on sites, you think it had!

    Take-Care/Not Offense.

    PS: forgot the guy who tweaked the Reno, but how did ya get it up to "Scion tC-automatic' speed?
    Cold air, turbo?
    Other?
    Suzuki will have a "sporty" Reno, from what I read, as an 07(or in 07) model, and a sedan to follow as either rna 08 or in 08(see future vehicles, may be on this site, or Motortrend, Intellichoice, etc0. Forgot which one's(maybe all?).

    Have a good week everyone.
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