Are gas prices fueling your pain?

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Comments

  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Thanks, it's about that time. A whole shelf in the frig is full of potted seeds doing their "winter" thing and there's about 2 sq feet of seeds started in the southern windows already. The grow lamps will come out soon too, and that 2 sq ft will about quintuple. Then there's the 1,000 (literally) yarrow seeds to spread soon. It was 53 yesterday and positively springlike.

    In a few more weeks I'll be able to park the Subaru for the summer and whack my gasoline bill back.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Growing your own tomatoes is a good way to save money for those big gas bills. Men need lycopene for good health. I will have to try that straw bale idea.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,690
    Gardening by the Bale Tip Sheet

    Tip sheet page list

    Doing the bales in rows of two side-by-side makes it easy to care for them. Read all pages of the tip sheet.

    This is from 55krc.com Cincinnati radio. Ron Wilson is from Natorp's Garden Center and has done the show for several years after an earlier head gardener had left their company and started his own nursery. Lots of tip sheets on the radio station's link under his name Ron Wilson.

    The Saturday morning show is streamed on the web; you can listen and post on Edmunds at the same time! www.55krc.com

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    I used to commute by bus or train or auto from North Jersey to lower Manhattan for 20+ years. The bus and train were very very easy commutes. Drive to the station or bike there. Get on a coach with leatherette seats and fall asleep for 30-60 min.

    It was a pleasure except for the rigid schedule.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Well, I'm already using about 6 bales for a couple of compost piles so I'm about ready to plant as soon as Memorial Day rolls around.

    Maybe I'll move this whole thread over to Gardening....
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Wednesday it was 80 here. Yesterday at 4 PM it was 36 and snowing. It is beautiful today. The hills all around us are white. Did not stick at our elevation. Does the Subaru use more gas than the mini van?
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,038
    my last experience with it was the DC Metro (subway), which I took to go to the DC auto show a few weeks ago. Picked it up in Greenbelt, Maryland, and we didn't have to wait long for a train. I think the ride down to the Convention center was about 20 minutes. Now truth be told, I could drive down to the convention center in 20 minutes, but then I'd have to deal with trying to find a place to park, not to mention the "wildlife" that tends to come out at night. The Metro station, meanwhile, is right there at the Convention center.

    My experience with the subways in other cities is limited to that episode of "I Love Lucy" where she gets the loving cup stuck on her head. :P So I honestly dunno how DC's Metro compares. I think it's pretty nice, though. I used to be leery of it, if nothing else because they make you buy a "fastpass" these days in order to park, and I didn't think I'd use it enough to really benefit. But I finally broke down and did it. Plus, parking's free on the weekends, and also on Fridays if you leave late enough.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    About the same.

    Lifetime for the Quest is 21.49. Low of ~19 around town, and over 25 on the road. All time high 29.9.

    Lifetime for the Subaru is 22.74, with a similar split - 20 in town, high 20's on the road. All time high of 32.5.

    Going from 3,000 to 6,000 feet 20 or 30 times a winter (1,000 miles +) hammers the lifetime mpg average on the Subaru I'm sure.

    I bet total miles accumulated on both cars is only around 12,000 miles a year now. Let's see, 12k divided by 20 mpg means ~600 gallons of regular used a year here. Call it $3.00 a gallon, that's $1800.

    If gas pops to $4.00, that's $2400. That extra $600 would about cover my car insurance.
  • chuckhoychuckhoy Member Posts: 420
    It may break 10F here today. But, spring is around the corner becaue I just got done signing up my two oldest for little-league and T-Ball. I am going into my 5th year of coaching (mostly T-Ball) and it is a blast. I am really dssapointed that we had so few girls in T-Ball this year. :cry: A few years ago every team had two girls. Now, there may only be 3 in the whole league. At this age the girls tend to be better than the boys because they actually listen.
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,709
    yeah, adobe houses abound around here. Good choice for the heavy heat from the sun. Straw bale wall-homes are one interesting proposition. Yeah, grow your veggies inside your walls. Another way to fight off those nasty ghastly bills.

    I saw that Hugo Chavez from Argentina was going to withhold oil from the U.S. if Exxon didn't retract their "possession" lawsuit. Not sure what that lawsuit is about but it's creating a big stir from them down south right now. Anyone else Google that or see it on the news? I mean, Argentina is about in 6th or 7th place on our list of importing oil sources, I saw that in that same news article.

    I still want to jump over to all-electric propelled vehicles next purchase time. One thing that will be interesting is what kind of technology, performance, price, etc. will have been achieved by 2013 or so. That's a ballpark figure for the year it may be when we'll need a new rig. :)

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Chavez is from Venezuela if you're still in edit mode. Argentina is where we get the beef. :shades:
  • tedebeartedebear Member Posts: 832
    Heck, I'd be willing to take a bus to work if it was convenient. But it just isn't. I can drive it in about 6-7 minutes. 10 on a bad day. In theory I could walk it in about an hour, but that's just not safe, walking the shoulder of a 4-lane divided road where traffic routinely gets up to 60+ mph.

    Sounds like about a 15 minute trip by bike. Think outside the box. ;)

    My commute is around 25 minutes by car. I've done it in a little under 46 minutes by bike with a moderate tailwind and the stop lights all being in my favor.

    I guess someone who wears a suit at work might have a problem riding but there's always the option of keeping a change of clothes at the office and driving in on Monday and Friday. I know other bike commuters who do this.

    Speaking of buses and mass transit, I always marvel at how well the mass transit system in Paris is arranged. I only used their bus service once but whenever I'm there I'm a regular customer on their Metro train system.

    It looked like they kicked off the panhandlers who used to frequent the rails when I was there in August. I didn't mind them too much anyway. They always spoke in French and I never understood what they were saying. :confuse:
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    okay, it was Weird Al who said that last one, not my Dad

    Ah, Another one rides the bus, thats what went through my head to about this. A major disadvantage with busses for people like me is that they are as rare as hens teeth and they rarely go near where you are or want to be.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • 1stpik1stpik Member Posts: 495
    people don't take the bus is this: a bus makes you dependent on someone else to go places, while a car makes you independent.

    Freedom beats green-dom every time.

    .
  • 1stpik1stpik Member Posts: 495
    you've probably heard the news:

    Oil prices approach 100 dollars

    World oil prices advanced on Friday, briefly topping 96 dollars, as jitters stemming from Nigeria and Venezuela stoked global supply concerns, traders said.

    Those market fears overshadowed a gloomy warning from Federal Reserve chairman Ben Bernanke, who predicted "a period of sluggish growth" ahead for the energy-hungry US economy.

    Light sweet crude for delivery in March, gained 43 cents to 95.89 dollars a barrel, after rising as high as 96.05 dollars -- which was last seen on January 9.

    Crude futures began surging at the start of the week after Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez threatened to halt oil deliveries to the United States.

    The market bounced even higher after Venezuela's state petroleum company PDVSA suspended oil supplies to ExxonMobil in retaliation for the US energy giant's effort to freeze billions of dollars in global PDVSA assets.

    The move came after ExxonMobil, the world's biggest energy company, secured international court orders freezing up to 12 billion dollars in PDVSA assets.

    NOTE: These stories always cite "jitters" or "concerns" of oil traders, not actual shortages or disruptions. If the price of oil was based on real events, it'd still be $30.

    Also, do the rest of you find it convenient that Exxon and Chavez are both doing things that raise oil prices, while both of them actually benefit from higher oil prices?

    If any of you were waiting for oil prices to drop as a result of last month's reports showing reduced demand and increased reserves ..... you can stop waiting now.

    .
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    ModBob IM'd me a little while ago and said gas in his area (State College PA) jumped .14 cents there today.

    Meanwhile a bunch of folks are going to be driving around in circles all weekend burning gas like there's no tomorrow. :shades:

    Ask Dub Schwartz!
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Also, do the rest of you find it convenient that Exxon and Chavez are both doing things that raise oil prices, while both of them actually benefit from higher oil prices?

    You could be right. Or it may be that Exxon is standing up to this thug Chavez. Our government has done little to keep him in line. Best way to bring Chavez into line is not pay him. $12 billion here and $12 billion there, before long you are talking some serious money. If we forced Chavez out of his dictatorship it would make the King of Spain happy. :) If Exxon has to pay more for oil and they are selling gas competitively it may not be a money maker for them. At $95 per barrel that is over $2 per gallon of unrefined product. With refined gas selling at $2.46 and retailing at $2.91 here in San Diego. That does not leave a lot for tax and profit.
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,709
    steve, it appears I got my South America's mixed up. Wonder how such a thing like that could happen?

    Freezing assets is ExxonMobil...12B in PDVSA assets? Well, it doesn't seem to me that they're making enough money yet. Better freeze some assets Chavez wants to grub on to, yep. :shades:

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    Not sure what that lawsuit is about but it's creating a big stir from them down south right now.

    Exxon invested lots of money in assets, facilities and equipment in Venezuela to pump out and process oil. Chavez went in and stole those assets (well basically he nationalized the oil industry but its the same thing). Exxon is trying to recoup the value of those seized assets via the lawsuit.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,709
    here I was harboring all of this resentment against ExxonMobil for charging us such ghastly gasoline prices and then this. Just sounds like a fair and square grab-back fight. Sort of like a food fight only with horrendously profitable oil.

    The sooner I get out of an ICE engined car and in to an all-EV the better. These clowns can sap China dry with their ghastly prices. ;)

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    should i trade in my suv for a better mpg car and lose a ton of cash, or hang
    in there?
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    Depends on how much money you would lose.If it's a lot...keep it because you can buy lots of gas for thousands of dollars. IMO if you lose only a couple grand or less,it might be worthwhile to buy an economy car. It also depends on how many MPG you gain over your SUV.
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    about 6gs. gaining double the mileage. thinking about a Passat wagon.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    Are you saying that you owe 6 grand more than you will get as a trade in? If so then you will be paying out the nose and you would better off staying with the SUV. 6 grand can currently buy almost 2,000 gallons of gas and that would power your SUV for almost 2 years.

    Generally it is not fiscally a good ideal to dump a current car just to get a better mileage car. The cost of switching cars usually eats all the gas savings.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    "Generally it is not fiscally a good ideal to dump a current car just to get a better mileage car. The cost of switching cars usually eats all the gas savings."

    I agree. I was all hot to trade my new KIA for a hybrid when the gas prices jumped,but fortunately I crunched the numbers and managed to keep my sanity.I kept the Optima. Whew...
    :sick:
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    $15-20 a week savings. Now if I can sell it outright and lose a couple
    grand, thats entirely different.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    You might also check insurance rates. My 2007 Sequoia 4X4 is $400 less per year full coverage than my 2005 Passat Wagon diesel was. Safety and comfort are worth something also. The Passat diesel did get better than twice the mileage of the Sequoia.
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    comfort is something I think a lot of
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    but comfort is something I think a lot of
  • avalon02whavalon02wh Member Posts: 785
    Will you switch to a hybrid? No. Car payments would far exceeded any savings even if gasoline hit $6 a gallon. If I needed a replacement car, buying a $24k Prius over a $18k Scion would save me about $500 per year in gas costs. The payback would be 12 years. I will likely go with a basic 4 cyl ICE.
    Will you dump your SUV/ truck for a car/ crossover? Not really, we traded in a V6 minivan (3950 lbs.) for a 4 cyl SUV (3500 lbs) last year. The SUV gets about 15% better MPG.
    Will you drive less? No. I only use about 15 gallons a month for personal use. If I use the car for work I get paid 45 cents a mile. Actual out of pocket costs (gas, oil, maintenance, tire wear) runs about 15 to 20 cents a mile.
    Will you switch to Asian makes? Already done. Might consider a Fusion or Verve in the future.
    Will you add accessories that help you save gas? No. I am not convinced any are worth the money.
    Will you drive in a more conservative manner... the so-called light-foot? That is already standard operating procedure.
    Also, if you were driving in 70s when oil rose to all time high, what did you do? Sat in line every Sunday morning until the gas station opened up.
    And, did that help? I don't know. The engine was off. :) The real problem was availability not price.
  • ronsmith38ronsmith38 Member Posts: 228
    Since I have not read all 4500+ posts in this forum, it may have been mentioned here before: Work from home! If one were to work only two days a week from home it would essentially reduce your gas bill by 40%. So $4 gas becomes $2.40 a gallon.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    Here's another key issue on the potential switch from an SUV to another vehicle. If someone is in a normal SUV like an Explorer or a 4Runner going to a Scion is like riding a bike again. Basic only begins to describe the ride and amenities.

    Going from a Sequoia or Tahoe or similar larger upscale vehicle to a Scion is really not an option most would choose. Most of these switchers will immediately rule out the Scions, Fit, Versa, Yaris, Aveo for something somewhat nicer.

    Enter the Prius, Hybric Civic, Jetta and others. What price do you put on amenities and comfort?
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Going from a Sequoia or Tahoe or similar larger upscale vehicle to a Scion is really not an option most would choose

    You got that right. However, I am not ruling out such a vehicle for running errands around town. Out on the highway I want my SUV. I would prefer a diesel engine that gets better mileage. I find the Sequoia just about the right size. Not too big and not too small. I keep watching for a good buy on the older style xB. They do not go down in price enough to justify one for a runabout. Same goes for the VW Beetle TDI.
  • dave8697dave8697 Member Posts: 1,498
    In 6 more weeks, I will move and end up 65 miles a day closer to work, which will cut 15,000 miles a year out of my commute. My interest rate on my new house will be low to mid fives and that is at least 1% lower than I have ever had before.

    I just spent $37 to drive the Sonoma to work and back for 3 days. After I move, that 3 days gas should cost $11.40. My gas savings from the shorter commute will pay the interest on the first $39,000 on my new home loan and feel like I get 7 more weeks of vacation per year from travel time saved. A new 30 mpg car would raise my expenses, not lower them like moving will. How the house trading pans out I don't know but I'm shooting for a break even swap.

    The Sonoma is $110 a year to insure, cheap to register, and the 25.5 mpg it gets on a trip is not bad for a 4.3 liter pushing well over 2 tons. Some people I know don't average but 1 or 2 more mpg in their commutes with their Accord 4 cyl's.
    than my 23.8 commute avg in the Sonoma. I see the Sonoma as affordable to drive even at $4 a gallon, after I move.
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    does a beater make sense? picking up a $2500 honda. My insurance agent
    told me a lot of people have dumped SUVs, but many more have gone to the
    pubic auto auction and picked up an around town car.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I would be tickled if my 99 Ford Ranger got anywhere near what you are getting with your Sonoma. It has a FlexFuel V6 that gets about 17 MPG on a good tank. I don't drive it that much so it is not a big deal. Sounds like you made a good move to save on gas.
  • avalon02whavalon02wh Member Posts: 785
    Don't forget the other savings like tire wear, less oil changes.... We dropped our commutes from about 45 minutes to 6 minutes when we moved. It is great. You will also find that your Sonoma will last forever or close to it.
  • avalon02whavalon02wh Member Posts: 785
    "Most of these switchers will immediately rule out the Scions, Fit, Versa, Yaris, Aveo for something somewhat nicer." I would agree, but for the record, I liked the Versa a lot better than the Yaris. :D

    "Enter the Prius, Hybric Civic, Jetta and others. What price do you put on amenities and comfort?" I think that is the question we will all be asking as gasoline prices rise.

    For me, $4 a gallon is not an issue. I am actually more concerned about shortages. We had some diesel shortages here last year. Alberta, Canada has or is experiencing some shortages due to refinery problems. If you read theoildrum.com drumbeat section you will see that shortages are not that uncommon. :(
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    I agree that shortages will be the primary problem(s) we all will face in the near future.
  • chuckhoychuckhoy Member Posts: 420
    I don't think so. The price will soar before we see shortages (barring any major refinery problems) because the poorer countries will see shortages because they will not be able to pony up the $ to get gas.

    Remember that the embargo of the 70s was a political event, not a supply based event.
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    up go the prices. just another excuse. between the exxon and chavez deal,
    and this, I expect to see a $.30 hit tomorrow. doesnt make losing 6gs look
    so bad.
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    I dont expect that large an increase, and I am a pessimist. What Chavez deal are you refferring to? I hadn't heard much about that guy lately.
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    We have two vehicles in the family. A KIA Optima which is used almost exclusively for longer trips and our old Town and Country which my wife drives to work.(1.5 miles) When it's driven so little the MPG is not that important as typically I fill it only once a month. The Optima gets a very respectable 30-40 MPG on the highway, so even with high prices for gas,we can handle it.They both are quite comfortable.
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    If it does come..the question is how much gas will be alotted and how. Per driver,per family or per car. Any thoughts about that? I think if there is a real shortage,rationing will come.
  • hpia4v2hpia4v2 Member Posts: 62
    So by look of it, not much change in routine/behavior of people.
    Now $6 a gallon would be hardship, the driving part is easy. My company pays for bus passes but food would cost more and last time I checked, my company doesn't give free food-coupons!
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    dude, WTF are you talking about? you are talking about trading a car that
    you only fill up once a month that gets 30-40mpg on the highway for a hybrid? Get real. I am the [non-permissible content removed] who got the big truck knowing what kind of situation we are facing. I made the most horrible decision anyone could have made and I should probably do something about it while I still can.
  • kernickkernick Member Posts: 4,072
    If there were a large war, or if there was some sort of oil embargo, then yes rationing is a definite possibility.

    If the supply of oil to the global simply decreases 1-2% /year or demand grows outstripping supply, governments will probably do as they do today - let the market work - meaning that the price will go up until there is slightly less people to buy, or the people buying cut-back a little.

    Whether you think it fair or not, there is no rule saying that everyone has to have gas and oil. I know people who have 2 large houses heated with oil and 3 large vehicles, and I know people who don't have the money for a car and gasoline.

    Tighter supplies will push the people who can marginally afford a car out of ownership, which will be based on your income, and what else you spend $ on. How many people will give up their cable TV before giving up gasoline? Or their cell phone? I think when you see the unnecessary things people spend money on, there really is a lot left to buy gasoline.
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    WTF are YOU talking about?....I did not say I was trading my car. At least not for a long time.Are you replying to an old post?
  • scottinkyscottinky Member Posts: 194
    i was referring to post # 4568 made by you a couple days ago, unless
    are were being sarcastic.
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    Read that post again Scott.. i was saying how happy I was that I didn't trade my Optima. I wrote that I had crunched the numbers and regained my sanity. The time when I was considering that deal was when gas prices were above $3.00 and expected to hit at leats $4.00. It also was a year ago.
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